parenting plan - what you wish you had included or really great provisions that you wish you had included

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

PP here. We have not had this issue raised, but based on my reading of our plan-Yes, I believe the other parent could. Ours specifies that parenting time applies only to the biological parents. On one hand, it may let ex prevent dc from a sleepover that I approve of. On the other hand, I could prevent dc from a sleepover that I do not approve of.

If its his time you should not be approving a sleep over.

If it's in the agreement that parenting time is for biological parents, then yes you get offered parenting time first, before a child would spend extended time away from the biological parents.

What happens when your child is 10 and really wants to go Lego day camp with his friends, or he’s 14 and he wants to go to a sleep-away lacrosse clinic with his team, and your ex decides he’s going to exercise his ROFR? Your provision is about you, not about what is best for your child.

The ex would still have this imput if you were still married-if you were married one parent could still say no to that. And good luck to an ex who keeps a 14 yo instead of letting them go to the clinic-I'm sure child would be super pleasant and fun in that situation LOL.

If I go on a business trip on my parenting time, I offer ex the time first, before arranging care. Why shouldn't ex get parenting time with his own dc before a grandparent or friend? That is what rofr ensures.

It's in the child's best interest to be with one of their own parents. That's why that provision is there.

The clause also means that the other parent

the point of divorcing is so that you minimize the amount of agreements and contact you have to make. ROFR means that you potentially have to negotiate with your ex every time you want to leave the kid for three hours. this may make sense for an infant but not an older child. and there can be unintended consequences like your ex flaking on an agreement to take the kids or blocking a sleepover with cousins.

barring some specific concerns (like not trusting a grandparent babysitting or thinking your ex will just pawn an infant off on a nanny) the best parenting agreement will be limited to the *actual* concerns you have, rather than being overly prescriptive. there are some theoretical issues you do want to cover because they are so important, like relocation. but you don’t want to try to dictate every tiny thing.

Actually, you should try to spell it out clearly. That leaves less room for conflict.

You don't 'negotiate' with rofr. You offer the time and they accept it or not. No reason to say why you are offering time, just that you are. It's not complicated.

So, you just say "Do you want Larla from 2 to 6 p.m. on Saturday?" and not "Larla was invited to Zoe's birthday party. She really wants to go to. The party is at X place. Can she go?"

Because the former seems unfair to Larla, and potentially to the other parent who is being set up to disappoint their kid.

I mean, the most obvious and simple solution to this if you think the other parent would stop them from going, would be to stay at the party for 5 or 10 minutes or show up 5 or 10 minutes early. Then she's not away from you for over 4 hours. That's completely legal.

Until there's a 5 hour party.

Have 5 hr drop off parties been a significant factor in your parenting journey?

Exactly 5? Probably not. Longer than 5? Sure, my kids frequently get invited to things that last all day.

I am assuming you have little kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

PP here. We have not had this issue raised, but based on my reading of our plan-Yes, I believe the other parent could. Ours specifies that parenting time applies only to the biological parents. On one hand, it may let ex prevent dc from a sleepover that I approve of. On the other hand, I could prevent dc from a sleepover that I do not approve of.

If its his time you should not be approving a sleep over.

If it's in the agreement that parenting time is for biological parents, then yes you get offered parenting time first, before a child would spend extended time away from the biological parents.

What happens when your child is 10 and really wants to go Lego day camp with his friends, or he’s 14 and he wants to go to a sleep-away lacrosse clinic with his team, and your ex decides he’s going to exercise his ROFR? Your provision is about you, not about what is best for your child.

The ex would still have this imput if you were still married-if you were married one parent could still say no to that. And good luck to an ex who keeps a 14 yo instead of letting them go to the clinic-I'm sure child would be super pleasant and fun in that situation LOL.

If I go on a business trip on my parenting time, I offer ex the time first, before arranging care. Why shouldn't ex get parenting time with his own dc before a grandparent or friend? That is what rofr ensures.

It's in the child's best interest to be with one of their own parents. That's why that provision is there.

The clause also means that the other parent

the point of divorcing is so that you minimize the amount of agreements and contact you have to make. ROFR means that you potentially have to negotiate with your ex every time you want to leave the kid for three hours. this may make sense for an infant but not an older child. and there can be unintended consequences like your ex flaking on an agreement to take the kids or blocking a sleepover with cousins.

barring some specific concerns (like not trusting a grandparent babysitting or thinking your ex will just pawn an infant off on a nanny) the best parenting agreement will be limited to the *actual* concerns you have, rather than being overly prescriptive. there are some theoretical issues you do want to cover because they are so important, like relocation. but you don’t want to try to dictate every tiny thing.

Actually, you should try to spell it out clearly. That leaves less room for conflict.

