Why are most teachers too scared to return to in person teaching, but most parents want schools open

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am the first to argue for money money for education. Even the money for education goes to the top however.
I think our education system needs a complete overhaul and this may just be the first step to do it.
However, teachers 100% should be doing their jobs in person for elementary students. there are so many vacant buildings not being used right now, why can't schools utilize those if the space isn't adequate at the actual school.

As for not going back without 100% building overhaul. Do you think every office, nursing home, care facility, etc has up to date new HVAC systems?? They don't. Yet here I am working in one and have since April and haven't died. No one I work with has had COVID (some have been tested) and we work with people with mental and physical challenges who are not always the most hygenic and need a fair amount of support when they come to us.

No one has said building overhaul. We have said filters for hvac are important and ppe as you have meaning face masks gloves and masks. A care facility has the ability to only let in workers and residents who live there full time and don’t go back to families each night where the children are both exposed to community spread and are possible exposing vectors to their families. Though a Few individuals in your facility may be leaving it to go out in the community, all of a teachers students go out in the community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, the funniest part is that at my school we still have close to 10-15% of content teacher positions unfilled. Secondary. Yeah, we're laughing all the way to the bank. And so will you when your kid is being taught by a long-term sub with only 2 years of college and it isn't in the subject matter being taught.

Don't stress about it. "Content teacher positions" can be adequately filled by anyone with a HS diploma. You have vacancies because we pay teachers too little for any true professionals to take the position. We need to pay more and then expect more. Stop hiring blow-average slackers and paying them peanuts.

Why do you want schools to open, if not for your children to work with trained educators? It’s clear that so many of you with low opinions of teachers are really struggling to parent your children and are desperate for time away from them. It would be much easier to respect you if you would just admit to it.

And people like you will always scream it’s too unsafe to reopen schools, no matter how good the numbers are, because you just want to stay on the couch and get paid.

You don't know anything about me. I would happily go back to school with PPE, ventilation reports, and proof that all staff and students have been tested for COVID prior to opening. If schools can't or won't put those things in place, then they shouldn't open. Period.

It’s crazy that we’ve had all of these months and still don’t have widespread rapid testing. That would help so much- even if you could test all kids/teachers at the start of each week. Even if they are not 100% accurate you’d still catch a lot more and have a reasonable path forward. If we could get a good testing strategy down, I would go back (in this area, where numbers are good) without question.

I don’t think it’s realistic to expect to be provided hospital-grade PPE in schools. Plenty of people out there working to keep society going in cloth and surgical masks. Of my numerous family members in essential positions, the only ones being provided fitted N95s are a police officer and those working in hospitals (and even then they get one per shift). Who doesn’t have a proper supply of masks by now anyway? Have y’all been sitting at home since March?

Speaking as a self contained special education teacher, yes, we do need hospital grade PPE. We have students who bite and spit. We have been told our kids don’t have to wear masks. My kids need help blowing their noses, toileting, tying shoes, etc. so we have no choice but to be hands on with them. I’m not wearing a cloth mask to physically assist a student like that. Teachers should not be begging friends and family for money for PPE to fund an unsafe school opening, and I refuse to do that. I agree that gen ed teachers of older students don’t need N95s, face shields, etc.

Yet they’re good enough for the grocery store workers who need to deal with hundreds of people per day, including beligerant ones. Got it.

I just laughed when I read that. You spelled belligerent wrong. And grocery store workers don't assist customers in the bathroom, blow their noses, hold them when they cry, tie their shoes, or physically touch them in any way. They stand behind plexiglass and you have a 2 minute interaction with them. They can also throw out customers who aren't wearing masks. Give me a plexiglass barrier to stand behind, limit my interaction with students to 2 minutes, prevent me from having to touch them, and sure! I'll wear a cloth mask.
That is the worst analogy I've ever seen.

Yeah I laughed too- a SPED teacher is more analogous to a nursing home worker. Give teachers the same PPE as nursing home staff and then we can talk. Until then, the safest place for those kids and teachers is at home.

NP. I don’t work in a nursing home but I work in a hospital. We’re given one surgical mask for the whole day. One flimsy eyeglass that’s supposed to be one time used but are supposed to reuse it unless it breaks. We’re given N95s only if we need to go in a covid+ or PUI(person under investigation) room. And that’s only one N95 and one face shield per day. We do have enough hand sanitizers and hand washing stations with soap. We also have carefully regulated wipes to clean.

