Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A big MAGA talking point is that foreigners are taking US jobs. It's true - you try getting a job in the Silicon Valley. That is where I'm from, my family lived there until recently but it is literally impossible to compete with H1B visa holders - and now their kids and friends. Even in areas that you don't need tech skills - like marketing - you can't compete. And then competing with foreign students to get into college - there are less spaces for Americans, so there is less opportunity for them and it's a downward spiral.

The universities don't need billions saved in endowments. They can afford to not take foreign money from students.

Sounds like you want a form of socialism where the government dictates how private organizations are run.

Fwiw I also used to work in the Bay Area. I'm also an American.

lol. So anytime the government dictates something that is socialism. Can I stop paying my taxes because this isn’t a socialist country? You are an idiot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.

International students are a major source of funding. They are almost all full pay (sometimes at higher rates than Americans) so they subsidize financial aid as well as their programs of study.

If the government were paying for universities - as it could and arguably should, so that everyone could have a low-cost or free education - then maybe we could talk about it. But as it is, limiting international students would just reduce what the university can afford to do for Americans.

NP. At top universities - at least top 20, top 50, there are enough domestic full pay applicants to make up that funding.

Enough domestic full pay applicants without the university meaningfully lowering their admissions standards? Or are you just saying that if you let in anybody who can pay, you will find enough people who want to go?

I'm sure there's a lot of variation in how admissions are done, but the schools I'm familiar with have a separate application for international students. Domestic students are not truly competing with the international pool for the same spots.

They reject tons of full pay kids with high stats. There are some high schools around here where nearly every kid would do fine at Harvard (class average SATs over 1400), and Harvard accepts zero to 1 kid, so most don't even bother applying. They happily go to other great schools, and get merit aid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.

International students are a major source of funding. They are almost all full pay (sometimes at higher rates than Americans) so they subsidize financial aid as well as their programs of study.

If the government were paying for universities - as it could and arguably should, so that everyone could have a low-cost or free education - then maybe we could talk about it. But as it is, limiting international students would just reduce what the university can afford to do for Americans.

I am for intl students being enrolled, but my kid is at a T20, and I am surprised that probably the 25 I have spoken to are all receiving aid. Zero told me they are full pay. I used to think as you do now.

So you are grilling your DC’s friends about how much they pay the university because you have a agenda? You sound like a peach and a liar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A big MAGA talking point is that foreigners are taking US jobs. It's true - you try getting a job in the Silicon Valley. That is where I'm from, my family lived there until recently but it is literally impossible to compete with H1B visa holders - and now their kids and friends. Even in areas that you don't need tech skills - like marketing - you can't compete. And then competing with foreign students to get into college - there are less spaces for Americans, so there is less opportunity for them and it's a downward spiral.

The universities don't need billions saved in endowments. They can afford to not take foreign money from students.

Oh, come on. Don't overstate your case; you lose the audience. There are thousands of colleges in the U.S. No one is getting shut out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:From Common Data Set

24-25 Princeton 11.2%
396 International students out of 3,525 enrolled freshman

John Hopkins 17%
236 international out of 1389 enrolled freshman

23-24, 24-25 Stanford Section C1 listing of international students Blank

23-24, 24-25 MIT Section Blank

Cornell 11.2%
396 International freshman out of 3525

Dartmouth 14.3%
170 freshman out of 1,182 enrolled freshman

Brown 17.6%
304 international out of 1719 enrolled freshman

These are all private institutions who don’t owe you anything. Further, many of these wealthy international kids went to US boarding schools from middle school up. We know several.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.

In what universe does a government have a right to do that? I mean they could cut off all foreign students but not just to “top” schools.
I won’t even get into how dumb this is - these students are the way we get skilled immigrants , which we need. Not to mention massive soft power and prestige. Which is way better as a defense investment than most of thr DoD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm almost positive that the majority of international students at a school like Harvard are graduate students.

Just under 30% of undergrads at Harvard are foreign.

No, most of the internationals at Harvard are grad students. 14% of undergrads are internationals per the Common Data Set.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You would think they would start by limiting international enrollment at state schools first, by apparently Trump is on a revenge tour against Harvard for some reason.

Trump has no business dictating anything to states or private institutions.

