Spare

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For those who are appalled at how Harry is airing his “family’s” dirty laundry, this isn’t a family. At best this is a dysfunctional business that is desperate to hang into its position. While many of us would operate under different norms when it comes to our own families, those norms have never applied to the BRF.

We all know it’s ugly and unfair. But apparently no one wants to see it in print or hear it said out loud.



See, that's part of the charm of the royal family. It is a family, including family squabbles and family laundry. But still, family laundry doesn't need to be public.


As an American and someone who believes in the importance of family, I don’t find any of it charming. And you’re still applying traditional family norms to them. They are in the public eye and hold their positions because….they were born into a certain group of people who are related by birth whose ancestors acquired wealth and power in questionable ways. Being part of that “family” means nothing if you aren’t the monarch, the direct heir to the throne, or are willing to live your entire life supporting the monarch and the heir.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For those who are appalled at how Harry is airing his “family’s” dirty laundry, this isn’t a family. At best this is a dysfunctional business that is desperate to hang into its position. While many of us would operate under different norms when it comes to our own families, those norms have never applied to the BRF.

We all know it’s ugly and unfair. But apparently no one wants to see it in print or hear it said out loud.



See, that's part of the charm of the royal family. It is a family, including family squabbles and family laundry. But still, family laundry doesn't need to be public.


As an American and someone who believes in the importance of family, I don’t find any of it charming. And you’re still applying traditional family norms to them. They are in the public eye and hold their positions because….they were born into a certain group of people who are related by birth whose ancestors acquired wealth and power in questionable ways. Being part of that “family” means nothing if you aren’t the monarch, the direct heir to the throne, or are willing to live your entire life supporting the monarch and the heir.


I guess I'm not sure what you're arguing. That they aren't a family? Or should behave better since they are a family? Or that you just think it's good entertainment and fine for Harry to write a tell-all book about his family and the current and future king and queen of England?
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For those who are appalled at how Harry is airing his “family’s” dirty laundry, this isn’t a family. At best this is a dysfunctional business that is desperate to hang into its position. While many of us would operate under different norms when it comes to our own families, those norms have never applied to the BRF.

We all know it’s ugly and unfair. But apparently no one wants to see it in print or hear it said out loud.



See, that's part of the charm of the royal family. It is a family, including family squabbles and family laundry. But still, family laundry doesn't need to be public.


As an American and someone who believes in the importance of family, I don’t find any of it charming. And you’re still applying traditional family norms to them. They are in the public eye and hold their positions because….they were born into a certain group of people who are related by birth whose ancestors acquired wealth and power in questionable ways. Being part of that “family” means nothing if you aren’t the monarch, the direct heir to the throne, or are willing to live your entire life supporting the monarch and the heir.


I guess I'm not sure what you're arguing. That they aren't a family? Or should behave better since they are a family? Or that you just think it's good entertainment and fine for Harry to write a tell-all book about his family and the current and future king and queen of England?


Did you read the first post? To be clear, I think Harry is fully within his rights to tell his story. Those claiming to be appalled that he’d “air his family’s dirty laundry” presume that his family operates as ours do. But it doesn’t. Given everything that the world has learned about the royals over the last 40 years, it’s baffling to me how people honestly can claim he “shouldn’t” be saying these things in public. And for Americans to side with the monarchy and act as though they are the epitome of class and morality - and that Harry is persona non grata for speaking out against them- is even more baffling.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:“Willy”;expected Meghan to curtsy to him the first time they met! His brother’s serious girlfriend in a casual, private venue (Harry’s kitchen).

How can you people defend him? He’s so gross.


She wanted to be a princess. That means that lots of people bow to her. And she curtseys to a few people.


True. If you accept the system (which I think needs to be abolished), you accept the system. That said, William sounds quite rigid.