You don't 'negotiate' with rofr. You offer the time and they accept it or not. No reason to say why you are offering time, just that you are. It's not complicated.

So, you just say "Do you want Larla from 2 to 6 p.m. on Saturday?" and not "Larla was invited to Zoe's birthday party. She really wants to go to. The party is at X place. Can she go?"

Because the former seems unfair to Larla, and potentially to the other parent who is being set up to disappoint their kid.

I mean, the most obvious and simple solution to this if you think the other parent would stop them from going, would be to stay at the party for 5 or 10 minutes or show up 5 or 10 minutes early. Then she's not away from you for over 4 hours. That's completely legal.

Until there's a 5 hour party.

Have 5 hr drop off parties been a significant factor in your parenting journey?

Exactly 5? Probably not. Longer than 5? Sure, my kids frequently get invited to things that last all day.

I am assuming you have little kids.

Sounds like an 8 hr rofr would be better for your situation.

[Anonymous]

We do not have ROFR, and I would talk to your lawyer about using a different mechanism to prevent unsafe situations.

Think long and hard about ROFR because you’ll have to deal with transportation to and from their house if/when they exercise it, they’ll have the ability to make you late if they run late, or cancel at the last minute leaving you high and dry. There are just as many bad parts as there are good parts - and it’s really important to make a clean break from your ex and not try to control them/give them opportunities to control you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

PP here. We have not had this issue raised, but based on my reading of our plan-Yes, I believe the other parent could. Ours specifies that parenting time applies only to the biological parents. On one hand, it may let ex prevent dc from a sleepover that I approve of. On the other hand, I could prevent dc from a sleepover that I do not approve of.

If its his time you should not be approving a sleep over.

If it's in the agreement that parenting time is for biological parents, then yes you get offered parenting time first, before a child would spend extended time away from the biological parents.

What happens when your child is 10 and really wants to go Lego day camp with his friends, or he’s 14 and he wants to go to a sleep-away lacrosse clinic with his team, and your ex decides he’s going to exercise his ROFR? Your provision is about you, not about what is best for your child.

The ex would still have this imput if you were still married-if you were married one parent could still say no to that. And good luck to an ex who keeps a 14 yo instead of letting them go to the clinic-I'm sure child would be super pleasant and fun in that situation LOL.

If I go on a business trip on my parenting time, I offer ex the time first, before arranging care. Why shouldn't ex get parenting time with his own dc before a grandparent or friend? That is what rofr ensures.

It's in the child's best interest to be with one of their own parents. That's why that provision is there.

The clause also means that the other parent

the point of divorcing is so that you minimize the amount of agreements and contact you have to make. ROFR means that you potentially have to negotiate with your ex every time you want to leave the kid for three hours. this may make sense for an infant but not an older child. and there can be unintended consequences like your ex flaking on an agreement to take the kids or blocking a sleepover with cousins.

barring some specific concerns (like not trusting a grandparent babysitting or thinking your ex will just pawn an infant off on a nanny) the best parenting agreement will be limited to the *actual* concerns you have, rather than being overly prescriptive. there are some theoretical issues you do want to cover because they are so important, like relocation. but you don’t want to try to dictate every tiny thing.

Actually, you should try to spell it out clearly. That leaves less room for conflict.

You don't 'negotiate' with rofr. You offer the time and they accept it or not. No reason to say why you are offering time, just that you are. It's not complicated.

So, you just say "Do you want Larla from 2 to 6 p.m. on Saturday?" and not "Larla was invited to Zoe's birthday party. She really wants to go to. The party is at X place. Can she go?"

Because the former seems unfair to Larla, and potentially to the other parent who is being set up to disappoint their kid.

I mean, the most obvious and simple solution to this if you think the other parent would stop them from going, would be to stay at the party for 5 or 10 minutes or show up 5 or 10 minutes early. Then she's not away from you for over 4 hours. That's completely legal.

Until there's a 5 hour party.

Have 5 hr drop off parties been a significant factor in your parenting journey?

Your kid will get older and by 9 or 10 will easily be able to spend 5 hrs at a friend’s house …

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

PP here. We have not had this issue raised, but based on my reading of our plan-Yes, I believe the other parent could. Ours specifies that parenting time applies only to the biological parents. On one hand, it may let ex prevent dc from a sleepover that I approve of. On the other hand, I could prevent dc from a sleepover that I do not approve of.

If its his time you should not be approving a sleep over.

If it's in the agreement that parenting time is for biological parents, then yes you get offered parenting time first, before a child would spend extended time away from the biological parents.

What happens when your child is 10 and really wants to go Lego day camp with his friends, or he’s 14 and he wants to go to a sleep-away lacrosse clinic with his team, and your ex decides he’s going to exercise his ROFR? Your provision is about you, not about what is best for your child.

