Fall 2022 Over/Under-Enrollment at FCPS High Schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Regardless of the school’s name, an FCPS high school with an IB program that produces only four IB diploma recipients in a graduating class needs to pull the plug on IB. It’s nuts they think they are honoring John Lewis by associating his name with such poor achievement.

Achievement is not measured by IB diplomas alone.

And the faux “concern” for Lewis is pretty transparent.

C’mon. You know a high school IB program at a school with 400 or so seniors and only 4 IB diploma graduates sucks big time.

How many IB classes are being taken? How many juniors and seniors take 1, 2, 3, 4 or more IB classes during high school? Looking at IB diplomas awarded is only one metric and is not the best metric to use. Should FCPS high schools no longer offer AP classes if only have single-digit graduates with the Capstone?

One percent of graduates earning the IB diploma shows terrible results at the top end, which likely are reflected in the other lower level metrics that you mentioned. And AP is better for a la carte courses if that is the way they are going to be taken. AP is also less expensive. FCPS is not obligated to maintain two different sets of advanced courses. Simplify everything in the county by making all schools AP.

I would support a School Board candidate that pledged to take a serious look at IB. Unfortunately there are a few members who just won't give IB up.

The only people who will try to explain this poor showing away as anything less than grim are (1) die-hard IB supporters; (2) West Springfield parents who want to suggest Lewis is doing great to squelch any redistricting talk; and (3) Lewis-zoned parents who want to suggest IB is succeeding at Lewis so they can keep pupil-placing their kids to AP schools.

Otherwise it’s a clear distress sign.

What a crock.

The Lewis zoned parents on this thread keep defending the abysmal desults of only 4 students graduating with an IB diploma. Who knows why. Perhaps it is because they want to keep that IB loophole so they can transfer out of Lewis.

No WSHS parent cares whether or not Lewis is IB. It does not affect their school one iota. What they have commented on is that IB does not make any sense at neigbboring Lewis because the program sucks and because it has zero appeal or usefulness to military families.

Keep your IB if you are so attached to it.

If my kid was zoned for an IB school with such poor results as Lewis IB program, I would fight like hell to either get rid of the program, or transfer my kkd to an actual AP school, including a Catholic high school if all else fails.

The existence and fate of Lewis is very much intertwined with WSHS. At one point, though it was an early Gatehouse blueprint, there were talks of Lee getting shut down as a 'normal' high school after the ESOL young adult program was placed there. If any plans to dissolve Lewis ever come to light again, WSHS could be the first on the hook for receiving students from some of the poorest ES in the county like Lynbrook and Crestwood which would surely affect WSHS's outcomes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Regardless of the school’s name, an FCPS high school with an IB program that produces only four IB diploma recipients in a graduating class needs to pull the plug on IB. It’s nuts they think they are honoring John Lewis by associating his name with such poor achievement.

Achievement is not measured by IB diplomas alone.

And the faux “concern” for Lewis is pretty transparent.

C’mon. You know a high school IB program at a school with 400 or so seniors and only 4 IB diploma graduates sucks big time.

How many IB classes are being taken? How many juniors and seniors take 1, 2, 3, 4 or more IB classes during high school? Looking at IB diplomas awarded is only one metric and is not the best metric to use. Should FCPS high schools no longer offer AP classes if only have single-digit graduates with the Capstone?

One percent of graduates earning the IB diploma shows terrible results at the top end, which likely are reflected in the other lower level metrics that you mentioned. And AP is better for a la carte courses if that is the way they are going to be taken. AP is also less expensive. FCPS is not obligated to maintain two different sets of advanced courses. Simplify everything in the county by making all schools AP.

I would support a School Board candidate that pledged to take a serious look at IB. Unfortunately there are a few members who just won't give IB up.

The only people who will try to explain this poor showing away as anything less than grim are (1) die-hard IB supporters; (2) West Springfield parents who want to suggest Lewis is doing great to squelch any redistricting talk; and (3) Lewis-zoned parents who want to suggest IB is succeeding at Lewis so they can keep pupil-placing their kids to AP schools.

