US has no good options in Ukraine

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

Stop both-sidesing this. Ukraine's army wouldn't have to do that if Russia's hadn't illegally invaded (and raped their mothers in front of their crying children, which you just brush off as the business of war, which again, Ukraine did not do anything to provoke)

[Anonymous]

After the Russians get their asses kicked back to Moscow, the west should agree to lift sanctions just as soon as Russia disposed of their nuclear arsenal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

Stop both-sidesing this. Ukraine's army wouldn't have to do that if Russia's hadn't illegally invaded (and raped their mothers in front of their crying children, which you just brush off as the business of war, which again, Ukraine did not do anything to provoke)

+1. No more "both sides"

"Ukraine is putting military assets in the middle of civilian areas" is so much bullshit. I have yet to see photos of columns of destroyed Ukrainian equipment in the bombed out wreckage of Kharkiv and elsewhere. Instead, what Russia is doing is using dumb bombs and indiscriminately pounding Ukrainian cities regardless of military value just to try and punish them and beat them down to capitulation. It's nothing but blunt, brute force. All of that crap Russia said about "we are not targeting civilians" and "we make precision strikes" has proven itself over and over to be nothing but propaganda and lies. The PP needs to just stop repeating those lies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:After the Russians get their asses kicked back to Moscow, the west should agree to lift sanctions just as soon as Russia disposed of their nuclear arsenal.

that's a good idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

Stop both-sidesing this. Ukraine's army wouldn't have to do that if Russia's hadn't illegally invaded (and raped their mothers in front of their crying children, which you just brush off as the business of war, which again, Ukraine did not do anything to provoke)

+1. No more "both sides"

"Ukraine is putting military assets in the middle of civilian areas" is so much bullshit. I have yet to see photos of columns of destroyed Ukrainian equipment in the bombed out wreckage of Kharkiv and elsewhere. Instead, what Russia is doing is using dumb bombs and indiscriminately pounding Ukrainian cities regardless of military value just to try and punish them and beat them down to capitulation. It's nothing but blunt, brute force. All of that crap Russia said about "we are not targeting civilians" and "we make precision strikes" has proven itself over and over to be nothing but propaganda and lies. The PP needs to just stop repeating those lies.

Why don't you all take it up with Washington Post and stop telling others what they should question or not question. CNN also had an article about nazi presence in Ukraine, and it is also the topic that prompts people to pause and start wondering. I have nothing to do with the fact that this is a controversial and widely discussed topic. So stop your stupid nonsense trying to control people's opinions. Russia is the invader, they are in the wrong, there is no "both siding" when it comes to this fact. But when someone is posting absurd statements like there is an ethnic cleansing war going on and Russians are there to rape and pillage and kill as many civilians as possible, I am going to call bullshit. Why?
Because this is insulting to anyone who can read.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

Stop both-sidesing this. Ukraine's army wouldn't have to do that if Russia's hadn't illegally invaded (and raped their mothers in front of their crying children, which you just brush off as the business of war, which again, Ukraine did not do anything to provoke)

+1. No more "both sides"

"Ukraine is putting military assets in the middle of civilian areas" is so much bullshit. I have yet to see photos of columns of destroyed Ukrainian equipment in the bombed out wreckage of Kharkiv and elsewhere. Instead, what Russia is doing is using dumb bombs and indiscriminately pounding Ukrainian cities regardless of military value just to try and punish them and beat them down to capitulation. It's nothing but blunt, brute force. All of that crap Russia said about "we are not targeting civilians" and "we make precision strikes" has proven itself over and over to be nothing but propaganda and lies. The PP needs to just stop repeating those lies.

Why don't you all take it up with Washington Post and stop telling others what they should question or not question. CNN also had an article about nazi presence in Ukraine, and it is also the topic that prompts people to pause and start wondering. I have nothing to do with the fact that this is a controversial and widely discussed topic. So stop your stupid nonsense trying to control people's opinions. Russia is the invader, they are in the wrong, there is no "both siding" when it comes to this fact. But when someone is posting absurd statements like there is an ethnic cleansing war going on and Russians are there to rape and pillage and kill as many civilians as possible, I am going to call bullshit. Why?
Because this is insulting to anyone who can read.

