Admissions to change at Thomas Jefferson High, and others

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Change must happen.

Why?

[Anonymous]

Isn't the main point of TJ that it offers classes beyond what is offered in regular high schools? There are many post-AP classes in math, science, computer programming, and other areas. If a child is not advanced enough to take advantage of these classes, then there's no point in having that child attend TJ. Every area high school has a full load of AP or IB classes for those who are going to end high school at that level.

If they want to increase representation at TJ, the answer is to look at stronger free PK3/PK4 programs, improve Young Scholars, provide some free after school and summer enrichment. Then, ideally more URMs get into AAP and from there build up the qualifications to make them better candidates for TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. TJ parent here who came from Title I ES and MS so very interested.

Not sure I think the lottery after the first step test will solve the problem, but interesting idea. I liked the middle school idea as I thought there were other qualified applicants at my Title I MS who would have thrived at TJ.

The existence of feeder schools (which of course reflect the SES of applicants) is my interest - I am a proponent of offering lottery slots to FARMS kids to attend the ES and MS that send the majority of kids to TJ so those kids can immerse themselves in schools designed to prepare kids for the rigors of TJ. And please don't come at me with the busing argument t- I met family after family at Title I schools who would be perfectly willing to put their child on a longer bus ride to get them to a better school.

For others, here is the article:

https://wtop.com/education/2020/08/elite-public-schools-in-virginia-elsewhere-seek-diversity/

Why should Gen Ed parents at already overcrowded AAP centers have to accept even more overcrowding so other kids can "immerse themselves" in the AAP atmosphere?

Really stupid idea. If you want to eliminate AAP centers, just say so.

something about it being a public school seems like a good enough justification

They already have access to a public school, though maybe not the one you want. Overcrowding another school isn't the solution.

funny, that same statement could be applied to kids being bussed to level iv centers

[Anonymous]

Your kid is *not* more meritorious than a poor kid just because you paid for AOPS, Kumon, and an expensive home in a neighborhood with a middle school that has mathcounts, model UN, etc. Repeat that until it sinks in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As an AAP teacher, I see too many kids who are admitted to the program and whose math or reading skills are below grade level. It's true, and it needs to be fixed. These kids struggle to keep up. It's not fair to them - it's not meeting their needs.

This is interesting. Maybe we should look at kids who get admitted but then struggle, as this teacher says many do.

Since you only gain admission by passing the test, if you get in there and can't do the work... back to your home school.

+1. Doesn't TJ give you the boot if you get below a B+? Why should kids be allowed to stay in AAP if they can't keep up?

Isn't that why the term 'twice execptional' was invented? AAP isn't about being a good student, it's about being gifted and it's possible to be both gifted and a terrible student

That is not what twice exceptional means. 2E kids are kids who are gifted and have learning disabilities or ADHD or Autism or something else going on that impacts their ability to learn. 2E acknowledges that there are kids who have exceptional intelligence and learning issues that make it harder for them to demonstrate that they are exceptionally bright.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. TJ parent here who came from Title I ES and MS so very interested.

Not sure I think the lottery after the first step test will solve the problem, but interesting idea. I liked the middle school idea as I thought there were other qualified applicants at my Title I MS who would have thrived at TJ.

The existence of feeder schools (which of course reflect the SES of applicants) is my interest - I am a proponent of offering lottery slots to FARMS kids to attend the ES and MS that send the majority of kids to TJ so those kids can immerse themselves in schools designed to prepare kids for the rigors of TJ. And please don't come at me with the busing argument t- I met family after family at Title I schools who would be perfectly willing to put their child on a longer bus ride to get them to a better school.

For others, here is the article:

https://wtop.com/education/2020/08/elite-public-schools-in-virginia-elsewhere-seek-diversity/

Why should Gen Ed parents at already overcrowded AAP centers have to accept even more overcrowding so other kids can "immerse themselves" in the AAP atmosphere?

Really stupid idea. If you want to eliminate AAP centers, just say so.

Well, you could also redistrict overcrowded schools in high SES areas like the feeder schools, do you think parents would like that better?

something about it being a public school seems like a good enough justification

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. TJ parent here who came from Title I ES and MS so very interested.

Not sure I think the lottery after the first step test will solve the problem, but interesting idea. I liked the middle school idea as I thought there were other qualified applicants at my Title I MS who would have thrived at TJ.

The existence of feeder schools (which of course reflect the SES of applicants) is my interest - I am a proponent of offering lottery slots to FARMS kids to attend the ES and MS that send the majority of kids to TJ so those kids can immerse themselves in schools designed to prepare kids for the rigors of TJ. And please don't come at me with the busing argument t- I met family after family at Title I schools who would be perfectly willing to put their child on a longer bus ride to get them to a better school.

For others, here is the article:

https://wtop.com/education/2020/08/elite-public-schools-in-virginia-elsewhere-seek-diversity/

Why should Gen Ed parents at already overcrowded AAP centers have to accept even more overcrowding so other kids can "immerse themselves" in the AAP atmosphere?

Really stupid idea. If you want to eliminate AAP centers, just say so.

something about it being a public school seems like a good enough justification

They already have access to a public school, though maybe not the one you want. Overcrowding another school isn't the solution.

funny, that same statement could be applied to kids being bussed to level iv centers

That is true, but it hardly suggests that more of the same is a good idea. They ought to be downsizing the mega-centers like Carson, not expanding them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As an AAP teacher, I see too many kids who are admitted to the program and whose math or reading skills are below grade level. It's true, and it needs to be fixed. These kids struggle to keep up. It's not fair to them - it's not meeting their needs.

