S/O The obsession with class/tackiness/social standing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find the existence of the thousands of threads on this so interesting. Partly because my parents come from a country where lower class people have a much harder time changing their “class”- they can’t afford to take care of their teeth, they speak differently, dress differently, etc. It’s a much more marked difference than in America where the differences between a middle class person and an upper class person are more subtle. Personally it’s not something I think about with regards to my own standing- as long as my children grow up to be educated and civic-minded with decent jobs and teeth I think they will be fine. That’s mostly what I worry about.

What drives the interest in this? Do you think people feel insecure about their place in society? Like, if they are perceived as lower class then they and their children will be locked out of opportunities? Is this another symptom of the wealth gap in our country, that a bunch of middle class women obsess about this endlessly?

It's fun. And not something one can easily discuss without being criticized, which makes it perfect fodder for an anonymous message board. Lighten up.

If by "fun" you mean "incredibly lame" and and "tiresome" and "bizarre" then yes, I agree, it's "fun."

But on another level it's fascinating that some people actually worry/think about these issues.

DP. So don’t read the threads. And we won’t read your totally banal threads about how you can’t figure out by yourself how to fire your nanny, or Laura Trevyan’s accent and what John Legend and Chrissy Teigen are doing, or how your cat should be allowed to poop in your neighbors’ yard.

How is this hard?

I don't post about those things so I don't know, but at least celebrities change over every few years and your situation with your poor nanny may be unique. "Is this tacky" and "Old Money vs. New" and "This McMansion is ugly" is soooo repetitive over and over. And that's pretty fascinating in itself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well fwiw, I wouldn't say I am "obsessed" but I find the topic interesting. Primarily because I am a person who changed classes (maybe). Grew up poor, parents worked as a waitress and mechanic, barely got by, I'm a first generation college graduate, then I got a master's degree. Husband grew up the same way then through luck was involved in an IPO and made millions. Of course that was life changing. It kind of felt a little bit like winning the lottery. But I don't feel that the "social" part of our class changed that much.

The word is "social class" right? So I think it's interesting to question how much of it is social and how much is economic.

OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

To answer the bolded question, no. In my life, I've generally found that the only color people care about is green. If you have the money to be there (including "fancy" places like charity galas and country clubs), they think you belong. We're not trying to join the social elite though so I'm sure that makes a difference.

I'm not concerned about our standing at all, I just find the topic interesting.

According to the profile writer in the other thread, my DH and I are "nouveau riche" which I get the sense from her posts most people think is the worst, lol. It's perfectly fine with me. I'd much rather splurge and have fun on vacation, buy nice cars, have a nice house, etc. then live such parsimonious lives as she says the UC do in America.

Honestly, it's a head scratcher to me as to why anyone would want to live like those people (Old Money WASPs). Reusing tinfoil? Driving the same beat up Volvo for over 20 years? Not updating the finishes in your house or going to fancy restaurants or luxury destinations? No thanks.

I think I can step in here and explain this, Waspily, as I come from the Old Money WASP culture thing. It’s pragmatic. You never, ever touch your capital. Instead, you live off the interest that capital accrues. And you don’t work, unless it’s in a gentleman’s profession that you do because you enjoy it. So while you have money, the amount you can actually live on is likely to be less than what people with salaried professions are bringing in. And you pay in full for everything, because that way you spend a tiny percentage of what everyone else does for the same things. No mortgage, house bought outright; no student loans; no car payments; no credit cards except Amex, ever. It looks mysterious and arcane to people, but it really isn’t. It’s capitalism. If you earn a bunch of money and you’ve never had money before you’re probably going to spend it. That’s why that way of life is called new money, and it isn’t going to last. And the other way of life is called old money, because it has been around for a while and will continue to be. Also, if you grew up with money, you know that money doesn’t make people happy. I mean, you KNOW it. And, you probably don’t really want people knowing you have that money, because it’s so antithetical to the whole work-all-the-time and pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps and the-poor-are-lazy-and-deserve-to-be-poor ethos that Americans are so sold on. But, you have time, which no one can put a price on. My mother always reused tinfoil.

