Travel Soccer teams around NOVA let's discuss

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.
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In our large club-/the fee schedule is exacatly the same for all 6 teams U9-U12.

There is a marked difference in investment in players the farther down your kid is in pecking order. They get lost in the system. Later, they will not get the same opportunities for special teams, etc. They will play less and they will not scrimmage other clubs off-season like upper teams and have fewer practices. Over time, the gap just gets bigger. When you are talking about 8-9 year olds, just investing so heavily in the top 15 players is idiotic. Some of those kids just came in with more training under their belt initially and that advantage often dissipates. Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.

So the next question is, are the A teams getting more? Yes, yes they are but they are paying for it. A teams are not being subsidized by the lower teams. In general, at a large club the Rec program is really the clubs cash cow.

Actually, in most clubs that I am familiar with the rec program finances are separate from the travel program finances so rec would not be a cash cow for the travel program

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.

So the next question is, are the A teams getting more? Yes, yes they are but they are paying for it. A teams are not being subsidized by the lower teams. In general, at a large club the Rec program is really the clubs cash cow.

Actually, in most clubs that I am familiar with the rec program finances are separate from the travel program finances so rec would not be a cash cow for the travel program

Umm how does that discredit that a large clubs rec program is the actual cash cow of the club?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.
-----------------


In our large club-/the fee schedule is exacatly the same for all 6 teams U9-U12.

There is a marked difference in investment in players the farther down your kid is in pecking order. They get lost in the system. Later, they will not get the same opportunities for special teams, etc. They will play less and they will not scrimmage other clubs off-season like upper teams and have fewer practices. Over time, the gap just gets bigger. When you are talking about 8-9 year olds, just investing so heavily in the top 15 players is idiotic. Some of those kids just came in with more training under their belt initially and that advantage often dissipates. Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning.

We see the same thing at our club. No--the Rec program is definitely not the cash cow. Rec fees are $75 a season with Volunteer parent coaches. They use the elementary school fields. They are not funding the machine.

The machine is the lower travel teams and the developmental program. They found that if they add more teams they can get kids that would have been Rec-level paying $3k/year for 'travel' on a 5th/6th team. The rec program after 3rd grade virtually disappears--and it's often travel players that are also playing rec at that point. Our indoor rec league had to bend the rules this year with allowing more developmental players in 3rd grade+ because of the depletion of rec players (or rec players interested enough in soccer to want to play in the winter).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.
-----------------


In our large club-/the fee schedule is exacatly the same for all 6 teams U9-U12.

There is a marked difference in investment in players the farther down your kid is in pecking order. They get lost in the system. Later, they will not get the same opportunities for special teams, etc. They will play less and they will not scrimmage other clubs off-season like upper teams and have fewer practices. Over time, the gap just gets bigger. When you are talking about 8-9 year olds, just investing so heavily in the top 15 players is idiotic. Some of those kids just came in with more training under their belt initially and that advantage often dissipates. Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning.

We see the same thing at our club. No--the Rec program is definitely not the cash cow. Rec fees are $75 a season with Volunteer parent coaches. They use the elementary school fields. They are not funding the machine.

The machine is the lower travel teams and the developmental program. They found that if they add more teams they can get kids that would have been Rec-level paying $3k/year for 'travel' on a 5th/6th team. The rec program after 3rd grade virtually disappears--and it's often travel players that are also playing rec at that point. Our indoor rec league had to bend the rules this year with allowing more developmental players in 3rd grade+ because of the depletion of rec players (or rec players interested enough in soccer to want to play in the winter).

+1

[Anonymous]

"Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning."

I think we hashed this out that it's nearly impossible. We discussed how all clubs have good and bad teams with some good coaches and some bad coaches. You can go to a small club and find that it sucks. You can go to a big club and find that it sucks. Often it's luck. This statement is so easy to say but who has time to watch 3 practices and 3 games of each U-whatever team at Loudoun, Herndon, McLean, SYA, BRYC, Arlington, Vienna, FPYC, Reston, CYA, Alexandria, etc to determine if that team is right for their kid? I mean everyone says...do the research, but it's not that easy. More often than not, it's luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning."

I think we hashed this out that it's nearly impossible. We discussed how all clubs have good and bad teams with some good coaches and some bad coaches. You can go to a small club and find that it sucks. You can go to a big club and find that it sucks. Often it's luck. This statement is so easy to say but who has time to watch 3 practices and 3 games of each U-whatever team at Loudoun, Herndon, McLean, SYA, BRYC, Arlington, Vienna, FPYC, Reston, CYA, Alexandria, etc to determine if that team is right for their kid? I mean everyone says...do the research, but it's not that easy. More often than not, it's luck.

