Do any parents out there know their kids are the mean ones?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid, who is also super sarcastic and a bit of a moody loner, is stereotyped by other children as the likely next school shooter. Kids joke about it. They reported him to the counselors, etc.

He is a bit non-conformist and verbally mean. Other kids that think they are sweet, and wonderful, and caring have actually been sabotaging little jerks.

He is usually cheerful at home and we have no risk factors. He hated middle school but high school is much better because there is finally lots of tracking for the brighter and harder working students.

So I'm aware that people feel that my kid is the mean kid but I know for sure that it's not all his personality.

I used to tell people just to leave him alone. No counseling, no jollying, no calling on, no rearranging seats. Just let the bear rest in his cage (school) and there will be no verbal paw swipes.

It's been funny to me to see the outcomes of the "nice
kids" who caused my son problems. They have lost popularity in high school. And one came to realize he falsely overstated my son's issues and caused him real problems. That kid expressed guilt. Good.

I’m a high school teacher and this tracks with how the parents of the rare, few kids I’ve taught who I *and the students* got “could be a school shooter” vibes from. They all swore the kid was nice and polite and loving at home! I will just say this: children can’t name what is “off” about these kids so the only language they have is “future school shooter” but that’s code for “this kid gives everyone weird vibes- he’s unsettling, says scary, inappropriate things, and the energy around him is off.” They’re never wrong - the kids who give THEM these feelings give the adults these feelings too. Parents always swear the kid is a totally different human at home!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of those kids have parents who behave the same way.

This has been my experience as well, especially regarding girls. You’d be surprised how many moms care very much about social standing, perceived hierarchy and will brush off cutting girls out of the friend group as “the girls are just growing apart”. Obviously kids change as they get older but there’s a big difference in natural attrition and very clear social goals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid, who is also super sarcastic and a bit of a moody loner, is stereotyped by other children as the likely next school shooter. Kids joke about it. They reported him to the counselors, etc.

He is a bit non-conformist and verbally mean. Other kids that think they are sweet, and wonderful, and caring have actually been sabotaging little jerks.

He is usually cheerful at home and we have no risk factors. He hated middle school but high school is much better because there is finally lots of tracking for the brighter and harder working students.

So I'm aware that people feel that my kid is the mean kid but I know for sure that it's not all his personality.

I used to tell people just to leave him alone. No counseling, no jollying, no calling on, no rearranging seats. Just let the bear rest in his cage (school) and there will be no verbal paw swipes.

It's been funny to me to see the outcomes of the "nice
kids" who caused my son problems. They have lost popularity in high school. And one came to realize he falsely overstated my son's issues and caused him real problems. That kid expressed guilt. Good.

I’m a high school teacher and this tracks with how the parents of the rare, few kids I’ve taught who I *and the students* got “could be a school shooter” vibes from. They all swore the kid was nice and polite and loving at home! I will just say this: children can’t name what is “off” about these kids so the only language they have is “future school shooter” but that’s code for “this kid gives everyone weird vibes- he’s unsettling, says scary, inappropriate things, and the energy around him is off.” They’re never wrong - the kids who give THEM these feelings give the adults these feelings too. Parents always swear the kid is a totally different human at home!

I don't have one of these kids though my kid is despised by other kids for being cheery and loud and saying weird things though never scary or unsettling things. So I'm inclined to want "off" kids of any nonviolent variety to not be picked on and shunned by kids and teachers. Imagine a world were "off" people who give off "weird vibes" were welcome too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oldest 2 boys are probably mean. They exclude other boys and hold weak ones in semi-open disdain. We didn’t teach them to be this way but it came to them naturally.

They’re not cruel, though. The funny thing is they’re rewarded for their behavior by the other boys and girls.

And you know you have to rein it in, instead of writing that out as if you were proud of them?

Disagree. They’re not cruel and it helps them socially. They were raised to be strong, so not sure why I’d try to teach them something different after all these years.

I am proud of their strength, and I should be. DH and I made choices to raise good men, and we got what we wanted.

How does it show strength when they are disdainful of weaker children??? I see plenty of strong young men around my children's school and they have nothing to prove to anyone, no need to show off by bullying others. I see kids like your sons and they don't look strong, they look ridiculous. And if you're not sure why you'd teach your sons to be something other than "mean" (your words, in your first post), then you're probably beyond help.

Good question. As DH explains it, boys need hierarchy. Our two oldest exclude those who try to buck it. I should have been more clear.

This forum has a feminine take on protecting the weak. However, because my boys are strong, I don’t always agree with that reflex. Moms I know with strong sons think the way I do.

Do you mean physically strong? Tall and big? Socially adept? Good looking? I sincerely don’t even know what in the actual hell you are talking about.

“As DH explains it, boys need hierarchy” made me lol though. Glad your husband is around to explain these things.

I have

[Anonymous]

I think parents might have an idea, but may not realize how much their sh#t-headed kids negatively impact other kids around them.

