Man dies after unprovoked attack by teens at Frederick fair

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So basically DCUMers want to bring back segregation and/or lock up every black person between the ages of 6 and 60. That seems to be the underlying sentiment I’m sensing from posters.

Citation please, drama llama.

Please show us excerpts that support your assertion.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Frederick News Post also stopped giving an eff, and named the dad. But I cannot find the kids' names. I work in FCPS (MD) and am annoyed I cannot figure it out lol, but I refuse to ask any of my students.

You'll find out from a teacher, staff member or parent. Give it time.

Those little rascals won't be incognito for long.

What’s the plan when we find out their names?

I guess the teachers at that school will start to wear head and chest protection in anticipation of their return.

Oh, well that’s possible. I just thought from the tone of previous posters that there was a DCUM Justice League being organized and planning to do something upon learning the assailants identities.

No. People are just horrified by this whole situation. Would you want those kiddos going to your kids' school and living in your apartment building?

How do the members of that community protect themselves? Serious question. I don't live there but I would probably pick now to move if I did.

It’s two teenagers who made a very bad decision. They’ve killed a man and ruined their lives. I don’t think the community is in danger.

They committed a very violent crime. Of course, the community is in danger. Damn. Some of you will excuse anything.

“They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.” Right?

You can try to twist into whatever narrative is going on in your head. I was talking about these two, specific "kids" who killed a man for no reason. I hope you never lose a family member to such senseless crime.

Why did you place quotation marks around kids?

Because I saw the video and one of them at least is probably 6 feet tall and strong enough to kill a man with one punch.

Goodness gracious. A relatively tall, black teenager!

IMHO, this kind of assessment is exactly why the police kill us so quickly.

But thank you for being honest.

Oh, goodness and I only came to this conclusion after seeing him kill a man. Imagine that. Imagine the horror of me concluding that a person is dangerous based on the fact that he killed someone. How dare I???

Your false narrative is not going to serve you well in life. We can talk about police brutality against black men if that is what you like. I happen to believe that it's real. We can talk about systemic racism which I also happen to believe is real. None of those are relevant to this discussion, however.

These two killed a man who was enjoying his day at the fair. What is your defense for them?

I hear you and I'm with you. I, too, find the behavior of these kids abhorrent. There is no defense for what they did to Mr. Weed and his family. None. I'm sorry if you interpreted that from my post.

Also, I appreciate your understanding the pain and fear that's deeply rooted in the black community around law enforcement and the pernicious impact of systemic racism.

Through personal experience and observations, I do believe there are risky, and sometimes fatal, connections between one's fear and another person's perceived strength/size (particularly if they're black, or of color). After reading your response, I realize I was probably wrong in assuming that you saw the roughly 10 second video of this tragedy and made a similar assessment that I think some police officers have made - and people died/die. That's my concern. But again, I agree with you, this is not directly relevant to this discussion.

DP You sound like a very rational and reasonable person.....a rarity for this board so kudos to you. Given that, I’d like to get your thoughts on the very charged and sensitive issue of the high rate of violence amongst black males. DOJ statistics report that black males are 6% of the population and account for over 50% of violent crimes. Black teens are arrested for murder and manslaughter at a rate that is ten times that of white teens. Of course institutional racism and poverty account for some of this but what else is driving this highly disproportionate rate of violent crime? And why aren’t leaders in the black community addressing this issue in a serious manner? The vast majority of the victims of these crimes are other black men so why isn’t this issue a priority? It seems to be reaching crisis levels, especially in cities like Chicago and Baltimore. and I just want to understand why so little effort and attention are given to possible solutions. Thanks in advance.

I'm PP. It sounds like you've given this a lot of thought. You've raised some very important questions, not just to the black community, but for all of society. I'm afraid there are no easy answers.

I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So basically DCUMers want to bring back segregation and/or lock up every black person between the ages of 6 and 60. That seems to be the underlying sentiment I’m sensing from posters.

Citation please, drama llama.

Please show us excerpts that support your assertion.

Hmmm, you must not be very familiar with underlying sentiments if you’re asking for citations so let’s start with some basics...

When you perform sentiment analysis on content, you're basically looking for the opinions in content and picking the sentiment within those opinions.
Sentiment is influenced by emotion, a subjective feeling or thought. The strength of a sentiment is usually linked to the intensity of emotions felt by the opinion holder.

