Do you consider ADHD "special needs"?

[Anonymous]

Your acceptance of the fact that I can easily see how my approach to work, now, and school in the past is very different then my peers is not important to me. Yes, I have been successful and yes I am able to function well in the work place that I have found but it isn’t easy and there are plenty of places I would not fit in well. For example, I figured out quickly that I could not thrive in Academia because of my struggles to stay focused on one or two projects. It is the reason my degree took 8 years instead of the 4 that most of my peers finished in. There are a large number of work environments I would sink in.

There is a world of difference between different issues, which I understand. I also know that if my Mom hadn’t fought for me in early ES I would not have graduated with a standard diploma. The HS wanted to drop all math and science requirements for me and had already determined I wouldn’t go to college.

I never out grew the needed for academic accommodations, without them I would not have succeeded. I did learn how to compensate in many areas and I did very well in school once that happened. That said, my performance in Grad School was solid and strong enough to earn my PhD but it was still different then my peers. You are crazy if you don’t think there were comments and barbs thrown my way for that.

And my private office is an office with 8 other people instead of the open floor with 100 people. Yes, my work values me because of my degree and because of the work I produce. My team ends up with a lot of the people who struggle with the regular work environment because they know that I can help someone navigate our work area and have success.

Are my LDs a part of how I see myself? Yup. I had Teachers spend a good amount of time commenting that I wasn’t as smart as my brothers or remarking how amazing it was that I got an A or a B on a test. There were conferences to discuss whether I could take honors classes and a debate about taking an AP exam. People were very comfortable with telling me that I was over achieving and that I shouldn’t expect it to last. The Resource Teacher was shocked that I was attending a 4 year college and tried to talk me into taking it slow and going to Community College. Maybe if the people who were teaching me had ever had any confidence in my abilities I would have developed confidence in myself.

I get that there are people with far greater challenges then I had. I get that there are people who had the same challenges I did with less support. That does not change the path I took or the issues that existed along the way. Nor does it change that I struggle with how I interact with folks on a day to day basis.

The question wasn’t whether a kid with ADHD was severely Special Needs but if they had Special Needs. The answer is yes. Those needs might be less then kids with Autism or PANDAs or any number of health issues but they are real. If they are not addressed, they change the course of a persons life. The needs might be different but marginalizing those with ADHD or LDs because their issues seem less extreme is kind of bogus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Neurotypical” really refers to autism. People with ADHD typically don’t have the same issues with interpersonal relationships and friendships, and don’t have the very different type of information processing and way of seeing the world as kids with autism. I don’t think it’s correct to lump them together.

Now somebody will say “it’s all on a spectrum!”. OK fine but then none of this has any meaning.

Research scientist here. You are wrong, as you suspected. These terms do not simply refer to one psychiatric diagnosis, they refer to all mental health disorders. "Neurotypical" simply means what's typical behavior in the range of normal. "Neurodivergent" means what is not typical, and it infers there might be a particular diagnosis.

It's very important everyone understands that most mental health issues exist on a spectrum, ie, a range of severity. The DSMs set out a threshold of clinical diagnosis just because we need cut-offs and thresholds to practice medicine! Not because the issue magically disappears below the threshold. Families with a few diagnosed people and a bunch of non-diagnosed ones often notice that they share some of the same behaviors, but when that behavior is exaggerated, it leads to a diagnosis. There is a strong hereditary link to many mental health disorders, but since they exist on a spectrum, some relatives are hardly affected at all, while others are impacted in their daily lives.

I find your habit of showing up all over the special needs forum flashing your pseudo creds offensive. If you were truly a professional, you would know not to do this and many online parenting forums don't allow it. It seems you think it gives your opinions, which have been off the wall at times, more weight. You don't know more than the other parents here. Join in the conversation all you want but drop the research scientist crap. You're just another parent with an opinion like the rest of us. Occasionally an st, ot whatever will drop by and mention what they do but it's usually very specific advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’d have to meet your daughter before making that decision. ADHD has become so over diagnosed that most kids don’t have ADHD they just have no discipline and are allowed to be on electronics 10 hours a day and miss out on valuable hands on learning opportunities and social skills.

go away! you know nothing of anyone else's life or experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your acceptance of the fact that I can easily see how my approach to work, now, and school in the past is very different then my peers is not important to me. Yes, I have been successful and yes I am able to function well in the work place that I have found but it isn’t easy and there are plenty of places I would not fit in well. For example, I figured out quickly that I could not thrive in Academia because of my struggles to stay focused on one or two projects. It is the reason my degree took 8 years instead of the 4 that most of my peers finished in. There are a large number of work environments I would sink in.

