Alternative to ICE

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

People have deportation orders and dont leave. the big argument against changing asylum laws is that most dont qualify and are ordered to leave. However, they dont leave, start lives, have kids and your argument to not remove them is that they are "americans".

you HAVE to physically remove people and that will never change.

Also there is only ONE city under "siege". ICE is everywhere but only one state has this going on. thats a symptom of Minnesota's leadership.

Our long-standing need for immigration reform has much more to do with the need for easier pathways for economic migrants to work in the US legally than it does with the need for asylum protocol reform. Asylum claims have given economic migrants a pathway to enter the US but only a small percentage come with viable asylum claims.

Needless to say, Biden’s let them all in policy and Trump's kick them all out policy have been embarrassing disasters and of course Congress has continued to fail to produce comprehensive immigration law reform.

Comprehensive immigration reform, means amnesty. It is clear the enforcement portion will not happen, as Democrats are against it and will drop it at the first opportunity, with pro-corporate Republicans going along with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn’t read the whole thread but I have been wondering how prior administrations removed deportees. It seems it was humane?

Lack of media driving outrage cycles. Republican, especially Trump, means maximum outrage over everything. Then it becomes a self-defeating cycle of escalation.

Yes, Neville R. Singham is doing his thing through Beijing. Code Pink, ANSWER, and all the other fronts for the CCP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They need to overhaul the legal process. They need to structure it so it is open to all and not just people of higher means. The government needs to stop going after undocumented immigrants and start going after businesses. If you make it impossible to get work here, people will not come. They are coming to improve their lives and the lives of their children. Break the ability to earn money and they won’t come.

As an employer I am not allowed to question work documents even if I suspect they are fake. What can you go after the businesses for? You can’t say they knowingly hired an illegal immigrant if they’re not allowed to question if they are legal…..

E-Verify. It’s not perfect, but it will catch your obvious fakers.

Read the rules, if I get a mis match I can’t use that to deny the job. I still must hire them and give them the "opportunity to correct". How does that make sense?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if ICE cant remove criminals, visa overstays, denied asylum, and court ordered removals, how do you get illegals out of the country.

otherwise its basically open borders.

you are saying once you get here, you dont have to leave

No one is saying that at all, fool.

If they wanted to clean up the border they would be in TEXAS moron.

Drug cartels love Don The Con so does the Russian Mob...

They ARE in Texas and it's going quite well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Didn’t read the whole thread but I have been wondering how prior administrations removed deportees. It seems it was humane?

On a plane in shackles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

People have deportation orders and dont leave. the big argument against changing asylum laws is that most dont qualify and are ordered to leave. However, they dont leave, start lives, have kids and your argument to not remove them is that they are "americans".

you HAVE to physically remove people and that will never change.

Also there is only ONE city under "siege". ICE is everywhere but only one state has this going on. thats a symptom of Minnesota's leadership.

not to mention almost all Blue cities/states have decided to not work with ICE at all. so yeah, you have to have a organization that finds and removes people from the country.

The blue states are refusing to do ICE’s job for them, such as holding people longer than the law permits (at local taxpayer expense) so ICE can sit on their butts instead of putting in the work and getting the proper warrants. Local authorities are also refusing to play detective, such as by figuring out the legal status of every soul passed out in the drunk tank.

No blue state will refuse to comply with legal papers. Since having the correct paperwork is so important to ICE, isn’t it reasonable to expect they get their own paperwork right and in their own dime?

this isnt true. blue states refuse to even let ICE know they have someone who has an ICE detainer and let them go free in the streets. its deliberate to never have to expel an illegal out of the country.

This is the weirdest part. If they let ICE get the criminals, then ICE could make their quotas without having to get the regular illegals. Its essentially protecting the criminal element with human shields.

Minnesota already hands over undocumented immigrants to ICE who have committed crimes; they honor ICE detainers. That didn't stop the current Administration from all the wild tactics and the insane rhetoric.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Millions were deported under Obama. If you approach the process with decency then the people won't protest.

Yes and Obama sequestered and deported millions before they were freed by CBP.

Did Mayorkas and Biden do that?

Again, stop with any comparisons of Obama and Biden or Trump. Obama was a good leader and he is still the face of the Dem Party. Biden was a joke and Trump is a disgraceful joke. You all know this is true. The sooner you admit it, the sooner we can unite as a country and move forward together with peace and love. If you're still in denial, find a brain.

Biden is a joke, but he's left us where we are. That's a fact.

I don’t think it’s Biden’s fault that Trump is sh*tting the bed so badly in Minneapolis. I think that’s Trump’s fault. His people knew how to do the job correctly, and it could have been a great win for him. Instead, he let psychopaths like Miller call the shots and show off what “absolute immunity” looks like for the bootlickers and MAGA cult, and didn’t consider that killing white moms and hero nurses might not play well to middle America.

It's just like the housing crisis. Democrats demand housing for all regardless of ability to pay. Then the subprime mortgage crisis hits. And it's all based on ridiculous ideology.

Wrong Republicans were in charge then moron.

No, they weren't. Ask Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, and the others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

People have deportation orders and dont leave. the big argument against changing asylum laws is that most dont qualify and are ordered to leave. However, they dont leave, start lives, have kids and your argument to not remove them is that they are "americans".

you HAVE to physically remove people and that will never change.

