Harsh comment on being a Sahm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m another single mom and while I don’t have time to make my own crackers, I do work a second job and an occasional third job. Why? It’s the same reason most people work second jobs. Job #1 doesn’t pay all of the bills. Do I have the energy for it? Hell no! I’m 49 years old and spend my days in a overstimulating school that expects me to be everything to everybody. I’m not on drugs to do all of this. I do a lot of dropping off and picking up of my kids in between the two jobs. The house gets cleaned on weekends by all of us. My son will go to the grocery store today (he just got his license) and my DD and I will clean and cook. People do this all of the time because they don’t have a choice.

This is the point almost all of you are missing. People (households) ultimately work to pay the bills. No one vilifies working moms who DON’T work second and occasional third jobs. Because who the hell wants to do that? The vast majority of people would rather spend the extra time with their families or just chilling if they don’t need the money.

Now apply that logic to couples who make enough with ONE job to pay all the bills. The second job is optional, and many people choose not to work just for fun or to out accumulate more money than they actually need.

Again, this isn’t complicated and it’s not a moral argument. For most people, it’s just math and priorities.

I'm the single mom you quoted above. To me, that second job is definitely not optional. The second job (assuming it is the women who isn't working that second job) is because she needs to take care of herself and her children financially. A women who doesn't make money (or doesn't have family money) is a very risky situation. She can't ever leave her relationship because of her financial dependency on her husband. I would never put myself or my kids in a situation like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

Is this satire? What you described is simply being an adult and having kids.

The fact you think this one of the hardest jobs in the world is comical.

DP. No working parents don’t do this. My middle school kid starts school at 7:15, same for high schooler that doesn’t drive. My youngest starts 8:30. Older kids are done by 2:30, then extracurriculars immediately start. Two of my kids are in highly accelerated programs that are not at their home schools- they need to be picked up at noon twice per week and driven to another school. So unless your work day is 9-2 with the flexibility of leaving even early multiple days per week, this would be a problem. Oh, then there’s the unholy number of half days and random Fridays off. Since my kids have various private lessons and group practices nearly every day after school, I have to have dinner pretty much ready before I start school pick up. In the 5 hrs I’m home alone (less on the early pick up days), I work out, clean house, do yard work, run errands, and cook dinner plus make sure there is homemade food for packed lunches and snacks pack (baking bread and muffins, granola, etc). My spouse works about 60 hrs per week and makes plenty of money- it makes sense for me to be home and being present since that is what is needed more vs additional money. My teens know I do tons of behind the scenes work to make their lives smooth and to help them succeed and reach their potential.

Yes, queen! I see you because I’m living this every day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m another single mom and while I don’t have time to make my own crackers, I do work a second job and an occasional third job. Why? It’s the same reason most people work second jobs. Job #1 doesn’t pay all of the bills. Do I have the energy for it? Hell no! I’m 49 years old and spend my days in a overstimulating school that expects me to be everything to everybody. I’m not on drugs to do all of this. I do a lot of dropping off and picking up of my kids in between the two jobs. The house gets cleaned on weekends by all of us. My son will go to the grocery store today (he just got his license) and my DD and I will clean and cook. People do this all of the time because they don’t have a choice.

This is the point almost all of you are missing. People (households) ultimately work to pay the bills. No one vilifies working moms who DON’T work second and occasional third jobs. Because who the hell wants to do that? The vast majority of people would rather spend the extra time with their families or just chilling if they don’t need the money.

Now apply that logic to couples who make enough with ONE job to pay all the bills. The second job is optional, and many people choose not to work just for fun or to out accumulate more money than they actually need.

Again, this isn’t complicated and it’s not a moral argument. For most people, it’s just math and priorities.

I'm the single mom you quoted above. To me, that second job is definitely not optional. The second job (assuming it is the women who isn't working that second job) is because she needs to take care of herself and her children financially. A women who doesn't make money (or doesn't have family money) is a very risky situation. She can't ever leave her relationship because of her financial dependency on her husband. I would never put myself or my kids in a situation like that.

And yet you have put yourself in a situation in which you can’t ever leave your job because of your financial dependency on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m another single mom and while I don’t have time to make my own crackers, I do work a second job and an occasional third job. Why? It’s the same reason most people work second jobs. Job #1 doesn’t pay all of the bills. Do I have the energy for it? Hell no! I’m 49 years old and spend my days in a overstimulating school that expects me to be everything to everybody. I’m not on drugs to do all of this. I do a lot of dropping off and picking up of my kids in between the two jobs. The house gets cleaned on weekends by all of us. My son will go to the grocery store today (he just got his license) and my DD and I will clean and cook. People do this all of the time because they don’t have a choice.

