Nancy Mace’s Women’s Bathroom Bill

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

Best post of the thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who don't want to change in front of a transgender female, how do you feel about changing in front of a lesbian??

Since women don't generally rape and they don't have rape equipment on their bodies, it is not a problem at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

Best post of the thread.

And yet, women who were concerned about accusations against Trump did not get the same benefit. Double standard yet again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

The people who are trying to dismiss and minimize the issues here do not care about the increased risk to women. If some women get physically hurt in the service of protecting the feelings of transwomen, they’re fine with that tradeoff.

[Anonymous]

Mace is a bully, end of story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

So how do you envision this getting resolved? Penis check at the entrance? What do your trans friends want? Surely you discussed this with them.

DP. There needs to be a third bathroom option everywhere. It should be an ADA requirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

So how do you envision this getting resolved? Penis check at the entrance? What do your trans friends want? Surely you discussed this with them.

DP. There needs to be a third bathroom option everywhere. It should be an ADA requirement.

Ideally, they should all be unisex, single stall, agree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who don't want to change in front of a transgender female, how do you feel about changing in front of a lesbian??

Since women don't generally rape and they don't have rape equipment on their bodies, it is not a problem at all.

Not only that. If a biological woman tried to attack another woman, it is a more even playing field to fight her off. Even scrawny men have more strength than the average woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nancy Mace says she has PTSD because she’s a survivor of rape and doesn’t want anyone with a penis in women’s private spaces.

Dems are going to have a hard time with this one.

How does Mace know whether 1) McBride has a penis (McBride could be post-op) and 2) why does she think that said penis, if it exists, will be displayed in the bathroom? Women's bathrooms have private stalls.

Let’s play a thought experiment. How far do you want to take this? By your logic, Travis Kelce could just put on a wig and stand around a women’s locker room ogling everyone as long as he kept his clothes on and that’d be totally fine, right?

Crazy town.

Haven't travelled much, have you? Lots of countries have unisex bathrooms and some even have unisex locker rooms and unisex saunas. They also have nude and topless beaches. Heck, I lived in Northern Europe in the 70s and used unisex bathrooms in public facilities all the time.

Heck, lots of places in this area have only one bathroom and people manage. Unless a biological man is undressing and showering in a place like a gym, I do care if he pees where I do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

Best post of the thread.

I hear what you're saying but the reality is that if a man--any man, including one posing as a woman--wants to attack women in a pubic bathroom, there's not much stopping him. They don't need to pose as a woman to do it. The can just choose an out-of-the-way bathroom at off-peak hours, watch women enter and leave, and then go in and jam/lock the door shut to prevent entry. That could happen anywhere--in a mall, in a gas station, in a school, pretty much anywhere. Remember the straight teen in Massachusetts who followed his HS math teacher into the bathroom, raped and murdered her, and then smuggled her body out of the school in a janitor's barrel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mace is a bully, end of story.

Why is it that Democrats cannot stand women who stand up for themselves? All kinds of names are thrown at them for having an opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

Best post of the thread.

I hear what you're saying but the reality is that if a man--any man, including one posing as a woman--wants to attack women in a pubic bathroom, there's not much stopping him. They don't need to pose as a woman to do it. The can just choose an out-of-the-way bathroom at off-peak hours, watch women enter and leave, and then go in and jam/lock the door shut to prevent entry. That could happen anywhere--in a mall, in a gas station, in a school, pretty much anywhere. Remember the straight teen in Massachusetts who followed his HS math teacher into the bathroom, raped and murdered her, and then smuggled her body out of the school in a janitor's barrel?

You are not making the case for biological men in private women's spaces that you think you are. This is exactly why they should have separate spaces.

[Anonymous]

If you have a penis, you don't belong in the kind of bathroom designed for women that's enclosed with stalls. Too dangerous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Harris voter who hates Trump and I also have trans friends and colleagues and I want their rights protected. So those are my bona fides if you choose to believe them.

I think people who dismiss and put down the trans bathroom issue often don't really understand the argument being made. I think people are actually discouraged from engaging the argument at all and that this is to the detriment of Democrats because if you can't understand the argument you can't propose a solution to it that is consistent with Democratic values.

The argument is NOT that trans women should be barred from womens bathrooms because there is something scary about being the next stall over from someone with a penis or being in an enclosed space with someone with a penis. Women are around people with penises all the time including in a workplace like Congress.

The argument is that if we affirmatively allow trans women into womens restrooms, it opens the door for men who are perverts and predators to use that as a "loophole" for gaining access to a women's space where women might be vulnerable. If having a penis is not a disqualifer for entering a womens bathroom (since many trans women have penises) then, so people like Nancy Mace argue, there is no way to prevent men (just men, not trans women) from posing as women in order to go into womens bathrooms and attack women.

There are good arguments against this argument. Make them. But when you just roll your eyes and say things like "omg are you afraid of penises? you know people don't get naked in public bathrooms right?" you actually hand people like Mace a gift. Because it shows you don't actually understand the underlying concern (which is shared by plenty of Americans) and are unwilling to actually engage the argument being made so you throw up straw men instead. It's not helpful.

Best post of the thread.

I hear what you're saying but the reality is that if a man--any man, including one posing as a woman--wants to attack women in a pubic bathroom, there's not much stopping him. They don't need to pose as a woman to do it. The can just choose an out-of-the-way bathroom at off-peak hours, watch women enter and leave, and then go in and jam/lock the door shut to prevent entry. That could happen anywhere--in a mall, in a gas station, in a school, pretty much anywhere. Remember the straight teen in Massachusetts who followed his HS math teacher into the bathroom, raped and murdered her, and then smuggled her body out of the school in a janitor's barrel?

You are not making the case for biological men in private women's spaces that you think you are. This is exactly why they should have separate spaces.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who don't want to change in front of a transgender female, how do you feel about changing in front of a lesbian??

Since women don't generally rape and they don't have rape equipment on their bodies, it is not a problem at all.

So then vulnerable men are fair game but as long as women don’t have the “equipment” then everything is cool?