I think we should push for in-person learning for young kids who cannot benefit from DL. Super high risk kids should do DL, and parents should have an option for distance learning. We should push for budgeting that allows enough sanitizers and hand washing stations. Kids can and will wear masks. My 2year old will wear a mask if asked. Kids get used to it. Again, for higher risk kids needing accommodation, DL should be an option.

I don’t know how we can make totally fair, but I am more than willing to donate money and supplies for school. I am sure a lot of parents would prioritize this for in person learning versus spending money on other luxuries.

Hospitalizations has been a lot lower than what we saw a few months ago. Healthcare providers have learned a great deal in how to manage these patients. Not to minimize the gravity of what this virus can do to people.

The vaccines that are supposed to come out have cut so many corners in safety and efficacy studies. It takes years to develop effective and safe vaccines, not mere months. We can be sure that when and if it comes out, it won’t be this big end all be all of covid 19.

Our small kids are growing so fast and they are missing these important years where they learn about living in a community, following rules, be good citizens. At some point we have to take some risk so we don’t lock our kids inside our houses for years. This may very well last at least 2-4 years.

Can we all come together and come up with solutions instead of hiding and just saying nope can’t be done?

I’m not sure what to tell you. As a teacher, I don’t have a chance to wash my hands for four hours at a time. My workplace is not clean. My students are NOT wearing masks, because it has been deemed “developmentally inappropriate” for them to do so. My students come in sick and then their parents refuse to pick them up, so they sit in my class coughing all day (this continued to happen even mid March right before schools were closed, after COVID had been declared a pandemic). If my students WERE wearing masks, I had access to basic hygiene, there was a zero tolerance policy regarding sick students, and our schools were cleaned regularly then I think it would be fine. Because none of this is the case and there is no funding to do so, I don’t think we should. We can’t rely on parent donations. I work in a Title I school and we don’t receive any parent donations, which would mean that schools in wealthier neighborhoods would be significantly safer than mine. That’s immoral and wrong.

You really can't wash your hands for 4 hours? Ever heard of personal size hand sanitizer? It's so obvious you don't even want to try to make it work.

At least try harder the next time you come up with some BS excuse.

I'm not a teacher and have never worked for a school system, but your post makes me furious. You are a selfish abusive a@@. I am sick to death of these attacks on teachers. Be responsible for your kid yourself. When teachers do a crappy job, I'm there with you billybobdrumpster. There is nothing unreasonable at all in expecting a safe work space and as the poster above mentioned, the safe safety threshold in your mind is so low it's a joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, the funniest part is that at my school we still have close to 10-15% of content teacher positions unfilled. Secondary. Yeah, we're laughing all the way to the bank. And so will you when your kid is being taught by a long-term sub with only 2 years of college and it isn't in the subject matter being taught.

Don't stress about it. "Content teacher positions" can be adequately filled by anyone with a HS diploma. You have vacancies because we pay teachers too little for any true professionals to take the position. We need to pay more and then expect more. Stop hiring blow-average slackers and paying them peanuts.

Why do you want schools to open, if not for your children to work with trained educators? It’s clear that so many of you with low opinions of teachers are really struggling to parent your children and are desperate for time away from them. It would be much easier to respect you if you would just admit to it.

And people like you will always scream it’s too unsafe to reopen schools, no matter how good the numbers are, because you just want to stay on the couch and get paid.

You don't know anything about me. I would happily go back to school with PPE, ventilation reports, and proof that all staff and students have been tested for COVID prior to opening. If schools can't or won't put those things in place, then they shouldn't open. Period.

It’s crazy that we’ve had all of these months and still don’t have widespread rapid testing. That would help so much- even if you could test all kids/teachers at the start of each week. Even if they are not 100% accurate you’d still catch a lot more and have a reasonable path forward. If we could get a good testing strategy down, I would go back (in this area, where numbers are good) without question.

I don’t think it’s realistic to expect to be provided hospital-grade PPE in schools. Plenty of people out there working to keep society going in cloth and surgical masks. Of my numerous family members in essential positions, the only ones being provided fitted N95s are a police officer and those working in hospitals (and even then they get one per shift). Who doesn’t have a proper supply of masks by now anyway? Have y’all been sitting at home since March?

Speaking as a self contained special education teacher, yes, we do need hospital grade PPE. We have students who bite and spit. We have been told our kids don’t have to wear masks. My kids need help blowing their noses, toileting, tying shoes, etc. so we have no choice but to be hands on with them. I’m not wearing a cloth mask to physically assist a student like that. Teachers should not be begging friends and family for money for PPE to fund an unsafe school opening, and I refuse to do that. I agree that gen ed teachers of older students don’t need N95s, face shields, etc.

