Has this board missed the huge contraction in tech?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to understand that the kids that graduate from a CS program and typically much more intelligent that the others who didn't, especially considering the competition to get into those programs over the past several years. Do you think they won't be able to figure out their careers relative to someone who majored in, what, English?

+1

There are more CS hires, for sure, but Google hires more philosophy degree grads straight out of college than any other company. Humanities majors who want to move into product dev/man honestly can do okay. Not many want that, but if they do .. it's there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to understand that the kids that graduate from a CS program and typically much more intelligent that the others who didn't, especially considering the competition to get into those programs over the past several years. Do you think they won't be able to figure out their careers relative to someone who majored in, what, English?

But what does that have to do with this board’s intense focus on historical CS salaries and CS programs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fwiw, FAANG stock prices all doing very well this month. META is up 18 percent

Meta is doing so well because of how deeply they cut overpaid jobs!

Meta was paying SWE jobs like $300k which was higher than everyone else too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People are constantly pushing CS and other majors for “Big Tech” jobs. Meanwhile FAANG companies have done massive layoffs and the truth of fake jobs warehousing talent has come to light. Salaries are tanking because demand has plummeted. But the parents on here are still so focused on these employers!

The belt-tightening by a few companies has had little or no impact on the industry. Issues with META and Twitter were largely caused by mismanagement and aren't a symptom of anything. For anyone with talent, there's no lack of demand. Salaries have also increased so much these past few years that this blip isn't all that noticeable. At least from my view as someone who has worked at more than one of those companies over the past 35 years, I don't really see the problem.

Twitter and Meta have shed an absolutely massive number of highly qualified employees. I don’t understand how you can say this huge increase in supply isn’t harming demand. And prices.

Because they get new jobs immediately. There has always been such high demand and honestly, at least now they may do something useful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fwiw, FAANG stock prices all doing very well this month. META is up 18 percent

Meta is doing so well because of how deeply they cut overpaid jobs!

Meta was paying SWE jobs like $300k which was higher than everyone else too.

Yes. Was. That’s my point in starting this thread. People seem to be missing what has just happened and rely on historical data as if we weren’t in the middle of the new dot com bubble burst.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:should add, CS degrees will still be needed, but there will be a giant curriculum recharacterization and programs that pivot do not make the move will be left out. Waterloo is the first out of the gate.

Curious what you mean Re Waterloo. Is there some press on what they are doing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cybersecurity is still hot.

For now, I question how that field can possibly absorb all of the kids who are flocking to it now, especially given how ripe it is for automation.

It is a strange misconception that CS is ripe for automation...creative fields, law, accounting, etc. are routinely cited as far more ripe for automation. Not to say CS is not as well, but it is impossible to know what to study if you are worried about being automated out of a career. Unless you are planning to pursue a trade...basically, every white collar job is vulnerable.

At least someone needs to program the AI and build the robots overlords...until they become aware at least.

CS is far more ripe for automation than law. I can already use automation to build a functional app but would never use it to write a brief to file in federal court. I am a lawyer and DH is a software engineer and he whole heartedly agrees, BTW.

Good luck with that...

You really don’t get it. Law is war. Increased technology hasn’t ever made wars cheaper. Just more effective. If you give me an AI tool that makes my “troops” 1,000x more effective I’m not going to fire them. I’m going to rain hell down on my enemy. But wait, they will have the same tech, so we will still just be going head to head.

They guy selling the pick axes always does better than those doing the mining.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People are constantly pushing CS and other majors for “Big Tech” jobs. Meanwhile FAANG companies have done massive layoffs and the truth of fake jobs warehousing talent has come to light. Salaries are tanking because demand has plummeted. But the parents on here are still so focused on these employers!

The belt-tightening by a few companies has had little or no impact on the industry. Issues with META and Twitter were largely caused by mismanagement and aren't a symptom of anything. For anyone with talent, there's no lack of demand. Salaries have also increased so much these past few years that this blip isn't all that noticeable. At least from my view as someone who has worked at more than one of those companies over the past 35 years, I don't really see the problem.

Twitter and Meta have shed an absolutely massive number of highly qualified employees. I don’t understand how you can say this huge increase in supply isn’t harming demand. And prices.

Because they get new jobs immediately. There has always been such high demand and honestly, at least now they may do something useful.

That’s not what I’m hearing from my millennial friends in the SV area. Finding equivalent paying jobs has been a struggle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cybersecurity is still hot.

For now, I question how that field can possibly absorb all of the kids who are flocking to it now, especially given how ripe it is for automation.

