Algebra 1 in 5th

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Original poster here. When I mentioned the rarity of our situation in a previous post, it was only to back up the idea that it is hard to find other people to talk to who have been in a similar situation. Having other people and knowing their experiences would be helpful when trying to make some decisions for my son. But, since knowing the quantifiable rarity has become the focus, we were told by the head of math for the county that roughly 30 students take Algebra 1
in the county as 6th graders. We were also told that our son is one of 2 students tracking to take Algebra in 5th.

PP here with the kid who was similarly skipped ahead. I wish there was some way we could talk. You're right that you can't really talk to other people, because they'll view it as bragging or won't really get it.

For your kid, trust me that he will have zero problems with the online classes or with any FCPS math classes. They will all be trivially easy, boring, and a hoop that your kid needs to jump through. Sign him up for AoPS or RSM classes, since they're some of the only places that will challenge him. Also, you should look into math contests, as they are yet another way to encounter other similarly talented kids. If you haven't done so already, I'd sign your kid up for AMC 8. AoPS has a bunch of free past tests that he could look through. https://artofproblemsolving.com/wiki/index.php/AMC_8_Problems_and_Solutions

Also, the mathleague.org contests sound like they'd be a good fit for your child. Both of these contests are great ways for your child to see new, challenging problems and push himself a bit. They can also help your child gain some perspective, since there will be kids there who will outscore your kid. Some of the Texas and California kids are brutal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I encourage you to look ahead at where this path leads and recognize that faster isn't better.

Looking at the logistics of skipping ahead is always a good idea. I disagree with the implication that OP is rushing things and should slow down. FCPS does not skip kids ahead 2 or 3 years in math unless the kid is an extreme outlier. The kid will not get "stronger foundations" from slowing down. The only thing he could possibly get from slowing down is extreme boredom in math class.

If my child were an extreme outlier, I'd go around to some of the private schools and see if they would accept him - even on scholarship. My sister and I went to school that way and when we went back to public school (parents divorce, moving etc etc), it was a huge shock at how slow everything was. There is no way I'd keep a brilliant kid in FCPS.

If a child is an extreme outlier, the only real fit would be homeschooling. There are no DC metro schools geared toward outlier brilliant kids. OP is likely in the same position I was in, though. Kid is an extreme outlier in math, but a good fit for AAP language arts and a good fit for all of the social aspects of school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I encourage you to look ahead at where this path leads and recognize that faster isn't better.

Looking at the logistics of skipping ahead is always a good idea. I disagree with the implication that OP is rushing things and should slow down. FCPS does not skip kids ahead 2 or 3 years in math unless the kid is an extreme outlier. The kid will not get "stronger foundations" from slowing down. The only thing he could possibly get from slowing down is extreme boredom in math class.

If my child were an extreme outlier, I'd go around to some of the private schools and see if they would accept him - even on scholarship. My sister and I went to school that way and when we went back to public school (parents divorce, moving etc etc), it was a huge shock at how slow everything was. There is no way I'd keep a brilliant kid in FCPS.

If a child is an extreme outlier, the only real fit would be homeschooling. There are no DC metro schools geared toward outlier brilliant kids. OP is likely in the same position I was in, though. Kid is an extreme outlier in math, but a good fit for AAP language arts and a good fit for all of the social aspects of school.

This is why you turn to enrichment like AoPS or RSM and math competitions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If kids take classes early, then they can breeze through math classes later, when the other classes are harder.
I'd prefer this to having them take it easy in 5th or 6th grade. This frees up time to work on other classes in 11th and 12th grade, or take other electives.

A kid that advanced won’t be taking easy breezy math in 11th and 12th grade. They will likely want to continue with college level classes since they will be significantly beyond calculus. It’s difficult content. They won’t be taking years off of math to focus on other subjects.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If kids take classes early, then they can breeze through math classes later, when the other classes are harder.
I'd prefer this to having them take it easy in 5th or 6th grade. This frees up time to work on other classes in 11th and 12th grade, or take other electives.

A kid that advanced won’t be taking easy breezy math in 11th and 12th grade. They will likely want to continue with college level classes since they will be significantly beyond calculus. It’s difficult content. They won’t be taking years off of math to focus on other subjects.

Not necessarily. LCPS's staff argued for slowing down math acceleration based on data showing that lots of kids 'dropped out' of the advanced track. The data was not accurate as they ignored TJ and AOS students. 5th grade is one thing, but kids can qualify in 6th grade without being super advanced. Being able to handle 8th grade math in 6th grade is easier than being able to handle 10th grade math in 8th grade or advanced calculus in 12th grade.

[Anonymous]

I wonder if it's possible to get credit, or at least placement, from AoPS online courses? They're accredited after all. I wonder if it would be possible to forgo online Algebra 1 and instead take online AoPS Prealgebra B or Intro to Algebra A as a math class. If not, I don't see how taking algebra at the MS would be any socially worse than taking it online.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if it's possible to get credit, or at least placement, from AoPS online courses? They're accredited after all. I wonder if it would be possible to forgo online Algebra 1 and instead take online AoPS Prealgebra B or Intro to Algebra A as a math class. If not, I don't see how taking algebra at the MS would be any socially worse than taking it online.