I feel sad because I do these things and I am solidly middle class and I live this way because I like it. I like re-using things, keeping my car until it dies, etc. There's something really satisfying about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well fwiw, I wouldn't say I am "obsessed" but I find the topic interesting. Primarily because I am a person who changed classes (maybe). Grew up poor, parents worked as a waitress and mechanic, barely got by, I'm a first generation college graduate, then I got a master's degree. Husband grew up the same way then through luck was involved in an IPO and made millions. Of course that was life changing. It kind of felt a little bit like winning the lottery. But I don't feel that the "social" part of our class changed that much.

The word is "social class" right? So I think it's interesting to question how much of it is social and how much is economic.

OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

To answer the bolded question, no. In my life, I've generally found that the only color people care about is green. If you have the money to be there (including "fancy" places like charity galas and country clubs), they think you belong. We're not trying to join the social elite though so I'm sure that makes a difference.

I'm not concerned about our standing at all, I just find the topic interesting.

According to the profile writer in the other thread, my DH and I are "nouveau riche" which I get the sense from her posts most people think is the worst, lol. It's perfectly fine with me. I'd much rather splurge and have fun on vacation, buy nice cars, have a nice house, etc. then live such parsimonious lives as she says the UC do in America.

Honestly, it's a head scratcher to me as to why anyone would want to live like those people (Old Money WASPs). Reusing tinfoil? Driving the same beat up Volvo for over 20 years? Not updating the finishes in your house or going to fancy restaurants or luxury destinations? No thanks.

I think I can step in here and explain this, Waspily, as I come from the Old Money WASP culture thing. It’s pragmatic. You never, ever touch your capital. Instead, you live off the interest that capital accrues. And you don’t work, unless it’s in a gentleman’s profession that you do because you enjoy it. So while you have money, the amount you can actually live on is likely to be less than what people with salaried professions are bringing in. And you pay in full for everything, because that way you spend a tiny percentage of what everyone else does for the same things. No mortgage, house bought outright; no student loans; no car payments; no credit cards except Amex, ever. It looks mysterious and arcane to people, but it really isn’t. It’s capitalism. If you earn a bunch of money and you’ve never had money before you’re probably going to spend it. That’s why that way of life is called new money, and it isn’t going to last. And the other way of life is called old money, because it has been around for a while and will continue to be. Also, if you grew up with money, you know that money doesn’t make people happy. I mean, you KNOW it. And, you probably don’t really want people knowing you have that money, because it’s so antithetical to the whole work-all-the-time and pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps and the-poor-are-lazy-and-deserve-to-be-poor ethos that Americans are so sold on. But, you have time, which no one can put a price on. My mother always reused tinfoil.

I feel sad because I do these things and I am solidly middle class and I live this way because I like it. I like re-using things, keeping my car until it dies, etc. There's something really satisfying about it.

These are all environmentally-friendly things. I’m guessing a lot of “rich” tech workers on the west coast are doing exactly the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

NP here. But this question suggests to me that you must not be close to many people who grew up very differently than you did. My parents are immigrants who did well in the US as educated professionals. I grew up UMC/rich, and DH and I are now UMC/rich. Though his family has been in the US for generations (Mayflower on one side), there are similarities in our upbringings. He is also UMC, but his parents' income was lower and they have lower NW today.

DH and I are in fields (STEM PhD) that tend to be attainable to a broader set of SES backgrounds than the professions most UMC professionals work in (e.g. law, medicine). I've sat in professional trainings where people were taught which forks to use, how to introduce themselves at networking events, how to assess whether your "business casual" outfit is actually "business" or just "casual". The first time I encountered this kind of training, I thought it was so strange. All of this was stuff I was just expected to know by a pretty young age. But for many others, this was the first time someone had sat down to explain this stuff to them (though most of them had already picked up its importance). Pretending like these class differences don't exist and that they don't impact someone's career and social standing ultimately hurts people who did not grow up learning them.

OP here. My parents were immigrants and I think you are confusing the ability to pick up social cues with some sort of class difference. Introducing yourself at a network event is hard for many people because it can be awkward, not because they missed out on some sort of prior experience. Most people can figure out what "business casual" means or, worst case scenario, google it. The trainings you are talking about sound like they are for people who are awkward, not of a lower socioeconomic class.