FIGHT OVER WEDDING VENUES

Harry claims the royal household dragged its feet over the date and venue for his wedding with Meghan. He says that when he consulted his brother about the possibility of marrying in Westminster Abbey or St. Paul's Cathedral, William said he could not marry there because they had been venues for the weddings of Charles and Diana and of William and Kate respectively. Instead, William suggested a village chapel near Charles' home at Highgrove House in southwest England. Harry and Meghan finally got married at St George's Chapel, Windsor Castle, in May 2018.


He is not rigid, he was right. It would have been out of place to have Harry’s wedding at Westminster Abbey, too grand. Even the one he got at Windsor was too grand and expensive given what UK has been going through. Plus, are you telling me that the couple who said they did not want a big wedding and it was all a spectacle forced on them by the RF actually wanted a king sized wedding at Westminster Abbey?


Why? Princess Anne got married in Westminster Abbey and she wasn’t the second in line of succession-she was fourth because of her three brothers


+1 And Princess Beatrice also got married at Windsor Castle in the exact same year as Prince Harry. There's no rule that people get to keep their wedding venues exclusive.


Didn’t more people watch H&M’s wedding than Will and Kates? Pretty sure I read that, and at that time H&M we’re still viewed as the workhorses of the BRF, increasing the likeability factor of an outdated institution and the lack of appeal of Charles & Wills. Does anyone else remember something happening on instagram about the same time? I remember H&M gaining more followers than W&K bc either they had to pull back or ended up combining? I remember thinking there was probably tension that W&K were not as popular. I feel like there was a viral tik tok or other video explaining it.

I’m not a fan of the royals - it’s like the epitome of wealthy white entitlement, especially with the feet dragging and covering of Andrew’s pedo/predator scandal. I went to a wealthy private college and am about the same age as Will & Kate; people definitely were dressing up and having inappropriate costume parties. No one dressed up as a nazi (it was heavily Jewish), but for sure minority stereotypes, socioeconomic stereotypes. Etc. And the stories leaking about Will’s purported affair, the general snobbery or rudeness among their crowd, it doesn’t seem surprising. These are very wealthy, privileged people and they likely do behave badly by todays standards, but it wasn’t a shock until someone so very different entered their social circle - different culture, race, socioeconomic background... i mean the entire institution continues to rely on its ties to colonialism, which seems unbelievable. So I’m biased, but I think in normal life, we are generally sympathetic to people experience significant favoritism of a sibling; the BRF is even worse for that, and it must have been frustrating especially when H&M surged in popularity. I imagine the “machine” did its work to try to balance things out, but at a minimum the party line is always to stay behind the heir. I also thought that prior to meeting Meghan, Harry always appeared quietly disapproving of the way his brother treated Kate, whether it be walking ahead of her or lack of attention or obvious affection, which seems an earlier divergence between the two, with Will follwing the fairly cold royal protocol and Harry expecting a warmer focus on family. Really, no one knows the true story, but the idealization of the BRF and the blind adherence to the idea Will is impotent and bound by protocol (or Charles for that matter, who could change whatever he wants) is stunning to me.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I read that Harry will narrate the audiobook, which makes it more interesting to me. I won't buy the book so I'll have to wait for it via the library on Overdrive.


Oh that’s awesome if true. I’m definitely buying it the audiobook in that case.


It’s definitely true. Amazon and iTunes both have links up for pre-orders.



Lol Harry will be reading his ghostwriters work for the first time so you and him will in essence be discovering the book together!! So exciting
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Anonymous wrote:https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11602551/Prince-Harrys-book-William-pointed-finger-Meghan-called-rude.html
I hope Spare is clearer than this DailyMail article. Meghan makes a comment about hormones that sets Kate off at the bridal salon, but then somehow (at a different point in time?) William shows up and waves a finger in her face and that makes Meghan cry?


The way I read this is that there was a confrontation after the bridal salon exchange.

Man if someone I barely knew told me I had "baby brain" I would be LIVID. Is anyone else seeing this as William defending his wife?


