So realistically, when do you think somewhat normal full time f2f education will resume?

[Anonymous]

I think Fall 2022.

However, I think there will be incremental baby steps along the way with Fall 2021 looking more like “normal”, but maybe more cleaning and continued part-time or a la carte DL as an option in order to reduce secondary and college class sizes.

Of course, we may have a completely new pandemic the year after that. Humanity has entered the era of novel diseases rapidly spreading.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

Stupid tw*t, my kid is 15 years old and needs zero child care but an EDUCATION.

And they are getting one to the best of the public school system’s abilities and in consideration of public health. Your child is in more need of a parent who cares about needs other than their own and doesn’t call people names on the internet. Be a role model instead of throwing tantrums.

[Anonymous]

To answer your question: Fall 2021

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

DP. My kids are in high school. I don't need childcare. My children do need an education. And yes, they need school for that. It is not selfish of me to want my children, and everybody else's children, to get an education.

This! Geez! Enough with saying this is only about childcare. But the number one issue for most parents is the quality of EDUCATION!! FFS!!!

That is clearly not the case with the parents screaming to fire all teachers and hire unemployed people with zero experience teaching.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

Stupid tw*t, my kid is 15 years old and needs zero child care but an EDUCATION.

And they are getting one to the best of the public school system’s abilities and in consideration of public health. Your child is in more need of a parent who cares about needs other than their own and doesn’t call people names on the internet. Be a role model instead of throwing tantrums.

NP. Since you mention caring about the needs of others - there are millions of kids and families in this country who are not in a position to provide either the educational support or the - yes - childcare schools are expected to provide. This isn't about DCUMers' "tantrums", this is about policy and the social ramifications of prolonged school closures, which are grave for millions, and likely are not outweighed by the actual benefit they have for stemming the pandemic and "saving lives". This is what is so infuriating about how this is being approached, if you think beyond your own little privileged world. Aside from that, though, it's also legitimate even for privileged parents to be concerned about the effects of this on their own kids, especially if you don't believe that school closures will have a significant impact on overall mortality.

[Anonymous]

January 2022, hopefully.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

Stupid tw*t, my kid is 15 years old and needs zero child care but an EDUCATION.

And they are getting one to the best of the public school system’s abilities and in consideration of public health. Your child is in more need of a parent who cares about needs other than their own and doesn’t call people names on the internet. Be a role model instead of throwing tantrums.

Your sanctimoniousness ignores the very real negative effects closed schools have on less affluent kids and families. Since you care so much about others, maybe you should consider that side of the equation. It's not a simple matter which decision would cause the most harms, especially in the long run.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know people at the FDA. Promising vaccines with adult roll out and a good number of adults vaccinated around March 2021. Pediatric studies are not steering yet but will follow.

In this optimistic scenario, if we wait for a vaccine for our children to go back to school, then our children will have missed one and a third years of school. 10% of their K-12 education.

It's completely unacceptable. If they are not back in school, full-time by November, there has to be an uprising. We undertake activities every damn day of our lives that are higher risk than sending our kids to school during this pandemic. This is driven by politics alone. Death rates are now below predicted rates for ALL CAUSES. By September, there will be no reason to prevent our children from getting the education that we pay enormously for. I have two high schoolers, so this is not about childcare. In fact, those of you making it about childcare need to stop. School is not childcare. It is a necessary and critical function of our society. I am dumbfounded that anyone thinks keeping our kids out of school is acceptable.

I completely agree. I don't think this will be sustainable. At some point in the near future, we will have to start accepting more risk and reopen schools, which perform many functions in this society.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

Stupid tw*t, my kid is 15 years old and needs zero child care but an EDUCATION.

And they are getting one to the best of the public school system’s abilities and in consideration of public health. Your child is in more need of a parent who cares about needs other than their own and doesn’t call people names on the internet. Be a role model instead of throwing tantrums.

NP. Since you mention caring about the needs of others - there are millions of kids and families in this country who are not in a position to provide either the educational support or the - yes - childcare schools are expected to provide. This isn't about DCUMers' "tantrums", this is about policy and the social ramifications of prolonged school closures, which are grave for millions, and likely are not outweighed by the actual benefit they have for stemming the pandemic and "saving lives". This is what is so infuriating about how this is being approached, if you think beyond your own little privileged world. Aside from that, though, it's also legitimate even for privileged parents to be concerned about the effects of this on their own kids, especially if you don't believe that school closures will have a significant impact on overall mortality.

You mean those millions who also are more likely to live with elderly relatives that will get infected when kids are back at school? Anyway, since you don’t *believe* that school closures have any effect, there is nothing to discuss. You should really have led with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021

Most experts claim a vaccine will be available in late 2020 to early 2021. I'm guessing January 2021.

Then.. at least 6 months to vaccinate the entire population. I read somewhere that they expect a shortage of the glass used to make the vials that hold vaccines. It's some special type of glass and there's a limited capacity to produce it.

Also for these vaccines -- how about the pediatric vaccine? Aren't all the tests being done on an adult vaccine? We'd need to do the same for pediatric also.

Yes. Anyone who thinks the U.S. is going to roll vaccines out swiftly is seriously delusional. We have a fractured health care system. I think six months to vaccinate is optimistic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fall 2021, sadly. There are two ways I think they'd be open to full-time F2F:

1. Everyone vaccinated. Even if we have vaccine by the end of this year, it will take at least 6 months to vaccinate 330 million people.
2. Rapid testing (like, answer in an hour). Then if any kid shows symptoms, test the whole classroom the same day, so you have results before they even go home.