I totally disagree. I grew up with plenty of awkward people in my mostly non-immigrant community. We were still all taught these things in the course of growing up. Many people are not taught these things because of class differences, and it can be overwhelming to figure it out. Certainly, there are some people who are extremely adept at figuring these things out without instruction. But you don't have to be particularly awkward to benefit from some coaching in these areas. I know plenty of people who are in no way awkward, but also just never learned subtle things like the way hierarchy impacts how you make introductions at a networking event. I grew up absorbing those things to the point where I don't even think about them. But as I've interacted more and more with people who did not grow up like me and had them tell me what was hard, I've come to appreciate that these are class advantages I didn't even know I had.

Alright- let me clarify. People who are working class or lower on the socio-economic ladder may have difficulty with forks or introducing themselves at work events. That's not what we're discussing here, and the pp who started this tangent admitted as much, that because she is now rich no one really cares about any subtleties in her behavior. And that's not really the focus on DCUM- this is not a crowd that worries about poor people. Middle class people can function at work events. People on the other thread are spending 30 pages arguing about whether the upper class goes to Portugal or buys Stickley furniture- why do they do that? That's what's interesting to me.

Probably because it’s really f’ing weird how people write off entire countries on this web site. In particular, they have a weird obsession with saying that travelers to Portugal, Iceland, Croatia, and Costa Rica (and Belize to some extent) are passé posers and strivers and that “anyone who is anyone” is not going to those places. I have seen this many times in the travel board and have always thought it’s incredible bizarre.

I thought the Stickley thing was weird too. It’s nice stuff. Maybe it’s not your style but it’s nice hard wood and hand made. What more can be said?

Those places are not “striver” destinations. They are hidden gems!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find the existence of the thousands of threads on this so interesting. Partly because my parents come from a country where lower class people have a much harder time changing their “class”- they can’t afford to take care of their teeth, they speak differently, dress differently, etc. It’s a much more marked difference than in America where the differences between a middle class person and an upper class person are more subtle. Personally it’s not something I think about with regards to my own standing- as long as my children grow up to be educated and civic-minded with decent jobs and teeth I think they will be fine. That’s mostly what I worry about.

What drives the interest in this? Do you think people feel insecure about their place in society? Like, if they are perceived as lower class then they and their children will be locked out of opportunities? Is this another symptom of the wealth gap in our country, that a bunch of middle class women obsess about this endlessly?

It's fun. And not something one can easily discuss without being criticized, which makes it perfect fodder for an anonymous message board. Lighten up.

If by "fun" you mean "incredibly lame" and and "tiresome" and "bizarre" then yes, I agree, it's "fun."

But on another level it's fascinating that some people actually worry/think about these issues.

DP. So don’t read the threads. And we won’t read your totally banal threads about how you can’t figure out by yourself how to fire your nanny, or Laura Trevyan’s accent and what John Legend and Chrissy Teigen are doing, or how your cat should be allowed to poop in your neighbors’ yard.

How is this hard?

I don't post about those things so I don't know, but at least celebrities change over every few years and your situation with your poor nanny may be unique. "Is this tacky" and "Old Money vs. New" and "This McMansion is ugly" is soooo repetitive over and over. And that's pretty fascinating in itself.

The fact that you stick with these threads, through many pages, is pretty fascinating and says a lot about how invested you are.

Look, this is one of the things DCUM does best. Sure, there’s the occasional helpful thread. But mostly, DCUM is an outlet for people who are bored at work or at home. Nobody is living or dying by these threads, or by the Chrissy Teigen threads. If you don’t like what’s on offer here, find a thread that appeals to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Probably because it’s really f’ing weird how people write off entire countries on this web site. In particular, they have a weird obsession with saying that travelers to Portugal, Iceland, Croatia, and Costa Rica (and Belize to some extent) are passé posers and strivers and that “anyone who is anyone” is not going to those places. I have seen this many times in the travel board and have always thought it’s incredible bizarre.

I thought the Stickley thing was weird too. It’s nice stuff. Maybe it’s not your style but it’s nice hard wood and hand made. What more can be said?

Those places are not “striver” destinations. They are hidden gems!

