Med-free labor trend

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First of all, PP, did the epi save your life, or the C-section? two different issues.

Secondly, I had an epidural managed induction, and I am only having one child, so no future plans for me or real stake in this issue.

However, I ma noticing a disturbing posting pattern here.

It seems like OP comes in here with a defensive question belittling other women's choices, the natural birthers explain their choices when ASKED, and the responses from the mediated side trend toward " so the natural birth moms can feel superior.

What is with you ladies? Defensive wackos a lot of you.

What are you talking about? Did you miss the part where they said it was "sad" that women got epidurals because they "couldn't take it"? There is a whooooole lot of smug up in here, and it is possibly the dumbest thing in the world to be smug about (on either side of the fence).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:THe difference is in this debate only one side is judging the other. In the SAHM vs WOHM the judging contest is mutual.

I don't think moms who take the epidural give a shit or feel guilty about it. It's the ones who think they deserve recognition or validation for having gone without that set the tone.

I even know moms who opted for a vanity C... Personally I do judge that as it just seems lazy. But, not the moms who are realistic to know they may want pain medication.

I hear a lot about how ladies who have med-free births judge people who get epidurals, c-sections, etc. Every time someone at my office is pregnant, I hear about how judgy "my people" are, because right after my daughter was born, when my colleague asked, I told her that I didn't have any medication.

I admit that I have judged women based on their birth choices. A friend of a friend was induced and got an epidural almost immediately, then afterward bragged about "how great she was at being in labor". She went on at great length about how our experiences were the same, and honestly, they just were not. She was great at being in labor. But her labor and my labor were just different. Hers was easy and she spent it watching TV and posting on Facebook about how easy it was. Mine was really hard. I don't think that I'm any better or worse than she is at birthing babies - we both have great babies who have always been healthy. But our experiences were very different and mine was harder and her casual comments that they were basically the same were annoying and I judged her for them.

At the end of the day, though, I feel like I have heard a lot more "Why do you feel like you have to be a hero? Look at you with your crazy crunchy lifestyle choices! Do you think you deserve a medal or something" comments than I have of the "You're lazy and less of a mother for your epidural/c section/whatever" comments. Maybe that's just me, coming from where I'm coming from. If a mom is proud of her med-free labor, let her be proud. Be proud for her. Her choices don't say anything about yours. Be proud of yourself for however you did it. No matter how a baby is born, it's never "easy". There is always "labor" involved, whether it's medicated or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First of all, PP, did the epi save your life, or the C-section? two different issues.

Secondly, I had an epidural managed induction, and I am only having one child, so no future plans for me or real stake in this issue.

However, I ma noticing a disturbing posting pattern here.

It seems like OP comes in here with a defensive question belittling other women's choices, the natural birthers explain their choices when ASKED, and the responses from the mediated side trend toward " so the natural birth moms can feel superior.

What is with you ladies? Defensive wackos a lot of you.

What are you talking about? Did you miss the part where they said it was "sad" that women got epidurals because they "couldn't take it"? There is a whooooole lot of smug up in here, and it is possibly the dumbest thing in the world to be smug about (on either side of the fence).

There's a lot of smug on both sides.

[Anonymous]

PPs, the OP wrote a defensive and not very nice post that basically categorized women who chose natural birth as doing it for bizarre reasons (turning down pain just to do so) as well as doing it "for a reason to feel superior." Her post, in itself, was judgmental and misguided. You can hardly blame people who have responded passionately in defense of their own choice.

Im the PP who said I never, ever bring up my drug free childbirth. It was a personal choice to me, much like what type of hiking boots I buy - I want support that's right for MY foot, but I'm not going to pretend I know what's best for yours. I might share my preferences and reasoning if you ASK me, but I'm not going to presume we have the same objectives or priorities. What I *am* giong to do, is defend my choices when they come under attack, and I'm going to tell women who seem confused about what goes into the choice, or who draw incorrect conclusions about why I made the choice (like OP and many of you) what I know about it and why I chose it.

