Asian-Americans Fight Back Against School Discrimination

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As an ivy-league educated African-American, I'd said that admissions to elite high schools are the least of our concerns...or at least should be.

Most of us are much more focused on getting black and brown kids to read and perform math at somewhere close to grade level...the numbers are abysmal (though quite mediocre for white kids as well). A world where 50% of black kids read and perform math at grade level is a world transformed---more meaningfully transformed than a world with a few more black kids at TJ, Lowell, or Stuyvesant.

Once we get a critical mass of our kids to grade level, we can then work on cultivating an advanced crew that operates 2-3 years above grade level (which seems to be about avg among Asians or at least certain sub-categories thereof).

At that point, we can begin to have a discussion about elite school admissions and putting in place the requisite prep systems -- which really need to start around 3rd grade...right? My understanding is that Asian parents are working toward schools like TJ for years before taking the test.

To the extent Asian kids are "privileged", it's because they have parents and a community that are truly committed to academic excellence BEYOND what the public school is offering, and they seem to have developed an academic acceleration eco-system to support it. That is a real privilege for kids with access to those (often ethnic) eco-systems, but one that "we" should seek to emulate, not punish.

Funny thing is, most normal black folks (i.e., black folks you'd meet in the barbershop) would agree with all of the above. These school boards need to spend more time on "the street" vs. carousing with white liberals and activists black folks with agendas far removed from the people for whom they purport to speak.

+1 very very well stated, and I whole heartedly agree. I have stated something similar (though less eloquently) in another thread about how the BOE should be more focused on closing the wide achievement gap (made worse by the pandemic) than increasing the URM participation in magnets by a few percentage points. The achievement gap is more of a shame and concerning than the lack of URM representation in magnet programs.

I also find it alarming that some people say that we shouldn't look at URM kids as just their test scores, but have no compunction about looking at the Asian American kid as just their test scores/grades, or to assume that every Asian American kid was prepped and tutored since grade school, and that's the *only* reason why they got in.

IMO, the school system can just as easily create that ecosystem of tutoring and prep classes after school. I have no issues with my tax dollars supporting that in lower income areas. What the parents cannot do for themselves due to the lack of resources, the school system can provide (and they do so in many ways). But, even if they create that kind of program, you cannot force students to go. That's where the paradigm shift in the culture comes in. The school can't create that culture in the families/communities. So, instead, they change the "rules" to overcome that barrier.

FWIW, I grew up lower income, and if my school had these kinds of after school programs, I think I could've gone to a much better university than the B rated state univ I did end up at, and my older siblings could've gone to a 4 yr instead of only community college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

The entire fcps board members will be obliterated next year if they have managed to stay out of prison that long for what they did.

Since when does racial discrimination lead to prison term? If that was the case, you'd see a lot more white Trumpsters in prison than we are seeing now.

Title 18, U.S.C., Section 242 - Deprivation of Rights Under Color of Law

This statute makes it a crime for any person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or custom to willfully deprive or cause to be deprived from any person those rights, privileges, or immunities secured or protected by the Constitution and laws of the U.S.

This law further prohibits a person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation or custom to willfully subject or cause to be subjected any person to different punishments, pains, or penalties, than those prescribed for punishment of citizens on account of such person being an alien or by reason of his/her color or race.

Acts under "color of any law" include acts not only done by federal, state, or local officials within the bounds or limits of their lawful authority, but also acts done without and beyond the bounds of their lawful authority; provided that, in order for unlawful acts of any official to be done under "color of any law," the unlawful acts must be done while such official is purporting or pretending to act in the performance of his/her official duties. This definition includes, in addition to law enforcement officials, individuals such as Mayors, Council persons, Judges, Nursing Home Proprietors, Security Guards, etc., persons who are bound by laws, statutes ordinances, or customs.

Punishment varies from a fine or imprisonment of up to one year, or both, and if bodily injury results or if such acts include the use, attempted use, or threatened use of a dangerous weapon, explosives, or fire shall be fined or imprisoned up to ten years or both, and if death results, or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.