Yet they’re good enough for the grocery store workers who need to deal with hundreds of people per day, including beligerant ones. Got it.

I just laughed when I read that. You spelled belligerent wrong. And grocery store workers don't assist customers in the bathroom, blow their noses, hold them when they cry, tie their shoes, or physically touch them in any way. They stand behind plexiglass and you have a 2 minute interaction with them. They can also throw out customers who aren't wearing masks. Give me a plexiglass barrier to stand behind, limit my interaction with students to 2 minutes, prevent me from having to touch them, and sure! I'll wear a cloth mask.
That is the worst analogy I've ever seen.

Yeah I laughed too- a SPED teacher is more analogous to a nursing home worker. Give teachers the same PPE as nursing home staff and then we can talk. Until then, the safest place for those kids and teachers is at home.

NP. I don’t work in a nursing home but I work in a hospital. We’re given one surgical mask for the whole day. One flimsy eyeglass that’s supposed to be one time used but are supposed to reuse it unless it breaks. We’re given N95s only if we need to go in a covid+ or PUI(person under investigation) room. And that’s only one N95 and one face shield per day. We do have enough hand sanitizers and hand washing stations with soap. We also have carefully regulated wipes to clean.

I think we should push for in-person learning for young kids who cannot benefit from DL. Super high risk kids should do DL, and parents should have an option for distance learning. We should push for budgeting that allows enough sanitizers and hand washing stations. Kids can and will wear masks. My 2year old will wear a mask if asked. Kids get used to it. Again, for higher risk kids needing accommodation, DL should be an option.

I don’t know how we can make totally fair, but I am more than willing to donate money and supplies for school. I am sure a lot of parents would prioritize this for in person learning versus spending money on other luxuries.

Hospitalizations has been a lot lower than what we saw a few months ago. Healthcare providers have learned a great deal in how to manage these patients. Not to minimize the gravity of what this virus can do to people.

The vaccines that are supposed to come out have cut so many corners in safety and efficacy studies. It takes years to develop effective and safe vaccines, not mere months. We can be sure that when and if it comes out, it won’t be this big end all be all of covid 19.

Our small kids are growing so fast and they are missing these important years where they learn about living in a community, following rules, be good citizens. At some point we have to take some risk so we don’t lock our kids inside our houses for years. This may very well last at least 2-4 years.

Can we all come together and come up with solutions instead of hiding and just saying nope can’t be done?

I’m not sure what to tell you. As a teacher, I don’t have a chance to wash my hands for four hours at a time. My workplace is not clean. My students are NOT wearing masks, because it has been deemed “developmentally inappropriate” for them to do so. My students come in sick and then their parents refuse to pick them up, so they sit in my class coughing all day (this continued to happen even mid March right before schools were closed, after COVID had been declared a pandemic). If my students WERE wearing masks, I had access to basic hygiene, there was a zero tolerance policy regarding sick students, and our schools were cleaned regularly then I think it would be fine. Because none of this is the case and there is no funding to do so, I don’t think we should. We can’t rely on parent donations. I work in a Title I school and we don’t receive any parent donations, which would mean that schools in wealthier neighborhoods would be significantly safer than mine. That’s immoral and wrong.

You really can't wash your hands for 4 hours? Ever heard of personal size hand sanitizer? It's so obvious you don't even want to try to make it work.

At least try harder the next time you come up with some BS excuse.

I'm not a teacher and have never worked for a school system, but your post makes me furious. You are a selfish abusive a@@. I am sick to death of these attacks on teachers. Be responsible for your kid yourself. When teachers do a crappy job, I'm there with you billybobdrumpster. There is nothing unreasonable at all in expecting a safe work space and as the poster above mentioned, the safe safety threshold in your mind is so low it's a joke.

Ugh you again, nothing but lies and fake outrage. With some money and effort our schools could be made reasonably safe with PPE, filters, etc. People like you want to pretend that schools are unsafe no matter what. And when people call you out on your BS you just scream and shout and insult.

So please get a grip. Schools in MA put in the work and were able to open up carefully. We can do the same, at least for our ES kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am the first to argue for money money for education. Even the money for education goes to the top however.
I think our education system needs a complete overhaul and this may just be the first step to do it.
However, teachers 100% should be doing their jobs in person for elementary students. there are so many vacant buildings not being used right now, why can't schools utilize those if the space isn't adequate at the actual school.

As for not going back without 100% building overhaul. Do you think every office, nursing home, care facility, etc has up to date new HVAC systems?? They don't. Yet here I am working in one and have since April and haven't died. No one I work with has had COVID (some have been tested) and we work with people with mental and physical challenges who are not always the most hygenic and need a fair amount of support when they come to us.