Now generally we describe something as “underlying” when it is below the surface of something else, i.e. an underlying sentiment. So when trying to identify underlying sentiments, which are not overt or explicit but instead something concealed but detectable, the key to discernment is not looking for a specific citation but rather the simple task of asking the question: “What are the underlying opinions behind that specific content?”

If you go back thru many of the posts in the 20+ pages of this thread and ask that question you should be able to discern the .underlying sentiments. It is not the two teenage siblings who senselessly murdered that poor man who posters are taking issue with. It is ALL blacks who posters are taking issue with.

[Anonymous]

It would be awesome if people would learn to quote snippets instead of reposting an entire thread of replies in 1.5 point type.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

PP from previous page who wrote about high unwed mother rate, and I also mentioned education.

Let's take Baltimore since you mentioned it. Baltimore City schools have the 3rd highest spending per student in the entire country:
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-spending.html

"Of the 100 largest school systems based on enrollment in the United States, the five school systems with the highest spending per pupil in 2017 were New York City School District in New York ($25,199), Boston City Schools in Massachusetts ($22,292), Baltimore City Schools in Maryland ($16,184)"

I guess we already are throwing enough money at the problem, so is is just being poorly spent or mismanaged?

My theory is it's home life. You can provide the best school environment for a child, but if their home life isn't supportive, it's going to very difficult to succeed anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So basically DCUMers want to bring back segregation and/or lock up every black person between the ages of 6 and 60. That seems to be the underlying sentiment I’m sensing from posters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So basically DCUMers want to bring back segregation and/or lock up every black person between the ages of 6 and 60. That seems to be the underlying sentiment I’m sensing from posters.

Citation please, drama llama.

Please show us excerpts that support your assertion.

Hmmm, you must not be very familiar with underlying sentiments if you’re asking for citations so let’s start with some basics...

When you perform sentiment analysis on content, you're basically looking for the opinions in content and picking the sentiment within those opinions.
Sentiment is influenced by emotion, a subjective feeling or thought. The strength of a sentiment is usually linked to the intensity of emotions felt by the opinion holder.

Now generally we describe something as “underlying” when it is below the surface of something else, i.e. an underlying sentiment. So when trying to identify underlying sentiments, which are not overt or explicit but instead something concealed but detectable, the key to discernment is not looking for a specific citation but rather the simple task of asking the question: “What are the underlying opinions behind that specific content?”

If you go back thru many of the posts in the 20+ pages of this thread and ask that question you should be able to discern the .underlying sentiments. It is not the two teenage siblings who senselessly murdered that poor man who posters are taking issue with. It is ALL blacks who posters are taking issue with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

PP from previous page who wrote about high unwed mother rate, and I also mentioned education.

Let's take Baltimore since you mentioned it. Baltimore City schools have the 3rd highest spending per student in the entire country:
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-spending.html

"Of the 100 largest school systems based on enrollment in the United States, the five school systems with the highest spending per pupil in 2017 were New York City School District in New York ($25,199), Boston City Schools in Massachusetts ($22,292), Baltimore City Schools in Maryland ($16,184)"

I guess we already are throwing enough money at the problem, so is is just being poorly spent or mismanaged?

My theory is it's home life. You can provide the best school environment for a child, but if their home life isn't supportive, it's going to very difficult to succeed anyway.

I think the PP point about quality education is still valid. The problem with school districts like Baltimore with very high spending and very poor outcomes is that the unions drive up labor prices and refuse to allow any meaningful assessment of job performance to be used in teacher evaluations, compensation or career progression decisions. Any child could get a high quality education for law less than 25k at a decent parochial school. But yes, a stable and supportive home life has to be the other bookend to a positive childhood....not sure there is a systemic way to address that issue though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

PP from previous page who wrote about high unwed mother rate, and I also mentioned education.

Let's take Baltimore since you mentioned it. Baltimore City schools have the 3rd highest spending per student in the entire country:
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-spending.html

"Of the 100 largest school systems based on enrollment in the United States, the five school systems with the highest spending per pupil in 2017 were New York City School District in New York ($25,199), Boston City Schools in Massachusetts ($22,292), Baltimore City Schools in Maryland ($16,184)"

I guess we already are throwing enough money at the problem, so is is just being poorly spent or mismanaged?

My theory is it's home life. You can provide the best school environment for a child, but if their home life isn't supportive, it's going to very difficult to succeed anyway.

I think the PP point about quality education is still valid. The problem with school districts like Baltimore with very high spending and very poor outcomes is that the unions drive up labor prices and refuse to allow any meaningful assessment of job performance to be used in teacher evaluations, compensation or career progression decisions. Any child could get a high quality education for law less than 25k at a decent parochial school. But yes, a stable and supportive home life has to be the other bookend to a positive childhood....not sure there is a systemic way to address that issue though.

