Magnet application result High School

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the discussion is about Blair SMAC.

The list I saw from TPMS (compiled by the kids) seemed to have very few white kids.

It’s pretty shameful to come in here and try to undermine the very real accomplishments of these kids just to make yourself feel better. I think the kids know better than that. Mine certainly does.

you are such a great parent with a great kid. not talking down to people. congrats.

That doesn't mean there is not an unfair system. agree there is no perfect system. there was a reason there was a test and teacher recs before - to not just rely on MAP - which is gameable through AOPS, etc, and grades. I hear the test is back next year which may make it fairer.

The old test was gameable. My kid noted that many kids (at TPMS magnet back in the day) had A++ binders and were in test prep classes designed for the magnet admissions test. Other kids went to Dr. Li. It kind of freaked mine out because we are downcounty where the prep culture is not as strong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have no skin in the game as my child is in but I would not brag about the "very real accomplishments" of kids who got in versus the ones who did not.

I really think it's very arbitrary once you get past the very top kids. It's more about luck. Your child got lucky. Mine got. Theirs did not. Don't devalue their achievements because some parents are confused and upset about what happened. It could very well have been you who is in that position.

Isn’t this the “splitting hairs” that AEI says they’re trying to eliminate by using a lottery? Maybe they should do a lottery here too. Then it won’t bring out the nasty.

They created the problem by not using the Cogat. Once you use the Cogat you have more data to start differentiating. You can also look at a broader range of grades rather than just focusing on math or science or English. That's more holistic and fair IMO. A lottery is much worse because it does not capture the outliers.

True.

Yep. We are homeschoolers, and the list of accepted tests was mind- boggling and expensive and not easily accessible. We went with our cheapest option, but maybe that was a bad decision on my part. I even tried to email and ask a specific clarifying question, and the person who replied had no clue. Their bizarre list of acceptable options included IQ, aptitude, and achievement tests, which indicates that the person making the list didn’t understand that they were creating an apples to oranges situation. The tests measure different parameters. Maybe my kid would have had a better shot with a MAP a score.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

You are making the assumption that the asian kid is not into art, poetry or drama...that's the essential problem here. putting people in boxes...

Nope. I noted that the program is majority Asian, actually. This is based on the complaints here that parents make, then they only focus on scores. Also, based on years of experience in the magnets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the discussion is about Blair SMAC.

The list I saw from TPMS (compiled by the kids) seemed to have very few white kids.

It’s pretty shameful to come in here and try to undermine the very real accomplishments of these kids just to make yourself feel better. I think the kids know better than that. Mine certainly does.

you are such a great parent with a great kid. not talking down to people. congrats.

That doesn't mean there is not an unfair system. agree there is no perfect system. there was a reason there was a test and teacher recs before - to not just rely on MAP - which is gameable through AOPS, etc, and grades. I hear the test is back next year which may make it fairer.

The old test was gameable. My kid noted that many kids (at TPMS magnet back in the day) had A++ binders and were in test prep classes designed for the magnet admissions test. Other kids went to Dr. Li. It kind of freaked mine out because we are downcounty where the prep culture is not as strong.

a good test + recs + map + grades is better than what we have now. will actually get a diverse group in just because of the process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

Very interesting! This makes sense. For months I thought my child was at a disadvantage because they aren’t in math team or robotics but maybe the selection committee saw a kid with a strong interest in STEM but some diverse interests, particularly in the arts. What I thought was a weakness might have been a strength.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

You are making the assumption that the asian kid is not into art, poetry or drama...that's the essential problem here. putting people in boxes...

Nope. I noted that the program is majority Asian, actually. This is based on the complaints here that parents make, then they only focus on scores. Also, based on years of experience in the magnets.

years of experience doesn't cure prejudice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the discussion is about Blair SMAC.

The list I saw from TPMS (compiled by the kids) seemed to have very few white kids.

It’s pretty shameful to come in here and try to undermine the very real accomplishments of these kids just to make yourself feel better. I think the kids know better than that. Mine certainly does.

you are such a great parent with a great kid. not talking down to people. congrats.

That doesn't mean there is not an unfair system. agree there is no perfect system. there was a reason there was a test and teacher recs before - to not just rely on MAP - which is gameable through AOPS, etc, and grades. I hear the test is back next year which may make it fairer.

The old test was gameable. My kid noted that many kids (at TPMS magnet back in the day) had A++ binders and were in test prep classes designed for the magnet admissions test. Other kids went to Dr. Li. It kind of freaked mine out because we are downcounty where the prep culture is not as strong.

a good test + recs + map + grades is better than what we have now. will actually get a diverse group in just because of the process.