No one has said building overhaul. We have said filters for hvac are important and ppe as you have meaning face masks gloves and masks. A care facility has the ability to only let in workers and residents who live there full time and don’t go back to families each night where the children are both exposed to community spread and are possible exposing vectors to their families. Though a Few individuals in your facility may be leaving it to go out in the community, all of a teachers students go out in the community.

Don’t forget gowns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, the funniest part is that at my school we still have close to 10-15% of content teacher positions unfilled. Secondary. Yeah, we're laughing all the way to the bank. And so will you when your kid is being taught by a long-term sub with only 2 years of college and it isn't in the subject matter being taught.

Don't stress about it. "Content teacher positions" can be adequately filled by anyone with a HS diploma. You have vacancies because we pay teachers too little for any true professionals to take the position. We need to pay more and then expect more. Stop hiring blow-average slackers and paying them peanuts.

Why do you want schools to open, if not for your children to work with trained educators? It’s clear that so many of you with low opinions of teachers are really struggling to parent your children and are desperate for time away from them. It would be much easier to respect you if you would just admit to it.

And people like you will always scream it’s too unsafe to reopen schools, no matter how good the numbers are, because you just want to stay on the couch and get paid.

You don't know anything about me. I would happily go back to school with PPE, ventilation reports, and proof that all staff and students have been tested for COVID prior to opening. If schools can't or won't put those things in place, then they shouldn't open. Period.

It’s crazy that we’ve had all of these months and still don’t have widespread rapid testing. That would help so much- even if you could test all kids/teachers at the start of each week. Even if they are not 100% accurate you’d still catch a lot more and have a reasonable path forward. If we could get a good testing strategy down, I would go back (in this area, where numbers are good) without question.

I don’t think it’s realistic to expect to be provided hospital-grade PPE in schools. Plenty of people out there working to keep society going in cloth and surgical masks. Of my numerous family members in essential positions, the only ones being provided fitted N95s are a police officer and those working in hospitals (and even then they get one per shift). Who doesn’t have a proper supply of masks by now anyway? Have y’all been sitting at home since March?

Speaking as a self contained special education teacher, yes, we do need hospital grade PPE. We have students who bite and spit. We have been told our kids don’t have to wear masks. My kids need help blowing their noses, toileting, tying shoes, etc. so we have no choice but to be hands on with them. I’m not wearing a cloth mask to physically assist a student like that. Teachers should not be begging friends and family for money for PPE to fund an unsafe school opening, and I refuse to do that. I agree that gen ed teachers of older students don’t need N95s, face shields, etc.

Yet they’re good enough for the grocery store workers who need to deal with hundreds of people per day, including beligerant ones. Got it.

I just laughed when I read that. You spelled belligerent wrong. And grocery store workers don't assist customers in the bathroom, blow their noses, hold them when they cry, tie their shoes, or physically touch them in any way. They stand behind plexiglass and you have a 2 minute interaction with them. They can also throw out customers who aren't wearing masks. Give me a plexiglass barrier to stand behind, limit my interaction with students to 2 minutes, prevent me from having to touch them, and sure! I'll wear a cloth mask.
That is the worst analogy I've ever seen.

Yeah I laughed too- a SPED teacher is more analogous to a nursing home worker. Give teachers the same PPE as nursing home staff and then we can talk. Until then, the safest place for those kids and teachers is at home.

NP. I don’t work in a nursing home but I work in a hospital. We’re given one surgical mask for the whole day. One flimsy eyeglass that’s supposed to be one time used but are supposed to reuse it unless it breaks. We’re given N95s only if we need to go in a covid+ or PUI(person under investigation) room. And that’s only one N95 and one face shield per day. We do have enough hand sanitizers and hand washing stations with soap. We also have carefully regulated wipes to clean.

I think we should push for in-person learning for young kids who cannot benefit from DL. Super high risk kids should do DL, and parents should have an option for distance learning. We should push for budgeting that allows enough sanitizers and hand washing stations. Kids can and will wear masks. My 2year old will wear a mask if asked. Kids get used to it. Again, for higher risk kids needing accommodation, DL should be an option.

I don’t know how we can make totally fair, but I am more than willing to donate money and supplies for school. I am sure a lot of parents would prioritize this for in person learning versus spending money on other luxuries.

Hospitalizations has been a lot lower than what we saw a few months ago. Healthcare providers have learned a great deal in how to manage these patients. Not to minimize the gravity of what this virus can do to people.

