Taking classes for high school credit in middle school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

You are right that an acccurate grade is not a penalty.

What is a penalty, is making an 11yo who wants to learn a foreign language either not take a class at all, or take the class for high school credit.

You are lucky that MCPS high school will allow your middle school child to sit next to a high school student in their school and classroom taking language, mathematics and science courses. Some middle school students don't even have this option in public ... or private school. In the latter instance, no foul no penalty. I would prefer the have an option to advance to high school classes for my children. I'm willing to have skin in the game and take the grade on his transcript. If my child good not compete eith the high school students I certainly would not advise that he take the high school classes as a 10 year-old. If he is capable of competing at that level..no problem on this end. This philosophy applies to sport, music and art.

Middle school students taking foreign languages for a high-school credit and transcript grade do not sit next to high school students in the classroom. They sit in middle-school classrooms with fellow sixth-graders.

To my knowledge, MCPS does not have this approach for any other classes taught in middle school.

I took foreign language starting in sixth grade, not for high school credit, and advanced to the appropriate level when I was a freshman in high school, at which point the grade "counted" for transcript & college admissions purposes. I don't see how that translates to me not having had "skin in the game" in middle school.

Shall we push this policy all the way down to preschool? Where will it end?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Great approach however I doubt the MCPS high schools would have the resources to accommodate all the middle school students in the county that will immediately avail themselves of this opportunity "without skin in the game" = grade counts. Frankly, this grade obsession is foolish. No college worth it's salt will disregard/discount a 10 year-old getting Bs in high school of college courses. If the fit and challenge are appropriate go ahead. I do not buy into the local grade obsession. Cream rises even with Bs obtained in high school courses by elementary and middle school kids. Strictly my opinion. This approach did not fail me growing up and has not failed my children all of whom at one time or another were 4-6 th grades ahead in subjects and forced to take material for grades at higher levels. They were not driven by grades rather passion and challenge. I'll happily take the Bs as a 10/11 year-old in high school language, math and science courses for the 5s on the AP exams in high school whereever that may be if not even in the same elementary or middle school district.

Cream rises to the top. Worthy institutions at the collegiate level can recognize accomplishment when they see it. Talk to the homeschoolers -- without public or private high school transcripts--for these lessons!

I don't know what you are talking about, notwithstanding all those words you used in your post.

What is your point?

[Anonymous]

In our cluster in MCPS we have a few students in middle school every year taking courses at the high school.

[Anonymous]

Middle school students taking foreign languages for a high-school credit and transcript grade do not sit next to high school students in the classroom. They sit in middle-school classrooms with fellow sixth-graders.

To my knowledge, MCPS does not have this approach for any other classes taught in middle school.

I took foreign language starting in sixth grade, not for high school credit, and advanced to the appropriate level when I was a freshman in high school, at which point the grade "counted" for transcript & college admissions purposes. I don't see how that translates to me not having had "skin in the game" in middle school.

Shall we push this policy all the way down to preschool? Where will it end?

We are clearly talking about apples and oranges. I am not talking about middle students taking advanced courses or language ourses in middle school. I can't comment on this experienece. I am talking about middle school students taking courses in high schools in the MCPS area. According to policy, the grade of the high school course (taken in the MCPS high school) will show up on the MCPS high school transcript. I can comment on the latter experience.

[Anonymous]

I took foreign language starting in sixth grade, not for high school credit, and advanced to the appropriate level when I was a freshman in high school, at which point the grade "counted" for transcript & college admissions purposes. I don't see how that translates to me not having had "skin in the game" in middle school.

When you were in middle school starting in sixth grade where did you take your foreign language classes? Was this taken at the high school the middle students feed into? ...or was this in an independent facility or your own middle school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Middle school students taking foreign languages for a high-school credit and transcript grade do not sit next to high school students in the classroom. They sit in middle-school classrooms with fellow sixth-graders.

