Discussion Boundary Map out for APS- elementary schools

[Anonymous]

Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People prefer to have their kids as close to home as possible because it makes life easier, especially since there are no aftercare opportunities available in most neighborhoods other than APS extended day. When you move kids to more distant schools in a congested county, you are adding a significant round trip commute to the day in the race for a 6pm pickup. To the person who will helpfully point out that school is not childcare and kids can ride the bus, you are essentially telling people to just hire a part time nanny or quit their job if they can't handle the logistics, which is a "let them eat cake" kind of solution.

We all make choices. We all have our life situations to deal with.
I'm ONE of those who has pointed out that school is not childcare and I continue to hold fast to that perspective. Your argument of convenience or having to make different life choices doesn't sway me in the least. There is nothing requiring APS to provide extended day services. They are not required to make life convenient. They are required to provide a free public education. PERIOD.

DP. Sure, let's take that approach. Who do you think will be disproportionately burdened, the UMC family that can pay for alternative childcare, of the LMC/MC family struggling to get by as it is? Do you really think you're making life better for disadvantaged students by making school harder for their families?

And that's what it always comes back to, very conveniently: We ever-so- compassionate MC/UMC are concerned for the LMC/MC families who might be burdened.....after all the hardship and convenience for ourselves arguments are done.
Do you know the economic breakdown of extended day enrollees or who benefits more from extended day services? I don't. But I will bet the majority of them are not FRL-eligible families.

of course they are not. Extended day primarily serves the upper middle class two parent working family in arlington where at least one parent works 9-5. It does not serve those who do shift type work. Here is the breakdown as of last year

Number of Extended Day Families by Income Level
as of Sept. 30, 2018
Income Level After School Before School
Below $8,000 64 37
$8,001 - $12,000 202 120
$12,001 - $16,000 208 99
$16,001 - $20,000 127 58
$20,001 - $26,000 131 70
$26,001 - $32,000 81 34
$32,001 - $38,000 50 41
$38,001 - 46,000 68 43
$46,001 - $55,000 39 22
$55,001 - $65,000 53 29
$65,001 - $88,240 108 47
$88,241 & above 2054 904

https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/FY-2020-Budget-Questions-and-Responses-as-of-April-12-2019.pdf

Based on that breakdown, it appears that over a third of the students in extended day qualify as low-income.

Yeah and didn’t someone upthread say that the county average for FRL was about 30%? Seems like extended day serves many across the board.

DCUM posters who don’t use extended day are primarily wealthy stay at home moms. That they would have the gall to suggest it’s elimination is truly abhorrent.

I didn't review all the postings; but I don't recall it being recommended to eliminate it. It was pointed out that APS isn't required to offer it and then someone went on about how inconvenient that would be, making people hire nannies and whatnot.

This. Nobody is saying to eliminate it, but they aren’t required to provide it, nor are they required to make sure everyone has what they consider the most convenient situation, because in almost every situation, one person’s convenience will come at the cost of another’s. Some schools don’t have enough spots at extended day as it is and there are waitlists, so there aren’t guarantees even now. This can’t really be a factor in boundary decisions. They only have the schools where they have them, and that may not be in the place that is most convenient for transportation or the current population. And they can’t ever make everyone happy. They can’t promise that because you bought or rented a house in a specific school zone, that it will never change so as not to inconvenience you. That’s just not a realistic ask.

They should take into account where people live (what areas are dense), and which schools are walkable and which are not when considering whether or not to move option programs. But, they also have to consider instruction. For instance, if they move an Immersion program, they also need to consider whether or not that location will help them with the 50/50 student balance. And, per their own criteria, they have to consider demographics. They don’t want to create new schools with attendance zones where the fr/l rate would be over 80%. They have to look at the locations of option programs through that lens, too.

It’s a balancing act and not everyone is going to walk away with the outcome they want at the end. But they have to try to do right by the kids first, and that does include considering how families get their kids to and from school, but it can’t be the only thing they look at.