The vaccines that are supposed to come out have cut so many corners in safety and efficacy studies. It takes years to develop effective and safe vaccines, not mere months. We can be sure that when and if it comes out, it won’t be this big end all be all of covid 19.

Our small kids are growing so fast and they are missing these important years where they learn about living in a community, following rules, be good citizens. At some point we have to take some risk so we don’t lock our kids inside our houses for years. This may very well last at least 2-4 years.

Can we all come together and come up with solutions instead of hiding and just saying nope can’t be done?

I’m not sure what to tell you. As a teacher, I don’t have a chance to wash my hands for four hours at a time. My workplace is not clean. My students are NOT wearing masks, because it has been deemed “developmentally inappropriate” for them to do so. My students come in sick and then their parents refuse to pick them up, so they sit in my class coughing all day (this continued to happen even mid March right before schools were closed, after COVID had been declared a pandemic). If my students WERE wearing masks, I had access to basic hygiene, there was a zero tolerance policy regarding sick students, and our schools were cleaned regularly then I think it would be fine. Because none of this is the case and there is no funding to do so, I don’t think we should. We can’t rely on parent donations. I work in a Title I school and we don’t receive any parent donations, which would mean that schools in wealthier neighborhoods would be significantly safer than mine. That’s immoral and wrong.

You really can't wash your hands for 4 hours? Ever heard of personal size hand sanitizer? It's so obvious you don't even want to try to make it work.

At least try harder the next time you come up with some BS excuse.

I'm not a teacher and have never worked for a school system, but your post makes me furious. You are a selfish abusive a@@. I am sick to death of these attacks on teachers. Be responsible for your kid yourself. When teachers do a crappy job, I'm there with you billybobdrumpster. There is nothing unreasonable at all in expecting a safe work space and as the poster above mentioned, the safe safety threshold in your mind is so low it's a joke.

Ugh you again, nothing but lies and fake outrage. With some money and effort our schools could be made reasonably safe with PPE, filters, etc. People like you want to pretend that schools are unsafe no matter what. And when people call you out on your BS you just scream and shout and insult.

So please get a grip. Schools in MA put in the work and were able to open up carefully. We can do the same, at least for our ES kids.

No they got parent volunteers to retrofit the hvac! The schools and districts themselves did nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, the funniest part is that at my school we still have close to 10-15% of content teacher positions unfilled. Secondary. Yeah, we're laughing all the way to the bank. And so will you when your kid is being taught by a long-term sub with only 2 years of college and it isn't in the subject matter being taught.

Don't stress about it. "Content teacher positions" can be adequately filled by anyone with a HS diploma. You have vacancies because we pay teachers too little for any true professionals to take the position. We need to pay more and then expect more. Stop hiring blow-average slackers and paying them peanuts.

Why do you want schools to open, if not for your children to work with trained educators? It’s clear that so many of you with low opinions of teachers are really struggling to parent your children and are desperate for time away from them. It would be much easier to respect you if you would just admit to it.

And people like you will always scream it’s too unsafe to reopen schools, no matter how good the numbers are, because you just want to stay on the couch and get paid.

You don't know anything about me. I would happily go back to school with PPE, ventilation reports, and proof that all staff and students have been tested for COVID prior to opening. If schools can't or won't put those things in place, then they shouldn't open. Period.

It’s crazy that we’ve had all of these months and still don’t have widespread rapid testing. That would help so much- even if you could test all kids/teachers at the start of each week. Even if they are not 100% accurate you’d still catch a lot more and have a reasonable path forward. If we could get a good testing strategy down, I would go back (in this area, where numbers are good) without question.

I don’t think it’s realistic to expect to be provided hospital-grade PPE in schools. Plenty of people out there working to keep society going in cloth and surgical masks. Of my numerous family members in essential positions, the only ones being provided fitted N95s are a police officer and those working in hospitals (and even then they get one per shift). Who doesn’t have a proper supply of masks by now anyway? Have y’all been sitting at home since March?

Speaking as a self contained special education teacher, yes, we do need hospital grade PPE. We have students who bite and spit. We have been told our kids don’t have to wear masks. My kids need help blowing their noses, toileting, tying shoes, etc. so we have no choice but to be hands on with them. I’m not wearing a cloth mask to physically assist a student like that. Teachers should not be begging friends and family for money for PPE to fund an unsafe school opening, and I refuse to do that. I agree that gen ed teachers of older students don’t need N95s, face shields, etc.

Yet they’re good enough for the grocery store workers who need to deal with hundreds of people per day, including beligerant ones. Got it.