There is a world of difference between different issues, which I understand. I also know that if my Mom hadn’t fought for me in early ES I would not have graduated with a standard diploma. The HS wanted to drop all math and science requirements for me and had already determined I wouldn’t go to college.

I never out grew the needed for academic accommodations, without them I would not have succeeded. I did learn how to compensate in many areas and I did very well in school once that happened. That said, my performance in Grad School was solid and strong enough to earn my PhD but it was still different then my peers. You are crazy if you don’t think there were comments and barbs thrown my way for that.

And my private office is an office with 8 other people instead of the open floor with 100 people. Yes, my work values me because of my degree and because of the work I produce. My team ends up with a lot of the people who struggle with the regular work environment because they know that I can help someone navigate our work area and have success.

Are my LDs a part of how I see myself? Yup. I had Teachers spend a good amount of time commenting that I wasn’t as smart as my brothers or remarking how amazing it was that I got an A or a B on a test. There were conferences to discuss whether I could take honors classes and a debate about taking an AP exam. People were very comfortable with telling me that I was over achieving and that I shouldn’t expect it to last. The Resource Teacher was shocked that I was attending a 4 year college and tried to talk me into taking it slow and going to Community College. Maybe if the people who were teaching me had ever had any confidence in my abilities I would have developed confidence in myself.

I get that there are people with far greater challenges then I had. I get that there are people who had the same challenges I did with less support. That does not change the path I took or the issues that existed along the way. Nor does it change that I struggle with how I interact with folks on a day to day basis.

The question wasn’t whether a kid with ADHD was severely Special Needs but if they had Special Needs. The answer is yes. Those needs might be less then kids with Autism or PANDAs or any number of health issues but they are real. If they are not addressed, they change the course of a persons life. The needs might be different but marginalizing those with ADHD or LDs because their issues seem less extreme is kind of bogus.

Other than a school wanting to drop your science/math requirements for high school graduation, you are mostly describing the average experience of someone pursuing a graduate degree and getting a job. I think your experiences earlier in life have influenced you to think that you are uniquely challenged as an adult and it really sounds like you are not.

[Anonymous]

Other then dropping math and science requirements in high school? What would I have done if I did not have those classes? How would that have effected college? I am reasonably certain that my life would look very different today.

Twenty percent of the population has LDs, so it is not unique. What is problematic is parents who don’t have the info that my parents did who fought for me to get the services I needed. And fought with the school so that I could graduate with a high school degree and go to college. Kind of like what a lot of parents on this board are doing for their kids every day.

And if you don’t understand that there are social issues surrounding ADHD and executive functioning issues that make school, job hunting, and keeping a job that much harder then you don’t understand the challenges that kids and adults with ADHD face.

[Anonymous]

Yes, and I have fought long and hard to get my child help. It's not an easy road. By you telling her it's no big deal may invalidate services she needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’d have to meet your daughter before making that decision. ADHD has become so over diagnosed that most kids don’t have ADHD they just have no discipline and are allowed to be on electronics 10 hours a day and miss out on valuable hands on learning opportunities and social skills.

What are your credentials?

[Anonymous]

Yes it a disability and she has special needs (medication, extra time). By high school, most kids are labeled as such.

[Anonymous]

I have ADHD and went to s SLAC for undergrad and an Ivy for grad school and now make about $250K in a somewhat prestigious job. I don't think of myself as having special needs, but I have had a lot more challenges getting to where I am -- and now staying where I am (especially as a mom of 2 who does a lot of unseen work with scheduling and all that jazz). My parents never presented ADHD as a special need and I never thought of it as a special need. I don't think it would have helped me to think of it as a special need, but I think as a parent it can be helpful to think of it as a special need so that you can advocate for your child appropriately and teach your kid how to advocate for themself (if they need advocacy). It's also important for your child to understand how to create guardrails to keep themselves on track. You can do the latter without presenting ADHD as a special need. It's just how they are and it's something that they need to be aware and accommodate for. We all have things like that though.