To my knowledge, MCPS does not have this approach for any other classes taught in middle school.

I took foreign language starting in sixth grade, not for high school credit, and advanced to the appropriate level when I was a freshman in high school, at which point the grade "counted" for transcript & college admissions purposes. I don't see how that translates to me not having had "skin in the game" in middle school.

Shall we push this policy all the way down to preschool? Where will it end?

We are clearly talking about apples and oranges. I am not talking about middle students taking advanced courses or language ourses in middle school. I can't comment on this experienece. I am talking about middle school students taking courses in high schools in the MCPS area. According to policy, the grade of the high school course (taken in the MCPS high school) will show up on the MCPS high school transcript. I can comment on the latter experience.

In my part of the county (eastern MC/Silver Spring & Takoma Park), there is no such thing as middle school students taking courses in high schools. There are only middle school students taking courses in middle schools, for high school credit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I took foreign language starting in sixth grade, not for high school credit, and advanced to the appropriate level when I was a freshman in high school, at which point the grade "counted" for transcript & college admissions purposes. I don't see how that translates to me not having had "skin in the game" in middle school.

When you were in middle school starting in sixth grade where did you take your foreign language classes? Was this taken at the high school the middle students feed into? ...or was this in an independent facility or your own middle school?

I took foreign language in middle school itself - not in the high school; my own middle school. In ninth grade I took Spanish III (for high school credit of course), after taking I and II in middle school (the latter not for high school credit).

I would not have been allowed to take Spanish I in high school since I had taken, and passed, Spanish I and II.

It's not rocket science. MCPS could choose to do it; they just don't (see one of the PPs above re: Jerry Weast and his obsession with All Things College).

[Anonymous]

Since my child is in the highly gifted center (MCPS) I am well aware of a few students in the Takoma Park Middle School taking a Mathematics course in Functions (Calculus) at Blair High School magnet program. Your account is not accurate. These are cases of students in Takoma Middle School bused to Blair High School to take a course not offered in the middle school. And yes, these students are sitting next to high school students and graded by the same metrics. The grade will show up on their high school transcript. These students are competent and capable and they are not whining about their grades because they are in the high school. That's my experience with MCPS in Silver Springs area.

[Anonymous]

I took foreign language in middle school itself - not in the high school; my own middle school. In ninth grade I took Spanish III (for high school credit of course), after taking I and II in middle school (the latter not for high school credit).

I would not have been allowed to take Spanish I in high school since I had taken, and passed, Spanish I and II.

It's not rocket science. MCPS could choose to do it; they just don't (see one of the PPs above re: Jerry Weast and his obsession with All Things College).

I cannot comment on middle school students taking middle school courses in their own middle school students. I am talking about middle school students taking high school courses in the high school. The grade in these high school courses appears on the high school transcript.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I took foreign language in middle school itself - not in the high school; my own middle school. In ninth grade I took Spanish III (for high school credit of course), after taking I and II in middle school (the latter not for high school credit).

I would not have been allowed to take Spanish I in high school since I had taken, and passed, Spanish I and II.

It's not rocket science. MCPS could choose to do it; they just don't (see one of the PPs above re: Jerry Weast and his obsession with All Things College).

I cannot comment on middle school students taking middle school courses in their own middle school students. I am talking about middle school students taking high school courses in the high school. The grade in these high school courses appears on the high school transcript.


The problem many of us seem to have is with middle school students taking language courses in their middle school classrooms and then having the resulting grade go onto their high school transcript. I do not like that. However, if my middle school dc was taking a class AT the high school, then of course it is more understandable and acceptable that those grades would go on the high school transcript.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I took foreign language in middle school itself - not in the high school; my own middle school. In ninth grade I took Spanish III (for high school credit of course), after taking I and II in middle school (the latter not for high school credit).

I would not have been allowed to take Spanish I in high school since I had taken, and passed, Spanish I and II.