I just laughed when I read that. You spelled belligerent wrong. And grocery store workers don't assist customers in the bathroom, blow their noses, hold them when they cry, tie their shoes, or physically touch them in any way. They stand behind plexiglass and you have a 2 minute interaction with them. They can also throw out customers who aren't wearing masks. Give me a plexiglass barrier to stand behind, limit my interaction with students to 2 minutes, prevent me from having to touch them, and sure! I'll wear a cloth mask.
That is the worst analogy I've ever seen.

Yeah I laughed too- a SPED teacher is more analogous to a nursing home worker. Give teachers the same PPE as nursing home staff and then we can talk. Until then, the safest place for those kids and teachers is at home.

NP. I don’t work in a nursing home but I work in a hospital. We’re given one surgical mask for the whole day. One flimsy eyeglass that’s supposed to be one time used but are supposed to reuse it unless it breaks. We’re given N95s only if we need to go in a covid+ or PUI(person under investigation) room. And that’s only one N95 and one face shield per day. We do have enough hand sanitizers and hand washing stations with soap. We also have carefully regulated wipes to clean.

I think we should push for in-person learning for young kids who cannot benefit from DL. Super high risk kids should do DL, and parents should have an option for distance learning. We should push for budgeting that allows enough sanitizers and hand washing stations. Kids can and will wear masks. My 2year old will wear a mask if asked. Kids get used to it. Again, for higher risk kids needing accommodation, DL should be an option.

I don’t know how we can make totally fair, but I am more than willing to donate money and supplies for school. I am sure a lot of parents would prioritize this for in person learning versus spending money on other luxuries.

Hospitalizations has been a lot lower than what we saw a few months ago. Healthcare providers have learned a great deal in how to manage these patients. Not to minimize the gravity of what this virus can do to people.

The vaccines that are supposed to come out have cut so many corners in safety and efficacy studies. It takes years to develop effective and safe vaccines, not mere months. We can be sure that when and if it comes out, it won’t be this big end all be all of covid 19.

Our small kids are growing so fast and they are missing these important years where they learn about living in a community, following rules, be good citizens. At some point we have to take some risk so we don’t lock our kids inside our houses for years. This may very well last at least 2-4 years.

Can we all come together and come up with solutions instead of hiding and just saying nope can’t be done?

I’m not sure what to tell you. As a teacher, I don’t have a chance to wash my hands for four hours at a time. My workplace is not clean. My students are NOT wearing masks, because it has been deemed “developmentally inappropriate” for them to do so. My students come in sick and then their parents refuse to pick them up, so they sit in my class coughing all day (this continued to happen even mid March right before schools were closed, after COVID had been declared a pandemic). If my students WERE wearing masks, I had access to basic hygiene, there was a zero tolerance policy regarding sick students, and our schools were cleaned regularly then I think it would be fine. Because none of this is the case and there is no funding to do so, I don’t think we should. We can’t rely on parent donations. I work in a Title I school and we don’t receive any parent donations, which would mean that schools in wealthier neighborhoods would be significantly safer than mine. That’s immoral and wrong.

You really can't wash your hands for 4 hours? Ever heard of personal size hand sanitizer? It's so obvious you don't even want to try to make it work.

At least try harder the next time you come up with some BS excuse.

I'm not a teacher and have never worked for a school system, but your post makes me furious. You are a selfish abusive a@@. I am sick to death of these attacks on teachers. Be responsible for your kid yourself. When teachers do a crappy job, I'm there with you billybobdrumpster. There is nothing unreasonable at all in expecting a safe work space and as the poster above mentioned, the safe safety threshold in your mind is so low it's a joke.

We have had our fair of bad teachers but blaming the teachers is wrong. Many of us parents don't want our kids going back yet either. Hand sanitizer is not a substitute for hand washing and this is mostly air born so hand washing helps but is not a solution. At our last school, we often went without heat or ac so not sure where all this good ventilation is when we had to dress kids in layers and send extra clothing. We are trying to get donations for our PTSA but a low income school and we are really struggling.

[Anonymous]

PP - it is your story that merits attention. It would be great to put all the time, money and energy from protests/counter protests, unions, lawyers to fight the unions and unworthy bureaucrats into funding schools. Instead, we can't move forward because there is no money left to get teachers and schools equipped to safety educate children.

Sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP - it is your story that merits attention. It would be great to put all the time, money and energy from protests/counter protests, unions, lawyers to fight the unions and unworthy bureaucrats into funding schools. Instead, we can't move forward because there is no money left to get teachers and schools equipped to safety educate children.

Sad.