[Anonymous]

OP,
I have not read all responses, so I’m not sure about age of your DD.
My unscientific response would be to wait til high school. Then you will understand that your beautiful, talented, intelligent DD is indeed social needs. If not before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Neurotypical” really refers to autism. People with ADHD typically don’t have the same issues with interpersonal relationships and friendships, and don’t have the very different type of information processing and way of seeing the world as kids with autism. I don’t think it’s correct to lump them together.

Now somebody will say “it’s all on a spectrum!”. OK fine but then none of this has any meaning.

Many of the kids with "just" ADHD in my child's school have more issues with interpersonal relationships and friendships than the one child who I know has an ASD diagnosis.
The diagnoses are not as rigid as you think.

Quite true - my ADHD kid also is Aspergers and has an anxiety disorder

[Anonymous]

As an adult with ADHD, I never considered myself, nor was I ever considered special needs. Every single person I know with ADHD is highly creative and they flourish when doing what they love. We are only considered special needs bc we don’t fit into a pretty little box, making the educational years difficult. It’s not hard to reach a child with ADHD if you allow them to follow their passion. Unfortunately, those who make the rules felt that I needed to take calculus even though I was never going to need it. I struggled in math and science and it was setting me up for failure. So many kids with ADHD are struggling to stay afloat in classes that will be of zero use to them in the future. I would have been better served taking business and art classes that would have prepared me for my career. All of our kids would be better served taking the necessary classes in elementary and middle school and then allowing them to take classes that will be useful to them in the future in high school. That’s just my take and I know that it can all depend on the type of ADHD and it’s severity as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a kid I was diagnosed with LDs. I required specialized services throughout school to help me learn. I graduated in the top 10% of my class from high school and went on to earn a PhD. That doesn’t means that I didn’t require special services to meet my needs. I used those special services to be able to attain success in school. My Mom spent a lot of time fighting for those services and providing additional supports so that I could succeed.

I was very much a special needs kid.

As an adult I was diagnosed with ADHD. It only reinforced to me how differently I see process information and respond to stimulation around me. I now understand why I get agitated in high stimulation environments and why I struggle with some regular scenarios, like in conversations where I find it hard not to interrupt and why I blurt out information. I am lucky to work in an environment where those issues have no caused me any problems and where I can make a very nice salary but I am pretty well aware that there are many environments where I would struggle. My work place has lots of open seating but they have always found a desk for me in a smaller room. They are fine with my using headphones when most people are discouraged from doing so. They have been accommodating of my quirks.

I am very much an adult with special needs.

Are my needs so great that I would be unable to function without accommodations? Probably not. Would I be in a very different place if I had not received the support I did in school or the accommodations I receive at work? Hell yeah. 100% I would have had a very different life.

There is nothing wrong with being different and knowing that you need some accommodations.

There is so much unacknowledged privilege in this comment I don't even know where to start.

This is why it is sometimes annoying when people with mild ADHD say they are special needs.

NP. I don’t understand this comment. Can you explain more?

Because the primary differences between the PP and the average student or worker are:

1) A parent with the time, resources, and knowledge (and interest) I strongly advocating for her child to receive extra resources and accommodations so that her child could not merely get by in school, but excel above most others.m; and

2) Access to doctors/therapists who are able to provide official diagnoses that enables advocating for special accommodations like an office in an open plan office, for example.

A person who can excel at that level does not have special needs. They have ordinary needs but, with with extra accommodation and support, can really thrive. That’s true if most people, but most people don’t get it. PP is not uniquely hindered in life. By their own acknowledgement, they can function fine without accommodation. Only very well resourced people can conceptualize special needs in this way. 99% of the population would view someone like this as typical.

No, the primary difference between PP and the "average student or worker" are that she has learning disabilities and ADHD.