This is the point almost all of you are missing. People (households) ultimately work to pay the bills. No one vilifies working moms who DON’T work second and occasional third jobs. Because who the hell wants to do that? The vast majority of people would rather spend the extra time with their families or just chilling if they don’t need the money.

Now apply that logic to couples who make enough with ONE job to pay all the bills. The second job is optional, and many people choose not to work just for fun or to out accumulate more money than they actually need.

Again, this isn’t complicated and it’s not a moral argument. For most people, it’s just math and priorities.

I'm the single mom you quoted above. To me, that second job is definitely not optional. The second job (assuming it is the women who isn't working that second job) is because she needs to take care of herself and her children financially. A women who doesn't make money (or doesn't have family money) is a very risky situation. She can't ever leave her relationship because of her financial dependency on her husband. I would never put myself or my kids in a situation like that.

And yet you have put yourself in a situation in which you can’t ever leave your job because of your financial dependency on it.

I can't ever not work. It doesn't matter which job I have as long as I have one. I'm a teacher so I have my pick of jobs. I'll never be without A job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a stay at home mom, I definitely have downtime every day. But I choose to fill it with things that enrich my family‘s life, like making wholesome nutritious meals from scratch, including making my own bread. I don’t take shortcuts and go through drive-thrus when we are short on time. I make a point to always have healthy food in the house so I can pack nutritious food for car rides, snacks, lunches, etc…this takes an extraordinary amount of time. There is rarely a day that I don’t go to the grocery store. It’s actually very time-consuming to eat healthy and feed your entire family nutritiously all the time. But this is my choice and I think it’s a better use of my time than working outside of the home. Much of my motivation is preventing disease for our family, rather than dealing with disease later. My kids will never appreciate this as much as I would like them to because they don’t know any different.

Single mom from a few pages ago. I feel I am screaming into the void at this point but you don’t have to quit your job to feel your family a healthy diet. I feel my kid homemade meals every meal. I make bread. I ALSO HAVE A JOB.

I’m a SAHM. Back when my husband and I both worked we were each putting in 60 hours or more a week. Our free time was spent cooking, cleaning, yard work, errand running and on laundry. At night we watched an hour of television before going to bed. We didn’t really do much beyond working and doing chores. We couldn’t have a dog because we would have had no time for it.

When we had our first child in our mid 30’s I quit working to be a SAHM. But I also had a fully vested 401k which I rolled over to an IRA, as well as, a pension which I will start when I retire soon. We also had sizable equity in our home that we had purchased together years before. Staying at home with our children has been the best thing that I’ve ever done. Our house is a calmer, more peaceful and relaxed place. We have quality time together as a family that there is no way we would have if I had continued to work FT. My husband and I have both been able to volunteer in our kids’ various activities over the years. We would have had an extraordinarily difficult time carving out the time to accomplish what we have done had we both continued to work. Oh, and we have two dogs now who get lots of time and attention. We can afford to live on one salary and that is what we’ve done for the past 25 years. We’ll be able to retire a little early as a matter of fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, teenagers aren’t very subtle but it is a valid question. Why do you need to be at home all day and not at work? It isn’t the 1950s. Hire a cleaner and order everything like groceries, etc.

Why should we hire a cleaner and pay to have all those things done for us instead of one parent stay home to do it?
It's really not for you to judge. I'm not OP, but I'm in OP's position.

1. Do you have any clue how difficult it is to get a decent job after being a SAHP for several years?
2. Maybe as the kids are in and graduating from college a parent doesn't "need" to be home all day every day; but depending on your age, your spouse may be retiring or preparing to retire. Maybe that's not when you want to bind yourself to work commitments year-round, limited vacation days, etc.
3. It's not necessarily a matter of "needing" to be home all day rather than in an office or somewhere else "working." I struggle with "what's my purpose today" often; but it's still a very nice thing to be able to tend to the bulk of household stuff during the day and having the availability and flexibility to do other things with your spouse or kids or friends on evenings and weekends without being exhausted or in a rush all the time. Taking care of those things lightens the burden and lowers the stress on my spouse and gives them more time to deserved relaxation and pursuing interests. It's not like SAHPs aren't still doing stuff for their home into the evenings and on weekends (ie, preparing and serving dinner, cleaning up from dinner....)
4. Yeah, those kids think you do nothing all day; but they sure are put-out if you're not available to immediately tend to something they want or need done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, teenagers aren’t very subtle but it is a valid question. Why do you need to be at home all day and not at work? It isn’t the 1950s. Hire a cleaner and order everything like groceries, etc.

Why should we hire a cleaner and pay to have all those things done for us instead of one parent stay home to do it?
It's really not for you to judge. I'm not OP, but I'm in OP's position.