I don’t understand this reasoning at all. The only reason to bus students is to make schools more diverse because it boosts achievement for disadvantaged students. But how can you advocate for that in one breath and then in the next say APS shouldn't care about the increased burden they put on those same families, even though that burden correlates with worse educational outcomes for disadvantaged students?

Calm down. Nobody is going to “bus” students from one end of the county to the other. That is not what is happening.

They don’t have schools in every neighborhood. Walk zones are small. Many kids will have to take buses to get to school, always, because we don’t have schools in all the places we’d need them for everyone to walk.

And no, busing students does not correlate with worse outcomes, quite the opposite. But they’re not doing that anyway, so CALM DOWN.

citation?

You don’t have Google?

Why don’t you show me the study that shows Grandma being able to pick up her charge from extended day without having to take a bus materially affects student achievement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People prefer to have their kids as close to home as possible because it makes life easier, especially since there are no aftercare opportunities available in most neighborhoods other than APS extended day. When you move kids to more distant schools in a congested county, you are adding a significant round trip commute to the day in the race for a 6pm pickup. To the person who will helpfully point out that school is not childcare and kids can ride the bus, you are essentially telling people to just hire a part time nanny or quit their job if they can't handle the logistics, which is a "let them eat cake" kind of solution.

We all make choices. We all have our life situations to deal with.
I'm ONE of those who has pointed out that school is not childcare and I continue to hold fast to that perspective. Your argument of convenience or having to make different life choices doesn't sway me in the least. There is nothing requiring APS to provide extended day services. They are not required to make life convenient. They are required to provide a free public education. PERIOD.

DP. Sure, let's take that approach. Who do you think will be disproportionately burdened, the UMC family that can pay for alternative childcare, of the LMC/MC family struggling to get by as it is? Do you really think you're making life better for disadvantaged students by making school harder for their families?

And that's what it always comes back to, very conveniently: We ever-so- compassionate MC/UMC are concerned for the LMC/MC families who might be burdened.....after all the hardship and convenience for ourselves arguments are done.
Do you know the economic breakdown of extended day enrollees or who benefits more from extended day services? I don't. But I will bet the majority of them are not FRL-eligible families.

of course they are not. Extended day primarily serves the upper middle class two parent working family in arlington where at least one parent works 9-5. It does not serve those who do shift type work. Here is the breakdown as of last year

Number of Extended Day Families by Income Level
as of Sept. 30, 2018
Income Level After School Before School
Below $8,000 64 37
$8,001 - $12,000 202 120
$12,001 - $16,000 208 99
$16,001 - $20,000 127 58
$20,001 - $26,000 131 70
$26,001 - $32,000 81 34
$32,001 - $38,000 50 41
$38,001 - 46,000 68 43
$46,001 - $55,000 39 22
$55,001 - $65,000 53 29
$65,001 - $88,240 108 47
$88,241 & above 2054 904

https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/FY-2020-Budget-Questions-and-Responses-as-of-April-12-2019.pdf

Based on that breakdown, it appears that over a third of the students in extended day qualify as low-income.

Yeah and didn’t someone upthread say that the county average for FRL was about 30%? Seems like extended day serves many across the board.

DCUM posters who don’t use extended day are primarily wealthy stay at home moms. That they would have the gall to suggest it’s elimination is truly abhorrent.

I didn't review all the postings; but I don't recall it being recommended to eliminate it. It was pointed out that APS isn't required to offer it and then someone went on about how inconvenient that would be, making people hire nannies and whatnot.

This. Nobody is saying to eliminate it, but they aren’t required to provide it, nor are they required to make sure everyone has what they consider the most convenient situation, because in almost every situation, one person’s convenience will come at the cost of another’s. Some schools don’t have enough spots at extended day as it is and there are waitlists, so there aren’t guarantees even now. This can’t really be a factor in boundary decisions. They only have the schools where they have them, and that may not be in the place that is most convenient for transportation or the current population. And they can’t ever make everyone happy. They can’t promise that because you bought or rented a house in a specific school zone, that it will never change so as not to inconvenience you. That’s just not a realistic ask.