There's no correlation to school spending or strength of teachers unions. Surprisingly, schools don't matter that much past a low threshold. One meta-analysts concluded that at most, 10% of school achievement can be tracked back to differences in schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

PP from previous page who wrote about high unwed mother rate, and I also mentioned education.

Let's take Baltimore since you mentioned it. Baltimore City schools have the 3rd highest spending per student in the entire country:
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-spending.html

"Of the 100 largest school systems based on enrollment in the United States, the five school systems with the highest spending per pupil in 2017 were New York City School District in New York ($25,199), Boston City Schools in Massachusetts ($22,292), Baltimore City Schools in Maryland ($16,184)"

I guess we already are throwing enough money at the problem, so is is just being poorly spent or mismanaged?

My theory is it's home life. You can provide the best school environment for a child, but if their home life isn't supportive, it's going to very difficult to succeed anyway.

To your point about home life, I don't think PP disagrees. However, he does say without adequate education the chances of forming that supportive and nurturing home life aren't too great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

She sounds like a horrible human being who should be charged with something, and who never deserves another happy day in her life. But- she didn't murder the guy. The teenage boy did. In the eyes of the law, the two crimes are not the same.

She will have children some day. Do you believe she won't produce more of this kind of human beings that run around punching people and admire gang/crime life style?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I think the PP point about quality education is still valid. The problem with school districts like Baltimore with very high spending and very poor outcomes is that the unions drive up labor prices and refuse to allow any meaningful assessment of job performance to be used in teacher evaluations, compensation or career progression decisions. Any child could get a high quality education for law less than 25k at a decent parochial school. But yes, a stable and supportive home life has to be the other bookend to a positive childhood....not sure there is a systemic way to address that issue though.

But aren't all large school districts unionized? I know they are around these parts. So plenty of school districts (actually, all of them) spend less per-pupil than Baltimore City, also have unions, and yet have better educational outcomes. Why is Baltimore City doing such a bad job then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I think the PP point about quality education is still valid. The problem with school districts like Baltimore with very high spending and very poor outcomes is that the unions drive up labor prices and refuse to allow any meaningful assessment of job performance to be used in teacher evaluations, compensation or career progression decisions. Any child could get a high quality education for law less than 25k at a decent parochial school. But yes, a stable and supportive home life has to be the other bookend to a positive childhood....not sure there is a systemic way to address that issue though.

But aren't all large school districts unionized? I know they are around these parts. So plenty of school districts (actually, all of them) spend less per-pupil than Baltimore City, also have unions, and yet have better educational outcomes. Why is Baltimore City doing such a bad job then?

The amount of spending per pupil doesn't mean very much if the root causes are not addressed in the funding formula - which, I believe, includes intensifying family outreach and other pretty intrusive intervention measures.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'll admit that I did not check your data/stats, but I follow these issues closely because I am a black man. So these issues are personal for me, I live it; it's less about research. And I agree with you, black on black crime has long been a silent and deadly war in my community. Racism and poverty, as you pointed out, are two primary causes of this problem - but I believe the this greatest hazard to my community is the lack of quality education. I love black people for a lot of reasons, but I am especially proud of how we have stood up and risen above the a lot of the crippling racism and poverty you mention. But the lack of education is doing a serious number on our communities. It's a silent killer. Access to quality education is not free. Schools are not equal. We all know this. And because of the sometimes subtle and indirect ways in which this lack of education plays out - I worry that we (society) don't often think about the education systems that were supposed to help prepare people to be productive citizens, gainfully employed, and most of all, good parents. So, if you are sincerely interested, I invite you to dig a little deeper in your research and take a look at the education systems where the crime rates are highest - places like Chicago and Baltimore. It's a hypothesis, but I believe it's worth some thought.

PP from previous page who wrote about high unwed mother rate, and I also mentioned education.

Let's take Baltimore since you mentioned it. Baltimore City schools have the 3rd highest spending per student in the entire country:
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-spending.html

"Of the 100 largest school systems based on enrollment in the United States, the five school systems with the highest spending per pupil in 2017 were New York City School District in New York ($25,199), Boston City Schools in Massachusetts ($22,292), Baltimore City Schools in Maryland ($16,184)"

I guess we already are throwing enough money at the problem, so is is just being poorly spent or mismanaged?