And can you show me one white person who's gone to prison for racial discrimination?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work alone leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

FYP. My view is that the racist micro-aggression is the implication that the certain groups (URM, ED, etc.) aren't attaining success simply because they don't work hard. On the other hand, there's nothing racist about acknowledging that hard work is often one component of success (though for some who are very advantaged, it isn't necessarily a requirement either). That may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but it's an absolutely critical one... if you overindex just on "hard work" and believe in the oxymoronic platitude that anyone can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" if they simply have the will, etc. then yeah, that's ignoring a ton of structural and other factors, many/most of which have racist elements to them, and hence is an overall racist idea (even if that racism is born out of ignorance and oversimplification, rather than outright intent or contempt).

BS.

Under your false belief system, systemic white racism would never allow poor, non-English speaking Asian immigrants to ever succeed in the US (and yet they overwhelmingly do).

You believe non-white (or using your intersectional / leftist term, BIPOC) people cannot “pull themselves up by their own boot straps” - and yet, that is exactly what Asian immigrants overwhelmingly do in the United States.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

The entire fcps board members will be obliterated next year if they have managed to stay out of prison that long for what they did.

Since when does racial discrimination lead to prison term? If that was the case, you'd see a lot more white Trumpsters in prison than we are seeing now.

Title 18, U.S.C., Section 242 - Deprivation of Rights Under Color of Law

This statute makes it a crime for any person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or custom to willfully deprive or cause to be deprived from any person those rights, privileges, or immunities secured or protected by the Constitution and laws of the U.S.

This law further prohibits a person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation or custom to willfully subject or cause to be subjected any person to different punishments, pains, or penalties, than those prescribed for punishment of citizens on account of such person being an alien or by reason of his/her color or race.

Acts under "color of any law" include acts not only done by federal, state, or local officials within the bounds or limits of their lawful authority, but also acts done without and beyond the bounds of their lawful authority; provided that, in order for unlawful acts of any official to be done under "color of any law," the unlawful acts must be done while such official is purporting or pretending to act in the performance of his/her official duties. This definition includes, in addition to law enforcement officials, individuals such as Mayors, Council persons, Judges, Nursing Home Proprietors, Security Guards, etc., persons who are bound by laws, statutes ordinances, or customs.

Punishment varies from a fine or imprisonment of up to one year, or both, and if bodily injury results or if such acts include the use, attempted use, or threatened use of a dangerous weapon, explosives, or fire shall be fined or imprisoned up to ten years or both, and if death results, or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.

By this standard, there are whole lotta folks that need to go to jail. FCPS board members would be nowhere near the front of that line. But if we get to work on the others, we'll get to them eventually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As an ivy-league educated African-American, I'd said that admissions to elite high schools are the least of our concerns...or at least should be.

Most of us are much more focused on getting black and brown kids to read and perform math at somewhere close to grade level...the numbers are abysmal (though quite mediocre for white kids as well). A world where 50% of black kids read and perform math at grade level is a world transformed---more meaningfully transformed than a world with a few more black kids at TJ, Lowell, or Stuyvesant.

Once we get a critical mass of our kids to grade level, we can then work on cultivating an advanced crew that operates 2-3 years above grade level (which seems to be about avg among Asians or at least certain sub-categories thereof).

At that point, we can begin to have a discussion about elite school admissions and putting in place the requisite prep systems -- which really need to start around 3rd grade...right? My understanding is that Asian parents are working toward schools like TJ for years before taking the test.

To the extent Asian kids are "privileged", it's because they have parents and a community that are truly committed to academic excellence BEYOND what the public school is offering, and they seem to have developed an academic acceleration eco-system to support it. That is a real privilege for kids with access to those (often ethnic) eco-systems, but one that "we" should seek to emulate, not punish.

Funny thing is, most normal black folks (i.e., black folks you'd meet in the barbershop) would agree with all of the above. These school boards need to spend more time on "the street" vs. carousing with white liberals and activists black folks with agendas far removed from the people for whom they purport to speak.

There is so much good, common sense in your post, I almost can’t stand it.

The barbershop is chock full of people who agree with you. People like Winsome Sears.