They should take into account where people live (what areas are dense), and which schools are walkable and which are not when considering whether or not to move option programs. But, they also have to consider instruction. For instance, if they move an Immersion program, they also need to consider whether or not that location will help them with the 50/50 student balance. And, per their own criteria, they have to consider demographics. They don’t want to create new schools with attendance zones where the fr/l rate would be over 80%. They have to look at the locations of option programs through that lens, too.

It’s a balancing act and not everyone is going to walk away with the outcome they want at the end. But they have to try to do right by the kids first, and that does include considering how families get their kids to and from school, but it can’t be the only thing they look at.

I don’t understand this reasoning at all. The only reason to bus students is to make schools more diverse because it boosts achievement for disadvantaged students. But how can you advocate for that in one breath and then in the next say APS shouldn't care about the increased burden they put on those same families, even though that burden correlates with worse educational outcomes for disadvantaged students?

Calm down. Nobody is going to “bus” students from one end of the county to the other. That is not what is happening.

They don’t have schools in every neighborhood. Walk zones are small. Many kids will have to take buses to get to school, always, because we don’t have schools in all the places we’d need them for everyone to walk.

And no, busing students does not correlate with worse outcomes, quite the opposite. But they’re not doing that anyway, so CALM DOWN.

citation?

You don’t have Google?

Why don’t you show me the study that shows Grandma being able to pick up her charge from extended day without having to take a bus materially affects student achievement.

If APS actually prioritized overall student needs and achievement ahead of parental convenience and wants ... what would that look like?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People prefer to have their kids as close to home as possible because it makes life easier, especially since there are no aftercare opportunities available in most neighborhoods other than APS extended day. When you move kids to more distant schools in a congested county, you are adding a significant round trip commute to the day in the race for a 6pm pickup. To the person who will helpfully point out that school is not childcare and kids can ride the bus, you are essentially telling people to just hire a part time nanny or quit their job if they can't handle the logistics, which is a "let them eat cake" kind of solution.

We all make choices. We all have our life situations to deal with.
I'm ONE of those who has pointed out that school is not childcare and I continue to hold fast to that perspective. Your argument of convenience or having to make different life choices doesn't sway me in the least. There is nothing requiring APS to provide extended day services. They are not required to make life convenient. They are required to provide a free public education. PERIOD.

DP. Sure, let's take that approach. Who do you think will be disproportionately burdened, the UMC family that can pay for alternative childcare, of the LMC/MC family struggling to get by as it is? Do you really think you're making life better for disadvantaged students by making school harder for their families?

And that's what it always comes back to, very conveniently: We ever-so- compassionate MC/UMC are concerned for the LMC/MC families who might be burdened.....after all the hardship and convenience for ourselves arguments are done.
Do you know the economic breakdown of extended day enrollees or who benefits more from extended day services? I don't. But I will bet the majority of them are not FRL-eligible families.

of course they are not. Extended day primarily serves the upper middle class two parent working family in arlington where at least one parent works 9-5. It does not serve those who do shift type work. Here is the breakdown as of last year

Number of Extended Day Families by Income Level
as of Sept. 30, 2018
Income Level After School Before School
Below $8,000 64 37
$8,001 - $12,000 202 120
$12,001 - $16,000 208 99
$16,001 - $20,000 127 58
$20,001 - $26,000 131 70
$26,001 - $32,000 81 34
$32,001 - $38,000 50 41
$38,001 - 46,000 68 43
$46,001 - $55,000 39 22
$55,001 - $65,000 53 29
$65,001 - $88,240 108 47
$88,241 & above 2054 904

https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/FY-2020-Budget-Questions-and-Responses-as-of-April-12-2019.pdf

Based on that breakdown, it appears that over a third of the students in extended day qualify as low-income.

Yeah and didn’t someone upthread say that the county average for FRL was about 30%? Seems like extended day serves many across the board.

DCUM posters who don’t use extended day are primarily wealthy stay at home moms. That they would have the gall to suggest it’s elimination is truly abhorrent.

