Luxury Assisted Living No Longer Worth It?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps y’all could find a less high-end facility that would work for her in the same area?

Keep this in mind for the future. I suspect facilities in Palm Desert are cheaper than Beverly Hills. She could easily live another 10 years. Many do in care facilities.
For long term moving her to a facility closer to you or closer to DD in Beverly Hills makes sense over the 2 hour drive that DD currently has.

I saw your update about you think you are going to let things rest for now. Sometimes that is the best when it comes to seniors. If they are doing okay sometimes coast where you are at makes a lot of sense.

It's probably not a great time to be moving them now, anyway. That doesn't prevent Op from exploring all the options she can now so that when the time does come to move her, it can be done in a reasonably smooth way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like staying in place or moving to the home of the daughter willing to take care of her are the best options. If she's moves to the home, a lot of that money will be needed to prepare the home and pay for caregivers so cost may be about the same for the first couple of months and then go down. MIL would be much happier with social contact with the daughter, than no one else. And I don't think this pandemic is going to end anytime soon, so this is MILs life for the foreseeable future.

And there is no way a frail elderly person would be able to live by themselves in a regular apartment and Uber to see friends who probably won't be allowed to visit her anyhow.

As long as the daughter is willing to take this huge task on, it sounds like a good idea.

And if the daughter takes this on, sinks money into her house (putting in a chair lift, hand rails in the tub, ramp up on the front steps, etc) and then decides that is tooooo much for her to care for mom, what happens to mom then? Leave her where she actually IS being cared for and try to find a more affordable place to her closer to you, Op.

[Anonymous]

How close are DH and BIL? Can your husband tell him that he can't afford to chip in anymore and put ball in BIL's court? That is what I would do if BIL could easily afford it.

[Anonymous]

The isolation is due to the pandemic...not the place she is.
They may have more options to remedy that, when things get better, than the SIL will (such as programming, recreational therapists, peers.etc)

What do you think the MIL wants?
(Of course, discuss with SIL before you ask MIL. )

For purposes of planning, her life expectancy is roughly (i.e. I don't know her status/history) 3 years.

If you guys actually cannot afford the contribution right now (could you do half?), maybe put that in an email and suggest a family meeting on zoom. No assumptions should be made what about the various family members want or are willing to do. Nor does it sound like you know the BIL's finances. He has already had to back down once on his original commitment. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

I would look for a more affordable place. BIL can not be trusted and this could go on for another decade or more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of the retirement communities have put these measurements in place to protect their vulnerable residents. They have pretty much all suspended social activities, outings, dining room operations, most entertainment.

If your MIL is paying 9K/month for "assisted living" and the only thing that they assist her with is room service then that cost does seem really high. If she's there because she needs help with medication, dressing, bathing, etc then the 9K makes a bit more sense. If she's there because it gives you all piece of mind that she is checked on 3 times a day, that makes sense.

I think that having a vulnerable, elderly person living in your home right now would be especially difficult. I've heard some horror stories about home healthcare workers not showing up or being impossible to find. That probably isn't something that your SIL factored in when she was speaking of your MIL moving in with her. Is she willing to put her life on hold, never go on vacation and provide heavy duty physical assistance to your MIL for potentially years to come?

Personally, I don't think that I could ask a member of my family to make a sacrifice like that nor do I think it would necessarily be in the best interests of the parent. At the same time, I completely understand how paying 2K a month out of your own pocket for your MIL's care (nearly 10K total) when she's really not getting much more than room service would be hard to justify.

Caring for someone at home is really challenging in general, and even more so during this pandemic. Most of these people work other jobs, including inside healthcare facilities, so they are potentially bringing the virus with them. And right now there are many home health workers calling out sick.

My friend is caring for his mother at home. She has Alzheimer's and it has been horrible (even absent the pandemic) to coordinate her care and he has had challenges especially recently with people calling out and also with workers who can't deal with someone with dementia and call him to come home from work daily because of various emergencies.

Also, a lot of the home health workers cannot move someone who is larger by themselves; many of them are smaller women who cannot lift someone without help.

Probably when he moved her in it seemed doable but as the disease progressed it became an absolute nightmare. She's probably keeping him up all night and he's worried about her getting out of the house. I've even heard of Alzheimer's patients who haven't driven in years suddenly getting a hold of car keys and driving off....usually that does not end well.

Some of the caregivers are elderly themselves and not in the best of health. It's sad.