My theory is it's home life. You can provide the best school environment for a child, but if their home life isn't supportive, it's going to very difficult to succeed anyway.

I live in Baltimore. If you want to change things you need to follow the example of the Harrisburg pa school district. The corruption was Shute the spending per pupil on par with the lack of progress of Baltimore students so the school system was taken over and the dirtylaundry was aired. There are plenty of stories on the progress in Harrisburg so please familiarize yourselves with them. It was the strength that of the mostly single parent black households who fought to get control of their schools back from the status quo. It is not about home life as much as it is about a corrupt education system.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Frederick News Post also stopped giving an eff, and named the dad. But I cannot find the kids' names. I work in FCPS (MD) and am annoyed I cannot figure it out lol, but I refuse to ask any of my students.

You'll find out from a teacher, staff member or parent. Give it time.

Those little rascals won't be incognito for long.

What’s the plan when we find out their names?

I guess the teachers at that school will start to wear head and chest protection in anticipation of their return.

Oh, well that’s possible. I just thought from the tone of previous posters that there was a DCUM Justice League being organized and planning to do something upon learning the assailants identities.

No. People are just horrified by this whole situation. Would you want those kiddos going to your kids' school and living in your apartment building?

How do the members of that community protect themselves? Serious question. I don't live there but I would probably pick now to move if I did.

It’s two teenagers who made a very bad decision. They’ve killed a man and ruined their lives. I don’t think the community is in danger.

They committed a very violent crime. Of course, the community is in danger. Damn. Some of you will excuse anything.

“They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.” Right?

You can try to twist into whatever narrative is going on in your head. I was talking about these two, specific "kids" who killed a man for no reason. I hope you never lose a family member to such senseless crime.

Why did you place quotation marks around kids?

Because I saw the video and one of them at least is probably 6 feet tall and strong enough to kill a man with one punch.

Goodness gracious. A relatively tall, black teenager!

IMHO, this kind of assessment is exactly why the police kill us so quickly.

But thank you for being honest.

Oh, goodness and I only came to this conclusion after seeing him kill a man. Imagine that. Imagine the horror of me concluding that a person is dangerous based on the fact that he killed someone. How dare I???

Your false narrative is not going to serve you well in life. We can talk about police brutality against black men if that is what you like. I happen to believe that it's real. We can talk about systemic racism which I also happen to believe is real. None of those are relevant to this discussion, however.

These two killed a man who was enjoying his day at the fair. What is your defense for them?

I hear you and I'm with you. I, too, find the behavior of these kids abhorrent. There is no defense for what they did to Mr. Weed and his family. None. I'm sorry if you interpreted that from my post.

Also, I appreciate your understanding the pain and fear that's deeply rooted in the black community around law enforcement and the pernicious impact of systemic racism.

Through personal experience and observations, I do believe there are risky, and sometimes fatal, connections between one's fear and another person's perceived strength/size (particularly if they're black, or of color). After reading your response, I realize I was probably wrong in assuming that you saw the roughly 10 second video of this tragedy and made a similar assessment that I think some police officers have made - and people died/die. That's my concern. But again, I agree with you, this is not directly relevant to this discussion.

DP You sound like a very rational and reasonable person.....a rarity for this board so kudos to you. Given that, I’d like to get your thoughts on the very charged and sensitive issue of the high rate of violence amongst black males. DOJ statistics report that black males are 6% of the population and account for over 50% of violent crimes. Black teens are arrested for murder and manslaughter at a rate that is ten times that of white teens. Of course institutional racism and poverty account for some of this but what else is driving this highly disproportionate rate of violent crime? And why aren’t leaders in the black community addressing this issue in a serious manner? The vast majority of the victims of these crimes are other black men so why isn’t this issue a priority? It seems to be reaching crisis levels, especially in cities like Chicago and Baltimore. and I just want to understand why so little effort and attention are given to possible solutions. Thanks in advance.

WTF?!!!!
I’m not the poster you were addressing I’m a different poster. WTF! Why do you ignorant people always tot out these ridiculous tired statistics and Chicago and Baltimore neither of which have the highest rate of homicide in this nation. why are their articles about violence in Chicago and you m********* Still claim that nobody knows about it is talking about her doing anything about it the people in Chicago are very well-versed with the violence there and are trying things to address it. And who do you think is the one leader who is leading millions of different black people who live in different communities don’t always speak the same language have the same background political affiliation, religion!!
But because there’s violence in Chicago or Baltimore doesn’t mean the black folks are somehow prone to criminality.
People like you are sick.