So tired of being taken for granted and told who I “just have to” vote for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work alone leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

FYP. My view is that the racist micro-aggression is the implication that the certain groups (URM, ED, etc.) aren't attaining success simply because they don't work hard. On the other hand, there's nothing racist about acknowledging that hard work is often one component of success (though for some who are very advantaged, it isn't necessarily a requirement either). That may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but it's an absolutely critical one... if you overindex just on "hard work" and believe in the oxymoronic platitude that anyone can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" if they simply have the will, etc. then yeah, that's ignoring a ton of structural and other factors, many/most of which have racist elements to them, and hence is an overall racist idea (even if that racism is born out of ignorance and oversimplification, rather than outright intent or contempt).

BS.

Under your false belief system, systemic white racism would never allow poor, non-English speaking Asian immigrants to ever succeed in the US (and yet they overwhelmingly do).

You believe non-white (or using your intersectional / leftist term, BIPOC) people cannot “pull themselves up by their own boot straps” - and yet, that is exactly what Asian immigrants overwhelmingly do in the United States.

To be fair, black folks have been pulling themselves up by the bootstraps for generations and have real (albeit insufficient) progress to show for it. Of course, as a group, Asians are MUCH more successful. But then again, Asians are also much more successful than whites, as measured by academic achievement, representation in high-prestige professions, income, etc.

So I guess the question is what is it that keeps white folks (who enjoy privileges that Asians don't) from meeting the "Asian standard"? What explains this achievement gap? I mean, black folks have a real lived history with their hard work being unrequited, so one can sorta understand the lack of devotion to academic success, as misguided and self-defeating as that may be. But what excuse do white folks have?

And how are Asians performing (or how will they perform) once we get to the 3rd, 4th, or 5th generation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work alone leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

FYP. My view is that the racist micro-aggression is the implication that the certain groups (URM, ED, etc.) aren't attaining success simply because they don't work hard. On the other hand, there's nothing racist about acknowledging that hard work is often one component of success (though for some who are very advantaged, it isn't necessarily a requirement either). That may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but it's an absolutely critical one... if you overindex just on "hard work" and believe in the oxymoronic platitude that anyone can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" if they simply have the will, etc. then yeah, that's ignoring a ton of structural and other factors, many/most of which have racist elements to them, and hence is an overall racist idea (even if that racism is born out of ignorance and oversimplification, rather than outright intent or contempt).

BS.

Under your false belief system, systemic white racism would never allow poor, non-English speaking Asian immigrants to ever succeed in the US (and yet they overwhelmingly do).

You believe non-white (or using your intersectional / leftist term, BIPOC) people cannot “pull themselves up by their own boot straps” - and yet, that is exactly what Asian immigrants overwhelmingly do in the United States.

BIPOC is a term that excludes Asian immigrants or American born Asian-Americans. As does the term URM. By definition, they are not the subject of the discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work alone leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

FYP. My view is that the racist micro-aggression is the implication that the certain groups (URM, ED, etc.) aren't attaining success simply because they don't work hard. On the other hand, there's nothing racist about acknowledging that hard work is often one component of success (though for some who are very advantaged, it isn't necessarily a requirement either). That may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but it's an absolutely critical one... if you overindex just on "hard work" and believe in the oxymoronic platitude that anyone can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" if they simply have the will, etc. then yeah, that's ignoring a ton of structural and other factors, many/most of which have racist elements to them, and hence is an overall racist idea (even if that racism is born out of ignorance and oversimplification, rather than outright intent or contempt).

BS.

Under your false belief system, systemic white racism would never allow poor, non-English speaking Asian immigrants to ever succeed in the US (and yet they overwhelmingly do).

You believe non-white (or using your intersectional / leftist term, BIPOC) people cannot “pull themselves up by their own boot straps” - and yet, that is exactly what Asian immigrants overwhelmingly do in the United States.

BIPOC is a term that excludes Asian immigrants or American born Asian-Americans. As does the term URM. By definition, they are not the subject of the discussion.

