What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m not going to quote that long explanation but seems very plausible to me. One member started to collapse and brought the whole thing down.

And coupled with the idea that they were overconfident about conditions and their capabilities. That seems very plausible.

[Anonymous]

I think she died first. If he were ill, he would not be able to care for the dog and baby. She was much smaller than him. Men have longer legs, can take greater strides. He may have been waiting for her to catch up. She may have drunk water, and then vomited it. The vomit evaporated, leaving no trace. He may have sat to wait for her, not knowing she was ill. When he found her, he couldn't call for help. He walked back to sit so the baby wouldn't see the dead mom. It's very hot having a baby on your back. He had no will to live with her gone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m not going to quote that long explanation but seems very plausible to me. One member started to collapse and brought the whole thing down.

I’m slowly starting to be maybe convinced of it too, BUT:

1. The comments from the dad’s dad in the UK really sounded like he knew it was family annihilation to me

2. Authorities said they can’t tell the cause, and they put out that potential algae theory. If there was a snake bite or sprained ankle, that would have been apparent.

3. Isn’t heat stroke something that would leave indicators? Then why are they waiting for toxicology? The fact that it all hinges on toxicology suggest some kind of poisoning

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not that odd to me that they still had drinking water. If the deaths were heat-related they were probably trying to conserve the water while they were still capable of rational thought (again I think they likely planned a short AM hike and something happened to keep them out there longer than expected - sprained ankle, dog overexerts and collapses, any number of things can happen to even experienced outdoorsmen and women and they didn't want to burn through all the water they packed for a short hike). They didn't realize they were in a survival situation until it was too late - at some point you aren't going to be thinking clearly or rationally about the water.

Unfortunately, decision-making rapidly deteriorates in conditions like this and even experienced hikers can get themselves into a deadly situation as a result. One of the things experienced hikers do that can actually be worse for their survival is try to self-rescue.

DP. Agree. I also think the people who find the heatstroke theory implausible are assuming that they all dropped dead at once, and there is no reason to think that. It’s entirely possible that one of them (most likely the dad) wasn’t feeling well. He was in his mid 40s, not thin, and pasty. Could be the heat, a heart issue, who knows. When it’s clear he can’t continue up a steep switchback (1500 feet elevation gain up the remaining 1.5 miles) they maybe waste too much time in the brutal heat panicking about the best way to get him to safety. They decide having him and the baby resting there makes the most sense so she can move fast to get help (the mom is slight and carrying the baby would slow her down if she could carry her that far at all). She puts the baby next to him in the shade of his body (websleuths theory), leaves the dog to guard them, and leaves the remaining water with them. She sprints up the trail to go for help, faints, and that’s the end of the chances for all of them. Dad passes out from heat. Baby can’t escape the carrier, nor dog, who, is tethered to them. Also plausible that dog or baby struggled first and they both tried to sprint the rest of the way home to save them, dad needs to rest because he’s carrying one or both, same outcome.

I think they got overconfident because they thought their hiking experience prepared them for every eventuality.

Then why didn't she take the phone? The phone blows this whole theory to bits. They have the wherewithal to make an exit plan but she forgets the one thing that will enable her to summon help?

Maybe by the time she took off, the heat had gotten to her too and she wasn't thinking clearly. If dad was struggling and had to sit and rest, I can't see mom being all that eager to leave her baby behind and go for help on her own. She probably stayed with them too long.

[Anonymous]

There was no phone reception so no point in carrying it.

You can't judge someone's health based on their skin color. Don't call white people "pasty" unless you want to sound like a racist.

Men are usually more into hiking than women. She seemed more fashionable and into yoga which is not very strenuous. If she were breastfeeding, that could have dehydrated her more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not going to quote that long explanation but seems very plausible to me. One member started to collapse and brought the whole thing down.

I’m slowly starting to be maybe convinced of it too, BUT:

1. The comments from the dad’s dad in the UK really sounded like he knew it was family annihilation to me

2. Authorities said they can’t tell the cause, and they put out that potential algae theory. If there was a snake bite or sprained ankle, that would have been apparent.

3. Isn’t heat stroke something that would leave indicators? Then why are they waiting for toxicology? The fact that it all hinges on toxicology suggest some kind of poisoning

The chances of all 3 autopsies showing no signs of heat stroke, if it was heat stroke are slim. The signs may be minimal but you would think under these conditions the medical examiner would be looking closely for any sign of heat stroke. None was found so I think the heat stroke is off the table.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not going to quote that long explanation but seems very plausible to me. One member started to collapse and brought the whole thing down.