The ex would still have this imput if you were still married-if you were married one parent could still say no to that. And good luck to an ex who keeps a 14 yo instead of letting them go to the clinic-I'm sure child would be super pleasant and fun in that situation LOL.

If I go on a business trip on my parenting time, I offer ex the time first, before arranging care. Why shouldn't ex get parenting time with his own dc before a grandparent or friend? That is what rofr ensures.

It's in the child's best interest to be with one of their own parents. That's why that provision is there.

The clause also means that the other parent

the point of divorcing is so that you minimize the amount of agreements and contact you have to make. ROFR means that you potentially have to negotiate with your ex every time you want to leave the kid for three hours. this may make sense for an infant but not an older child. and there can be unintended consequences like your ex flaking on an agreement to take the kids or blocking a sleepover with cousins.

barring some specific concerns (like not trusting a grandparent babysitting or thinking your ex will just pawn an infant off on a nanny) the best parenting agreement will be limited to the *actual* concerns you have, rather than being overly prescriptive. there are some theoretical issues you do want to cover because they are so important, like relocation. but you don’t want to try to dictate every tiny thing.

This is “OP”- unfortunately we remained separated for long enough for me to now have some bigger concerns that I would not have had if we’d divorced right away because of how things have played out. I guess I should be grateful!? Agreed in re minimizing but there are some super valid concerns abt leaving older kids with random people and we have a kid with some special needs so those considerations are different. Thank you all for your help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

OP here- the clause I have now that’s applicable to this is that any unsupervised by parent time anywhere other than school, camp, classes requires consent unless we’ve shifted as mutual general rule for any kid. That shift is revocable. Again, will see what flies.

so this effectively means that your stbx gets veto power if you want to let your kids stay with your mom.

Yeah, that’s fine. They wouldn’t do that. And, if they did, I’d take that alt over some of the stuff that’s been happening any day. Mom can come and hang out while I’m here. I’ve got a limited amt of years left and I just want to make sure they launch without any additional trauma.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

OP here- the clause I have now that’s applicable to this is that any unsupervised by parent time anywhere other than school, camp, classes requires consent unless we’ve shifted as mutual general rule for any kid. That shift is revocable. Again, will see what flies.

so this effectively means that your stbx gets veto power if you want to let your kids stay with your mom.

Yeah, that’s fine. They wouldn’t do that. And, if they did, I’d take that alt over some of the stuff that’s been happening any day. Mom can come and hang out while I’m here. I’ve got a limited amt of years left and I just want to make sure they launch without any additional trauma.

got it. the right of first refusal can be s great tool for you - just make sure it is tailored for your situation so you don’t get caught in an unintended consequence. for example you can include carve outs for specific relatives, playdates, activities, etc. you may be able to include something about having to agree on a sitter. You don’t want to be in a position where your ex can harass you with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I don't think you can ban the other parent from taking the child to religious things on their parenting time OP.

I'm very happy that we included Right of First Refusal. Ours starts at 4 hours-basically if the parent who has parenting time cannot care for the child for 4 hours or more, they must first offer parenting time to the other parent before getting other care (in school time is not included in this). Also our order specifies that parenting time is between the biological parents.

Really spelling things out like holidays, vacations, out of state notifications, future cell phone plans, orthodontics (mine says split cost whether needed or cosmetic, although our dc's is needed), passports, schooling, child contact with parents, all the things, has been useful for us.

I suggest googling the Florida parenting plan. It's very thorough and will give you ideas of what to put in yours.

NP here
Does it cover parties/time with friends? If your kid's friend has a sleep over party from 6 pm-9 am and you are fine with your kid attending (and obviously you would not be there) can your ex contest this?

OP here- the clause I have now that’s applicable to this is that any unsupervised by parent time anywhere other than school, camp, classes requires consent unless we’ve shifted as mutual general rule for any kid. That shift is revocable. Again, will see what flies.

so this effectively means that your stbx gets veto power if you want to let your kids stay with your mom.

Yeah, that’s fine. They wouldn’t do that. And, if they did, I’d take that alt over some of the stuff that’s been happening any day. Mom can come and hang out while I’m here. I’ve got a limited amt of years left and I just want to make sure they launch without any additional trauma.

got it. the right of first refusal can be s great tool for you - just make sure it is tailored for your situation so you don’t get caught in an unintended consequence. for example you can include carve outs for specific relatives, playdates, activities, etc. you may be able to include something about having to agree on a sitter. You don’t want to be in a position where your ex can harass you with it.

Thank you. Yes. I really appreciate the thought process this post has led to in terms of making sure that this is specifically crafted to not prevent the kids from engaging in typical age-appropriate activities, work being reasonably managed, allowance for dating within safe parameters for kids, etc.