I'm opposed to tinkering with admissions standards to achieve diversity and have no use for the privilege-policing inter-sectionalists, but it's intellectually dishonest to equate the historical experiences of African-Americans vs. Asian Americans in this country and then ask, we'll if the Asians did it, why can't they?

I think a better comparator would be black-Africans/Afro-Carribeans vs. African-Americans descended from slaves in the United States. I mean, it's those blacks taking all the spots at Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not Asian but I hope they fight back. In my city, our number 1 magnet has a high Asian population. Similar things are happening with the admissions process. However, a large percentage of the Asian population have parents who are poor immigrants. People keep throwing the word "privilege" around. I am mot sure how being a poor immigrant and probably a high percentage are not documented make you privileged.

Agree 100%.

The left - on every level - has increasingly fostered a hatred towards Asian people.

Their motive seems to be that the Asian experience in the United States simply obliterates the left’s narrative about “privilege.”

For example, the left pushes this idea:

- “the idea that hard work alone leads to success is a racist micro-aggression”. (implying you are a racist if you say, teach your kids, or even think this is true).

Tired of it, and not following the democrats BS any longer. Completely done with that party, and I am officially an independent now.

FYP. My view is that the racist micro-aggression is the implication that the certain groups (URM, ED, etc.) aren't attaining success simply because they don't work hard. On the other hand, there's nothing racist about acknowledging that hard work is often one component of success (though for some who are very advantaged, it isn't necessarily a requirement either). That may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but it's an absolutely critical one... if you overindex just on "hard work" and believe in the oxymoronic platitude that anyone can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" if they simply have the will, etc. then yeah, that's ignoring a ton of structural and other factors, many/most of which have racist elements to them, and hence is an overall racist idea (even if that racism is born out of ignorance and oversimplification, rather than outright intent or contempt).

BS.

Under your false belief system, systemic white racism would never allow poor, non-English speaking Asian immigrants to ever succeed in the US (and yet they overwhelmingly do).

You believe non-white (or using your intersectional / leftist term, BIPOC) people cannot “pull themselves up by their own boot straps” - and yet, that is exactly what Asian immigrants overwhelmingly do in the United States.

BIPOC is a term that excludes Asian immigrants or American born Asian-Americans. As does the term URM. By definition, they are not the subject of the discussion.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/0/1041477.page#22129843

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As an ivy-league educated African-American, I'd said that admissions to elite high schools are the least of our concerns...or at least should be.

Most of us are much more focused on getting black and brown kids to read and perform math at somewhere close to grade level...the numbers are abysmal (though quite mediocre for white kids as well). A world where 50% of black kids read and perform math at grade level is a world transformed---more meaningfully transformed than a world with a few more black kids at TJ, Lowell, or Stuyvesant.

Once we get a critical mass of our kids to grade level, we can then work on cultivating an advanced crew that operates 2-3 years above grade level (which seems to be about avg among Asians or at least certain sub-categories thereof).

At that point, we can begin to have a discussion about elite school admissions and putting in place the requisite prep systems -- which really need to start around 3rd grade...right? My understanding is that Asian parents are working toward schools like TJ for years before taking the test.

To the extent Asian kids are "privileged", it's because they have parents and a community that are truly committed to academic excellence BEYOND what the public school is offering, and they seem to have developed an academic acceleration eco-system to support it. That is a real privilege for kids with access to those (often ethnic) eco-systems, but one that "we" should seek to emulate, not punish.

Funny thing is, most normal black folks (i.e., black folks you'd meet in the barbershop) would agree with all of the above. These school boards need to spend more time on "the street" vs. carousing with white liberals and activists black folks with agendas far removed from the people for whom they purport to speak.

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

DP.. if those kids were actually 2-3 years ahead in math, how is it that they weren't admitted? Did they apply? Were their test scores low? If that is the case, then instead of looking at race, they should be providing after school tutoring for test prep.

How is it that the previous policy excluded ED, URM and the broader FCPS community?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

DP.. if those kids were actually 2-3 years ahead in math, how is it that they weren't admitted? Did they apply? Were their test scores low? If that is the case, then instead of looking at race, they should be providing after school tutoring for test prep.