Uh, Russia *is* there to rape and pillage and kill as many civilians as possible. Putin has even said as much. And the recorded calls of Russian soldiers stealing civilians' things have been released. Seems like the only information you avail yourself to, and spread, is the Russian narrative. Stop being so self-righteous, it's pretty insulting for you to dispute this.

[Anonymous]

Ukrainians did not place their cities in front of the Russian army. The Russians attacked their cities and especially attacked civilian targets to try to force Ukraine to surrender. It’s idiotic to blame the Ukrainians for civilian deaths caused by Russia attacking them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

Stop both-sidesing this. Ukraine's army wouldn't have to do that if Russia's hadn't illegally invaded (and raped their mothers in front of their crying children, which you just brush off as the business of war, which again, Ukraine did not do anything to provoke)

+1. No more "both sides"

"Ukraine is putting military assets in the middle of civilian areas" is so much bullshit. I have yet to see photos of columns of destroyed Ukrainian equipment in the bombed out wreckage of Kharkiv and elsewhere. Instead, what Russia is doing is using dumb bombs and indiscriminately pounding Ukrainian cities regardless of military value just to try and punish them and beat them down to capitulation. It's nothing but blunt, brute force. All of that crap Russia said about "we are not targeting civilians" and "we make precision strikes" has proven itself over and over to be nothing but propaganda and lies. The PP needs to just stop repeating those lies.

Why don't you all take it up with Washington Post and stop telling others what they should question or not question. CNN also had an article about nazi presence in Ukraine, and it is also the topic that prompts people to pause and start wondering. I have nothing to do with the fact that this is a controversial and widely discussed topic. So stop your stupid nonsense trying to control people's opinions. Russia is the invader, they are in the wrong, there is no "both siding" when it comes to this fact. But when someone is posting absurd statements like there is an ethnic cleansing war going on and Russians are there to rape and pillage and kill as many civilians as possible, I am going to call bullshit. Why?
Because this is insulting to anyone who can read.

Uh, Russia *is* there to rape and pillage and kill as many civilians as possible. Putin has even said as much. And the recorded calls of Russian soldiers stealing civilians' things have been released. Seems like the only information you avail yourself to, and spread, is the Russian narrative. Stop being so self-righteous, it's pretty insulting for you to dispute this.

Their quibble is that only dozens have been raped not thousands. There's only thousands of civilians killed not hundreds of thousands. There's only tens of thousands being sent to "filtration camps" not millions. Lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

This is one of the stupidest posts I have read in a while; which is impressive due to the high number of uninformed posters.

So, by this logic; if Russia was rolling tanks into Arlington; if the US put a tank in Arlington to blow up the Russian tank then leveling Arlington is ok?

What are you supposed to do? Send a text to Russians saying “tank battle moved to bull run battlefield . See u there”

[Anonymous]

The results of the arrival of "Russian anti-fascists" in Irpin. Dozens of killed civilians, shot just like that, because they are Ukrainians.
[/twitter]https://twitter.com/den_kazansky/status/1509451038885093376?s=21&t=_1ky-s0fyMt3QnnpIcsBtw[twitter]

[Anonymous]

The results of the arrival of "Russian anti-fascists" in Irpin. Dozens of killed civilians, shot just like that, because they are Ukrainians.

[Anonymous]

Ukrainian choppers blew up target inside Russia.

Nice.

Russian response will be interesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ukrainian choppers blew up target inside Russia.

Nice.

Russian response will be interesting.

Oh the war will come to Russia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the end result of all of this is a divided Ukraine -- with Russia holding the eastern areas -- then was there any purpose to the war, even if Ukraine ends up "winning"?

Would Ukraine have been better off side-stepping the conflict by agreeing, months ago, to long-term neutrality with NATO membership permanently off the table?