[Anonymous]

I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

lol talk to your lawyer if you don’t understand how your parenting plan works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

I thought about trying to be helpful and respond to some concerns at first...then you just kept going, and threw in a dumb crack about kids with special needs. So at this point, I'm assuming you started drinking early for the weekend or something.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

I thought about trying to be helpful and respond to some concerns at first...then you just kept going, and threw in a dumb crack about kids with special needs. So at this point, I'm assuming you started drinking early for the weekend or something.

DP here
But the pp you quoted brings up some good points. If the parent is otherwise legally allowed to own a weapon (no felonies, lives in an area it's legal, etc.) there's nothing to really prevent them from owning one. The gun shop isn't going to ask to see divorce/child custody agreement paperwork before selling a gun.
Even if both parents agree at the time of the divorce that they don't want guns around their kid(s), people's opinions change over time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

I thought about trying to be helpful and respond to some concerns at first...then you just kept going, and threw in a dumb crack about kids with special needs. So at this point, I'm assuming you started drinking early for the weekend or something.

DP here
But the pp you quoted brings up some good points. If the parent is otherwise legally allowed to own a weapon (no felonies, lives in an area it's legal, etc.) there's nothing to really prevent them from owning one. The gun shop isn't going to ask to see divorce/child custody agreement paperwork before selling a gun.
Even if both parents agree at the time of the divorce that they don't want guns around their kid(s), people's opinions change over time.

Most of what the pp brought up was nonsense. A parenting plan can't prevent a parent from legally owning a gun, but it can require that it be stored and locked away from the kids (that is the law in my state). As far as dad (why only dad) leaving the kid with the chess-playing girlfriend and going grocery shopping...well how many hours is this guy grocery shopping? If rofr is like 4 or 6 or 8 hours, he can leave kid with gf for time less than that-not sure what point pp was trying to make. And no one cares if the gf likes chess or whatever, wtf?

The pp said a lot of gibberish to confuse a rather straightforward issue.

[Anonymous]

Omg my friend has ROFR and it’s a mess. Both of them lie so the other can’t exercise it. My friend will get a babysitter to watch the kids and another babysitter to bring them back to their house so that when ex picks them up, they can pretend they were home and let the kids run out to meet with ex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand how these parenting plans work. Who exactly checks on an ex to see if he indeed doesn’t have guns? And, if he’s allowed by the government to have guns, how can the desires of another person, one who is no longer a legal family member trump his rights? Same for a smoke alarm, who checks that yes, the ex has been a good boy nd replaced them? What prevents the checker from lying or not understanding what they’re looking at? Who decides if a girlfriend is sketchy? Who sorts out if the dad really did leave the kid with the girlfriend or if the kid and girlfriend were very happy say playing chess and the dad went to the grocery store? What’s to prevent the girlfriend from saying “I’m not bound by this parenting agreement, the kid really likes chess as do I, his dad said he’s fine if we play, and oh I’m an adult, I can sleep with whoever wants to sleep with me, you can’t restrict me because I just so happen to be dating the kid’s dad” Also, why would anybody sign a contract stipulating what they can’t do with their own kid? Marriage you at least like the person so you may put up with things that otherwise you wouldn’t. I wonder if this is a legal fiction to keep the lawyers in business, the more you deal with them, the more you pay.
My advice op is that you talk to the people who have successful parenting plans. You say you’ve seen some work and some not, so talk to those people.
I have no idea why you didn’t divorce sooner and what you now don’t like about the man who is still your husband, just know that whatever makes him behave won’t be a factor when you are no longer married. I also wonder about these special needs, it seems like whenever a woman doesn’t like her husband, time for a kid to get special needs so mom has more control then she would otherwise. All of us have special needs to some extent or other. I’m also not sure it’s fair to judge someone’s behavior when you put them in a state of limbo, he’s still a married man but you don’t want him anymore, yet for whatever reason he hasn’t said “Then we start divorce tomorrow”. The way it is now, he can’t plan, he can’t date anybody worth dating, he’s kind of waiting for you to.. what exactly? That isn’t nice. Fine not to like him, maybe he truly is unsafe, but you married him and put up with him and then stalled on the divorce which makes me wonder how bad things really are.

I thought about trying to be helpful and respond to some concerns at first...then you just kept going, and threw in a dumb crack about kids with special needs. So at this point, I'm assuming you started drinking early for the weekend or something.

DP here
But the pp you quoted brings up some good points. If the parent is otherwise legally allowed to own a weapon (no felonies, lives in an area it's legal, etc.) there's nothing to really prevent them from owning one. The gun shop isn't going to ask to see divorce/child custody agreement paperwork before selling a gun.
Even if both parents agree at the time of the divorce that they don't want guns around their kid(s), people's opinions change over time.

The parenting plan is legally binding. If you sign it, you are bound to it. I have the no guns provision in mine.