It's not rocket science. MCPS could choose to do it; they just don't (see one of the PPs above re: Jerry Weast and his obsession with All Things College).

I cannot comment on middle school students taking middle school courses in their own middle school students. I am talking about middle school students taking high school courses in the high school. The grade in these high school courses appears on the high school transcript.


The problem many of us seem to have is with middle school students taking language courses in their middle school classrooms and then having the resulting grade go onto their high school transcript. I do not like that. However, if my middle school dc was taking a class AT the high school, then of course it is more understandable and acceptable that those grades would go on the high school transcript.

This.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Since my child is in the highly gifted center (MCPS) I am well aware of a few students in the Takoma Park Middle School taking a Mathematics course in Functions (Calculus) at Blair High School magnet program. Your account is not accurate. These are cases of students in Takoma Middle School bused to Blair High School to take a course not offered in the middle school. And yes, these students are sitting next to high school students and graded by the same metrics. The grade will show up on their high school transcript. These students are competent and capable and they are not whining about their grades because they are in the high school. That's my experience with MCPS in Silver Springs area.

Yes, I am aware of that as well. I'm not sure how having a child in the highly gifted center translates to you knowing that and other people not knowing that, especially since your child isn't yet in middle school if s/he is at the CHG.

I too am aware of those TPMS students take math *at Blair*. That is completely different from the scenario I am talking about, where students take foreign language *at Takoma Park MS*.

I haven't seen anyone whining on this thread. I don't know what you are referring to with that comment.

And Silver Spring is Silver Spring (singular), not Silver *Springs* (plural). It is unusual IME that someone who actually lives here makes that mistake.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No the public school system is not making the child take this course for credit. The parent and the child are consenting to take this course for credit on the high school transcript.
!

This isn't exactly true. In my child's middle school, Westland, foreign language is a choice in 6th grade available only to those who read above grade level, and even if your child does read above grade level it's fine to opt out. However, in 7th foreign language is the default. Only students who are significantly behind take remedial reading instead. So while I guess I could go beg for my child to take remedial reading, that seems an odd choice. There are no foreign language classes that don't appear on your high school transcript.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Great approach however I doubt the MCPS high schools would have the resources to accommodate all the middle school students in the county that will immediately avail themselves of this opportunity "without skin in the game" = grade counts.

All middle schoolers in MCPS take the same number of courses -- allowing foreign language to be one of those courses without it needing to be at a high school level, would just mean reallocating resources from other subjects.

I wonder if MCPS finds that their middle schoolers in high school level foreign language work significantly harder than, say, their middle schoolers in honors science, or honors English. If not then it would defeat your argument that kids need "skin in the game" to be motivated. I'd argue that middle schoolers rarely have the foresight to be motivated by college placement at age 11, and that their teacher's approval and the grade on their report card are bigger motivating factors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Great approach however I doubt the MCPS high schools would have the resources to accommodate all the middle school students in the county that will immediately avail themselves of this opportunity "without skin in the game" = grade counts.

All middle schoolers in MCPS take the same number of courses -- allowing foreign language to be one of those courses without it needing to be at a high school level, would just mean reallocating resources from other subjects.

I wonder if MCPS finds that their middle schoolers in high school level foreign language work significantly harder than, say, their middle schoolers in honors science, or honors English. If not then it would defeat your argument that kids need "skin in the game" to be motivated. I'd argue that middle schoolers rarely have the foresight to be motivated by college placement at age 11, and that their teacher's approval and the grade on their report card are bigger motivating factors.

Yes, this. Why is it that English, math, science are all middle school courses and thus don't show up on high school transcripts (even if they are GT/advanced, as they are at Takoma Park MS for example), but foreign language classes are somehow carved out from that general approach?

A student who takes e.g. algebra in eighth grade cannot re-take it it ninth grade for an "easy A." S/he would be barred from doing that. It would be just as easy to bar a student who passed Spanish I/II/III from re-taking them in high school

There is no reason it has to be done this way. None.