We have a few girls on our DD soccer team, they always say very pointed/ mean things that are critical of their teammates at U11. My DD really doesn't like it. I honestly thought we were the only family that was impacted by it, but it turns out most of the families were impacted by it. -Which is to say, it is obvious to everyone around the mean kids, but it seems to be less obvious to those parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oldest 2 boys are probably mean. They exclude other boys and hold weak ones in semi-open disdain. We didn’t teach them to be this way but it came to them naturally.

They’re not cruel, though. The funny thing is they’re rewarded for their behavior by the other boys and girls.

And you know you have to rein it in, instead of writing that out as if you were proud of them?

Disagree. They’re not cruel and it helps them socially. They were raised to be strong, so not sure why I’d try to teach them something different after all these years.

I am proud of their strength, and I should be. DH and I made choices to raise good men, and we got what we wanted.

How does it show strength when they are disdainful of weaker children??? I see plenty of strong young men around my children's school and they have nothing to prove to anyone, no need to show off by bullying others. I see kids like your sons and they don't look strong, they look ridiculous. And if you're not sure why you'd teach your sons to be something other than "mean" (your words, in your first post), then you're probably beyond help.

Good question. As DH explains it, boys need hierarchy. Our two oldest exclude those who try to buck it. I should have been more clear.

This forum has a feminine take on protecting the weak. However, because my boys are strong, I don’t always agree with that reflex. Moms I know with strong sons think the way I do.

Yikes. Your sons are jerks, not “strong”. They hold weaker boys in disdain? Wow. I can tell you that other boys have a very specific view of yours, and it’s not positive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oldest 2 boys are probably mean. They exclude other boys and hold weak ones in semi-open disdain. We didn’t teach them to be this way but it came to them naturally.

They’re not cruel, though. The funny thing is they’re rewarded for their behavior by the other boys and girls.

You think mean is a step below cruel so the boys are ok? No. You’re describing cruel behavior. Who do they think they are to be so disdainful of other students? These boys your sons have labeled “weak” probably have skills your sons know nothing about.

Cruelty isn’t natural it’s learned behavior and it can be changed. You don’t want your son peaking in their teen years, clowns that feel the need to put others down so they can be rewarded like dogs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oldest 2 boys are probably mean. They exclude other boys and hold weak ones in semi-open disdain. We didn’t teach them to be this way but it came to them naturally.

They’re not cruel, though. The funny thing is they’re rewarded for their behavior by the other boys and girls.

And you know you have to rein it in, instead of writing that out as if you were proud of them?

Disagree. They’re not cruel and it helps them socially. They were raised to be strong, so not sure why I’d try to teach them something different after all these years.

I am proud of their strength, and I should be. DH and I made choices to raise good men, and we got what we wanted.

How does it show strength when they are disdainful of weaker children??? I see plenty of strong young men around my children's school and they have nothing to prove to anyone, no need to show off by bullying others. I see kids like your sons and they don't look strong, they look ridiculous. And if you're not sure why you'd teach your sons to be something other than "mean" (your words, in your first post), then you're probably beyond help.

Good question. As DH explains it, boys need hierarchy. Our two oldest exclude those who try to buck it. I should have been more clear.

This forum has a feminine take on protecting the weak. However, because my boys are strong, I don’t always agree with that reflex. Moms I know with strong sons think the way I do.

Yikes. Your sons are jerks, not “strong”. They hold weaker boys in disdain? Wow. I can tell you that other boys have a very specific view of yours, and it’s not positive.

+10 A “feminine take on protecting the weak” is a cowardly way of saying “I encourage my kids to bully”. The only type of kids who would want to be around someone like that are those with a similar personality disorder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oldest 2 boys are probably mean. They exclude other boys and hold weak ones in semi-open disdain. We didn’t teach them to be this way but it came to them naturally.

They’re not cruel, though. The funny thing is they’re rewarded for their behavior by the other boys and girls.

And you know you have to rein it in, instead of writing that out as if you were proud of them?

Disagree. They’re not cruel and it helps them socially. They were raised to be strong, so not sure why I’d try to teach them something different after all these years.

I am proud of their strength, and I should be. DH and I made choices to raise good men, and we got what we wanted.

They sound like amazing men. Well done.

(That is so much sarcasm. You are terrifying.)

OMG, this IS terrifying.
You consciously are proud of the fact that your boys exclude others and hold others in disdain?
They don't sound like good people in this way at all, but you see this as strong and good?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

I am concerned that the "strong Mom" who says her husband tells her boys need hierarchy may not be uncommon.
As the parent of girls, whom I guess need protecting because of my feminist slant (eye roll), I would hope I have raised my kids to steer far, far away from these kids

Any hints on how to do that other than to raise them to respect themselves and be kind to others?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

I am concerned that the "strong Mom" who says her husband tells her boys need hierarchy may not be uncommon.
As the parent of girls, whom I guess need protecting because of my feminist slant (eye roll), I would hope I have raised my kids to steer far, far away from these kids

Any hints on how to do that other than to raise them to respect themselves and be kind to others?