This not about a lack of money. This is about a lack of teachers willing to do their jobs.

[Anonymous]

We have had our fair of bad teachers but blaming the teachers is wrong. Many of us parents don't want our kids going back yet either. Hand sanitizer is not a substitute for hand washing and this is mostly air born so hand washing helps but is not a solution. At our last school, we often went without heat or ac so not sure where all this good ventilation is when we had to dress kids in layers and send extra clothing. We are trying to get donations for our PTSA but a low income school and we are really struggling.

Just wanted to mention covid-19 is mostly droplet. Surgical mask and face shields should be enough in community settings. Sanitizers are extremely effective. I don’t understand why we cannot hear about how to troubleshoot our problems. Please make a list of reasonable things that needs to be fixed before opening in person and ask mcps to fulfill these criteria. No, N95s and complete overhaul of ventilation are not reasonable. Hand washing stations in each room, sanitizers, wipes are reasonable. Strict mask rules are reasonable. No sick kid to school is reasonable.

Legitimate high risk teachers should be given exemption from in person classes. They can lead DL. High risk kids, or anyone who do not want in person can be in those DL classes. Anyone violating strict sick child policy or mask policy should be DL.

Teachers, please list valid needs that need to be fulfilled prior to opening. You are the ones facing the challenges, i am sure you would have better idea on how to solve this problem. Not having school for years is bad for students, teachers, parents.....society.

MCPS May have to make some tough choices. Cutting budget on transportation, or PE? They are not useful for DL anyways. Transportation for only if truly needed. Ask state and county leaders for more money. Ask parents for more money and volunteers for a lot of these things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your kids. Your responsibility. Don’t put them off on teachers just cause you tired of dealing with em.

This is so laughable. It is like a grocery store worker saying, you're hungry? Your problem. Go grow some food.
Or a utility company saying "You want electricity?" "Go find some"

Thought this analogy was right on! So witty and on point!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Teachers have ZERO downside to the DL plan. They keep their jobs, they keep their salary. . Even if the Academic results are terrible.

Parents have HUGE downside to the DL plan. Most kids will lose an entire year of education. And parents have the struggle of figuring out solutions to kids being home all day while parents have to go to jobs.

Opening schools is mostly, but not 100 percent safe. The person who has literally nothing to lose from DL (teachers) will choose DL, because they don’t have to make any trade off. Those who have a lot to lose from dL (parents) will weigh the safety trade off and, given the low safety risks, it reasonable that 70 percent of parents will want to send kids back to school and take that small gamble.

My guess is the 30 percent of parents who favor full DL probably have a sahp or available grandparent who can handle all of the oversight. For those families, like teachers, there is close to ZERO downside to the DL plan. With a full time available caregiver, their kids will not lose a year of education. And they don’t have to worry about juggling jobs with the DL plan. The only downside for these families is the loss of social interaction - which may not offset the small safety risks for those families.

You are absolutely right! Incentives are huge here. I wonder if teachers' salaries were reduced by 10-20% (perhaps to offset parents' expenses), they would be more inclined to return to the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

Not my fault your job doesn’t allow you to telework.
Teachers can.
Buckle up and drive safe.

This is such a myth. DL is pretense for teachers. DL is not effective for the majority of students. If a restaurant cooks nothing but spoiled food, can they really still say they're "serving meals"?

So put your parent-pants on and pick up the slack and take responsibility for your child.
You the parent...teach em.

I would love that. Put teachers on unpaid furlough, use the money to hand out vouchers, and let every family choose what's best for them. Everybody wins: Teachers will no longer be afraid to "DIEEEE!!!!!!!," and kids will actually get educated.

Yes! I love that the pro-union responses all urge parents to just "buck up," but there's no discussion about what teachers should give up in this remote learning environment. Furlough and vouchers sound good to me!

Wonder if we'll see some major political change after this whole Distance Learning fiasco.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do teachers really think the rest of us working in the world are washing our hands every 2 minutes?
I work with people with disabilities, intellectual and physical barriers. Do i wash my hands? Yes. When i can. Otherwise i use sanitizer and don't touch my face/eyes/nose/mouth.
I wear a mask and face shield. The people I work with do the same (those with disabilities). Really only 1 person has a medical need adn cannoot wear one but can wear a face shield and she does.

This is not rocket science. Does my job look the same as it did in March? Hell no. But you know what, in many ways it is better. Smaller group sizes, greater focus on sanitization and respect for personal space. PErfect? Nope. But if the people I work with can figure this out with a great deal of success I think our children can as well. You aren't even letting them try.
My kids don't touch people, touch their faces, blow snot everywhere, kiss, climb on people etc. THey just don't. They wear masks and shields consistently and have sanitzer to use when they touch something public.
NOt a big deal at all.

