Where Can A 91 GPA Student From St. Alban's Go?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Times have changed. Ivies are unlikely without a hook. A 91 is not a 4.0, that starts at 93. A 91 is around a 3.7 or 3.8 on 4.0 scale. Kids are competing against all the public school kids with 4.0s.

You are right kids are competing against public school kids with 4's, but colleges are aware (at least the T20/Ivies) that Saint Albans's curriculum is more rigorous than the vast majority of those. The school CCO does an excellent job in ensuring that universities where the boys are typically enrolling understand this.

OP, based on past years, your son has a chance at the Ivies and other top. It is not going to be a slam dunk because there are boys who will have higher grades and higher scores AND have legacy AND possibly be athletes AND have some strange and crazy ECs (like starting a business or saving the whales). But he sounds like a great candidate who will have decent odds.

another one of these comments - people, the top 10% at just about any public is comparable to most privates at the same rank. The drop off and disconnect occurs below that - sorry your massive tuition bill alone doesn’t make you a better candidate, especially vs the strong AP/IB public candidate

Yes, top 10-15% at the publics are comparable to the privates. And those public school kids rightly get admitted to the T10.

However, MANY more privates at average and median level make it to higher-ranked T15-T40 than public school kids who are average or median. So, top performers everywhere have about an equal shot, but average to high-average performers at the privates are doing much better than those who are doing an average performance at the publics.

Some of that is full pay. More of the 15-40 are need aware. And with a few high income school exceptions there will be far more public school students who need aid, and more interest in in-state public schools. Even at Whitman some of my DCs classmates chose UMD over higher ranked private and OOS schools they had been accepted to. At my other DCs private school that was much rarer.

The only top 40 college that I know of that is need aware is Tufts (unless you are an international student). Could you provide examples of others that are need aware for US citizens?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, my son has a 91 GPA at St. Alban's with a 1540 SAT score. Are Ivies or other top 20 schools realistic for him to aim for?

In your experience, where do kids with these grades from St. Alban's end up?

The college counseling office will share with you some data. My recollection is that those scores are within the range of Ivy T20 admits but there is a lot of variation and some with really high SATs are turned down as well (yield protection perhaps).

Is he a legacy at any Ivies?

Does that really matter if you aren't routinely donating 7 figures?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

As an STA parent, I can tell some of this info isn’t from people with direct experience at STA and I would ignore it. Also, college office is helpful, so rely on them once they start working with kids as second semester juniors.

My hunch is there has been some grade inflation due to COVID - not that the top grade is much higher but rather more guys are above a 90. My guess is 91 isn’t top 20% anymore. I think a boy would need closer to 93/94 to be competitive at Ivies, and then probably not HYPSM without something else. It also matters what classes he takes. STA doesn’t weight for AP or honors but most of the academic guys take them anyway. I would think you would need at least AP BC Calc, AP Physics C, and four years of language to be considered rigorous.


No, I don't agree with these.... Depends on the major that you are seeking.

Actually, what PP said regarding the most rigorous classes is consistent with advice provided by the college counseling office regardless of major.

There are plenty of boys in the last few years who did not take BC or Physics C and got into Ivys. If you are a humanities major, these courses are unnecessary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

As an STA parent, I can tell some of this info isn’t from people with direct experience at STA and I would ignore it. Also, college office is helpful, so rely on them once they start working with kids as second semester juniors.

My hunch is there has been some grade inflation due to COVID - not that the top grade is much higher but rather more guys are above a 90. My guess is 91 isn’t top 20% anymore. I think a boy would need closer to 93/94 to be competitive at Ivies, and then probably not HYPSM without something else. It also matters what classes he takes. STA doesn’t weight for AP or honors but most of the academic guys take them anyway. I would think you would need at least AP BC Calc, AP Physics C, and four years of language to be considered rigorous.


No, I don't agree with these.... Depends on the major that you are seeking.

Actually, what PP said regarding the most rigorous classes is consistent with advice provided by the college counseling office regardless of major.

There are plenty of boys in the last few years who did not take BC or Physics C and got into Ivys. If you are a humanities major, these courses are unnecessary.

So far this year, most boys did take at least one of those (or were hooked). maybe it will change with RD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, my son has a 91 GPA at St. Alban's with a 1540 SAT score. Are Ivies or other top 20 schools realistic for him to aim for?

In your experience, where do kids with these grades from St. Alban's end up?

The college counseling office will share with you some data. My recollection is that those scores are within the range of Ivy T20 admits but there is a lot of variation and some with really high SATs are turned down as well (yield protection perhaps).

Is he a legacy at any Ivies?

Does that really matter if you aren't routinely donating 7 figures?