This is interesting. Maybe we should look at kids who get admitted but then struggle, as this teacher says many do.

Since you only gain admission by passing the test, if you get in there and can't do the work... back to your home school.

+1. Doesn't TJ give you the boot if you get below a B+? Why should kids be allowed to stay in AAP if they can't keep up?

Isn't that why the term 'twice execptional' was invented? AAP isn't about being a good student, it's about being gifted and it's possible to be both gifted and a terrible student

That is not what twice exceptional means. 2E kids are kids who are gifted and have learning disabilities or ADHD or Autism or something else going on that impacts their ability to learn. 2E acknowledges that there are kids who have exceptional intelligence and learning issues that make it harder for them to demonstrate that they are exceptionally bright.

you mean gifted kids who are terrible students?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. TJ parent here who came from Title I ES and MS so very interested.

Not sure I think the lottery after the first step test will solve the problem, but interesting idea. I liked the middle school idea as I thought there were other qualified applicants at my Title I MS who would have thrived at TJ.

The existence of feeder schools (which of course reflect the SES of applicants) is my interest - I am a proponent of offering lottery slots to FARMS kids to attend the ES and MS that send the majority of kids to TJ so those kids can immerse themselves in schools designed to prepare kids for the rigors of TJ. And please don't come at me with the busing argument t- I met family after family at Title I schools who would be perfectly willing to put their child on a longer bus ride to get them to a better school.

For others, here is the article:

https://wtop.com/education/2020/08/elite-public-schools-in-virginia-elsewhere-seek-diversity/

Why should Gen Ed parents at already overcrowded AAP centers have to accept even more overcrowding so other kids can "immerse themselves" in the AAP atmosphere?

Really stupid idea. If you want to eliminate AAP centers, just say so.

then just do away with centers

something about it being a public school seems like a good enough justification

They already have access to a public school, though maybe not the one you want. Overcrowding another school isn't the solution.

funny, that same statement could be applied to kids being bussed to level iv centers

That is true, but it hardly suggests that more of the same is a good idea. They ought to be downsizing the mega-centers like Carson, not expanding them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love the lottery idea. And the reserved slots by geography. It is a public school, it should serve all students.

Why not enter all students who complete algebra I in middle school with a B average or better into the lottery? No special test, no extracurriculars or essays.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the lottery idea. And the reserved slots by geography. It is a public school, it should serve all students.

Why not enter all students who complete algebra I in middle school with a B average or better into the lottery? No special test, no extracurriculars or essays.

Exactly.

NP with an elementary schooler so no current dog in this fight. If you do nothing else starting in Pre-K to prepare kids at all the middle schools for the rigor of TH, then do the reserved slots matter? Do you then need to downgrade the rigor of TJ because the kids may have the ability but not the requisite knowledge to succeed because they are behind others?

I’m sure I’m missing something, but that’s my initial thought.

[Anonymous]

There is no way to keep the rigor of TJ by doing something like geographical quotas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the lottery idea. And the reserved slots by geography. It is a public school, it should serve all students.

Why not enter all students who complete algebra I in middle school with a B average or better into the lottery? No special test, no extracurriculars or essays.

Exactly.

A B average in middle school in Algebra is a low bar for TJ. TJ rejects hundreds of students every year who have all As, including in Geometry.

I guess you could do that if your main goal was increasing the number of Blacks and Hispanics. Make no mistake, though, New TJ wouldn't be much more than an Academy program, it wouldn't continue to offer the same number of higher level courses, and it likely would be considered inferior to many of the neighborhood schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As an AAP teacher, I see too many kids who are admitted to the program and whose math or reading skills are below grade level. It's true, and it needs to be fixed. These kids struggle to keep up. It's not fair to them - it's not meeting their needs.

This is interesting. Maybe we should look at kids who get admitted but then struggle, as this teacher says many do.

Since you only gain admission by passing the test, if you get in there and can't do the work... back to your home school.

+1. Doesn't TJ give you the boot if you get below a B+? Why should kids be allowed to stay in AAP if they can't keep up?

Isn't that why the term 'twice execptional' was invented? AAP isn't about being a good student, it's about being gifted and it's possible to be both gifted and a terrible student

That is not what twice exceptional means. 2E kids are kids who are gifted and have learning disabilities or ADHD or Autism or something else going on that impacts their ability to learn. 2E acknowledges that there are kids who have exceptional intelligence and learning issues that make it harder for them to demonstrate that they are exceptionally bright.

you mean gifted kids who are terrible students?

You are definitely not gifted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the lottery idea. And the reserved slots by geography. It is a public school, it should serve all students.

Why not enter all students who complete algebra I in middle school with a B average or better into the lottery? No special test, no extracurriculars or essays.

Exactly.

A B average in middle school in Algebra is a low bar for TJ. TJ rejects hundreds of students every year who have all As, including in Geometry.

I guess you could do that if your main goal was increasing the number of Blacks and Hispanics. Make no mistake, though, New TJ wouldn't be much more than an Academy program, it wouldn't continue to offer the same number of higher level courses, and it likely would be considered inferior to many of the neighborhood schools.

ok?