Yeah, but I thought there was crying during the bridal salon exchange, so I guess I'm just not understanding the sequence. Anyway, I can see how some people would get pissed at that kind of offhand remark being made, especially Kate with her tough pregnancies. But many many many others would just laugh it off.


yeah. i joke about mommy brain and baby brain with my friends (who are also mothers). it's definitely not up there with the worst things you could say to an in-law.


Not the worst thing. But it can be used as an insult. And getting a finger wag in response seems appropriate.

Not a great relationship among in-laws. But not the worst. Or at least not then - now it is. SMH



How could the money and revenge possibly have been worth the end of your relationship with your only brother? I don't care how much you resented being "the spare," it is simply not worth it.


What did Harry actually want of William? To change their birth order? In every aspect of life (like it or not), there is a hierarchy.



I think he wanted his family/the institution to protect him in the same way William was protected. It's an understandable desire, if not realistic.


Of course he didn't want to "change the birth order." God, I don't think he envies William in any way and barely tolerated his royal duties, given what happened to his mother. And after finding other things that gave him more happiness: his military service, his philanthropies, and now his wife/kids. He absolutely expected his brother and father to protect his family and they didn't, going as far to remove their security detail once they decided to step away. Were they entitled to pull it back? Sure. But it makes them look petty and vindictive, and left them open to security breaches. Jesus, Tyler Perry had to step in to help them when their own family couldn't be magnanimous enough to keep them safe. It's absolutely grotesque.

While there are not doubt different recollections on the two sides re: some of the details, I 100000% believe Harry and Meghan. There are plenty of examples of hideous behavior by the Royal family to know what they are saying is true. Good for them for stepping away. Protecting their family. And of not longer sitting back and being the punching bags and telling their side.


H&M could have stayed in England (even as non-working Royals) and lived at Frogmore House and had security. They chose to move to the US, out of the jurisdiction of the British government. If they didn’t think through the consequences of that, that’s on them. They said they wanted to be independent and make their own way (except for the titles, and the police protection, and the Royal family sticking up for them in the press…). Choices have consequences.


Well, they're making more money now than in Britain. So, yeah! You're right, choices have consequences .


Security alone was worth more than they have made by cashing in all their cards.


Yet at some point, had they stayed, their financial well-being, possibly where they lived, and legal custody of their children would have been in William’s hands. That’s reason enough for leaving while they still had multiple options for making money — and possibly better options for the well-being of their kids.


This nonsense was floated as a justification for Meghan to take Archie and run. It was nonsense then and it's nonsense now.

Also, Beatrice and Eugenie may not have everything they desire but they are doing just fine. "Better option for the well-being of their kids"? Being raised as the idle rich in California is healthier for them than being raised in England among family? I suppose anything is possible.


Nonsense? Check out the list of people that the reigning monarch actually has legal rights over — whether or not they choose to exercise those rights. The grandchildren of the King are on that list. Guess who that transfers to next?

Similarly, I’m sure you’ve done a deep dive into the impact of lifelong attention of the very racist press on the first openly mixed race grandchildren of a British monarch. A summary of your findings would be great.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Initially I was very sympathetic to them but now I'm with those who feel it's incredibly unfair to disclose what largely amounts to private family business, when the opposing side is not permitted to respond with their side of it. Just gross.


The 'other side' is constantly getting their side out though leaks to friendly press


H and M were doing he same thing. Well, M was.


At least they put their names on it, instead of letting the tabloids do the dirty work.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Violence is inexcusable. If indeed William laid hands in his brother he has a lot to apologize for.


Inexcusable? I don't know, some brothers still wrestle, even as grown-ups. Should they? Probably not. People do lots of things they probably shouldn't do.

Presumably a friendly tussle is different from shoving your brother forcefully because you disapprove of his choice of wife. 🙄


The issue was that Meghan was bullying the palace staff.


I really wish she'd addressed this in their documentary on Netflix.



She didn't dare say anything about it, lest Buckingham Palace release "the goods" on her. Wonder if it will leak now. William will be p*ssed and likely find it difficult to restrain himself.