I wonder how many of you would start off saying "those natural childbirth people are just out to prove something" and then feel offended when I tell you how wonderful my birth actually was? I don't feel sad for anyone else, as long as they are at peace with their birth and feel their children are healthy.

Some other natural birthing supporters have the zeal of the newly converted, and I can understand how that is grating. When I first had my kid, I wanted to shout from the mountain tops that I'd had a baby, and that it was nothing like the way childbirth is depicted in books, TV, and even from other parents. I quickly learned that when you do that, other people can feel judged. But I wasn't TRYING to judge them. I felt like nobody told ME that it wasn't as hard as it seemed on TV, and I wanted to get the good word out. But, like religion, it's just one of those things that only a few people want to hear about.

I try to reserve my comments for those people, but I admit to being goaded into responding to posts like the OP's, which seem to cast all of us med-free birthing mamas in the "uncontrolled, crazy scheming" and "eschewing modern medicine" and "have something to prove / wanna be a hero" camp. I think many of these people are dismissing something they did not have the courage to try, or they are confusing a failed epidural with natural childirtth as if it that is the same thing (it's not!) or like it gives them some authority to discuss my choice as if they understand it. I'm going to continue to call those people out, and correct them where I see fit. That doesn't mean I am judging someone else for their epidural. Trust me.

[Anonymous]

There was nothing smug, rude, superior or belittling in OP's post. People on both sides are hearing what they want to hear and reading between the lines because this is such a loaded topic. That being said, such a "done" topic. Nothing new to add.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PPs, the OP wrote a defensive and not very nice post that basically categorized women who chose natural birth as doing it for bizarre reasons (turning down pain just to do so) as well as doing it "for a reason to feel superior." Her post, in itself, was judgmental and misguided. You can hardly blame people who have responded passionately in defense of their own choice.

Im the PP who said I never, ever bring up my drug free childbirth. It was a personal choice to me, much like what type of hiking boots I buy - I want support that's right for MY foot, but I'm not going to pretend I know what's best for yours. I might share my preferences and reasoning if you ASK me, but I'm not going to presume we have the same objectives or priorities. What I *am* giong to do, is defend my choices when they come under attack, and I'm going to tell women who seem confused about what goes into the choice, or who draw incorrect conclusions about why I made the choice (like OP and many of you) what I know about it and why I chose it.

I wonder how many of you would start off saying "those natural childbirth people are just out to prove something" and then feel offended when I tell you how wonderful my birth actually was? I don't feel sad for anyone else, as long as they are at peace with their birth and feel their children are healthy.

Some other natural birthing supporters have the zeal of the newly converted, and I can understand how that is grating. When I first had my kid, I wanted to shout from the mountain tops that I'd had a baby, and that it was nothing like the way childbirth is depicted in books, TV, and even from other parents. I quickly learned that when you do that, other people can feel judged. But I wasn't TRYING to judge them. I felt like nobody told ME that it wasn't as hard as it seemed on TV, and I wanted to get the good word out. But, like religion, it's just one of those things that only a few people want to hear about.

I try to reserve my comments for those people, but I admit to being goaded into responding to posts like the OP's, which seem to cast all of us med-free birthing mamas in the "uncontrolled, crazy scheming" and "eschewing modern medicine" and "have something to prove / wanna be a hero" camp. I think many of these people are dismissing something they did not have the courage to try, or they are confusing a failed epidural with natural childirtth as if it that is the same thing (it's not!) or like it gives them some authority to discuss my choice as if they understand it. I'm going to continue to call those people out, and correct them where I see fit. That doesn't mean I am judging someone else for their epidural. Trust me.

Uh, really? You sound pretty judgmental to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PPs, the OP wrote a defensive and not very nice post that basically categorized women who chose natural birth as doing it for bizarre reasons (turning down pain just to do so) as well as doing it "for a reason to feel superior." Her post, in itself, was judgmental and misguided. You can hardly blame people who have responded passionately in defense of their own choice.