It is a strange misconception that CS is ripe for automation...creative fields, law, accounting, etc. are routinely cited as far more ripe for automation. Not to say CS is not as well, but it is impossible to know what to study if you are worried about being automated out of a career. Unless you are planning to pursue a trade...basically, every white collar job is vulnerable.

At least someone needs to program the AI and build the robots overlords...until they become aware at least.

CS is far more ripe for automation than law. I can already use automation to build a functional app but would never use it to write a brief to file in federal court. I am a lawyer and DH is a software engineer and he whole heartedly agrees, BTW.

Good luck with that...

You really don’t get it. Law is war. Increased technology hasn’t ever made wars cheaper. Just more effective. If you give me an AI tool that makes my “troops” 1,000x more effective I’m not going to fire them. I’m going to rain hell down on my enemy. But wait, they will have the same tech, so we will still just be going head to head.

They guy selling the pick axes always does better than those doing the mining.

My whole career in litigation I’ve been hearing tech would bring down bills. The opposite has happened the whole time. We use tech to do more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People are constantly pushing CS and other majors for “Big Tech” jobs. Meanwhile FAANG companies have done massive layoffs and the truth of fake jobs warehousing talent has come to light. Salaries are tanking because demand has plummeted. But the parents on here are still so focused on these employers!

The belt-tightening by a few companies has had little or no impact on the industry. Issues with META and Twitter were largely caused by mismanagement and aren't a symptom of anything. For anyone with talent, there's no lack of demand. Salaries have also increased so much these past few years that this blip isn't all that noticeable. At least from my view as someone who has worked at more than one of those companies over the past 35 years, I don't really see the problem.

Yes, the problems at Meta and Twitter were brought on by Zuckerberg and Musk's bad choices and lack of real vision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Fwiw, FAANG stock prices all doing very well this month. META is up 18 percent

Mostly because META has cut 24% of their job force in last year, most of it in last 6 months. Twenty Four Percent. Good for stock, not great for recruiting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CS majors will continue to be in demand.

Most kids of parents in DCUM won't hit the job market for another 4 - 5 years.

+1 I wrote in another thread about college kids and jobs.

It's a cycle.

But, I do agree that paying $80K/year for a CS degree is not worth it. I talked DC out of doing ED to CMU because while we could pay for it (but a hit to our retirement), it was not worth it.

So, DC will be going to UMDCP with some merit aid. They will do a +1 masters, and also have the time and finances to do a doublemajor if they want.

CS isn't going anywhere, but the next year or two will mean job seekers won't be getting the ridiculous salaries. That party was not going to last anyway. I am much older and have been in the high tech industry for 30+ years, went through two recessions and the dot com bomb in the Bay Area.

But, a CS degree is also more marketable and portable if DC wants to ever live in another country.

You are paying for optionality by going to CMU vs. UMDCP. Hedge funds, AI offshoots coming out of CMU, etc. are heavily recruiting at CMU...I don't know if they are at UMD (maybe they are, in which case agree with you). If your goal is just to get a good CS job at some company, I completely agree with you.

DC is not interested in working for places like hedge fund companies. They want some work/life balance, interesting work, and decent pay. If DC was a striver, then yes, I would've paid for CMU, but that's not who DC is, and they agreed as much.

A CS degree from UMDCP will be fine for the type of life DC wants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to understand that the kids that graduate from a CS program and typically much more intelligent that the others who didn't, especially considering the competition to get into those programs over the past several years. Do you think they won't be able to figure out their careers relative to someone who majored in, what, English?

+1

There are more CS hires, for sure, but Google hires more philosophy degree grads straight out of college than any other company. Humanities majors who want to move into product dev/man honestly can do okay. Not many want that, but if they do .. it's there.

The question is not if they do, but if they CAN do. A few liberal arts majors (especially those from Ivys) can learn and adapt quickly, and they are willing to venture out of their comfort zones. But many liberal arts majors can’t. I’ll take a civil or environmental engineering major over any liberal arts major any day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:should add, CS degrees will still be needed, but there will be a giant curriculum recharacterization and programs that pivot do not make the move will be left out. Waterloo is the first out of the gate.

Curious what you mean Re Waterloo. Is there some press on what they are doing?

Probably not. But you can check out curriculums, look past first year (although probably more data abstraction and math than coding .. I wonder if they do coding at all) and look at 3rd/4th year vs US schools.

[Anonymous]

Most parents are not in tech. There are layoffs but depending on the job skills you can still get a job. Where you go to school does not matter as much as interviewing well and having the degree. It takes about ten years to make a decent amount.