That was the “profile writer,” who writes well, is pretty observant, and is probably also a great person. But she admits she’s not upper class herself, and sometimes gets the wrong end of the stick. The last place old money wants to be is on Ibiza with the flashy, new money poseurs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well fwiw, I wouldn't say I am "obsessed" but I find the topic interesting. Primarily because I am a person who changed classes (maybe). Grew up poor, parents worked as a waitress and mechanic, barely got by, I'm a first generation college graduate, then I got a master's degree. Husband grew up the same way then through luck was involved in an IPO and made millions. Of course that was life changing. It kind of felt a little bit like winning the lottery. But I don't feel that the "social" part of our class changed that much.

The word is "social class" right? So I think it's interesting to question how much of it is social and how much is economic.

OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

To answer the bolded question, no. In my life, I've generally found that the only color people care about is green. If you have the money to be there (including "fancy" places like charity galas and country clubs), they think you belong. We're not trying to join the social elite though so I'm sure that makes a difference.

I'm not concerned about our standing at all, I just find the topic interesting.

According to the profile writer in the other thread, my DH and I are "nouveau riche" which I get the sense from her posts most people think is the worst, lol. It's perfectly fine with me. I'd much rather splurge and have fun on vacation, buy nice cars, have a nice house, etc. then live such parsimonious lives as she says the UC do in America.

Honestly, it's a head scratcher to me as to why anyone would want to live like those people (Old Money WASPs). Reusing tinfoil? Driving the same beat up Volvo for over 20 years? Not updating the finishes in your house or going to fancy restaurants or luxury destinations? No thanks.

I think I can step in here and explain this, Waspily, as I come from the Old Money WASP culture thing. It’s pragmatic. You never, ever touch your capital. Instead, you live off the interest that capital accrues. And you don’t work, unless it’s in a gentleman’s profession that you do because you enjoy it. So while you have money, the amount you can actually live on is likely to be less than what people with salaried professions are bringing in. And you pay in full for everything, because that way you spend a tiny percentage of what everyone else does for the same things. No mortgage, house bought outright; no student loans; no car payments; no credit cards except Amex, ever. It looks mysterious and arcane to people, but it really isn’t. It’s capitalism. If you earn a bunch of money and you’ve never had money before you’re probably going to spend it. That’s why that way of life is called new money, and it isn’t going to last. And the other way of life is called old money, because it has been around for a while and will continue to be. Also, if you grew up with money, you know that money doesn’t make people happy. I mean, you KNOW it. And, you probably don’t really want people knowing you have that money, because it’s so antithetical to the whole work-all-the-time and pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps and the-poor-are-lazy-and-deserve-to-be-poor ethos that Americans are so sold on. But, you have time, which no one can put a price on. My mother always reused tinfoil.

This is the best description I've seen of "old money," with a few exceptions. I use credit cards but never carry a balance. I don't have an Amex card anymore. I pay in full for everything, house, school tuition, cars, vacations...I work because of satisfaction. I live off interest on investments. I don't wear trendy clothing or drive a status car (Toyota Rav4 currently). I do most of my grocery shopping at Aldi. I'm interested in people who talk about books, art, food, travel and culture. I have no interest in celebrities or reality TV (except Survivor).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find the existence of the thousands of threads on this so interesting. Partly because my parents come from a country where lower class people have a much harder time changing their “class”- they can’t afford to take care of their teeth, they speak differently, dress differently, etc. It’s a much more marked difference than in America where the differences between a middle class person and an upper class person are more subtle. Personally it’s not something I think about with regards to my own standing- as long as my children grow up to be educated and civic-minded with decent jobs and teeth I think they will be fine. That’s mostly what I worry about.

What drives the interest in this? Do you think people feel insecure about their place in society? Like, if they are perceived as lower class then they and their children will be locked out of opportunities? Is this another symptom of the wealth gap in our country, that a bunch of middle class women obsess about this endlessly?

It's fun. And not something one can easily discuss without being criticized, which makes it perfect fodder for an anonymous message board. Lighten up.

If by "fun" you mean "incredibly lame" and and "tiresome" and "bizarre" then yes, I agree, it's "fun."

But on another level it's fascinating that some people actually worry/think about these issues.

DP. So don’t read the threads. And we won’t read your totally banal threads about how you can’t figure out by yourself how to fire your nanny, or Laura Trevyan’s accent and what John Legend and Chrissy Teigen are doing, or how your cat should be allowed to poop in your neighbors’ yard.

How is this hard?