I didn't review all the postings; but I don't recall it being recommended to eliminate it. It was pointed out that APS isn't required to offer it and then someone went on about how inconvenient that would be, making people hire nannies and whatnot.

This. Nobody is saying to eliminate it, but they aren’t required to provide it, nor are they required to make sure everyone has what they consider the most convenient situation, because in almost every situation, one person’s convenience will come at the cost of another’s. Some schools don’t have enough spots at extended day as it is and there are waitlists, so there aren’t guarantees even now. This can’t really be a factor in boundary decisions. They only have the schools where they have them, and that may not be in the place that is most convenient for transportation or the current population. And they can’t ever make everyone happy. They can’t promise that because you bought or rented a house in a specific school zone, that it will never change so as not to inconvenience you. That’s just not a realistic ask.

They should take into account where people live (what areas are dense), and which schools are walkable and which are not when considering whether or not to move option programs. But, they also have to consider instruction. For instance, if they move an Immersion program, they also need to consider whether or not that location will help them with the 50/50 student balance. And, per their own criteria, they have to consider demographics. They don’t want to create new schools with attendance zones where the fr/l rate would be over 80%. They have to look at the locations of option programs through that lens, too.

It’s a balancing act and not everyone is going to walk away with the outcome they want at the end. But they have to try to do right by the kids first, and that does include considering how families get their kids to and from school, but it can’t be the only thing they look at.

I don’t understand this reasoning at all. The only reason to bus students is to make schools more diverse because it boosts achievement for disadvantaged students. But how can you advocate for that in one breath and then in the next say APS shouldn't care about the increased burden they put on those same families, even though that burden correlates with worse educational outcomes for disadvantaged students?

Calm down. Nobody is going to “bus” students from one end of the county to the other. That is not what is happening.

They don’t have schools in every neighborhood. Walk zones are small. Many kids will have to take buses to get to school, always, because we don’t have schools in all the places we’d need them for everyone to walk.

And no, busing students does not correlate with worse outcomes, quite the opposite. But they’re not doing that anyway, so CALM DOWN.

citation?

You don’t have Google?

Why don’t you show me the study that shows Grandma being able to pick up her charge from extended day without having to take a bus materially affects student achievement.

I've only heard that busing does NOT help with performance, so I was surprised to see you claim otherwise. If you make the claim, support it. I'm not your google bitch.

DP - not involved in the inane extended day/grandmother discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People prefer to have their kids as close to home as possible because it makes life easier, especially since there are no aftercare opportunities available in most neighborhoods other than APS extended day. When you move kids to more distant schools in a congested county, you are adding a significant round trip commute to the day in the race for a 6pm pickup. To the person who will helpfully point out that school is not childcare and kids can ride the bus, you are essentially telling people to just hire a part time nanny or quit their job if they can't handle the logistics, which is a "let them eat cake" kind of solution.

We all make choices. We all have our life situations to deal with.
I'm ONE of those who has pointed out that school is not childcare and I continue to hold fast to that perspective. Your argument of convenience or having to make different life choices doesn't sway me in the least. There is nothing requiring APS to provide extended day services. They are not required to make life convenient. They are required to provide a free public education. PERIOD.

DP. Sure, let's take that approach. Who do you think will be disproportionately burdened, the UMC family that can pay for alternative childcare, of the LMC/MC family struggling to get by as it is? Do you really think you're making life better for disadvantaged students by making school harder for their families?