#2 requires a higher level of acceptance of risk. Based on watching the BOE meeting earlier this week, I'm skeptical MCPS will even be open to this should it be possible.

At a certain point though, they can't just continue keeping kids out of school because they simply don't want to take on any risk. I think probably a whole academic year with the hybrid option will be OK (I mean it's not great but it's something) but anything longer than that is going to break the entire educational system. Kids will be at least a year behind and it's just going to be absolutely terrible.

Really, kids will be a year behind? They will learn absolutely nothing during DL? All these parents criticizing DL probably just never had much insight into how much their children learned or didn’t learn in regular school. All of a sudden their lives will be ruined by a year of substandard learning, justifying the need to risk the lives of teachers, parents, grandparents, and yes also some children. The selfishness of people is beyond belief. Get your childcare another way without endangering others.

Stupid tw*t, my kid is 15 years old and needs zero child care but an EDUCATION.

And they are getting one to the best of the public school system’s abilities and in consideration of public health. Your child is in more need of a parent who cares about needs other than their own and doesn’t call people names on the internet. Be a role model instead of throwing tantrums.

NP. Since you mention caring about the needs of others - there are millions of kids and families in this country who are not in a position to provide either the educational support or the - yes - childcare schools are expected to provide. This isn't about DCUMers' "tantrums", this is about policy and the social ramifications of prolonged school closures, which are grave for millions, and likely are not outweighed by the actual benefit they have for stemming the pandemic and "saving lives". This is what is so infuriating about how this is being approached, if you think beyond your own little privileged world. Aside from that, though, it's also legitimate even for privileged parents to be concerned about the effects of this on their own kids, especially if you don't believe that school closures will have a significant impact on overall mortality.

You mean those millions who also are more likely to live with elderly relatives that will get infected when kids are back at school? Anyway, since you don’t *believe* that school closures have any effect, there is nothing to discuss. You should really have led with that.

Reading is fundamental. I did not say they don't have any effect. I said that their beneficial effects likely don't outweigh their negative effects in the long run. There are many experts who have raised this concern by now, and their voices will only grow louder. It's the conversation we need to have.

Just as an example, IF the early estimate by the Imperial College (who generally issued dire predictions) is correct that opening schools might increase overall deaths by 2-4% (we don't know if that's the case, but say it is), does such an increase in mortality warrant the enormous costs of school closures to millions of kids and society? Especially if the vast majority of those deaths would be among the elderly and already ill? That is a question for bioethicists that is not easy to answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know people at the FDA. Promising vaccines with adult roll out and a good number of adults vaccinated around March 2021. Pediatric studies are not steering yet but will follow.

Yeah, people at the FDA shouldn’t be speculating on something as unpredictable as clinical trials, assuming you’re telling the truth.

OP, I’m crossing all fingers and toes for Fall 2021. The upcoming year is going to be a wash.

Not acceptable.

Oh, I completely agree. It’s TOTALLY unacceptable. I’m not sure what we as parents can do about that, beyond contacting the people in charge.

This is what people said and the red-states that rushed to reopen and look what that got them.

Yes. Look at where stamping feet about mask wearing got the red states. Adjust your expectations: F2F by Fall 2021 will be your best case scenario. We have been banned from Europe for God’s sake. Think we can manage the logistics of a complicated vaccine rollout in a timely fashion?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m thinking Spring 2022 will be the earliest if the county/teachers want a vaccine to go back to school. If a vaccine is out in early 2021, the manufacturing process and distribution to the community will be a full year to implement. With the way things are landing with the state and county decisions and teachers not being considered essential front line employees, people should start adapting to this new norm for the next 18 to 24 months which means finding childcare, cutting discretionary costs like Netflix, cell phone plans for the family (only having a family cell phone or land line), changing car insurance levels, looking at cheaper housing, accepting that you will be your child’s Interim teacher, guidance counselor Etc. For single household families, working to build a network of support of “it takes a village” will be key even if that means reaching out to other single families to create a cohort of support for each other and pooling shared resources etc.

Assuming that things are going to go back to normal anytime soon instead planning for this new normal will be a detriment to many families.

100% agree. Adjust both your expectations and your logistics now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know people at the FDA. Promising vaccines with adult roll out and a good number of adults vaccinated around March 2021. Pediatric studies are not steering yet but will follow.

In this optimistic scenario, if we wait for a vaccine for our children to go back to school, then our children will have missed one and a third years of school. 10% of their K-12 education.

Pandemics are inconvenient.

If our kids miss 10% of their public schooling, then "inconvenience" is not the right word.

It's not the pandemic that's keeping our kids out of school. It's school officials' belief that the only acceptable level of risk of getting covid at school is: zero.

It is the pandemic. And that’s an excellent risk tolerance. Any argument from you to the contrary makes you a bad person and a terrible parent and you should have your children removed from your custody.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think those that say there kids are going to learn nothing through distance learning are being extreme. Distance learning this last Spring was terrible, and I agree they did not learn as much as they would in person. But I do think my child learned a little bit (she also had a great teacher who made the most of their Zoom time). My hope is that this year MCPS will step up the distance learning program. I feel like they are wasting a lot of time now, and they really need to figure out how to do this better. I have one in private school, and he definitely learned during distance learning. Was it as good as in person? Of course not, but I don't feel like the entire Spring was lost on him. Kids may not end the year this year exactly where they should be, but I also don't think distance learning means they will be an entire year behind either.

You really think high school juniors and seniors should miss this entire year of school? Most of them will not be able to go on to college as planned. It's a travesty. We will be getting a refund on our taxes?

Why would you get a tax refund? And what is wrong with you for even being concerned about that?