It's not that difficult. People just become complacent. They bitch and complain, but doing nothing about it. Change isn't easy for the average person. Just a fact of life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much MORE does your "A" team get than your "B" team in terms of training, additional scrimmages, tournaments, attention for the head coach, etc. etc. etc. If they get more, do they pay more? If they pay the same and get more, has anything ever been done about it?

Our A and B teams get the exact same training, tourneys, etc. All parents pay the same and get the same. We are a very small club though, which is probably why we can do it that way.

Yes. The bigger the club/more teams per age group--usually the bigger discrepancies--even when fees are the same.

Any examples?

Just about any large club, Loudoun, Arlington, McLean, Bethesda, SAC etc. The A teams will usually play in "larger", i.e. more expensive tournaments than say the 3rd or 4th team in the same club would. The coach for a large club A or B team will almost always be a paid coach and some of that mileage will vary based upon the coaches license, experience etc. Winter training expenses may be different if the A team is both practicing more off season and depending on the indoor space being used. Those differences alone can net around $300-$400 premium for playing on a A team.

And I say the difference between the A team and the 4rd or 4th team in a large club. The B team in a large club generally will pay a very similar fee to the A team. They often play in the same tournaments, just a bracket lower than the A team.

So the next question is, are the A teams getting more? Yes, yes they are but they are paying for it. A teams are not being subsidized by the lower teams. In general, at a large club the Rec program is really the clubs cash cow.

Actually, in most clubs that I am familiar with the rec program finances are separate from the travel program finances so rec would not be a cash cow for the travel program

Umm how does that discredit that a large clubs rec program is the actual cash cow of the club?

Umm, wasn't trying to discredit ... merely trying to clarify that one aspect of a club that may be a cash cow (rec) does not subsidize the other area of the club (travel), at least in the clubs that I have participated in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Look for somewhere in the early years that is smaller and more focused on development not winning."

I think we hashed this out that it's nearly impossible. We discussed how all clubs have good and bad teams with some good coaches and some bad coaches. You can go to a small club and find that it sucks. You can go to a big club and find that it sucks. Often it's luck. This statement is so easy to say but who has time to watch 3 practices and 3 games of each U-whatever team at Loudoun, Herndon, McLean, SYA, BRYC, Arlington, Vienna, FPYC, Reston, CYA, Alexandria, etc to determine if that team is right for their kid? I mean everyone says...do the research, but it's not that easy. More often than not, it's luck.

It's not that difficult. People just become complacent. They bitch and complain, but doing nothing about it. Change isn't easy for the average person. Just a fact of life.

Exactly.

I mean -- people in Vienna should have anticipated that the technical staff would split off to Arlington and Chantilly -- CYA, not CSC, where a bunch of kids moved onto a team but then found the whole team was going to Reston, unlike the other CSC team that went to SYA to join a CCL club without being a CCL team, while Reston developed a nice style of play even though a lot of its good players would wind up in McLean or Herndon -- and replaced them with an English guy and a guy who had previously coached at McLean, where he favored athleticism over soccer skill, as was the style at the time at McLean but might not be now that they've changed boys' technical directors again in an effort to stay ahead of BRYC, which has brought in a bunch of players from PAC, many of whom were initially at Arlington or Vienna and opted for PAC over Great Falls, which now has a deal with Bethesda South and Sterling, which would seem to leave little place for Cugini, but Cugini keeps plugging along while SYC -- which, now that the Vienna staff has changed over, might be the area's biggest proponent of the "academy" model of training all its teams in one place -- produces the occasional good team.

I mean, what about that isn't obvious?

[Anonymous]

+1000

[Anonymous]

Funny because of the successful SYA teams In the CCL I give a lot of props! In that area there are more than a few clubs pulling from there

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Funny because of the successful SYA teams In the CCL I give a lot of props! In that area there are more than a few clubs pulling from there

This is could be one of the worst sentences (or two). I know it has a punctuation mark in the middle but I have no idea what the fuck their point is. : )

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Funny because of the successful SYA teams In the CCL I give a lot of props! In that area there are more than a few clubs pulling from there

This is could be one of the worst sentences (or two). I know it has a punctuation mark in the middle but I have no idea what the fuck their point is. : )

Let's eat, Grandma.

Let's eat Grandma.

Punctuation can kill.

[Anonymous]

An older Barca team just had 2 players move to an SYA team 2 weeks ago. 2 starters at that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:An older Barca team just had 2 players move to an SYA team 2 weeks ago. 2 starters at that

How is that legal?