Better for whom? Your rejected self-proclaimed genius?
And no, adding another gameable test will not ensure a 'diverse group', it will only bring about another batch of prepped tortured children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

You are making the assumption that the asian kid is not into art, poetry or drama...that's the essential problem here. putting people in boxes...

Nope. I noted that the program is majority Asian, actually. This is based on the complaints here that parents make, then they only focus on scores. Also, based on years of experience in the magnets.

years of experience doesn't cure prejudice

Stop with the dog whistle. These are race blind, and I am trying to help parents who seem to think that their is a certain recipe for admission. Observations are not prejudice. Your petty remark may feed your distorted narrative, but it helps no one.
The prejudice is from the parents who insist their metrics are the most important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the discussion is about Blair SMAC.

The list I saw from TPMS (compiled by the kids) seemed to have very few white kids.

It’s pretty shameful to come in here and try to undermine the very real accomplishments of these kids just to make yourself feel better. I think the kids know better than that. Mine certainly does.

you are such a great parent with a great kid. not talking down to people. congrats.

That doesn't mean there is not an unfair system. agree there is no perfect system. there was a reason there was a test and teacher recs before - to not just rely on MAP - which is gameable through AOPS, etc, and grades. I hear the test is back next year which may make it fairer.

The old test was gameable. My kid noted that many kids (at TPMS magnet back in the day) had A++ binders and were in test prep classes designed for the magnet admissions test. Other kids went to Dr. Li. It kind of freaked mine out because we are downcounty where the prep culture is not as strong.

a good test + recs + map + grades is better than what we have now. will actually get a diverse group in just because of the process.

Better for whom? Your rejected self-proclaimed genius?
And no, adding another gameable test will not ensure a 'diverse group', it will only bring about another batch of prepped tortured children.

prepped, tortured vs holistic, free...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

You are making the assumption that the asian kid is not into art, poetry or drama...that's the essential problem here. putting people in boxes...

Nope. I noted that the program is majority Asian, actually. This is based on the complaints here that parents make, then they only focus on scores. Also, based on years of experience in the magnets.

years of experience doesn't cure prejudice

Stop with the dog whistle. These are race blind, and I am trying to help parents who seem to think that their is a certain recipe for admission. Observations are not prejudice. Your petty remark may feed your distorted narrative, but it helps no one.
The prejudice is from the parents who insist their metrics are the most important.

it is ok. everyone can become a better person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

Not the point. Just comparing kids within TPMS. If a 290 Asian boy doesn't get in but a 260 white kid or a 250 girl gets in that means Asians are just being compared among themselves. Like they are not real individuals but just a homogenous group.

Not necessarily. Blair wants innovation, to think outside the box. That requires some diversity. If the kids in question are all in the same box of robotics, cs and strings, they may prefer a kid who has a slightly lower map who will bring art, environmental science, poetry and/or drama. It's likely more about scope than race. TPMS and Blair have always been heavily Asian and skewed male, btw. It would be good to have more diversity.

You are making the assumption that the asian kid is not into art, poetry or drama...that's the essential problem here. putting people in boxes...

Nope. I noted that the program is majority Asian, actually. This is based on the complaints here that parents make, then they only focus on scores. Also, based on years of experience in the magnets.

years of experience doesn't cure prejudice

Stop with the dog whistle. These are race blind, and I am trying to help parents who seem to think that their is a certain recipe for admission. Observations are not prejudice. Your petty remark may feed your distorted narrative, but it helps no one.
The prejudice is from the parents who insist their metrics are the most important.

This! +1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel really bad for my child, they are gutted. Not even waitlisted at their school of choice. Does anyone have any advice on the appeals process?

I am so sorry, PP. I am sure your child would have been an enthusiastic and successful student at those schools...it is just hard to get into and sometimes what the decision-makers are looking at is not anything we can control, and maybe they are prioritizing things in a way that's not ideal---or that they aren't looking at things they should.

Sadly for MCPS's gifted children, even those that get admitted (and I DON'T want to rain on other parents' parade tonight...just please go forward with open eyes...) will have numerous disadvantages in the magnet high schools due to things like distance....which creates a burdensome commute, and a disconnect with the school community (because it's far and they can't necessarily do after-school ECs or easily hang out with a classmate after school). Unlike some other schools (e.g those in the Bethesda area), the schools in which the magnets are located typically do not have large, active, well-funded PTSAs/boosters that can enable top-notch extracurriculars like drama, athletics, music, debate team etc. or even events that help develop school spirit. (this is not a knock on those school communities, and it's not due to income levels...our area just has a variety of communities with relatively new Americans who have never heard of the PTA concept in their country of origin so don't have any encouragement to join).