1. Do you have any clue how difficult it is to get a decent job after being a SAHP for several years?
2. Maybe as the kids are in and graduating from college a parent doesn't "need" to be home all day every day; but depending on your age, your spouse may be retiring or preparing to retire. Maybe that's not when you want to bind yourself to work commitments year-round, limited vacation days, etc.
3. It's not necessarily a matter of "needing" to be home all day rather than in an office or somewhere else "working." I struggle with "what's my purpose today" often; but it's still a very nice thing to be able to tend to the bulk of household stuff during the day and having the availability and flexibility to do other things with your spouse or kids or friends on evenings and weekends without being exhausted or in a rush all the time. Taking care of those things lightens the burden and lowers the stress on my spouse and gives them more time to deserved relaxation and pursuing interests. It's not like SAHPs aren't still doing stuff for their home into the evenings and on weekends (ie, preparing and serving dinner, cleaning up from dinner....)
4. Yeah, those kids think you do nothing all day; but they sure are put-out if you're not available to immediately tend to something they want or need done.

You don’t see the problem here?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

Is this satire? What you described is simply being an adult and having kids.

The fact you think this one of the hardest jobs in the world is comical.

DP. No working parents don’t do this. My middle school kid starts school at 7:15, same for high schooler that doesn’t drive. My youngest starts 8:30. Older kids are done by 2:30, then extracurriculars immediately start. Two of my kids are in highly accelerated programs that are not at their home schools- they need to be picked up at noon twice per week and driven to another school. So unless your work day is 9-2 with the flexibility of leaving even early multiple days per week, this would be a problem. Oh, then there’s the unholy number of half days and random Fridays off. Since my kids have various private lessons and group practices nearly every day after school, I have to have dinner pretty much ready before I start school pick up. In the 5 hrs I’m home alone (less on the early pick up days), I work out, clean house, do yard work, run errands, and cook dinner plus make sure there is homemade food for packed lunches and snacks pack (baking bread and muffins, granola, etc). My spouse works about 60 hrs per week and makes plenty of money- it makes sense for me to be home and being present since that is what is needed more vs additional money. My teens know I do tons of behind the scenes work to make their lives smooth and to help them succeed and reach their potential.

Yes!
Not everyone is in a high-paying field, either. So even if I (SAHM) were to be working, that salary would be eaten up by daycare/extended day costs plus the expenses of a house cleaner that nobody working outside the home can seem to live without these days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m another single mom and while I don’t have time to make my own crackers, I do work a second job and an occasional third job. Why? It’s the same reason most people work second jobs. Job #1 doesn’t pay all of the bills. Do I have the energy for it? Hell no! I’m 49 years old and spend my days in a overstimulating school that expects me to be everything to everybody. I’m not on drugs to do all of this. I do a lot of dropping off and picking up of my kids in between the two jobs. The house gets cleaned on weekends by all of us. My son will go to the grocery store today (he just got his license) and my DD and I will clean and cook. People do this all of the time because they don’t have a choice.

This is the point almost all of you are missing. People (households) ultimately work to pay the bills. No one vilifies working moms who DON’T work second and occasional third jobs. Because who the hell wants to do that? The vast majority of people would rather spend the extra time with their families or just chilling if they don’t need the money.

Now apply that logic to couples who make enough with ONE job to pay all the bills. The second job is optional, and many people choose not to work just for fun or to out accumulate more money than they actually need.

Again, this isn’t complicated and it’s not a moral argument. For most people, it’s just math and priorities.

I'm the single mom you quoted above. To me, that second job is definitely not optional. The second job (assuming it is the women who isn't working that second job) is because she needs to take care of herself and her children financially. A women who doesn't make money (or doesn't have family money) is a very risky situation. She can't ever leave her relationship because of her financial dependency on her husband. I would never put myself or my kids in a situation like that.

And yet you have put yourself in a situation in which you can’t ever leave your job because of your financial dependency on it.

I can't ever not work. It doesn't matter which job I have as long as I have one. I'm a teacher so I have my pick of jobs. I'll never be without A job.

LOL you clearly haven’t been paying attention to the news!!! Good luck to you in your future endeavors ma’am, and I truly hope your one kid isn’t as naive as you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DC1 never made such comments, because he got to know our family history before adolescence hit. As soon as DC2 started making comments - which are entirely natural, BTW! - I explain how I worked 10 hr days before staying home, and that I never got to see DC1 awake, who was in daycare at a very young age. He then developed failure to thrive, had multiple medical issues, and I had to quit my job. DC2 had the luxury of a stay-at-home parent all her life.

Since then, no more comments. And now I'm preparing to transition to a new career, they're actually hugely supportive - while still making some snarky comments every now and then, because they're TEENS!

Explain, don't defend, OP.