Fellow girl mom here - the boys like PP describes aren't maybe so bad because if they hold other kids in semi-open disdain, they are easy to spot. The problem gets to be (like Brock Turner mentioned above) when people are in a vulnerable position around these boys/men. AFAIK the only solution to that is to steer far away and travel in packs in vulnerable situations.

The guys who are even more scary are the ones who are able to conceal the disdain - the type people call narcissists these days, though I think that word is horrifically overused.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

+1 million. The PP who talks about her "strong" sons has weak sons who think that getting even weaker followers by their mean flexes is OK. Unfortunately in our increasingly "might makes right" society, it just might work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

I am concerned that the "strong Mom" who says her husband tells her boys need hierarchy may not be uncommon.
As the parent of girls, whom I guess need protecting because of my feminist slant (eye roll), I would hope I have raised my kids to steer far, far away from these kids

Any hints on how to do that other than to raise them to respect themselves and be kind to others?

Fellow girl mom here - the boys like PP describes aren't maybe so bad because if they hold other kids in semi-open disdain, they are easy to spot. The problem gets to be (like Brock Turner mentioned above) when people are in a vulnerable position around these boys/men. AFAIK the only solution to that is to steer far away and travel in packs in vulnerable situations.

The guys who are even more scary are the ones who are able to conceal the disdain - the type people call narcissists these days, though I think that word is horrifically overused.

PP here. Your daughters will have no problem avoiding boys like mine because they are openly MAGA. You may be surprised that your daughter may change her behavior to win their favor because they are quite popular with the girls. It probably won’t surprise anyone that they are lax bros.

I was talking with a mom of a high-achieving girl (headed to an high Ivy purely on academics), who confessed her daughter hides her views so as to not offend similar boys at a different school. Thought it was interesting because I was a huge Democrat before meeting DH. It’s not always bad to change the way you see politics.

Also, it seems like there is an obsession with empathy. Too much empathy isn’t good either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

I am concerned that the "strong Mom" who says her husband tells her boys need hierarchy may not be uncommon.
As the parent of girls, whom I guess need protecting because of my feminist slant (eye roll), I would hope I have raised my kids to steer far, far away from these kids

Any hints on how to do that other than to raise them to respect themselves and be kind to others?

Fellow girl mom here - the boys like PP describes aren't maybe so bad because if they hold other kids in semi-open disdain, they are easy to spot. The problem gets to be (like Brock Turner mentioned above) when people are in a vulnerable position around these boys/men. AFAIK the only solution to that is to steer far away and travel in packs in vulnerable situations.

The guys who are even more scary are the ones who are able to conceal the disdain - the type people call narcissists these days, though I think that word is horrifically overused.

PP here. Your daughters will have no problem avoiding boys like mine because they are openly MAGA. You may be surprised that your daughter may change her behavior to win their favor because they are quite popular with the girls. It probably won’t surprise anyone that they are lax bros.

I was talking with a mom of a high-achieving girl (headed to an high Ivy purely on academics), who confessed her daughter hides her views so as to not offend similar boys at a different school. Thought it was interesting because I was a huge Democrat before meeting DH. It’s not always bad to change the way you see politics.

Also, it seems like there is an obsession with empathy. Too much empathy isn’t good either.

Empathy is not the problem. Stupidity is. We could use more open-hearted empathy paired with some critical thinking. But both are in very short supply these days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The strongest kids are the ones who buck the hierarchy and look out for the vulnerable. The weakest are afraid to disrupt the status quo.

I am concerned that the "strong Mom" who says her husband tells her boys need hierarchy may not be uncommon.
As the parent of girls, whom I guess need protecting because of my feminist slant (eye roll), I would hope I have raised my kids to steer far, far away from these kids

Any hints on how to do that other than to raise them to respect themselves and be kind to others?

Fellow girl mom here - the boys like PP describes aren't maybe so bad because if they hold other kids in semi-open disdain, they are easy to spot. The problem gets to be (like Brock Turner mentioned above) when people are in a vulnerable position around these boys/men. AFAIK the only solution to that is to steer far away and travel in packs in vulnerable situations.

The guys who are even more scary are the ones who are able to conceal the disdain - the type people call narcissists these days, though I think that word is horrifically overused.

PP here. Your daughters will have no problem avoiding boys like mine because they are openly MAGA. You may be surprised that your daughter may change her behavior to win their favor because they are quite popular with the girls. It probably won’t surprise anyone that they are lax bros.

I was talking with a mom of a high-achieving girl (headed to an high Ivy purely on academics), who confessed her daughter hides her views so as to not offend similar boys at a different school. Thought it was interesting because I was a huge Democrat before meeting DH. It’s not always bad to change the way you see politics.

Also, it seems like there is an obsession with empathy. Too much empathy isn’t good either.

My kids care much more about their religion than their politics. As they should, given our religion says it's primary and politics is only good in it's place.

But we don't like the empathy obsession either. Feeling along with people doesn't you help them the way sympathy (feeling FOR them) does.

And you've misread our politics by the way. You can consider my politics, and my principals, to basically be The Dispatchp. And for now at least my girls agree.