Otherwise it’s a clear distress sign.

What a crock.

The Lewis zoned parents on this thread keep defending the abysmal desults of only 4 students graduating with an IB diploma. Who knows why. Perhaps it is because they want to keep that IB loophole so they can transfer out of Lewis.

No WSHS parent cares whether or not Lewis is IB. It does not affect their school one iota. What they have commented on is that IB does not make any sense at neigbboring Lewis because the program sucks and because it has zero appeal or usefulness to military families.

Keep your IB if you are so attached to it.

If my kid was zoned for an IB school with such poor results as Lewis IB program, I would fight like hell to either get rid of the program, or transfer my kkd to an actual AP school, including a Catholic high school if all else fails.

The existence and fate of Lewis is very much intertwined with WSHS. At one point, though it was an early Gatehouse blueprint, there were talks of Lee getting shut down as a 'normal' high school after the ESOL young adult program was placed there. If any plans to dissolve Lewis ever come to light again, WSHS could be the first on the hook for receiving students from some of the poorest ES in the county like Lynbrook and Crestwood which would surely affect WSHS's outcomes.

Seems like that would have big ripple effects that a School Board composed of cowards who are big on talk and light on action would never set in motion. Dream away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Regardless of the school’s name, an FCPS high school with an IB program that produces only four IB diploma recipients in a graduating class needs to pull the plug on IB. It’s nuts they think they are honoring John Lewis by associating his name with such poor achievement.

Achievement is not measured by IB diplomas alone.

And the faux “concern” for Lewis is pretty transparent.

C’mon. You know a high school IB program at a school with 400 or so seniors and only 4 IB diploma graduates sucks big time.

How many IB classes are being taken? How many juniors and seniors take 1, 2, 3, 4 or more IB classes during high school? Looking at IB diplomas awarded is only one metric and is not the best metric to use. Should FCPS high schools no longer offer AP classes if only have single-digit graduates with the Capstone?

One percent of graduates earning the IB diploma shows terrible results at the top end, which likely are reflected in the other lower level metrics that you mentioned. And AP is better for a la carte courses if that is the way they are going to be taken. AP is also less expensive. FCPS is not obligated to maintain two different sets of advanced courses. Simplify everything in the county by making all schools AP.

I would support a School Board candidate that pledged to take a serious look at IB. Unfortunately there are a few members who just won't give IB up.

The only people who will try to explain this poor showing away as anything less than grim are (1) die-hard IB supporters; (2) West Springfield parents who want to suggest Lewis is doing great to squelch any redistricting talk; and (3) Lewis-zoned parents who want to suggest IB is succeeding at Lewis so they can keep pupil-placing their kids to AP schools.

Otherwise it’s a clear distress sign.

What a crock.

The Lewis zoned parents on this thread keep defending the abysmal desults of only 4 students graduating with an IB diploma. Who knows why. Perhaps it is because they want to keep that IB loophole so they can transfer out of Lewis.

No WSHS parent cares whether or not Lewis is IB. It does not affect their school one iota. What they have commented on is that IB does not make any sense at neigbboring Lewis because the program sucks and because it has zero appeal or usefulness to military families.

Keep your IB if you are so attached to it.

If my kid was zoned for an IB school with such poor results as Lewis IB program, I would fight like hell to either get rid of the program, or transfer my kkd to an actual AP school, including a Catholic high school if all else fails.

The existence and fate of Lewis is very much intertwined with WSHS. At one point, though it was an early Gatehouse blueprint, there were talks of Lee getting shut down as a 'normal' high school after the ESOL young adult program was placed there. If any plans to dissolve Lewis ever come to light again, WSHS could be the first on the hook for receiving students from some of the poorest ES in the county like Lynbrook and Crestwood which would surely affect WSHS's outcomes.

Yeah... that is not happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Open classrooms were a trend for schools built in the 1970s. Turned out they weren’t great learning environments and school systems had to spend money to modify buildings so their classrooms.