And that's what it always comes back to, very conveniently: We ever-so- compassionate MC/UMC are concerned for the LMC/MC families who might be burdened.....after all the hardship and convenience for ourselves arguments are done.
Do you know the economic breakdown of extended day enrollees or who benefits more from extended day services? I don't. But I will bet the majority of them are not FRL-eligible families.

of course they are not. Extended day primarily serves the upper middle class two parent working family in arlington where at least one parent works 9-5. It does not serve those who do shift type work. Here is the breakdown as of last year

Number of Extended Day Families by Income Level
as of Sept. 30, 2018
Income Level After School Before School
Below $8,000 64 37
$8,001 - $12,000 202 120
$12,001 - $16,000 208 99
$16,001 - $20,000 127 58
$20,001 - $26,000 131 70
$26,001 - $32,000 81 34
$32,001 - $38,000 50 41
$38,001 - 46,000 68 43
$46,001 - $55,000 39 22
$55,001 - $65,000 53 29
$65,001 - $88,240 108 47
$88,241 & above 2054 904

https://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/FY-2020-Budget-Questions-and-Responses-as-of-April-12-2019.pdf

Based on that breakdown, it appears that over a third of the students in extended day qualify as low-income.

Yeah and didn’t someone upthread say that the county average for FRL was about 30%? Seems like extended day serves many across the board.

DCUM posters who don’t use extended day are primarily wealthy stay at home moms. That they would have the gall to suggest it’s elimination is truly abhorrent.

I didn't review all the postings; but I don't recall it being recommended to eliminate it. It was pointed out that APS isn't required to offer it and then someone went on about how inconvenient that would be, making people hire nannies and whatnot.

This. Nobody is saying to eliminate it, but they aren’t required to provide it, nor are they required to make sure everyone has what they consider the most convenient situation, because in almost every situation, one person’s convenience will come at the cost of another’s. Some schools don’t have enough spots at extended day as it is and there are waitlists, so there aren’t guarantees even now. This can’t really be a factor in boundary decisions. They only have the schools where they have them, and that may not be in the place that is most convenient for transportation or the current population. And they can’t ever make everyone happy. They can’t promise that because you bought or rented a house in a specific school zone, that it will never change so as not to inconvenience you. That’s just not a realistic ask.

They should take into account where people live (what areas are dense), and which schools are walkable and which are not when considering whether or not to move option programs. But, they also have to consider instruction. For instance, if they move an Immersion program, they also need to consider whether or not that location will help them with the 50/50 student balance. And, per their own criteria, they have to consider demographics. They don’t want to create new schools with attendance zones where the fr/l rate would be over 80%. They have to look at the locations of option programs through that lens, too.

It’s a balancing act and not everyone is going to walk away with the outcome they want at the end. But they have to try to do right by the kids first, and that does include considering how families get their kids to and from school, but it can’t be the only thing they look at.

I don’t understand this reasoning at all. The only reason to bus students is to make schools more diverse because it boosts achievement for disadvantaged students. But how can you advocate for that in one breath and then in the next say APS shouldn't care about the increased burden they put on those same families, even though that burden correlates with worse educational outcomes for disadvantaged students?

Calm down. Nobody is going to “bus” students from one end of the county to the other. That is not what is happening.

They don’t have schools in every neighborhood. Walk zones are small. Many kids will have to take buses to get to school, always, because we don’t have schools in all the places we’d need them for everyone to walk.

And no, busing students does not correlate with worse outcomes, quite the opposite. But they’re not doing that anyway, so CALM DOWN.

Oh, the irony of yelling at someone to calm down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

There are small choices they can make that can not make things worse. For instance, moving the Gilliam Place PUs to Fleet rather than Barcroft, and the Arlington Mill residences to a Barcroft rather than Carlin Springs. They can’t completely change the make-up of all schools without “busing,” but they can avoid further entrenching segregation in some cases. Also, they still have to fill buildings and balance enrollment. If they can do that without exacerbating disparities between neighboring schools, they should.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

And the neighborhoods are that way because.....????
Historical redlining, segregation, wealthy whites flocking to wealthy white neighborhoods, NIMBYism, etc. aka, gerrymandering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

There are small choices they can make that can not make things worse. For instance, moving the Gilliam Place PUs to Fleet rather than Barcroft, and the Arlington Mill residences to a Barcroft rather than Carlin Springs. They can’t completely change the make-up of all schools without “busing,” but they can avoid further entrenching segregation in some cases. Also, they still have to fill buildings and balance enrollment. If they can do that without exacerbating disparities between neighboring schools, they should.