Im the PP who said I never, ever bring up my drug free childbirth. It was a personal choice to me, much like what type of hiking boots I buy - I want support that's right for MY foot, but I'm not going to pretend I know what's best for yours. I might share my preferences and reasoning if you ASK me, but I'm not going to presume we have the same objectives or priorities. What I *am* giong to do, is defend my choices when they come under attack, and I'm going to tell women who seem confused about what goes into the choice, or who draw incorrect conclusions about why I made the choice (like OP and many of you) what I know about it and why I chose it.

I wonder how many of you would start off saying "those natural childbirth people are just out to prove something" and then feel offended when I tell you how wonderful my birth actually was? I don't feel sad for anyone else, as long as they are at peace with their birth and feel their children are healthy.

Some other natural birthing supporters have the zeal of the newly converted, and I can understand how that is grating. When I first had my kid, I wanted to shout from the mountain tops that I'd had a baby, and that it was nothing like the way childbirth is depicted in books, TV, and even from other parents. I quickly learned that when you do that, other people can feel judged. But I wasn't TRYING to judge them. I felt like nobody told ME that it wasn't as hard as it seemed on TV, and I wanted to get the good word out. But, like religion, it's just one of those things that only a few people want to hear about.

I try to reserve my comments for those people, but I admit to being goaded into responding to posts like the OP's, which seem to cast all of us med-free birthing mamas in the "uncontrolled, crazy scheming" and "eschewing modern medicine" and "have something to prove / wanna be a hero" camp. I think many of these people are dismissing something they did not have the courage to try, or they are confusing a failed epidural with natural childirtth as if it that is the same thing (it's not!) or like it gives them some authority to discuss my choice as if they understand it. I'm going to continue to call those people out, and correct them where I see fit. That doesn't mean I am judging someone else for their epidural. Trust me.

Uh, really? You sound pretty judgmental to me.

Totally. I don't FEEL my kids are healthy, I KNOW they are healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, assuming this is an honest question, I suggest you educate yourself about the history of obstetrical anesthesia in America. A superb book is "Deliver Me From Pain," a fascinating and accessible medical-social history. There are plenty of other excellent books, such as "Gentle Birth," "Immaculate Deception," "Orgasmic Birth," and "Pushed."

As someone who has had one late epidural and seven unmedicated births, who is looking forward to her third blissful homebirth, I urge every mother-to-be to learn as much as possible about the physiology and psychology of birth. When women experience birth in privacy, with loving support and respect, they often experience the greatest moments of pleasure in their entire lives. There are benefits to the baby and the mother when birth is allowed to unfold unmedicated, as the body's custom-made hormone cocktail works to ease the baby out with just the right mixture of work ("labor") and rest.

In many countries, throughout history, birth was not feared or experienced as torturously painful. A lot of work, yes, but also blissful, gorgeous, celebrated. It is a shame many women miss out on that experience. Every woman deserves to birth surrounded by love, deference, and respect.

hoarder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Eh, I did natural labor, and it was 30 hours of hellish pain. Totally worth it. I think a lot of people don't have what it takes to endure and overcome trial and pain anymore. I'm as proud of overcoming 30 hours of pain as I am of other accomplishments. Just feels good to not have given up because I couldn't take it.

P.S. I completely, 100% support c-sections and other interventions when necessary. I just think it's sad so many women give up because they can't take the pain, and get epidurals. I know I'm weird, but that's my view, OP. I don't think you're a failure, I just think you should have stuck it out, much as I would think someone who trained for a marathon should cross the finish line.

Whenever I get migraines I go 24 hours with the blinding pain. Its's TOTALLY worth it. I mean people just don't have what it takes to endure and overcome trial and pain anymore. It is such an accomplishment each and every time I suffer through my migraines without pain meds. This goes for my kids too. When they get ear infections, I just tell them to suck it up, no Tylenol for them! They need to build some fucking character like it the olden days. Oh yea, we also have sheep and spin our own wool. So cool!