I don't post about those things so I don't know, but at least celebrities change over every few years and your situation with your poor nanny may be unique. "Is this tacky" and "Old Money vs. New" and "This McMansion is ugly" is soooo repetitive over and over. And that's pretty fascinating in itself.

The fact that you stick with these threads, through many pages, is pretty fascinating and says a lot about how invested you are.

Look, this is one of the things DCUM does best. Sure, there’s the occasional helpful thread. But mostly, DCUM is an outlet for people who are bored at work or at home. Nobody is living or dying by these threads, or by the Chrissy Teigen threads. If you don’t like what’s on offer here, find a thread that appeals to you.

You're kind of being weirdly antagonistic and I'm not sure why. What does it "say" if I read something I find stupid and am "invested"? Invested in what, exactly? What does that even mean? That I'm wasting my time? I'll cop to that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well fwiw, I wouldn't say I am "obsessed" but I find the topic interesting. Primarily because I am a person who changed classes (maybe). Grew up poor, parents worked as a waitress and mechanic, barely got by, I'm a first generation college graduate, then I got a master's degree. Husband grew up the same way then through luck was involved in an IPO and made millions. Of course that was life changing. It kind of felt a little bit like winning the lottery. But I don't feel that the "social" part of our class changed that much.

The word is "social class" right? So I think it's interesting to question how much of it is social and how much is economic.

OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

To answer the bolded question, no. In my life, I've generally found that the only color people care about is green. If you have the money to be there (including "fancy" places like charity galas and country clubs), they think you belong. We're not trying to join the social elite though so I'm sure that makes a difference.

I'm not concerned about our standing at all, I just find the topic interesting.

According to the profile writer in the other thread, my DH and I are "nouveau riche" which I get the sense from her posts most people think is the worst, lol. It's perfectly fine with me. I'd much rather splurge and have fun on vacation, buy nice cars, have a nice house, etc. then live such parsimonious lives as she says the UC do in America.

Honestly, it's a head scratcher to me as to why anyone would want to live like those people (Old Money WASPs). Reusing tinfoil? Driving the same beat up Volvo for over 20 years? Not updating the finishes in your house or going to fancy restaurants or luxury destinations? No thanks.

I think I can step in here and explain this, Waspily, as I come from the Old Money WASP culture thing. It’s pragmatic. You never, ever touch your capital. Instead, you live off the interest that capital accrues. And you don’t work, unless it’s in a gentleman’s profession that you do because you enjoy it. So while you have money, the amount you can actually live on is likely to be less than what people with salaried professions are bringing in. And you pay in full for everything, because that way you spend a tiny percentage of what everyone else does for the same things. No mortgage, house bought outright; no student loans; no car payments; no credit cards except Amex, ever. It looks mysterious and arcane to people, but it really isn’t. It’s capitalism. If you earn a bunch of money and you’ve never had money before you’re probably going to spend it. That’s why that way of life is called new money, and it isn’t going to last. And the other way of life is called old money, because it has been around for a while and will continue to be. Also, if you grew up with money, you know that money doesn’t make people happy. I mean, you KNOW it. And, you probably don’t really want people knowing you have that money, because it’s so antithetical to the whole work-all-the-time and pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps and the-poor-are-lazy-and-deserve-to-be-poor ethos that Americans are so sold on. But, you have time, which no one can put a price on. My mother always reused tinfoil.

This is the best description I've seen of "old money," with a few exceptions. I use credit cards but never carry a balance. I don't have an Amex card anymore. I pay in full for everything, house, school tuition, cars, vacations...I work because of satisfaction. I live off interest on investments. I don't wear trendy clothing or drive a status car (Toyota Rav4 currently). I do most of my grocery shopping at Aldi. I'm interested in people who talk about books, art, food, travel and culture. I have no interest in celebrities or reality TV (except Survivor).

Most of this is a pretty common immigrant mentality as well as almost a word-for-word profile of people in the book "The Millionaire Next Door." It doesn't seem like a class thing to me?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well fwiw, I wouldn't say I am "obsessed" but I find the topic interesting. Primarily because I am a person who changed classes (maybe). Grew up poor, parents worked as a waitress and mechanic, barely got by, I'm a first generation college graduate, then I got a master's degree. Husband grew up the same way then through luck was involved in an IPO and made millions. Of course that was life changing. It kind of felt a little bit like winning the lottery. But I don't feel that the "social" part of our class changed that much.