You are correct it does not matter if you are in those donor leagues, but EVEN for STA donors in that range are far and few between.
Big donors, yes. Huge donors, very few. Really important donors/or descendants (for whom buildings and labs are named) - maybe 1 or max 2.

[Anonymous]

Actually, what PP said regarding the most rigorous classes is consistent with advice provided by the college counseling office regardless of major.


There are plenty of boys in the last few years who did not take BC or Physics C and got into Ivys. If you are a humanities major, these courses are unnecessary.

DP, but both may be true. Boys may have been accepted, but I know for a fact that the counseling office has encouraged even boys clearly focused on the humanities to take AP Phys C and Calc BC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Actually, what PP said regarding the most rigorous classes is consistent with advice provided by the college counseling office regardless of major.


There are plenty of boys in the last few years who did not take BC or Physics C and got into Ivys. If you are a humanities major, these courses are unnecessary.

DP, but both may be true. Boys may have been accepted, but I know for a fact that the counseling office has encouraged even boys clearly focused on the humanities to take AP Phys C and Calc BC.

I would agree with this on STEM and my hunch is this evolving and more true this year than in previous years. Also, without giving away too much info, I think non-big donor legacy can make a difference for STA guys, provided the legacy kid is a great candidate. Won't get an unqualified candidate in, but could be differential between two qualified candidates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Actually, what PP said regarding the most rigorous classes is consistent with advice provided by the college counseling office regardless of major.


There are plenty of boys in the last few years who did not take BC or Physics C and got into Ivys. If you are a humanities major, these courses are unnecessary.

DP, but both may be true. Boys may have been accepted, but I know for a fact that the counseling office has encouraged even boys clearly focused on the humanities to take AP Phys C and Calc BC.

I have also heard the CCO recommend the most challenging courses (although I have not specifically heard that for humanities focused boys they recommend science focused - of course that could be the case, because the AP courses are heavily geared towards the sciences at STA)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Times have changed. Ivies are unlikely without a hook. A 91 is not a 4.0, that starts at 93. A 91 is around a 3.7 or 3.8 on 4.0 scale. Kids are competing against all the public school kids with 4.0s.

You are right kids are competing against public school kids with 4's, but colleges are aware (at least the T20/Ivies) that Saint Albans's curriculum is more rigorous than the vast majority of those. The school CCO does an excellent job in ensuring that universities where the boys are typically enrolling understand this.

OP, based on past years, your son has a chance at the Ivies and other top. It is not going to be a slam dunk because there are boys who will have higher grades and higher scores AND have legacy AND possibly be athletes AND have some strange and crazy ECs (like starting a business or saving the whales). But he sounds like a great candidate who will have decent odds.

another one of these comments - people, the top 10% at just about any public is comparable to most privates at the same rank. The drop off and disconnect occurs below that - sorry your massive tuition bill alone doesn’t make you a better candidate, especially vs the strong AP/IB public candidate

Yes, top 10-15% at the publics are comparable to the privates. And those public school kids rightly get admitted to the T10.

However, MANY more privates at average and median level make it to higher-ranked T15-T40 than public school kids who are average or median. So, top performers everywhere have about an equal shot, but average to high-average performers at the privates are doing much better than those who are doing an average performance at the publics.

Some of that is full pay. More of the 15-40 are need aware. And with a few high income school exceptions there will be far more public school students who need aid, and more interest in in-state public schools. Even at Whitman some of my DCs classmates chose UMD over higher ranked private and OOS schools they had been accepted to. At my other DCs private school that was much rarer.

The only top 40 college that I know of that is need aware is Tufts (unless you are an international student). Could you provide examples of others that are need aware for US citizens?

Wake Forest and Wash U come to mind. As do the UC schools (i think there are 4-5 of them in the top 40) and UT-Austin.

Also there are schools that are need blind but who don't guarantee meeting financial need - that is another barrier for some/many families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Times have changed. Ivies are unlikely without a hook. A 91 is not a 4.0, that starts at 93. A 91 is around a 3.7 or 3.8 on 4.0 scale. Kids are competing against all the public school kids with 4.0s.

You are right kids are competing against public school kids with 4's, but colleges are aware (at least the T20/Ivies) that Saint Albans's curriculum is more rigorous than the vast majority of those. The school CCO does an excellent job in ensuring that universities where the boys are typically enrolling understand this.