Kudos to you!
I stayed home from the beginning. But my sister always worked full-time through four kids spread out over 15 years. She is now a grandmother with her first grandchild living nearby. Since she is now retired, she has been able to help with childcare until her son and his wife secured quality daycare/preschool. It is the gift of her life to, as my sister described it to them, "to be able to do for (grandson) what I was not able to do for (son)."

I haven't been the best mom; but I am forever grateful to have been able to have all that much more time with my kids than "working parents" have with theirs. We live on less money, but what money I would have brought in would not have compensated for what I would have lost.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

You are doing your kids a disservice if they are not helping with or doing many of those chores, and if they are not seeing your husband doing some of it as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean, they’re curious. What DO you do all day? They’re at school, dad at work. How many times do you need to scrub the grout with a toothbrush?? You’re clearly not doing much all day, every day. They aren’t being rude by commenting that school is harder than sitting watching soap operas.

Well, not quite as rude as you; but still rude if asked in a judgy tone. If they are just genuinely asking what they do all day as a SAHP, that's ok in and of itself. But pairing it with the snark about how hard or how much work it is to be in school?? That's just ignorance and disrespect, which equals rude.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:you and your DH failed raising your kids. it's a parenting issue, not about SHAM vs working.

+1

Sounds like OP did better with the SAH part than the M part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not usually a very strict parent, but if my 13 year old said that to me I would make them submit to a week where I: do not drive them anywhere, including their favorite sports and classes, make them take the school bus, make them make their own meals, stop cleaning the house or doing the dishes, and stop doing laundry. If they have no idea what adulting looks like, we need to show them.

The thing is that all this gets done if both parents work. It’s not like their friends who have working parents don’t play sports, wear clean clothes or have dinner. Talk to your child about the pros and cons of staying home and why it works for you and DH and it may or may not work for then if they have families.

I'm 16:49 (work part time) and people always say all the same things get done either way as if it's obvious everyone should work FT. For me, that's not the case. I mean obviously they can still eat and get dressed if I worked.40 hours, but I have worked more sometimes and it affects my mood, how my body feels, how tired I am, and more. I don't have as much time to be as involved in school or even homework. We won't have the same conversations, etc.

My kids absolutely wouldn't be able to be in as many activities if I worked more. Some other families will have different constraints where the money is more limiting than the time and energy or different preferences where they don't mind outsourcing certain things.

In the real world there will be some trade-offs from any decision. With real people involved, you can't just say all else is equal. That also goes for the person who is a better parent or more themselves when working more, but they are not me.

There aren’t always trade-offs.

The fact that you are all in nothing about things is probably the problem.

But I don’t think there’s any negative side saying to your children. Some people can handle a lot and some people can’t handle a lot and I’m one of those people who can’t handle a lot and I’m sorry.

Just like there’s some people who make a lot of money and there’s some people who don’t make a lot of money and I’m somebody who doesn’t make a lot of money. I’m sorry that’s just who I am. That’s who you got as a parent.

If you want a different life, go out and make a different life but this is the life I created. I love it get over it.

I don't relate at all to the idea that there aren't always trade-offs. All decisions about work or anything else involve trade-offs.

I think you’re confused by the idea of there’s never trade-offs. That would be a false statement.

There are always trade-offs. That is also a false statement.

Sometimes there’s trade-offs, that would be a true statement.

For example, if I were a stay at home, mom I would do XY&Z. I’m a working mom. I still do XY.&Z . No trade offs.

I work at 9 to 5 job. I like to do yoga at 10 o’clock. You can’t do both.

I work at 9 to 5 job. I like to do yoga. My favorite yoga class is at 6 PM. I can do both.

See there’s sometimes trade-offs there’s not always trade-offs and there’s not never trade offs.

This is a matter of opinion. To me, the trade-off is being more stressed, having less time to relax and do more interesting things with my spouse and children. TIME is a very valuable commodity, and in this scenario you deem to be without trade-offs, TIME is a huge trade-off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, teenagers aren’t very subtle but it is a valid question. Why do you need to be at home all day and not at work? It isn’t the 1950s. Hire a cleaner and order everything like groceries, etc.

Because I can! And I like to play tennis and do pilates after drop-off b/c I am #1 chauffeur from 3-9 pm with sports, activities, etc.

Okay, but to a teenager, that’s a pretty lame way to spend day in and out. They probably see other moms who work and do the things you do.

13 and a DD is also right about the age academics tend to ramp up. If mom is on her about that and thinks it's important to do well in school and go to a top college, she probably looks at OP like she's kind of a loser. Why do all that to have a life of tennis, pilates, and playing driver? It does sound kind of lame. No volunteering? No hobbies beyond hanging at the club? Doesn't sound like someone necessarily doing tons of housework either and there are no little kids, teens mostly have their own lives and should be somewhat self sufficient.

Answer: so you can have a life of tennis pilates, and playing driver.
You put in the time and effort before you get the lifestyle.