TJ Admissions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

Grade inflation seems like a myth. Kids today are just smarter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Tests were never a barrier. Now that all merit tests have been eliminated, why is TJ admissions struggling to persuade even a couple of students from some of the academically bottom ranked middle schools to accept their offers under 1.5% quota?

Even after switching to non-merit essay criteria, TJ admissions is compelled to redirect hundreds of offers back to the same academically privileged schools as before, pretty much validating their overwhelming interest in STEM.

Such a strange reality you live in. "Struggling to persuade"? Wow. Just wow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

Grade inflation seems like a myth. Kids today are just smarter.

You're hilarious. If kids were smarter, they wouldn't need to keep watering down AP exams, recentering the SATs, and giving retakes for every exam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

For the millionth time, there is so much more to being a strong TJ candidate or student than math advancement or test scores.

I am not saying that the current TJ admissions process does a perfect job, but I'm getting awfully sick and tired of people pretending like math advancement and test scores should be automatic ways to get into the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

The majority of FCPS students have the 3.5 GPA required to go to TJ.

A 4.0 is not terribly rare either especially if the student is not taking any honors classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

For the millionth time, there is so much more to being a strong TJ candidate or student than math advancement or test scores.

Really? Like what?

The three NYC science high schools that have produced more nobel prize winners than most countries base admissions on a single test.

A single test certainly seems like it can identify the sort of students you want to identify.

I am not saying that the current TJ admissions process does a perfect job, but I'm getting awfully sick and tired of people pretending like math advancement and test scores should be automatic ways to get into the school.

Using a single test isn't perfect either but at least you are trying to select for excellence. You will miss some excellent minds if you only use a single test because some kids "just don't test well," but the universe of excellent students that are "just not good test takers" is relatively small and we identify them through other means. Right now we are abandoning merit and missing out on hundreds of our best minds on the off chance that we might randomly pick up one of those "just don't test well" kids.

Test scores should absolutely be one automatic pathway into TJ (IMO, it should be the primary pathway). You can play around at the margins to try and identify those hidden gems but testing usually does the job pretty well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

For the millionth time, there is so much more to being a strong TJ candidate or student than math advancement or test scores.

I am not saying that the current TJ admissions process does a perfect job, but I'm getting awfully sick and tired of people pretending like math advancement and test scores should be automatic ways to get into the school.

Math advancement and test scores are certainly part of being a strong TJ candidate. It’s a shame that neither one is considered in the current process. There’s a lot of space between automatic admissions and not being part of the admissions process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

For the millionth time, there is so much more to being a strong TJ candidate or student than math advancement or test scores.

I am not saying that the current TJ admissions process does a perfect job, but I'm getting awfully sick and tired of people pretending like math advancement and test scores should be automatic ways to get into the school.

Math advancement and test scores are certainly part of being a strong TJ candidate. It’s a shame that neither one is considered in the current process. There’s a lot of space between automatic admissions and not being part of the admissions process.

The irony is that students may not even be aware they are being admitted based on their ethnicity, using school location as a proxy, end up paying the price with low grades and forced to start in lowest-level math class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Well, yes. Grade inflation means that every above average kid who puts in any effort gets an A. They also aren't giving any boost to kids who take all Honors vs. taking one regular class. And they aren't giving any boost to kids who are in higher level math classes and still getting As.

Yet there is a two to three year knowledge difference within same graduating class, between the top merit half that completes post AP/DE courses, and bottom half that struggles to finish the minimum required calculus?

For the millionth time, there is so much more to being a strong TJ candidate or student than math advancement or test scores.

I am not saying that the current TJ admissions process does a perfect job, but I'm getting awfully sick and tired of people pretending like math advancement and test scores should be automatic ways to get into the school.

Math advancement and test scores are certainly part of being a strong TJ candidate. It’s a shame that neither one is considered in the current process. There’s a lot of space between automatic admissions and not being part of the admissions process.

The irony is that students may not even be aware they are being admitted based on their ethnicity, using school location as a proxy, end up paying the price with low grades and forced to start in lowest-level math class.

Agree. The prior school board - the one who insisted on revising TJ admissions due to their misguided obsession with “equity,” has really sabotaged most of the very population they sought to help.

Not the first time this has happened.

Maybe they should not have intervened. And certainly not in the way they did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

If the grades were more rigorous yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
When they changed the testing service to Quant Q, the idea was that they would have a proprietary test noone knew what the test looked like that first year but by the second year some organizations had feedback about the types of questions and the test format that allowed them to prepare their students better and this led to a jump in admissions for about one year before everyone else else knew what the question types and test format were. Then the test was worse than useless because it was a test that would be familiar to people who paid for prep and a secret to those who did not.

Any tests of that nature are great for one year and worthless after that. Even if the prep centers hadn't received feedback on the types of questions asked, any kids with older siblings who went through the process would have a huge advantage. Do people really imagine that a kid wouldn't tell the younger sibling/cousin/friend/teammate/neighbor what types of problems are on the test? There's also the old tried and true loophole cheat. The kid just needs to be "sick" on the testing day, and then get info from friends about the types of questions asked.

Using the SHSAT or PSAT 8/9 would make much more sense. Yes, kids can prep, but prepping will only raise the score so much. Prep materials are cheap and widely available. Kids who are 99th percentile gifted will still earn high scores even without prep.

Or they could just use all those tests they give in school that I think are called grades. I get that it doesn't give wealthy people who can afford prep an edge but it might be better for everyone.

I’m all for using grades more heavily in the process, especially if they do something about the rampant grade inflation and consider the difficulty of the courses taken. GPA should outweigh essays and experience factors.

according to TJ admissions, the average GPA of all applicants is above 3.9. Yet, after the admissions change a record number of admitted students are in the lowest math class, needing remedial from first month itself. They are confirming that GPA is not a sufficient criteria for screening qualified applicants.

Yes, but today, kids can get a 5.0, so it's all relative.