[Anonymous]

med-free birther here. i never talk about it unless asked, and i feel like most women don't want to know because i am rarely asked. that's fine with me. i do shun medicine, whether it be cold medicine or a needle in my spine. i'm also the person who is numb from the dental anesthesia for 6 hrs instead of 2. i make my choices because i know how i am, not because it's the latest "trend." i would just like the newly pregnant to understand all of the choices out there. i feel like education on birth topics is lacking. and i do not mean that in a judgmental way... i can already imagine some reading something into that last statement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't really get why there is so many women these days 'excited' labor without epidurals. I understand a first time Mom not really knowing how much pain for how long that labor involves, but more and more 2+ Mom friends are telling me how excited they are to try without an epidural.

Personally, I had an epidural and it gave me some relief, but not all that much relief toward the end and my birth turned out as great as it could be. Given that, I would never want to labor med free - it was absolute torture at the end. A woman down the hall going med free was screaming at the top of her lungs for hours on end.

I almost feel like this trend makes many women feel like they are failures if 1) they 'give in' to an epidural or 2) labor ends in c-section for various reasons. Modern medicine is a blessing for many reasons, it strange to feel like people are pushing back against pain relief that wasn't available to women not too long ago.

I am the mom looking forward to her eighth natural birth, third homebirth. Every mother-to-be on DCUM should thank God she lives in a time and place where women have access to medical technology that can protect and save her life and the life of her child, or give her comfort and respite from labor, and I think we all do. In addition to the technology, every laboring mother deserves respectful support from everyone around her as she brings a new baby into the world.

But there is no need to feel that making an informed choice to use or decline various interventions is a "victory" or a "defeat," a "success" or a "failure." When I share how much I love giving birth, how those moments are the best moments of my life, I am NOT saying "I won, you lost!" I can't imagine how that is the message received. Birth is sacred, whether at home in bed or strapped to a surgical table. The mother should be revered for her part in giving her body over to her baby so her baby can have life.

It has never crossed my mind, not once, that I was a hero or a martyr or deserving of a medal. The honor was all mine, that I was healthy enough and supported enough that I was able to experience birth as intensely pleasurable, sensual, and beautiful--more than once! The birth experiences and the memories are their own reward. And not every birth was blissful--there was one very traumatic experience, not because of the birth, but because of the hospital staff. But I embrace that experience, too, because without it, I never would have stayed home and known the joy and peace of giving birth in my room. I love and cherish all of my births, from my long and naive first one to my sexy and glorious most recent one. Every woman should cherish every minute of each birth they are privileged to have, because they are all moments when we touch eternity.

This paradigm proposed by the OP--unmedicated success versus medicated defeat--simply does not exist. What every woman should strive towards is a very thorough self-education in every aspect of healthy pregnancy and birth, so she is prepared to make informed choices every step of the way. Knowledge is power, and the more women empower themselves, the more joyful birth can be, whatever path it takes.

I'm hoping for another serene, gentle birth in my room this time, but if circumstances require interventions I have not yet needed, I will STILL love every second, because it is my baby's story, our story, and every unique word is priceless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eh, I did natural labor, and it was 30 hours of hellish pain. Totally worth it. I think a lot of people don't have what it takes to endure and overcome trial and pain anymore. I'm as proud of overcoming 30 hours of pain as I am of other accomplishments. Just feels good to not have given up because I couldn't take it.

P.S. I completely, 100% support c-sections and other interventions when necessary. I just think it's sad so many women give up because they can't take the pain, and get epidurals. I know I'm weird, but that's my view, OP. I don't think you're a failure, I just think you should have stuck it out, much as I would think someone who trained for a marathon should cross the finish line.

Whenever I get migraines I go 24 hours with the blinding pain. Its's TOTALLY worth it. I mean people just don't have what it takes to endure and overcome trial and pain anymore. It is such an accomplishment each and every time I suffer through my migraines without pain meds. This goes for my kids too. When they get ear infections, I just tell them to suck it up, no Tylenol for them! They need to build some fucking character like it the olden days. Oh yea, we also have sheep and spin our own wool. So cool!