OP, based on past years, your son has a chance at the Ivies and other top. It is not going to be a slam dunk because there are boys who will have higher grades and higher scores AND have legacy AND possibly be athletes AND have some strange and crazy ECs (like starting a business or saving the whales). But he sounds like a great candidate who will have decent odds.

another one of these comments - people, the top 10% at just about any public is comparable to most privates at the same rank. The drop off and disconnect occurs below that - sorry your massive tuition bill alone doesn’t make you a better candidate, especially vs the strong AP/IB public candidate

Yes, top 10-15% at the publics are comparable to the privates. And those public school kids rightly get admitted to the T10.

However, MANY more privates at average and median level make it to higher-ranked T15-T40 than public school kids who are average or median. So, top performers everywhere have about an equal shot, but average to high-average performers at the privates are doing much better than those who are doing an average performance at the publics.

Some of that is full pay. More of the 15-40 are need aware. And with a few high income school exceptions there will be far more public school students who need aid, and more interest in in-state public schools. Even at Whitman some of my DCs classmates chose UMD over higher ranked private and OOS schools they had been accepted to. At my other DCs private school that was much rarer.

The only top 40 college that I know of that is need aware is Tufts (unless you are an international student). Could you provide examples of others that are need aware for US citizens?

Wake Forest and Wash U come to mind. As do the UC schools (i think there are 4-5 of them in the top 40) and UT-Austin.

Also there are schools that are need blind but who don't guarantee meeting financial need - that is another barrier for some/many families.

Wash U and UC schools in top 40 are need blind - these are recent policy changes within the last few years.

[Anonymous]

But how many boys actually make it through AP BC? I know a ton who dropped down to AB (and many others who never attempted it). You have the outlier math kids but outside of that I'm not sure how many boys complete calc BC. It's notoriously difficult at STA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But how many boys actually make it through AP BC? I know a ton who dropped down to AB (and many others who never attempted it). You have the outlier math kids but outside of that I'm not sure how many boys complete calc BC. It's notoriously difficult at STA.

In this senior class, there were at least 8-10 boys in BC Calc last year and a handful more are in it this year, I am pretty sure. And that isn’t counting the couple who are in Number Theory or whatever the heck is beyond HLAVC.

[Anonymous]

But how many boys actually make it through AP BC? I know a ton who dropped down to AB (and many others who never attempted it). You have the outlier math kids but outside of that I'm not sure how many boys complete calc BC. It's notoriously difficult at STA.

Two or three boys dropped to AB at the beginning of the year, but there are still at least 10 seniors in the class (along with some underclassmen), including kids who have no interest in pursuing STEM.

[Anonymous]

I think Rochester is need aware. And 40-50 are pretty much all need aware (BU, Northeastern, Brandeis, Case Western, etc).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Times have changed. Ivies are unlikely without a hook. A 91 is not a 4.0, that starts at 93. A 91 is around a 3.7 or 3.8 on 4.0 scale. Kids are competing against all the public school kids with 4.0s.

You are right kids are competing against public school kids with 4's, but colleges are aware (at least the T20/Ivies) that Saint Albans's curriculum is more rigorous than the vast majority of those. The school CCO does an excellent job in ensuring that universities where the boys are typically enrolling understand this.

OP, based on past years, your son has a chance at the Ivies and other top. It is not going to be a slam dunk because there are boys who will have higher grades and higher scores AND have legacy AND possibly be athletes AND have some strange and crazy ECs (like starting a business or saving the whales). But he sounds like a great candidate who will have decent odds.

another one of these comments - people, the top 10% at just about any public is comparable to most privates at the same rank. The drop off and disconnect occurs below that - sorry your massive tuition bill alone doesn’t make you a better candidate, especially vs the strong AP/IB public candidate

Yes, top 10-15% at the publics are comparable to the privates. And those public school kids rightly get admitted to the T10.

However, MANY more privates at average and median level make it to higher-ranked T15-T40 than public school kids who are average or median. So, top performers everywhere have about an equal shot, but average to high-average performers at the privates are doing much better than those who are doing an average performance at the publics.

Some of that is full pay. More of the 15-40 are need aware. And with a few high income school exceptions there will be far more public school students who need aid, and more interest in in-state public schools. Even at Whitman some of my DCs classmates chose UMD over higher ranked private and OOS schools they had been accepted to. At my other DCs private school that was much rarer.

The only top 40 college that I know of that is need aware is Tufts (unless you are an international student). Could you provide examples of others that are need aware for US citizens?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But how many boys actually make it through AP BC? I know a ton who dropped down to AB (and many others who never attempted it). You have the outlier math kids but outside of that I'm not sure how many boys complete calc BC. It's notoriously difficult at STA.

In this senior class, there were at least 8-10 boys in BC Calc last year and a handful more are in it this year, I am pretty sure. And that isn’t counting the couple who are in Number Theory or whatever the heck is beyond HLAVC.

heating lighting air video conditioning?