Depends on the school, most likely not. If credit is the main consideration a remedial algebra class at the local community college is the better route. Districts typically have agreements with community colleges for dual enrollment anyways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

It’s not FCPS, although it might be worth checking. Community colleges are desperate for students these days, their enrollment dropped so low it’s a crisis in the making.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

You just need to prove that your 9-10 year old is 11th grade. They are not allowed to discriminate based on age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I appreciate all of the thoughts given. What is clear to us is that it isn’t an easy situation to navigate. What makes it most challenging, perhaps, is the fact that there are so few other instances of other children and families in the same situation. We were told from the beginning that he is a true outlier. The county has seen a few other children like this, but not many.

5th grade algebra isn't that much of an outlier in Fairfax.

County wide, only a small handful of kids per grade level are jumped ahead more than a year. Being one of the top 3 or 4 kids out of 14,000 would make OP's kid an outlier, but not at all an anomaly for FCPS.

Algebra is officially a 9th grade class. It is more than a handful of kids per school who are this far ahead. Many have 7th grade algebra 2 years ahead, and even 3 years ahead there's probably at least 100 in the county taking algebra in 6th grade. There have been lots of posts on this forum about 5th grade algebra, so it seems it is not that unusual, probably 10 every year across the county.

Yeah, we should take at face value bragging posts on an anonymous forum. Also anecdotal, I’ve been told by proud parents that their 3rd graders are doing Algebra when in reality they just know how to solve a linear equation.

My advice for placement is to find a good diagnostic test like MAP, and target a grade where she’s at least in the 90th percentile. If it is too high she would not be challenged enough, if lower she might struggle when there’s additional stress from being in an environment with older kids.

So true. When I told my kid's school he was taking Algebra in 3rd grade, their reply was: "your kid is not that smart" and "all 3rd graders in our school take Algebra". As an immigrant, I thought public schools in this area must be so superior, until I found out we were not talking about the same "Algebra"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

You just need to prove that your 9-10 year old is 11th grade. They are not allowed to discriminate based on age.

You’re telling me this was at NVCC? I will ask the head of dual enrollment (the only way you could have done this) because we were together recently and she said the exact thing I wrote out. And she said no Dean would approve anyone before high school. This was said clearly and directly last week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

You just need to prove that your 9-10 year old is 11th grade. They are not allowed to discriminate based on age.

You’re telling me this was at NVCC? I will ask the head of dual enrollment (the only way you could have done this) because we were together recently and she said the exact thing I wrote out. And she said no Dean would approve anyone before high school. This was said clearly and directly last week.

To clarify: before high school age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a similar situation taking Algebra in 4th. He got this advanced because I was teaching him during the COVID times and we had a lot of time on our hands. He is also fairly quick to catch on things. The class he is taking is online through the local community college. I would not recommend an online class at that age unless there someone to tutor him one on one. We tried on line classes, regular classes through the school, enrichment like AOPS etc. and one on one instruction is by far the most effective since you can go back and forth with the student to figure out what he understood. Of course this takes more time and/or money compared to the others.

Another point, look carefully at the contents of the class, some skip material are are not well aligned with the common core. Then, when he house back to an in person class he might not have been taught the foundation for it.

Make sure he is placed appropriately through multiple measures. There are diagnostics test that are free like Khan Academy, or some that you can purchase like IXL or MAP. Don’t rely only on the school because this situation is something they don’t run into every year.

I would also advise taking your time, if it will be two years to go through Algebra 1, that’s perfectly fine, use the diagnostics to find areas that were not understood properly and have him work on them. In the end the goal is learning, not that he takes Algebra 1 as early as possible.

Which one? I’ve taught at NVCC and they would not accept a 4th grader. Most are 11th grade +, with rare exceptions for 9th - 10th graders. I only mention this so OP doesn’t think this could apply to her in FCPS through NVCC.

You just need to prove that your 9-10 year old is 11th grade. They are not allowed to discriminate based on age.

You’re telling me this was at NVCC? I will ask the head of dual enrollment (the only way you could have done this) because we were together recently and she said the exact thing I wrote out. And she said no Dean would approve anyone before high school. This was said clearly and directly last week.

Are you just name dropping to show you know important people? You seem to be overly involved in getting the posters straight.

The point is that community colleges could be an option that should be looked at. Often those institutions, choose to not serve the needs of the community funding their very existence. Regrettable, but true.

Maybe you can put in a word with your good friend, that taxpayers want education without that much red tape.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I encourage you to look ahead at where this path leads and recognize that faster isn't better.

Looking at the logistics of skipping ahead is always a good idea. I disagree with the implication that OP is rushing things and should slow down. FCPS does not skip kids ahead 2 or 3 years in math unless the kid is an extreme outlier. The kid will not get "stronger foundations" from slowing down. The only thing he could possibly get from slowing down is extreme boredom in math class.

If my child were an extreme outlier, I'd go around to some of the private schools and see if they would accept him - even on scholarship. My sister and I went to school that way and when we went back to public school (parents divorce, moving etc etc), it was a huge shock at how slow everything was. There is no way I'd keep a brilliant kid in FCPS.

If a child is an extreme outlier, the only real fit would be homeschooling. There are no DC metro schools geared toward outlier brilliant kids. OP is likely in the same position I was in, though. Kid is an extreme outlier in math, but a good fit for AAP language arts and a good fit for all of the social aspects of school.

This is why you turn to enrichment like AoPS or RSM and math competitions.

My DC took Aops during the pandemic. At the end of the summer, we were not convinced that DC actually benefited from it.