Not to feed the troll, but the pain experienced in childbirth has purpose, and is very different from the pain of injury or illness. It ebbs and flows, it eases and peaks, it falls away with position changes and counter pressure and warm and cold, in water and and under water, and it is not static--it changes second to second. Some moments can be excruciating, and some moments can be so relaxing, you fall asleep. One second you might feel utmost effort, and the next, complete peace. There is a moment in almost every woman's labor when everything, all that she is, silently screams "THERE IS NO WAY I CAN DO THIS," and that is the cue for observers that the baby is ready to be born. That moment is normal, expected, and necessary, because it takes an act of will to choose to participate in the pushing. You need to make a free will decision to let your body do what needs to be done.

There is nothing retro about the physiological process. Giving birth, having cycles, making love--all part of a woman's healthy reproductive life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't really get why there is so many women these days 'excited' labor without epidurals. I understand a first time Mom not really knowing how much pain for how long that labor involves, but more and more 2+ Mom friends are telling me how excited they are to try without an epidural.

Personally, I had an epidural and it gave me some relief, but not all that much relief toward the end and my birth turned out as great as it could be. Given that, I would never want to labor med free - it was absolute torture at the end. A woman down the hall going med free was screaming at the top of her lungs for hours on end.

I almost feel like this trend makes many women feel like they are failures if 1) they 'give in' to an epidural or 2) labor ends in c-section for various reasons. Modern medicine is a blessing for many reasons, it strange to feel like people are pushing back against pain relief that wasn't available to women not too long ago.

I am the mom looking forward to her eighth natural birth, third homebirth. Every mother-to-be on DCUM should thank God she lives in a time and place where women have access to medical technology that can protect and save her life and the life of her child, or give her comfort and respite from labor, and I think we all do. In addition to the technology, every laboring mother deserves respectful support from everyone around her as she brings a new baby into the world.

But there is no need to feel that making an informed choice to use or decline various interventions is a "victory" or a "defeat," a "success" or a "failure." When I share how much I love giving birth, how those moments are the best moments of my life, I am NOT saying "I won, you lost!" I can't imagine how that is the message received. Birth is sacred, whether at home in bed or strapped to a surgical table. The mother should be revered for her part in giving her body over to her baby so her baby can have life.

It has never crossed my mind, not once, that I was a hero or a martyr or deserving of a medal. The honor was all mine, that I was healthy enough and supported enough that I was able to experience birth as intensely pleasurable, sensual, and beautiful--more than once! The birth experiences and the memories are their own reward. And not every birth was blissful--there was one very traumatic experience, not because of the birth, but because of the hospital staff. But I embrace that experience, too, because without it, I never would have stayed home and known the joy and peace of giving birth in my room. I love and cherish all of my births, from my long and naive first one to my sexy and glorious most recent one. Every woman should cherish every minute of each birth they are privileged to have, because they are all moments when we touch eternity.

This paradigm proposed by the OP--unmedicated success versus medicated defeat--simply does not exist. What every woman should strive towards is a very thorough self-education in every aspect of healthy pregnancy and birth, so she is prepared to make informed choices every step of the way. Knowledge is power, and the more women empower themselves, the more joyful birth can be, whatever path it takes.

I'm hoping for another serene, gentle birth in my room this time, but if circumstances require interventions I have not yet needed, I will STILL love every second, because it is my baby's story, our story, and every unique word is priceless.

I've read a lot of your posts before and there are definitely times when you come off as kind of crazy and flaky, but this is one of the most beautiful things I've ever read on this site.

"The honor was all mine" indeed. I have never felt as proud or as grateful as I did when my daughter was born. Proud, because it really is amazing the things our bodies can do - we grow PEOPLE, you guys. They come out with eyes and ears and toenails, and that is cool as hell. Grateful, because after a rather rebellious teenager and years spent working with really jaded professional people, I didn't think there were going to be very many experiences that were truly surprising or completely new, and giving birth was. It doesn't matter where it happens. It's just as amazing when it happens in an operating room as when it happens in a damn yurt. We grow people, and then they turn into people, and THEY grow people.