It seems like your issue is that PP got access to resources and help that others did not. I agree that is a big problem. But that doesn't mean that she didn't deserve those resources, it just means that many others don't get the resources they deserve. This is true with all instances of unearned privilege. The privileges themselves aren't the problem. The fact that others are denied them is what needs to be changed. I assume you would take no issue with PP's comment were the system to better serve those with greater impairments.

It is absolutely untrue that somebody who can excel doesn't have special needs, regardless of how 99% of the population sees them. This is the big issue with being twice exceptional. Somebody can look like they are doing okay because their intelligence seems to counteract their impairments. But without accommodations typically 2e kids (and adults) are a ball of anxiety and shame about "not reaching their potential." It isn't just about the grades or the career, it's about overall wellbeing. The idea that we should only apportion resources to help people function, not thrive, seems to dismiss the potential severe mental health consequences of being denied accommodations for ADHD or learning disabilities (although I wouldn't even say we are trying to get people to thrive, I'd say we are trying to help them lead a life that isn't substantially more difficult than the lives of neurotypical people).

I mean, I’m a big ball of shame and anxiety about not meeting my potential at work. Am I special needs?

At a certain point, this IS objective. A disability has to be defined as something that truly burdens the ability to conduct life activities. People who get PhDs, hold down jobs, have families…. are not disabled.

I disagree. My twice-exceptional sibling has to work about twelve to fifteen extra hours a week to perform at the same level as her coworkers. I’ve seen her doing paperwork on Christmas, she was so overwhelmed. She’s always the last to leave and works an extra day on the weekend, every weekend. She’s unable to date, due to her schedule, and will never be able to have kids, because she’s missed her fertility window. So yes, she has a PHD, but her ADHD has wildly impacted her life, even with the diagnosis. She chose to be successful, and had to give up absolutely everything else. This might sound normal if she were in Big Law, but she’s pulling in under $100,000 and none of her coworkers do this. ADHD is absolutely a special need.

[Anonymous]

What if you take two kids with ADHD who have the exact level of impairment, but one cares significantly more about school? Perhaps because their parents push them, maybe peer pressure, maybe an intrinsic motivation, whatever.

The one who doesn't care as much about school starts failing classes (even though he does put forth effort and does want to succeed). You would never look at him and say "oh he will be fine even without accommodations." The one who cares significantly more about school sort of propels herself with anxiety, spends twice as much time studying, blows up at home, and is just generally miserable, but gets decent grades, maybe Cs and Bs.

Does the one who is failing school have a special need, but the one who is miserable but passes classes not have a special need?

I would say no. I would say they both have a "special need" for accommodations, or at least the same level of need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Neurotypical” really refers to autism. People with ADHD typically don’t have the same issues with interpersonal relationships and friendships, and don’t have the very different type of information processing and way of seeing the world as kids with autism. I don’t think it’s correct to lump them together.

Now somebody will say “it’s all on a spectrum!”. OK fine but then none of this has any meaning.

Research scientist here. You are wrong, as you suspected. These terms do not simply refer to one psychiatric diagnosis, they refer to all mental health disorders. "Neurotypical" simply means what's typical behavior in the range of normal. "Neurodivergent" means what is not typical, and it infers there might be a particular diagnosis.

It's very important everyone understands that most mental health issues exist on a spectrum, ie, a range of severity. The DSMs set out a threshold of clinical diagnosis just because we need cut-offs and thresholds to practice medicine! Not because the issue magically disappears below the threshold. Families with a few diagnosed people and a bunch of non-diagnosed ones often notice that they share some of the same behaviors, but when that behavior is exaggerated, it leads to a diagnosis. There is a strong hereditary link to many mental health disorders, but since they exist on a spectrum, some relatives are hardly affected at all, while others are impacted in their daily lives.

I find your habit of showing up all over the special needs forum flashing your pseudo creds offensive. If you were truly a professional, you would know not to do this and many online parenting forums don't allow it. It seems you think it gives your opinions, which have been off the wall at times, more weight. You don't know more than the other parents here. Join in the conversation all you want but drop the research scientist crap. You're just another parent with an opinion like the rest of us. Occasionally an st, ot whatever will drop by and mention what they do but it's usually very specific advice.

I actually found the comment helpful. It was in response to someone assertion that everyone but those with autism are NT, which is not my understanding of the terminology. Providing education is a valid response.