Or would Putin have eventually launched an invasion even if Ukraine had signed a neutrality agreement?

I have similar questions. Is this going to just go back to what it was before? Who won? Nobody. I also wonder if Ukrainian war didn't get as much western support and all the weapons...would have it ended the same way but earlier without so many casualties, massive destruction and horrendous humanitarian crisis in places like Mariupol? All that this created is millions of displaced refugees.

If Ukraine didn't get western support, Russia would have won and massacred even more of their people than they already have.

What? From the looks of it Russia had plenty of opportunity to massacre 100s of thousands of Ukrainians already, but they haven't . Explain this. If this were ethnic cleansing civilian casualties would be through the roof.

Mariupol and a few other cities are full of mass graves of civilians slaughtered by Russia. Peaceful villages have been completely leveled by indiscrimiate Russian artillery shelling. And even now Russia continues to randomly lob hundreds of missiles at Kyiv and other cities hitting one civilian target after another. Stop candy coating this. The only reason hundreds of thousands more Ukrainians have not been slaughtered yet is because of the incompetence of Russia's military planning versus the fierce determination and western help on the side of Ukraine.

Stop candy coating Russia's vile actions.

+1
and Ukrainian refugees who fled.

This is what people are candy coating, a Russian war crime, two Russian soldiers rape a Ukrainian woman repeatedly, in front of her crying 4 year old child, after they murdered her husband/her child's father.

Look, nobody is candy coating anything here or arguing that Russia's actions aren't vile. You have vivid imagination, find another outlet for this, because it's not helping your arguments. It is a war and atrocities do happen during the times of lawlessness, it's stupid to assume that it won't happen at all. Ukrainian army is also putting civilians in harms way with their tactics of urban warfare where they position their ant-tank crews in the residential buildings and other non-military structures. It is what attracts shelling and kills civilians too. I suppose you read this article in Washington Post?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/28/ukraine-kyiv-russia-civilians/


"But Ukraine’s strategy of placing heavy military equipment and other fortifications in civilian zones could weaken Western and Ukrainian efforts to hold Russia legally culpable for possible war crimes, said human rights activists and international humanitarian law experts. Last week, the Biden administration formally declared that Moscow has committed crimes against humanity."
“If there is military equipment there and [the Russians] are saying we are launching at this military equipment, it undermines an assertion that they are attacking intentionally civilian objects and civilians,” said Richard Weir, a researcher in Human Rights Watch’s crisis and conflict division, who is working in Ukraine."



I am still going to hold an opinion that this isn't ethnic cleansing conflict where the goal is to exterminate specific ethnicity. If you claim that it is, then you had been living under a rock and have no knowledge at all about real ethnic cleansing conflicts of which there are plentiful examples around the world. This is a different war which doesn't want to necessarily maximize civilian casualties, but where casualties are impossible to avoid. Just read the article.

This is one of the stupidest posts I have read in a while; which is impressive due to the high number of uninformed posters.

So, by this logic; if Russia was rolling tanks into Arlington; if the US put a tank in Arlington to blow up the Russian tank then leveling Arlington is ok?

What are you supposed to do? Send a text to Russians saying “tank battle moved to bull run battlefield . See u there”

This is exactly the point why there are increased civilian casualties. When military on both sides fires at each other civilians die. This isn't ethnic cleansing where invading army specifically targets civilians and exterminates them. The invade specifically to kill and destroy EVERYTHING in sight, burn everything to the ground, it's not what is happening, or casualties would be magnitudes higher. Sounds like some of you don't have brain cells to understand this or are unable to think logically blinded by rage. While your anger is justified, facts remain. Read the Washington Post article linked above and take it up with our press for not presenting this as a targeted massacre and ethnic cleansing of civilian population.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ukrainian choppers blew up target inside Russia.

Nice.

Russian response will be interesting.

Oh the war will come to Russia.

As long as we don't interfere and the war doesn't come to America. If Ukrainians want to take it to Russia, it's their business and I hope we stay out of it