So please do emphasize the positives of his/her home school--community/nearby friends, perhaps more ECs, less time on the bus. And in the meantime, try to do what you can to advocate for gifted children within MCPS as well as your local high school. I don't know about the appeals process for this but MCPS is not responsive to parent concerns from what I've seen (lip service at best) so it stinks....but maybe you can figure out a way to change this status quo (MCCPTA has a gifted education subgroup). Oh, and please join your PTSA if you aren't already a member...even if you aren't planning to spend a lot of time on it (just being a member is a good step) [this plea is for all parents, not just PP]

Thank you for your kind response. I believe going to a magnet middle school actually hurt my child's chances for high school programs. It will indeed be good for them to be closer to home. All of that commuting for middle school, for what?

PP, I'm the person who wrote the above. Don't regret helping your child have the magnet middle school experience. It's awesome for them, and I am certain that the skills they gained there will put them in a great position to start high school anywhere. And will be useful skills beyond that.

It is a sacrifice, indeed, to do all that commuting, so now that you've BTDT, that's one of the bright sides of them not going to the hs magnet. You may need to spend time advocating for their needs to be addressed at your HS--improving HS options for gifted kids is not likely to happen overnight though or without a lot of community advocacy. (keep this link in mind, the MCCPTA Gifted Education committee--and no I am not on the committee but I appreciate their stuff... https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nau5KEDGiM2jKbheaVq0MivzS2M2lv9qZUDOTBytN1Q/preview )

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

NP. I don't think they are supposed to take school into account for HS but I'm not sure. I'm not surprised a lot of kids got in from TPMS. This is an unusual class because it may be one of two grades that got into the MS magnets through universal selection and not a lottery or application. You'd expect that process to concentrate a lot of the top students at TPMS. I think next year they may have kids coming from more middle schools.

PP one possibility is there were a lot of highly qualified kids around the same range in terms of scores and grades at TPMS applying and they tried to create a diverse class based on the essays. I don't mean diverse necessarily in terms of race but of background and interests and there may be a race or ethnic correlation.

The ironic part is that I'm old enough to remember when people on this very board insisted that universal screening and some regard for peer cohort was going to destroy the middle school magnets, and that the universally screened kids would have no chance of getting into one of the high school programs.

This year's eighth graders were part of that experiment, and at both Takoma Park and Eastern, they seem to have done very well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

NP. I don't think they are supposed to take school into account for HS but I'm not sure. I'm not surprised a lot of kids got in from TPMS. This is an unusual class because it may be one of two grades that got into the MS magnets through universal selection and not a lottery or application. You'd expect that process to concentrate a lot of the top students at TPMS. I think next year they may have kids coming from more middle schools.

PP one possibility is there were a lot of highly qualified kids around the same range in terms of scores and grades at TPMS applying and they tried to create a diverse class based on the essays. I don't mean diverse necessarily in terms of race but of background and interests and there may be a race or ethnic correlation.

The ironic part is that I'm old enough to remember when people on this very board insisted that universal screening and some regard for peer cohort was going to destroy the middle school magnets, and that the universally screened kids would have no chance of getting into one of the high school programs.

This year's eighth graders were part of that experiment, and at both Takoma Park and Eastern, they seem to have done very well.

this batch was the last one that got into through application/test

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you even talking about? My child has not shown me the list but mentioned a bunch of friends who got in over dinner. I know these kids and DC has said for 2.5 years they are all the top students with 300+ MAP scores.

The top mostly Asian 300+ students have got in. Agree. Seems though that the bar for Asian kids is 300+ while the bar for others is much lower.

And? It's a county-wide program so they need to take students from other middle schools, not just TPMS . And I bet you Asian kids from North Bethesda MS or Julius West MS have a much lower bar, too.

NP. I don't think they are supposed to take school into account for HS but I'm not sure. I'm not surprised a lot of kids got in from TPMS. This is an unusual class because it may be one of two grades that got into the MS magnets through universal selection and not a lottery or application. You'd expect that process to concentrate a lot of the top students at TPMS. I think next year they may have kids coming from more middle schools.

PP one possibility is there were a lot of highly qualified kids around the same range in terms of scores and grades at TPMS applying and they tried to create a diverse class based on the essays. I don't mean diverse necessarily in terms of race but of background and interests and there may be a race or ethnic correlation.

The ironic part is that I'm old enough to remember when people on this very board insisted that universal screening and some regard for peer cohort was going to destroy the middle school magnets, and that the universally screened kids would have no chance of getting into one of the high school programs.

This year's eighth graders were part of that experiment, and at both Takoma Park and Eastern, they seem to have done very well.

this batch was the last one that got into through application/test

Yes, but they also had universal screening and the peer cohort was considered. People lost their minds over those relatively subtle changes and filed a whole lawsuit over them. That lawsuit pushed MCPS to adopt the lottery.