That's the point. Not how you did it or how I did or how the hostile PPs with their snark on both sides of this issue. We create life, and that's amazing, even if it's been done over and over and over throughout history. It's amazing every single time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My first was unmedicated. I was great! I went with an epidural for my second (my midwife suggested it, in fact, to get the baby to descend), and I thought it was great as well! Each way, same same. lol

Me too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't really get why there is so many women these days 'excited' labor without epidurals. I understand a first time Mom not really knowing how much pain for how long that labor involves, but more and more 2+ Mom friends are telling me how excited they are to try without an epidural.

Personally, I had an epidural and it gave me some relief, but not all that much relief toward the end and my birth turned out as great as it could be. Given that, I would never want to labor med free - it was absolute torture at the end. A woman down the hall going med free was screaming at the top of her lungs for hours on end.

I almost feel like this trend makes many women feel like they are failures if 1) they 'give in' to an epidural or 2) labor ends in c-section for various reasons. Modern medicine is a blessing for many reasons, it strange to feel like people are pushing back against pain relief that wasn't available to women not too long ago.

I am the mom looking forward to her eighth natural birth, third homebirth. Every mother-to-be on DCUM should thank God she lives in a time and place where women have access to medical technology that can protect and save her life and the life of her child, or give her comfort and respite from labor, and I think we all do. In addition to the technology, every laboring mother deserves respectful support from everyone around her as she brings a new baby into the world.

But there is no need to feel that making an informed choice to use or decline various interventions is a "victory" or a "defeat," a "success" or a "failure." When I share how much I love giving birth, how those moments are the best moments of my life, I am NOT saying "I won, you lost!" I can't imagine how that is the message received. Birth is sacred, whether at home in bed or strapped to a surgical table. The mother should be revered for her part in giving her body over to her baby so her baby can have life.

It has never crossed my mind, not once, that I was a hero or a martyr or deserving of a medal. The honor was all mine, that I was healthy enough and supported enough that I was able to experience birth as intensely pleasurable, sensual, and beautiful--more than once! The birth experiences and the memories are their own reward. And not every birth was blissful--there was one very traumatic experience, not because of the birth, but because of the hospital staff. But I embrace that experience, too, because without it, I never would have stayed home and known the joy and peace of giving birth in my room. I love and cherish all of my births, from my long and naive first one to my sexy and glorious most recent one. Every woman should cherish every minute of each birth they are privileged to have, because they are all moments when we touch eternity.

This paradigm proposed by the OP--unmedicated success versus medicated defeat--simply does not exist. What every woman should strive towards is a very thorough self-education in every aspect of healthy pregnancy and birth, so she is prepared to make informed choices every step of the way. Knowledge is power, and the more women empower themselves, the more joyful birth can be, whatever path it takes.

I'm hoping for another serene, gentle birth in my room this time, but if circumstances require interventions I have not yet needed, I will STILL love every second, because it is my baby's story, our story, and every unique word is priceless.

I've read a lot of your posts before and there are definitely times when you come off as kind of crazy and flaky, but this is one of the most beautiful things I've ever read on this site.

"The honor was all mine" indeed. I have never felt as proud or as grateful as I did when my daughter was born. Proud, because it really is amazing the things our bodies can do - we grow PEOPLE, you guys. They come out with eyes and ears and toenails, and that is cool as hell. Grateful, because after a rather rebellious teenager and years spent working with really jaded professional people, I didn't think there were going to be very many experiences that were truly surprising or completely new, and giving birth was. It doesn't matter where it happens. It's just as amazing when it happens in an operating room as when it happens in a damn yurt. We grow people, and then they turn into people, and THEY grow people.

That's the point. Not how you did it or how I did or how the hostile PPs with their snark on both sides of this issue. We create life, and that's amazing, even if it's been done over and over and over throughout history. It's amazing every single time.

Well, there's a reason they call me C9BL