How is it that the previous policy excluded ED, URM and the broader FCPS community?

Because they didn't want to go. Just like all the other highly talented students at the other high schools in the area who chose not to go to TJ.

That is part of what the changes in admissions was designed to fix, as well. But a lot of it has been obscured by the emails and communications that have come to light.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

DP.. if those kids were actually 2-3 years ahead in math, how is it that they weren't admitted? Did they apply? Were their test scores low? If that is the case, then instead of looking at race, they should be providing after school tutoring for test prep.

How is it that the previous policy excluded ED, URM and the broader FCPS community?

Because they didn't want to go. Just like all the other highly talented students at the other high schools in the area who chose not to go to TJ.

That is part of what the changes in admissions was designed to fix, as well. But a lot of it has been obscured by the emails and communications that have come to light.

If they don't want to go, then what's the issue? Why force them to go?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

DP.. if those kids were actually 2-3 years ahead in math, how is it that they weren't admitted? Did they apply? Were their test scores low? If that is the case, then instead of looking at race, they should be providing after school tutoring for test prep.

How is it that the previous policy excluded ED, URM and the broader FCPS community?

Because they didn't want to go. Just like all the other highly talented students at the other high schools in the area who chose not to go to TJ.

That is part of what the changes in admissions was designed to fix, as well. But a lot of it has been obscured by the emails and communications that have come to light.

If they don't want to go, then what's the issue? Why force them to go?[/quote]

Because they have a duty to be a credit to their race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As an ivy-league educated African-American, I'd said that admissions to elite high schools are the least of our concerns...or at least should be.

Most of us are much more focused on getting black and brown kids to read and perform math at somewhere close to grade level...the numbers are abysmal (though quite mediocre for white kids as well). A world where 50% of black kids read and perform math at grade level is a world transformed---more meaningfully transformed than a world with a few more black kids at TJ, Lowell, or Stuyvesant.

Once we get a critical mass of our kids to grade level, we can then work on cultivating an advanced crew that operates 2-3 years above grade level (which seems to be about avg among Asians or at least certain sub-categories thereof).

At that point, we can begin to have a discussion about elite school admissions and putting in place the requisite prep systems -- which really need to start around 3rd grade...right? My understanding is that Asian parents are working toward schools like TJ for years before taking the test.

To the extent Asian kids are "privileged", it's because they have parents and a community that are truly committed to academic excellence BEYOND what the public school is offering, and they seem to have developed an academic acceleration eco-system to support it. That is a real privilege for kids with access to those (often ethnic) eco-systems, but one that "we" should seek to emulate, not punish.

Funny thing is, most normal black folks (i.e., black folks you'd meet in the barbershop) would agree with all of the above. These school boards need to spend more time on "the street" vs. carousing with white liberals and activists black folks with agendas far removed from the people for whom they purport to speak.

Do you think that your race factored into your admission to an Ivy League school? Do you think Ivy League universities shouldn’t push to increase enrollment of URMs until after we had a critical mass of "Ivy-League-caliber", URM high school students?

There already is a small cohort of black students who are 2-3 years ahead in math. They were being admitted to TJ at 1/3rd of the rate of other kids in the same classes. Something in the old admissions process was broken.

I do agree that we should push hard to get kids on grade level - that is a huge issue. BUT, in parallel, we should also be revamping the admissions policy to be more inclusive of ED, URM, and broader FCPS community (not just a pocket of wealthy middle schools).

I'm not talking about what the schools should do. They do whatever suits them (for the most part). I'm talking about what "we" in the black community should do to the extent we care about things like admission to TJ and the like (and I'm not saying we should). Asian "over"-representation at TJ and co. is the result of certain processes, structures, and practices in place within that community. So the obvious thing -- to me at least -- would be for us to emulate those processes, structures, and practices within the black community, or at least encourage our motivated students to avail themselves of those processes, structures, and practices where accessible. I question whether intra-Asia community structures would be practically accessible given certain ethnic realities, which is why replication is probably the more viable approach. We cannot rely on public beneficence or largesse to do the job of prepping our children for elite academic spaces--- I mean, is there any community that has ever done that?