Also there is only ONE city under "siege". ICE is everywhere but only one state has this going on. thats a symptom of Minnesota's leadership.

Our long-standing need for immigration reform has much more to do with the need for easier pathways for economic migrants to work in the US legally than it does with the need for asylum protocol reform. Asylum claims have given economic migrants a pathway to enter the US but only a small percentage come with viable asylum claims.

Needless to say, Biden’s let them all in policy and Trump's kick them all out policy have been embarrassing disasters and of course Congress has continued to fail to produce comprehensive immigration law reform.

Comprehensive immigration reform, means amnesty. It is clear the enforcement portion will not happen, as Democrats are against it and will drop it at the first opportunity, with pro-corporate Republicans going along with it.

It was good enough for Reagan....

[Anonymous]

The only solution (ok not only), but the solution that comes up as a catch all is e-verify including, sadly, many checks on our identities during many processes.. like an annual check in at the dmv.
There are civil rights issues here even for bonafide citizens. So.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Immigration judges" should be part of the judicial branch. Right now, those administrative roles are part of the Executive branch and can be influenced by political whims every 4 years.

They need to have insulation from the Executive branch and be able to make unpopular decisions.

Agreed. Or, as the case is now, underfunded and understaffed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

People have deportation orders and dont leave. the big argument against changing asylum laws is that most dont qualify and are ordered to leave. However, they dont leave, start lives, have kids and your argument to not remove them is that they are "americans".

you HAVE to physically remove people and that will never change.

Also there is only ONE city under "siege". ICE is everywhere but only one state has this going on. thats a symptom of Minnesota's leadership.

Our long-standing need for immigration reform has much more to do with the need for easier pathways for economic migrants to work in the US legally than it does with the need for asylum protocol reform. Asylum claims have given economic migrants a pathway to enter the US but only a small percentage come with viable asylum claims.

Needless to say, Biden’s let them all in policy and Trump's kick them all out policy have been embarrassing disasters and of course Congress has continued to fail to produce comprehensive immigration law reform.

Comprehensive immigration reform, means amnesty. It is clear the enforcement portion will not happen, as Democrats are against it and will drop it at the first opportunity, with pro-corporate Republicans going along with it.

Amnesty for non-criminal aliens on our soil makes sense if and when the border is completely 100% secure and we've passed reform measures to make it easier for the economic migrants we need to work here legally and for legitimate asylum cases to be settled without having unvetted people roaming the country while their cases are pending.

[Anonymous]

It's clear that the Department of Homeland Security was a mistake. DHS needs to be dissolved. It's unfixable - everything from culture to mission is a problem.

Its functions should be returned to the pre-2001 departments. So for Immigration and Naturalization that would be Justice, which is where enforcement of deportations belongs anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They need to overhaul the legal process. They need to structure it so it is open to all and not just people of higher means. The government needs to stop going after undocumented immigrants and start going after businesses. If you make it impossible to get work here, people will not come. They are coming to improve their lives and the lives of their children. Break the ability to earn money and they won’t come.

As an employer I am not allowed to question work documents even if I suspect they are fake. What can you go after the businesses for? You can’t say they knowingly hired an illegal immigrant if they’re not allowed to question if they are legal…..

E-Verify. It’s not perfect, but it will catch your obvious fakers.

Read the rules, if I get a mis match I can’t use that to deny the job. I still must hire them and give them the "opportunity to correct". How does that make sense?

I’m sorry what’s the issue here? Paperwork mistakes happen. They happened pre DOGE and they are certainly happening now. People shouldn’t lose jobs over it.

Seems like a small inconvenience to make sure you are not hiring an illegal is preferable to hiring them and then watching them get disappeared the night before your biggest business day of the year. The fact that more employers don’t use it is telling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Millions were deported under Obama. If you approach the process with decency then the people won't protest.

Yes and Obama sequestered and deported millions before they were freed by CBP.

Did Mayorkas and Biden do that?

Again, stop with any comparisons of Obama and Biden or Trump. Obama was a good leader and he is still the face of the Dem Party. Biden was a joke and Trump is a disgraceful joke. You all know this is true. The sooner you admit it, the sooner we can unite as a country and move forward together with peace and love. If you're still in denial, find a brain.

Biden is a joke, but he's left us where we are. That's a fact.

I don’t think it’s Biden’s fault that Trump is sh*tting the bed so badly in Minneapolis. I think that’s Trump’s fault. His people knew how to do the job correctly, and it could have been a great win for him. Instead, he let psychopaths like Miller call the shots and show off what “absolute immunity” looks like for the bootlickers and MAGA cult, and didn’t consider that killing white moms and hero nurses might not play well to middle America.

It's just like the housing crisis. Democrats demand housing for all regardless of ability to pay. Then the subprime mortgage crisis hits. And it's all based on ridiculous ideology.

Wrong Republicans were in charge then moron.

No, they weren't. Ask Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, and the others.

Lady, no. republicans fully controlled the House and Senate from 1995 until 2007, except for periods in 2001 to 2002 when Democrats controlled the Senate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only solution (ok not only), but the solution that comes up as a catch all is e-verify including, sadly, many checks on our identities during many processes.. like an annual check in at the dmv.
There are civil rights issues here even for bonafide citizens. So.

Seems like a lot of people detained for deportation have work permits.