UHC CEO Gunned Down in Midtown Manhattan

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm not a psychologist but I have a close family member with schizophrenia. His behavior seems schizophrenic to me.

His descriptions of “brain fog” starting in college could be consistent with symptoms in the prodrome of schizophrenia as could the social and occupational withdrawal. To me he seems ill for sure but certainly not a slam dunk for schizophrenia based on what we’ve seen of his writing and behavior.

Interestingly, the unabomber was diagnosed w schizophrenia as that was thought to be the best fit but it definitely wasn’t a typical presentation. Just interesting to have two extremely bright people with similar (but very atypical) presentations if it does turn out to be schizophrenia.

Is a high level of intelligence consistent with schizophrenia?

Lady with schizophrenic relative here. There is a subtype of schizophrenia that correlates with high IQ-which by the way isn't crazy high, the study I read said 120 and above. Lots of schizophrenics have lower than average IQ and I think that's considered more common. We do believe our sibling is highly intelligent although I don't know if they had an IQ test.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:So lots of people in Baltimore, including his family must have recognized his photo from the news, but nobody turned him in?

+1 random McDonald’s worker ids him but not one of his 30 cousins do?

They probably did not know where he was - he had cut all contact.

None of them watched the news and saw his face all over it? How did the McDs employee recognize him based on that but nobody who had actually met him before?

He had on a mask in McDonalds, and the photos showed him masked. He did have a cap on. There is a good interview with a man who was in the restaurant when he came in and his friend said, “That looks like the CEO killer.” The counter worker heard him, so the guy said Luigi must have heard them saying that too. It’s on Fox (I found it through another site).

I hope he gets treatment for his mental illness in jail and is not sentenced to life in prison. No doubt he will be rehabilitated and go on to do great things with the rest of his life.He’ll probably be in his 40s or maybe even 50s when released.

You have a deep misunderstanding of how US prison works.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

There are thousands of people who march the images. The police probably got dozens of names. That's "not knowing his name".

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

There are thousands of people who march the images. The police probably got dozens of names. That's "not knowing his name".

Well, they did know his fake name, which happens to be the ID he came them. So dumb

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:In case you are one of those who are morally confused:

Good guy: Daniel Penny
Bad Guy: Luigi Mangione

+1

There are lots of seriously twisted and perverted people out there. So much justification over an assassination. There are people comparing this to what the founding fathers did for political change and text pretzel logic to reach those conclusions.

I think there's a LOT of righteous anger in this country towards the insurance industry. Righteous.

Sure, some people try to game the system. Those individuals pale in comparison to how the insurance industry is gaming the system.

If you can't understand these simple facts, neither I nor anyone else can help you.

So far as the vast majority of people are concerned, the murder of a corrupt, crooked member of this perverted insurance scam industry was a *shrug* event.

You must work in the insurance industry if you can't appreciate the frustration and anger the average America feels.

I don’t work for the insurance industry and I have had claims denied by insurance companies. I understand there is a lot of frustration, but frustration does not make murder acceptable. I bet you yourself feel frustration about many things. I bet you feel frustrations over things like politics, but you’re not going to go out and assassinate a politician, a president or a CEO. Just because you’re frustrated does not mean murder is acceptable.

If you’re advocating for people assassinating people they’re frustrated with well then I can’t help you understand how wrong it is.

What Luigi did wasn’t heroic. In fact, he was a coward. He shot the man in the back. He didn’t even have the righteous indignation or guts to say something to his face.

I am telling you that people are frustrated and angry. Where did I state I am advocating for murder?

Please read what I stated again.

The industry needs to get overhauled with closer regulation. Sure, they shouldn't be required to cover weight loss medication for cosmetic reasons. Sure, they shouldn't be required to cover every politicized and popular medical procedure that is not medically necessary. But denying and delaying medically critical covered procedures is immoral, unethical, and inexcusable. BC/BS trying to limit anesthesia in the middle of a complicated surgery is BEYOND reasonable denial. They were going for it. BC/BS was really going for it.

Discussions of the proposed BCBS policy have been insane. Anesthesiologists' lobbying firm deserves a huge bonus.

Obviously they weren't going to wake people up in the middle of the surgery. The idea was clearly to limit billing and reimbursement based on how long the procedure should have taken. Kind of like a mechanic billing you for labor hours based on the book times. If they opened you up and found another problem, then that could and would be added to the claim.