IB was a trend in the late 90s and early 00s. We now have several decades of experience that it’s been a net detriment to the schools where it was introduced. We just haven’t bit the bullet and gotten rid of it yet. In the meanwhile most IB programs will continue to flounder.

+1 IB was put in at a lot of the schools that have it in order to create a “school within a school” atmosphere for the top kids at that school, to hopefully segregate them from the general education kids. They wanted to do something to try to stop transfers out at those schools and/or to make them more desirable. It didn’t work, now it’s time to cut IB at most of the schools that have it and go back to AP. There’s really no reason that Lewis/Edison/Mt. Vernon all in the same general area of the county should all have IB, when very few kids there are choosing it.

[Anonymous]

Don't worry, Lewis trying something new next year!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't worry, Lewis trying something new next year!

I hope you are not referring to the public policy academy. Everyone can see that failure a mile away. Everyone but the School Board - though even some of them see it but are too afraid to stop the idea in its tracks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't worry, Lewis trying something new next year!

I hope you are not referring to the public policy academy. Everyone can see that failure a mile away. Everyone but the School Board - though even some of them see it but are too afraid to stop the idea in its tracks.

The academy has been referred to as both a "public policy" and a "social justice" academy. Note that the money (at this point over $500K, it appears) being spent to explore this idea could have been spent on additional English and math teachers at Lewis. It's a vanity project for Karen Keys Gamarra.

If it's a public policy academy, curious to know what courses it would offer that aren't offered at nearby schools. All schools used to teach "civics" and, while that term now sounds dated, schools still offer a range of social science electives. Parents at schools near Lewis should make sure FCPS isn't planning to strip your schools of electives such as "African American History" and "Debate" and force them to travel to Lewis instead.

If it's a social justice academy, and plans to offer new courses on topics like "Queer Justice," "Environmental Equity," or "Effective Social Media Campaign Strategies," there will be challenges developing a customized curriculum. Also, if the VDOE would have to agree that the courses counts towards graduation credits, there may be another battle between county and state officials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't worry, Lewis trying something new next year!

I hope you are not referring to the public policy academy. Everyone can see that failure a mile away. Everyone but the School Board - though even some of them see it but are too afraid to stop the idea in its tracks.

The academy has been referred to as both a "public policy" and a "social justice" academy. Note that the money (at this point over $500K, it appears) being spent to explore this idea could have been spent on additional English and math teachers at Lewis. It's a vanity project for Karen Keys Gamarra.

If it's a public policy academy, curious to know what courses it would offer that aren't offered at nearby schools. All schools used to teach "civics" and, while that term now sounds dated, schools still offer a range of social science electives. Parents at schools near Lewis should make sure FCPS isn't planning to strip your schools of electives such as "African American History" and "Debate" and force them to travel to Lewis instead.

If it's a social justice academy, and plans to offer new courses on topics like "Queer Justice," "Environmental Equity," or "Effective Social Media Campaign Strategies," there will be challenges developing a customized curriculum. Also, if the VDOE would have to agree that the courses counts towards graduation credits, there may be another battle between county and state officials.

If they got buy in from fairfax county police department, they could build an actually academy into the curriculum that graduated students ready to enter the police force.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't worry, Lewis trying something new next year!

I hope you are not referring to the public policy academy. Everyone can see that failure a mile away. Everyone but the School Board - though even some of them see it but are too afraid to stop the idea in its tracks.

The academy has been referred to as both a "public policy" and a "social justice" academy. Note that the money (at this point over $500K, it appears) being spent to explore this idea could have been spent on additional English and math teachers at Lewis. It's a vanity project for Karen Keys Gamarra.

If it's a public policy academy, curious to know what courses it would offer that aren't offered at nearby schools. All schools used to teach "civics" and, while that term now sounds dated, schools still offer a range of social science electives. Parents at schools near Lewis should make sure FCPS isn't planning to strip your schools of electives such as "African American History" and "Debate" and force them to travel to Lewis instead.