Just stop whining already about how NOTHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING can be done. Our children will kill you and can't follow basic rules.

Funny- we are asking for what you have. PPE. Proper ventilation. CLeaning supplies and hand sanitizer.

You are totally right, this isn’t rocket science, but people are protesting making their children wear masks.

I’m glad your non profit can get it’s act together. Ordering enough PPE for an entire school system week after week requires a magnitude of scale our country is finding difficult to provide.

I’m glad your kids can keep their hands to themselves and you have observed this behavior consistently across a school setting to make sure they do this when you aren’t around. Know that other parents aren’t able to ensure that their children are able to do these self care tasks and we have to take care of ALL kids not just yours.

Has anyone run the numbers on the cost of PPE per week? Some things could be reused (like face shields).

How do you propose we fund schools to redo the ventilation systems? This is not a covid-only problem, it's a long-standing problem. I think the union needs to make it super-clear that we will not go back until the ventilation systems are up to code period, even if a vaccine is available. A line needs to be drawn.

Hard line on asks too. ANyone who refuses to wear gets sent home.

x1000 NoVa, where I teach, is not a union state but I agree our teacher association needs to draw a hard line in the sand on safety issues. And I completely agree about masks. If you're not wearing a mask 100% of the time, then you're note entering the building. If you take off your mask, home you go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
We have had our fair of bad teachers but blaming the teachers is wrong. Many of us parents don't want our kids going back yet either. Hand sanitizer is not a substitute for hand washing and this is mostly air born so hand washing helps but is not a solution. At our last school, we often went without heat or ac so not sure where all this good ventilation is when we had to dress kids in layers and send extra clothing. We are trying to get donations for our PTSA but a low income school and we are really struggling.

Just wanted to mention covid-19 is mostly droplet. Surgical mask and face shields should be enough in community settings. Sanitizers are extremely effective. I don’t understand why we cannot hear about how to troubleshoot our problems. Please make a list of reasonable things that needs to be fixed before opening in person and ask mcps to fulfill these criteria. No, N95s and complete overhaul of ventilation are not reasonable. Hand washing stations in each room, sanitizers, wipes are reasonable. Strict mask rules are reasonable. No sick kid to school is reasonable.

Legitimate high risk teachers should be given exemption from in person classes. They can lead DL. High risk kids, or anyone who do not want in person can be in those DL classes. Anyone violating strict sick child policy or mask policy should be DL.

Teachers, please list valid needs that need to be fulfilled prior to opening. You are the ones facing the challenges, i am sure you would have better idea on how to solve this problem. Not having school for years is bad for students, teachers, parents.....society.

MCPS May have to make some tough choices. Cutting budget on transportation, or PE? They are not useful for DL anyways. Transportation for only if truly needed. Ask state and county leaders for more money. Ask parents for more money and volunteers for a lot of these things.








So many reasonable posters here, I applaud you. Mass hysteria has caused an inability to think clearly and problem solve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers have ZERO downside to the DL plan. They keep their jobs, they keep their salary. . Even if the Academic results are terrible.

Parents have HUGE downside to the DL plan. Most kids will lose an entire year of education. And parents have the struggle of figuring out solutions to kids being home all day while parents have to go to jobs.

Opening schools is mostly, but not 100 percent safe. The person who has literally nothing to lose from DL (teachers) will choose DL, because they don’t have to make any trade off. Those who have a lot to lose from dL (parents) will weigh the safety trade off and, given the low safety risks, it reasonable that 70 percent of parents will want to send kids back to school and take that small gamble.

My guess is the 30 percent of parents who favor full DL probably have a sahp or available grandparent who can handle all of the oversight. For those families, like teachers, there is close to ZERO downside to the DL plan. With a full time available caregiver, their kids will not lose a year of education. And they don’t have to worry about juggling jobs with the DL plan. The only downside for these families is the loss of social interaction - which may not offset the small safety risks for those families.

You are absolutely right! Incentives are huge here. I wonder if teachers' salaries were reduced by 10-20% (perhaps to offset parents' expenses), they would be more inclined to return to the classroom.

+1 This is the most accurate formulation, the economics of any decision is made on incentives. In the case of DL, you have virtually zero incentives for teachers to return to schools. Granting them additional hazard payments for in-school teaching people or disincentivizing by leveling a WFH tax would probably shift things. We have a full-time SAHP to concentrate on DL so it’s obviously a non-issue for us.