Yes, sometimes one case will take a little bit longer than another case, and you'll get paid the same for both, but that's pretty normal. This is basically how it works for other doctors.

This is a weird thing to complain about when people generally want to know how much a procedure will cost before going in.

+1

A big insurer backed off its plan to pay less for anesthesia. That’s bad.
https://www.vox.com/policy/390031/anthem-blue-cross-blue-shield-anesthesia-limits-insurance

Many pages ago, a poster asked why health care costs are so much higher than other countries. Anesthesiologists are just one of many reasons, but it's a big one. As an example, the most expensive part of a colonoscopy is the anesthesia, not the gastroenterologist. And that's for a procedure where the gastroenterologist themselves could administer and monitor the anesthesia, but they don't want to piss off the anesthesiologists that they need for the more complicated cases. So the anesthesiologists typically come in for every case, resulting in much higher costs. Colonoscopies are great deals for anesthesiologists.

You are partially right. While the GI dr or colorectal surgeon can write for the drugs, they cannot give it and monitor/manage the patient’s airway under general anesthesia while they are doing their procedure. They are 100% focused on their scope, the findings/taking biopsies , and going in/out without perforating your bowel. But a RN (doesn’t need to even be a CRNA) can be certified in conscious sedation and give that and monitor the patient. That is how these scopes are done acutely at bedside in the ICUs here. This is also how they are done routinely in other counties- no one is getting general anesthesia for scopes in other counties

Airway?

It's through the IV bag already set up. gawd .

It's amazing how arrogant someone can be despite total ignorance.

Yes, the anesthesia drugs enter through the IV. But one of the primary tasks of an anesthesiologist or CRNA is to monitor the patient's airway while they are under. That is, to make sure they're still breathing. JFC.

so 1:1 a paid nurse stands there watching you breathe for your entire baby delivery, or colonosopy, or wisdom tooth extraction, or open chest surgery?

Or the screen starts beeping?

What’s amazing is that those 4 procedures you randomly typed out actually utilize 3 (or 4) different types of anesthesia.

And yes, exactly. The anesthesiologist stands there and stares at you, watching you breathe, or else a screen beeps. You have summarized anesthesiology. Might as well just not use one for your next surgery. Just let the “nurse” put the “medicine in the bag” and tell the surgeon you’re good to go.

Unless you think you don’t need the surgeon either? I mean how hard can it be, just cut you open, remove the gallbladder, and sew you up. Done.

You are being unhelpfully loose.

For a vaginal baby delivery, the anesthesiologist comes in, sets up the epidural, fives the control to the patient, and leaves. He doesn't stand their for 2 to 30 hrs.

For dental surgery with laughing gas, there is no anesthesiologist.

For unconscious anesthesia there is more supervision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The other manifesto that was circulating was fake. This is the full text of his manifesto:

“To the Feds, I'll keep this short, because I do respect what you do for our country. To save you a lengthy investigation, I state plainly that I wasn't working with anyone. This was fairly trivial: some elementary social engineering, basic CAD, a lot of patience. The spiral notebook, if present, has some straggling notes and To Do lists that illuminate the gist of it. My tech is pretty locked down because I work in engineering so probably not much info there. I do apologize for any strife of traumas but it had to be done. Frankly, these parasites simply had it coming. A reminder: the US has the #1 most expensive healthcare system in the world, yet we rank roughly #42 in life expectancy. United is the [indecipherable] largest company in the US by market cap, behind only Apple, Google, Walmart. It has grown and grown, but as our life expectancy? No the reality is, these [indecipherable] have simply gotten too powerful, and they continue to abuse our country for immense profit because the American public has allwed them to get away with it. Obviously the problem is more complex, but I do not have space, and frankly I do not pretend to be the most qualified person to lay out the full argument. But many have illuminated the corruption and greed (e.g.: Rosenthal, Moore), decades ago and the problems simply remain. It is not an issue of awareness at this point, but clearly power games at play. Evidently I am the first to face it with such brutal honesty.”

Last sentence: guy's arrogance and astounding self-importance on display.

Young people idealize him because he's good looking and the chase and if a person will get away with it is always exciting to witness. Bad boys and criminals have always had appeal. The James Gang had many fans and they had a political agenda too and there have been many other criminal folk heroes. Outlaws are cool.