+1 The most important thing is de-concentrating excessive concentrations of poverty. It is disgraceful to have a range of 1% FRL to 80% FRL within a 26 square mile area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

There are small choices they can make that can not make things worse. For instance, moving the Gilliam Place PUs to Fleet rather than Barcroft, and the Arlington Mill residences to a Barcroft rather than Carlin Springs. They can’t completely change the make-up of all schools without “busing,” but they can avoid further entrenching segregation in some cases. Also, they still have to fill buildings and balance enrollment. If they can do that without exacerbating disparities between neighboring schools, they should.

Gilliam Place to Fleet is a helpful move. Arlington Mill to Barcroft is moving deck chairs on the Titanic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

And the neighborhoods are that way because.....????
Historical redlining, segregation, wealthy whites flocking to wealthy white neighborhoods, NIMBYism, etc. aka, gerrymandering.

Yes, that's why the neighborhoods are segregated. I'm still waiting to hear the plan to integrate Tuckahoe, Nottingham, Discovery, Jamestown, and Reed. Who goes where?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

And the neighborhoods are that way because.....????
Historical redlining, segregation, wealthy whites flocking to wealthy white neighborhoods, NIMBYism, etc. aka, gerrymandering.

Yes, that's why the neighborhoods are segregated. I'm still waiting to hear the plan to integrate Tuckahoe, Nottingham, Discovery, Jamestown, and Reed. Who goes where?

It’ll have nothing to do with integration, but APS will have to put an option school somewhere in the NW corner of the county, sooner or later. They’ve built too much capacity for an area that is not dense and is extremely unlikely to be upzoned for denser housing in the future. Most of the future population growth in the county is on major transportation corridors where there isn’t any land to build new schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where are these planning units that can be moved just a little further, but not too far, and will also significantly change the demographics of the schools? I don't think they exist. For real change you need to move people from S Arlington to the northwest schools. If Tuckahoe/Nottingham/Discovery/Jamestown are unacceptable locations for option schools because of access issues it's definitely not ok to force kids to travel there. If you move kids from northwest Arlington to S Arlington you are leaving empty seats that need to be filled in the NW. If you move kids around in the middle you aren't really accomplishing anything because those are the schools that are already balanced.

+1. The people claiming APS can meaningfully improve diversity without extensive busing are being deeply disingenuous. Our schools aren’t imbalanced because their borders have been gerrymandered that way, they’re imbalanced because the neighborhoods are imbalanced.

And the neighborhoods are that way because.....????
Historical redlining, segregation, wealthy whites flocking to wealthy white neighborhoods, NIMBYism, etc. aka, gerrymandering.

Yes, that's why the neighborhoods are segregated. I'm still waiting to hear the plan to integrate Tuckahoe, Nottingham, Discovery, Jamestown, and Reed. Who goes where?

You are not going to easily intergrate those schools tomorrow. It is just not feasible without crazy boundaries and a ton of bussing.

What you CAN do is look at some of the schools on the NA/SA border and try to redraw boundaries to even them out some. Ashlawn, Long Branch and Fleet are all under 30% this year while schools that immediately surround them are 50% and higher. Barcroft, Drew, Barrett and Randolph are all pretty high. I am sure there is a way to break all of those schools up and better draw boundaries without crazy bussing.

Turn Key into a neighborhood school, move the immersion program to Barcroft or Carlin Springs and you have even more flexibility to balance the numbers out.

Further down the road you can work on housing and other factors that contribute to the problem to better intergrate the schools that are not already intergrated.


There are a lot of factors that have lead to what we have now and I wish we could have all schools equal but to say we should not try because some schools will stay with super low FRL rates is not going to solve anything.

[Anonymous]

Dumb question, but if/when immersion moves it’ll be 2021/22, right? Not next year?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dumb question, but if/when immersion moves it’ll be 2021/22, right? Not next year?

Yes. Nothing is changing next year. Lots of uncertainty for incoming K kids because they aren't committing to deciding anything until fall 2020.