Yep, she has already wandered off and broken her arm at night. He’s an essential worker so it’s been very stressful since it’s just him and her in the house and he’s an only child. They were dead set on her staying there but I just don’t see it happening even with multiple aides.

[Anonymous]

How strong physically is SIL?

We have 24 hour care for my two parents at home and it is 17k a month. I think if it was just one person it would be more like 14k.

[Anonymous]

So her monthly expenses add up to about $9K a month.

Her 'rent' which includes food is about $6.5K

This doesn't make sense
Where is the $2,500 extra going? I don't believe your figures Op

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

So her monthly expenses add up to about $9K a month.

Her 'rent' which includes food is about $6.5K

This doesn't make sense
Where is the $2,500 extra going? I don't believe your figures Op

You have to look at the pricing structure of these places. Some do tack on additional charges for medication management, help with bathing/dressing, etc. I know that seems ridiculous given it's an "assisted living" and one would expect that type of help to be included in the monthly base rate. But you can not assume that.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Thanks for all of the replies, thoughts, ideas, and opinions.

Specially thanks to PP's who stated that BIL is a jerk. Yes he is. He told us if we did not contribute, he would pull ALL of his financial support and try to find her a medicare facility. We love her and did not want to have her life uprooted. We decided to contribute to keep the peace. She loves/loved her new life there.

Then covid hit. Then my husband took a 20% pay cut.

But I guess we are on the hook and we will just have to keep contributing every month. Does seem like too much money but not much we can do about that now. I just feel bad for her being stuck alone in her apartment going on months now.

Our retirement is on track. We have about $800K in 401Ks. DH is lucky to be in a fully funded pension plan and we expect about $7.5K a month. We are hopeful to inherit another $1M from my father who is also 93 but don't want to count on that as his in-home elder care is also expensive.

We are thinking of reducing contribution to our 401Ks. I just think I am feeling unsure about the future due to covid as are many.

DH and I are in our early 60s. Fortunately we only have one child which allowed us to save a lot.

Anyway, thanks again. And to the PP who doubted my figures, I posted an explanation on Page 2 I think. I wish my math was wrong!

[Anonymous]

Real issue is you cannot afford it and you need to tell them that.

[Anonymous]

Medicaid does not pay for nursing care. Medicaid does but she may not qualify. Find a cheaper place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for all of the replies, thoughts, ideas, and opinions.

Specially thanks to PP's who stated that BIL is a jerk. Yes he is. He told us if we did not contribute, he would pull ALL of his financial support and try to find her a medicare facility. We love her and did not want to have her life uprooted. We decided to contribute to keep the peace. She loves/loved her new life there.

Then covid hit. Then my husband took a 20% pay cut.

But I guess we are on the hook and we will just have to keep contributing every month. Does seem like too much money but not much we can do about that now. I just feel bad for her being stuck alone in her apartment going on months now.

Our retirement is on track. We have about $800K in 401Ks. DH is lucky to be in a fully funded pension plan and we expect about $7.5K a month. We are hopeful to inherit another $1M from my father who is also 93 but don't want to count on that as his in-home elder care is also expensive.

We are thinking of reducing contribution to our 401Ks. I just think I am feeling unsure about the future due to covid as are many.

DH and I are in our early 60s. Fortunately we only have one child which allowed us to save a lot.

Anyway, thanks again. And to the PP who doubted my figures, I posted an explanation on Page 2 I think. I wish my math was wrong!

Being on the hook for someone else's retirement home when you are of retirement age yourself is not good. I think you should find a less expensive place for your MIL.

You are right at that age when you or your spouse could get sick or maybe you'll have grandchildren that you need to help out with. You just never know. You are expecting to get approx $7.5K/month in retirement which is 90K and not too shabby. But when you subtract the 24K that you spend on your MIL's care each year that brings your income down to $66,000/year. Yes, people get by on much less than 66K in retirement but this is not the income that you have worked and saved your entire adult life for. And what happens when you need long term care for both you and your husband? You see how expensive things are, right? Do you want to put your own adult child in the position of paying for your assisted living?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Real issue is you cannot afford it and you need to tell them that.

+10000 You are in your 60's! You can not afford to be giving away your own retirement money. The money you have needs to last both you and your spouse for the next 20 or 30 years. Don't squander it on luxuries that your MIL can't even enjoy.

[Anonymous]

Your BIL will likely have trouble finding a medicaid facility for your MIL. Let him try. Also it is not clear she will qualify for medicaid.

If she does qualify for medicaid, some of the facilities are actually very nice.