I’m slowly starting to be maybe convinced of it too, BUT:

1. The comments from the dad’s dad in the UK really sounded like he knew it was family annihilation to me

2. Authorities said they can’t tell the cause, and they put out that potential algae theory. If there was a snake bite or sprained ankle, that would have been apparent.

3. Isn’t heat stroke something that would leave indicators? Then why are they waiting for toxicology? The fact that it all hinges on toxicology suggest some kind of poisoning

Why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Heat stroke only makes sense to me if I think of it as a domino effect, rather than everyone coincidentally going at the same time.

Dog runs happily down the trail to start the day, but becomes overheated and worn out playing alongside the river. When they start back up the trail, dog is moving more slowly than normal, so the hike stretches more into the heat of the day than planned. This wears on all of them. Dog eventually needs assistance getting up the hill. Mom and Dad are trying to share the heavy lifting (baby and/or dog). When one parent gets too worn out, the other takes a turn. Now the hike is taking even longer, and it's getting hotter. One of the adults starts to show signs of heat stress, so they stop to rest. Both parents are completely spent by now. Dog collapses during the rest period. Parents decide it's time to split up. Dad will stay with the dog, mom will go for help. She knows she won't be able to carry the baby the rest of the way up, so they decide baby will stay with Dad until she can come back with help. Unfortunately, she never does - she only makes it a little way up the trail before she collapses in the heat. Were they close enough for Dad to see her collapse? If it was around a switchback, he may not have realized it, so he sat there for a while waiting for her to send help - not knowing that she hadn't made it. He may have died shortly after, or an hour or more later. Even if a few hours passed, and he started to accept that help wasn't coming, the extra time sitting in direct sun meant he just couldn't get up at that point, especially carrying the baby. Baby would not have survived long with both parents passed out or dead.

The only thing about this scenario that doesn't make any sense at all: they apparently still had water. Maybe they were trying to save it for the baby? And neither of them realized just how bad of shape they were in until it was too late .... if they were still together, when one person started to collapse the other would likely push water on them, but if they had already split up at that point...

I don't know. Family annihilation could make sense too, but it's an odd way to do it. Not sure I buy the toxic algae theory.

Actually that totally makes sense. I live in a very hot desert, and a few years back a family got lost while hiking. Mom and dad died of heatstroke because they saved all the water for their child. So this mom and dad could have been saving the water for the baby (as most parents would), and ended up dying first.

[Anonymous]

What did the dad's dad say?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What did the dad's dad say?

It’s in this thread. I think it came from an article in People.

He said something along the lines of “I can’t say much, so much going on, we just have to wait for the authorities to do their jobs”. I don’t know, I just got the sense that it’s more than the sorrow of losing your kid in a tragic accident.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There was no phone reception so no point in carrying it.

You can't judge someone's health based on their skin color. Don't call white people "pasty" unless you want to sound like a racist.

Men are usually more into hiking than women. She seemed more fashionable and into yoga which is not very strenuous. If she were breastfeeding, that could have dehydrated her more.

You are an idiot. Calling someone pasty is not racist. Yoga is extremely strenuous when done at a higher level (power yoga). Go away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There was no phone reception so no point in carrying it.

You can't judge someone's health based on their skin color. Don't call white people "pasty" unless you want to sound like a racist.

Men are usually more into hiking than women. She seemed more fashionable and into yoga which is not very strenuous. If she were breastfeeding, that could have dehydrated her more.

What? I’m a woman and way into hiking. Including hikes at the elevation and gain they were doing. I don’t purposely go in such hot weather but have. If you hike regularly, it’s really not so bad. These folks looked to be in great shape and acclimated to the heat.

When not hiking, I like fashion. I’m not into yoga, but it can be very strenuous and muscle building.

[Anonymous]

Murder suicide. Question is who is the killer mom or dad. At first I thought dad but now I’m thinking mom and maybe she panicked and went to get help but then too late

[Anonymous]

FWIW, my dad passed out in the Mojave desert after sitting on a hot rock to rest. The Ranger told him that one should never sit on hot rocks in the desert because the heat draws the blood to the lower extremites so that when you try to get up you pass out. However, I just Googled that "fact" and can't find it.

[Anonymous]

Also we don’t know what they found or didn’t Find at the scene or at their house in terms of poison. That hasn’t been disclosed.