If it's a social justice academy, and plans to offer new courses on topics like "Queer Justice," "Environmental Equity," or "Effective Social Media Campaign Strategies," there will be challenges developing a customized curriculum. Also, if the VDOE would have to agree that the courses counts towards graduation credits, there may be another battle between county and state officials.

If they got buy in from fairfax county police department, they could build an actually academy into the curriculum that graduated students ready to enter the police force.

Since KKG's main initiative other than the Lewis academy and school name changes seems to be eliminating SROs, that one may not happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The academy has been referred to as both a "public policy" and a "social justice" academy. Note that the money (at this point over $500K, it appears) being spent to explore this idea could have been spent on additional English and math teachers at Lewis. It's a vanity project for Karen Keys Gamarra.

If it's a public policy academy, curious to know what courses it would offer that aren't offered at nearby schools. All schools used to teach "civics" and, while that term now sounds dated, schools still offer a range of social science electives. Parents at schools near Lewis should make sure FCPS isn't planning to strip your schools of electives such as "African American History" and "Debate" and force them to travel to Lewis instead.

If it's a social justice academy, and plans to offer new courses on topics like "Queer Justice," "Environmental Equity," or "Effective Social Media Campaign Strategies," there will be challenges developing a customized curriculum. Also, if the VDOE would have to agree that the courses counts towards graduation credits, there may be another battle between county and state officials.

clown world

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This does seen like a good boundary solution. We are zoned for FCHS and loved it - and it is going to be beautiful once the renovation is complete. The McLean schools are so overcrowded for years, with no renovation in sight, that I am surprised it has not had an effect on the real estate market there.

It's the location for commutes. Lots depends on where each of a couple works. If you have to get out of a current rental or whatever the reason... Some worse SFH houses for Chesterbrooke went under contract much quicker than stuff for KG. Similar price points.

Good point on the commutes. And on the ES - I wonder if people care more about overcrowding at ES or HS? I suppose people buying houses with young kids are focused on the ES and, as you say, assume (maybe incorrectly) that FCPS will finally give MHS the expansion it needs.

ES is 7 years and most are in the same room with a teacher for most of the 7. HS is 4 and each subject is in a different classroom. Worse is the fact that KG has been a problem from the days of 2nd class students-citizens whatever for non immersion.

As for IB that thing should be at max 3 high schools- west, middle, east FX. VDOE has the senior IB candidate pools and the number that got the diploma per school:
2020-21 IB diplomas
Lewis 4 SR pool 4
Mount 12 SR pool 19
Annandale 29 SR pool 31
Justice 42 SR pool 68
Edison 43 SR pool 52
South Lakes55 SR pool 61
Marshall 95 SR pool 98
Robinson 124 SR pool 138
404 471

Just too weird that FCPS has IB at MV which is the site for on base housing for Fort Belvoir, US Army.


Really interesting stats! Thank you!

How can the school board justify the expense and inflexibility of IB at that cluster of high schools that are only graduating a handful of aiB diplomas, particularly Lewis with only 4 students.

No wonder the Lewis parents are complaining that their kids cannot access advanced classes. With only 4 IB students, there is zero flexibility for those kids.

This is NOT a WSHS issue. This is an issue of the school board designating Lewis as an IB school.

Lewis parents, you need to fight to get your school switched from IB to AP, not rezoning.

Eliminating IB and switcing to AP will open many more advanced classes for your students, particularly those who are strong in math and science but cannot handle the writing components of IB.

It will also eliminate the IB/AP loophole where advanced students with engaged parents pupil place out of Lewis for AP.

Finally, switching to an AP school and eliminating IB will make Lewis less unappealing to military and academically focused families. IB is just not practical for those families.


Most Lewis pyramid parents who care about their kids' education hope and pray Lewis *never* gets anymore AP classes and keeps IB forever so that they have a loophole to get their kids out of having to go to Lewis HS.