For states there is a greater financial impact as OOS and International students pay substantially more. You could argue that the top 20 public institutions could fill their seats with domestic OOS but many public’s like Kansas, Iowa etc really struggle for OOS students and have to rely on international students.

Let foreigners go to red states then. Places like Harvard should prioritize Americans.

You laid out your desperate agenda like a red carpet. No, your kid won’t get in. I’m sure you’ll say Harvard is taking too many rural students from red states. Actually they should to combat MAGA rot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.

Stop being MAGA.

It's not healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm almost positive that the majority of international students at a school like Harvard are graduate students.

That is how it used to be. There has been an absolutely massive uptick in the number of international students at top schools for undergraduate. This is what has changed. International students used to be mainly graduate students. Now so many are undergraduate students. This is from Common Data Set for 23-24

Harvard Freshman Enrollment
In state students: 210. (12.7%)
Out of state students: 1167 (70.9%)
International Students: 268 (16.2%)
Total first time first degree seeking: 1645

That doesn’t look massive. So, call it 1,000 undergrads are international, out of 7700 international students. So, yes the vast majority are grad students.

It’s 16% of the undergraduate population; it should be 5%.
Back to the 1990s/2000s.

NP. Indeed, this has happened at many top schools. It's a curious change, particularly from certain countries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.

International students are a major source of funding. They are almost all full pay (sometimes at higher rates than Americans) so they subsidize financial aid as well as their programs of study.

If the government were paying for universities - as it could and arguably should, so that everyone could have a low-cost or free education - then maybe we could talk about it. But as it is, limiting international students would just reduce what the university can afford to do for Americans.

NP. At top universities - at least top 20, top 50, there are enough domestic full pay applicants to make up that funding.

Enough domestic full pay applicants without the university meaningfully lowering their admissions standards? Or are you just saying that if you let in anybody who can pay, you will find enough people who want to go?

I'm sure there's a lot of variation in how admissions are done, but the schools I'm familiar with have a separate application for international students. Domestic students are not truly competing with the international pool for the same spots.

There are 100,000 high schools in the U.S. which means that there are 500,000 kids who graduate in the top 5 of their class. Surely there are enough full pay kids in the U.S. who also meet academic standards.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You would think they would start by limiting international enrollment at state schools first, by apparently Trump is on a revenge tour against Harvard for some reason.

Trump has no business dictating anything to states or private institutions.

For states there is a greater financial impact as OOS and International students pay substantially more. You could argue that the top 20 public institutions could fill their seats with domestic OOS but many public’s like Kansas, Iowa etc really struggle for OOS students and have to rely on international students.

THank You. OMG did you read your title OP? ...if Trump limited international students.... If TRUMP limited. By what powers?
This is completely out of the realm of the tiny hand dictator.

[Anonymous]

Yes, prioritize Americans. Limit international students at ALL universities

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A big MAGA talking point is that foreigners are taking US jobs. It's true - you try getting a job in the Silicon Valley. That is where I'm from, my family lived there until recently but it is literally impossible to compete with H1B visa holders - and now their kids and friends. Even in areas that you don't need tech skills - like marketing - you can't compete. And then competing with foreign students to get into college - there are less spaces for Americans, so there is less opportunity for them and it's a downward spiral.

The universities don't need billions saved in endowments. They can afford to not take foreign money from students.

You have a poverty mindset. You should work on that. You might also think about issues not in black and white, but instead with nuance and consider unintended consequences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A big MAGA talking point is that foreigners are taking US jobs. It's true - you try getting a job in the Silicon Valley. That is where I'm from, my family lived there until recently but it is literally impossible to compete with H1B visa holders - and now their kids and friends. Even in areas that you don't need tech skills - like marketing - you can't compete. And then competing with foreign students to get into college - there are less spaces for Americans, so there is less opportunity for them and it's a downward spiral.

The universities don't need billions saved in endowments. They can afford to not take foreign money from students.

Sorry to hear that, but that's how to keep American companies competitive globally, suck talents from other countries, and keep labor cost low in this country.
Same for foreign students, some of them will stay, some will go back to their countries becoming head of states, bureaucrats in their government, that gives great advantage to U.S to advocate its policies and interests, other countries like China, Russia, or EU would dream to have talented students come to their universities.