The word is "social class" right? So I think it's interesting to question how much of it is social and how much is economic.

OP here. This doesn't really explain *why* you are concerned about your "social class." You are educated and wealthy- what is missing from your life? Are you ever in some social situation where you don't fit in despite having money and an education?

To answer the bolded question, no. In my life, I've generally found that the only color people care about is green. If you have the money to be there (including "fancy" places like charity galas and country clubs), they think you belong. We're not trying to join the social elite though so I'm sure that makes a difference.

I'm not concerned about our standing at all, I just find the topic interesting.

According to the profile writer in the other thread, my DH and I are "nouveau riche" which I get the sense from her posts most people think is the worst, lol. It's perfectly fine with me. I'd much rather splurge and have fun on vacation, buy nice cars, have a nice house, etc. then live such parsimonious lives as she says the UC do in America.

Honestly, it's a head scratcher to me as to why anyone would want to live like those people (Old Money WASPs). Reusing tinfoil? Driving the same beat up Volvo for over 20 years? Not updating the finishes in your house or going to fancy restaurants or luxury destinations? No thanks.

Nobody on that thread, or anywhere really, said old money doesn’t like restaurants or nice vacations. I have no idea where the thing about re-using tin foil comes from. The old car thing is true, though.

Can someone post a link to the thread that keeps getting referenced in this post?

[Anonymous]

I’m interested in class in my own life and the way it’s come up in subtle but insidious ways. Not obsessing over which vacations and kitchens and manicures make you seem upper class or upper middle class. I spent the first 18 years of my life feeling very privileged - ballet, sports, dressing like my peers, money to go to the movies and the prom. My dad wore a suit to work and our house was clean and comfortable and no one drank too much or cursed or smoked. I knew we weren’t rich by any means, but my world was small and I had classmates and extended family who had none of these things. It wasn’t until college and professional life made me realize that no, I am not like the people in the UMC world I entered as an adult. It’s never been that overt, like wearing fatigues to a job interview, but I have been judged negatively by the parents of more than one boyfriend, and my approach to working world norms was more blue collar flavored.

[Anonymous]

Old money: you have to be born to it to be it. Why waste time imitating it? New rich so much more fun.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m interested in class in my own life and the way it’s come up in subtle but insidious ways. Not obsessing over which vacations and kitchens and manicures make you seem upper class or upper middle class. I spent the first 18 years of my life feeling very privileged - ballet, sports, dressing like my peers, money to go to the movies and the prom. My dad wore a suit to work and our house was clean and comfortable and no one drank too much or cursed or smoked. I knew we weren’t rich by any means, but my world was small and I had classmates and extended family who had none of these things. It wasn’t until college and professional life made me realize that no, I am not like the people in the UMC world I entered as an adult. It’s never been that overt, like wearing fatigues to a job interview, but I have been judged negatively by the parents of more than one boyfriend, and my approach to working world norms was more blue collar flavored.

Very interesting... what do you think parents of boyfriends judged you over? What could have been missing in your upbringing? It sounds very similar to a nice UMC upbringing to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find the existence of the thousands of threads on this so interesting. Partly because my parents come from a country where lower class people have a much harder time changing their “class”- they can’t afford to take care of their teeth, they speak differently, dress differently, etc. It’s a much more marked difference than in America where the differences between a middle class person and an upper class person are more subtle. Personally it’s not something I think about with regards to my own standing- as long as my children grow up to be educated and civic-minded with decent jobs and teeth I think they will be fine. That’s mostly what I worry about.

What drives the interest in this? Do you think people feel insecure about their place in society? Like, if they are perceived as lower class then they and their children will be locked out of opportunities? Is this another symptom of the wealth gap in our country, that a bunch of middle class women obsess about this endlessly?

It's fun. And not something one can easily discuss without being criticized, which makes it perfect fodder for an anonymous message board. Lighten up.

This!

Relax, OP. Idle speculation about how the rich are different from you and me has been going on for millennia.

[Anonymous]

So much of this describes old money but broke. Or trustifarian but not more than a schoolteacher makes. You are not “rich”. You are gentile poverty.