Being an old person, none of this appeals to me. But I could imagine if I were a teen or in my 20s that it might.

He is in the wrong and deserves prison as do all other folk hero criminals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve come to the conclusion Gen Z is the most mentally unstable generation. Zero resilience and coping strategies outside of their therapists and pharmaceuticals

Agree. I think the best thing is a rude awakening.

Have the government go after them for anything and everything - pro-Hamas; any protests; online crazy posts that hinge on inciting violence. I’m all for it even as a Democrat.

We need better people.

“We need better people” said the psychopath? What in the fascist hell is this?

[Anonymous]

What was the source of “real manifesto”?

Yes, it has the previously released phrases in, is about the correct length (didn’t count the words, though) and rings true.

But it is also a simple task to write one with the “fill in the blanks” approach.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

But we don’t know how many people called to say, “ that might be my[son, cousin, coworker, ex-husband, former classmate].“ They could not jump from a tip to deciding that is the shooter’s name.

The probably got tips from all over but they sure showed up quickly at that McDonald’s. How did they know that was legit?

if calls from 10 different locations were made that the suspect was possibly spotted, im sure that the local police responded to those 10 different locations. We only heard about this one because it actually panned out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Surprised no one in Maryland knows a Mangione

Lots of us know or are acquainted with people in the family. I’m in the latter group, and just feel awful right now. I feel terrible about the victim, terrible about this bright kid who threw away his life and devastated two families and all that care about them. I was really interested in the true crime aspect of the story, but now I’m just profoundly sad.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

But we don’t know how many people called to say, “ that might be my[son, cousin, coworker, ex-husband, former classmate].“ They could not jump from a tip to deciding that is the shooter’s name.

The probably got tips from all over but they sure showed up quickly at that McDonald’s. How did they know that was legit?

A sighting (when he was sought) is different than someone saying, I think I know who that guy is (vs where he is). Plus they might have known the bus to Atlanta stopped there.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

There are thousands of people who march the images. The police probably got dozens of names. That's "not knowing his name".

Well, they did know his fake name, which happens to be the ID he came them. So dumb

He had four fake IDs? So, he was planning to take out more people? That's the only reason I can see that he would keep the murder weapon and all of the IDs. If he'd gotten rid of the evidence, kept his mask on in NYC, taken the mask and hood OFF outside of NYC, he would have gotten away with it probably.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I can't believe some of you thought he was good looking. He's hideous.

He looks good in his old pics. He is way skinny now and looks rough. He has reported missing November 18th by his family so he probably hasn’t been taking care of himself well.

How did they not know it was him with those pictures plastered all over?

who cares if his family didn’t identify him? they weren’t harboring him. they didn’t know where he was

You don’t think telling the cops who he was might have helped? If you knew that was your brother, cousin, son wouldn’t you be worried for their safety?

Why do you think they did not do so? We do not know everything. We do know his mom had reported him missing a while back.

Because the NYPD said they did not know the name of the suspect before Altoona police apprehended him, all they were going on was the photos. It wasn’t until he was arrested did they get his name. IF any of his relatives had called the tip lines, wouldn’t the police already have had his name? So no, none of his parents or siblings or 30 cousins called.

But we don’t know how many people called to say, “ that might be my[son, cousin, coworker, ex-husband, former classmate].“ They could not jump from a tip to deciding that is the shooter’s name.

The probably got tips from all over but they sure showed up quickly at that McDonald’s. How did they know that was legit?

A sighting (when he was sought) is different than someone saying, I think I know who that guy is (vs where he is). Plus they might have known the bus to Atlanta stopped there.

It’s funny how the spotters in McDonald’s thought he strongly resembled the shooter and his masked appearance but we can’t expect the family to recognize their own.

[Anonymous]

Insanity plea?

[Anonymous]

I’m seeing a lot of idolizing of the shooter as well among Gen Z and Gen Alpha, especially online. I don’t see how this is measurably different than the kids in the 1990s who adored Che Guavara (who executed far more innocents than Mangione did) and made him into a cultural hero.

Of course the reality is repellent, but there has always been a subset of young political idiots who ignore the real-life brutality and crime in favor of creating a myth. It’s shocking to many of us but it is not uncommon.