Why would they do that? I thought they would say no comment. Are you saying they will make an exception to trash MM?
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:For those who are appalled at how Harry is airing his “family’s” dirty laundry, this isn’t a family. At best this is a dysfunctional business that is desperate to hang into its position. While many of us would operate under different norms when it comes to our own families, those norms have never applied to the BRF.

We all know it’s ugly and unfair. But apparently no one wants to see it in print or hear it said out loud.



Yes, it IS a family. It may not be a family you admire, but he's sharing family moments and situations just to earn a buck. Neither he nor Meghan appear to want to be a part of their families. So be it, but they can't deny their backgrounds and hereditary factors that make them who they are -- in fact, very similar to the family members they criticize.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Harry's book?
No, he is illiterate


Thanks for letting us know that you don’t know what illiterate means.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11602551/Prince-Harrys-book-William-pointed-finger-Meghan-called-rude.html
I hope Spare is clearer than this DailyMail article. Meghan makes a comment about hormones that sets Kate off at the bridal salon, but then somehow (at a different point in time?) William shows up and waves a finger in her face and that makes Meghan cry?


The way I read this is that there was a confrontation after the bridal salon exchange.

Man if someone I barely knew told me I had "baby brain" I would be LIVID. Is anyone else seeing this as William defending his wife?


Yeah, but I thought there was crying during the bridal salon exchange, so I guess I'm just not understanding the sequence. Anyway, I can see how some people would get pissed at that kind of offhand remark being made, especially Kate with her tough pregnancies. But many many many others would just laugh it off.


yeah. i joke about mommy brain and baby brain with my friends (who are also mothers). it's definitely not up there with the worst things you could say to an in-law.


Not the worst thing. But it can be used as an insult. And getting a finger wag in response seems appropriate.

Not a great relationship among in-laws. But not the worst. Or at least not then - now it is. SMH



How could the money and revenge possibly have been worth the end of your relationship with your only brother? I don't care how much you resented being "the spare," it is simply not worth it.


What did Harry actually want of William? To change their birth order? In every aspect of life (like it or not), there is a hierarchy.



I think he wanted his family/the institution to protect him in the same way William was protected. It's an understandable desire, if not realistic.


+1

He literally says in the 60 minutes clip “I want a family, not an institution.”

What do people not get about this?? Makes perfect sense. It’s never a good idea to so clearly treat one sibling better than the other. And don’t give me any Bs about this being the royal family. It doesn’t matter, they don’t “have” to do things that way.


The BRF is probably one of the most dysfunctional families.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:He didn’t have to be the spare. He could have done something with his life. Couldn’t advance in the military because he couldn’t pass the texts so he had to leave, didn’t go to college, so complaining is his only means of employment.


Something like what? Sentebale? The Invictus Games? Co-write a book that has attracted worldwide interest? Establish a globally focused foundation? What exactly do you think Harry “could have done…with is life” that you would regard as more suitable employment?


All of those are great things but he needs to stop complaining.


I’m sure he cares deeply about what some nobody on an American mommy message board thinks he “needs to stop” doing.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:I see no one is taking on Harry’s complaint that his father and brother leaked negative stories about Meghan to the press. How is that defensible?


Would love to hear what the BRF has to say about it.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:He didn’t have to be the spare. He could have done something with his life. Couldn’t advance in the military because he couldn’t pass the texts so he had to leave, didn’t go to college, so complaining is his only means of employment.


Something like what? Sentebale? The Invictus Games? Co-write a book that has attracted worldwide interest? Establish a globally focused foundation? What exactly do you think Harry “could have done…with is life” that you would regard as more suitable employment?


All of those are great things but he needs to stop complaining.


I’m sure he cares deeply about what some nobody on an American mommy message board thinks he “needs to stop” doing.


+1 Nothing will get between him and getting a buck at the expense of his family.
Anonymous
This whole thing is in such poor taste. I can’t believe the world knows these personal details. I feel like Harry literally didn’t understand the assignment with this memoir and he has removed all doubt that he’s a fool. As they say, discretion is the better part of valor.
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