Hill Middle Schools

[Anonymous]

The mayor does not have the power to tell Basis and Latin when to start, or what years can be entry years.

[Anonymous]

No, but the city council plus the mayor do, and don't bother. The DC law on LEA arrangements could be updated to prevent charter middle schools from starting in 5th grade, That won't happen. Not worth discussing.

[Anonymous]

I have news for you. No one in Ward 3 knows or cares when the charter middle schools start, because no one is considering sending their kids there anyhow. Ward 3 kids have a viable DCPS path to Deal or Hardy, which most parents consider far preferable to any charter school. Very very few Ward 3 kids leave ES after 4th grade. Stop blaming the Hill 5th grade problem on charter schools and hold DCPS accountable for failing to provide families with viable DCPS options for MS.

The charters are correct that they need the 5th grade year to catch many students up, after a lackluster DCPS ES education. This might not apply to kids coming from Brent/Maury/LT, but certainly applies to kids coming from elsewhere. Plus the 5th grade year is a true gift to Hill parents who strike out in the lottery because it gives them a year to work on Plan B.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No, but the city council plus the mayor do, and don't bother. The DC law on LEA arrangements could be updated to prevent charter middle schools from starting in 5th grade, That won't happen. Not worth discussing.

DCPS has the power to start THEIR middle schools in 5th since they are the system having problems retaining students. In fact, Stuart Hobson started in 5th until about 10 years ago.

[Anonymous]

A better way for DCPS to compete for middle school students would be to limit access to DCPS selective high schools exclusively to graduates of DCPS middle school programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, but the city council plus the mayor do, and don't bother. The DC law on LEA arrangements could be updated to prevent charter middle schools from starting in 5th grade, That won't happen. Not worth discussing.

DCPS has the power to start THEIR middle schools in 5th since they are the system having problems retaining students. In fact, Stuart Hobson started in 5th until about 10 years ago.

Why did they change it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A better way for DCPS to compete for middle school students would be to limit access to DCPS selective high schools exclusively to graduates of DCPS middle school programs.

Above is not the answer and will not move the needle. In fact, Walls is getting academically weaker and Banneker is mediocre at best. More people, especially the higher performing families, are getting out of DCPS completely and opting out of Walls both EOTP and WOTP.

The answer is to address the underlying problem of why the majority of DCPS middle and high schools are so awful and failing the kids and providing appropriate level academics for all kids instead of dumbing down the curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know a bunch of Hill families of students who went through Stuart Hobson, now in HS (mostly at Walls) or college, who seem to be doing just fine. Some of these SH grads attend elite SLACs, Amherst, Middlebury, Swarthmore. We also know Brent students who went through Jefferson Academy and Maury students who went through Eliot-Hine, now top students at Walls or Banneker. These families coped and supplemented uncomplainingly, living their values by sending their children to neighborhood middle schools to stay in the community they love. More power to them. We've known these sweet kids since they were tiny tots. Come on, middle school is a tough age no matter where kids land. Our family isn't OK with DCPS after ES so we choose a parochial MS, but I'm not going to slam fellow Hill parents for having made a different choice, coming here to accuse them of poor parenting.

lol. they only “lived their values” because their kids got into Walls …

Also, they "lived their values"...by having the money to pay for private as a backup in case Walls didn't work out.

I think it is great if people want to send their kids to SH, of Jefferson or any other school. What is just dumb is people who make that about some larger social point, instead of what it is: parents making the best decision for their kid in light of their individual circumstances. This is the same old DCUM two step:

Poster #1: I choose public schools because charter schools are evil and people who send their kids there are evil and intentionally destabilizing schools. Also, I am also morally superior.

Poster #2: I send my kid to [BASIS/Latin] because I want to guarantee them a quality HS education and I can't afford private schools. SH is not an option for me because it does not offer truly advanced classes and has no guaranteed HS feed.

Poster #1: SH is an excellent school. A great school. A fine school. As long as you supplement out of pocket to keep your kid on grade level. Never mind that though, because people like you who don't have money to supplement or to afford private HS are entitled and. In fact your unwillingness to put your kid's future at risk to improve schools for the greater good is responsible for the fact that SH and other schools aren't great. The only possible explanation for you wanting a guaranteed HS path is hatred of public schools. Why don't people less entitled than me understand how much damage they are doing by putting their kids first?

Poster #2: So with all your moral superiority and commitment to public schools, are you going to send your kid to Eastern if they aren't admitted to Walls?

Poster #1: H*LL NO! If we don't get into walls we'll pay for private or move to a new state. Now let me lecture you some more about how you are destabilizing public education.

[Scene]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have news for you. No one in Ward 3 knows or cares when the charter middle schools start, because no one is considering sending their kids there anyhow. Ward 3 kids have a viable DCPS path to Deal or Hardy, which most parents consider far preferable to any charter school. Very very few Ward 3 kids leave ES after 4th grade. Stop blaming the Hill 5th grade problem on charter schools and hold DCPS accountable for failing to provide families with viable DCPS options for MS.

The charters are correct that they need the 5th grade year to catch many students up, after a lackluster DCPS ES education. This might not apply to kids coming from Brent/Maury/LT, but certainly applies to kids coming from elsewhere. Plus the 5th grade year is a true gift to Hill parents who strike out in the lottery because it gives them a year to work on Plan B.

Ummmm, not to let "data" and "facts" get in the way, but you have no idea what you are talking about. Based on last released DC data, there are more kids IB for Wilson at BASIS than from Dunbar. There are more kids IB from Hardy and Deal catchments (combined) at BASIS than from SH. Deal and SH send almost the same number of kids to Latin (41 vs 42). Almost the same number of Wilson kids as Dunbar (49 vs 50).

You remind me of that amazing Stephen Colbert performance at the WH Correspondence Association where he explained "truthiness". You are uneducated. Go away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One big problem for the Hill middle schools is that 5th is the only significant entry year for Latin and Basis. You can always “try” Latin or Basis for a year or two and then switch back to your in-bound middle school. But you cannot do the reverse. This results in a lot of people with some inclination to attend the nearby school gradually deciding to at least participate in the 5th grade charter school lottery and then further deciding to try Latin/Basis for 5th grade. Repeat.

100%. The biggest change I’d like to see to DC schools is ending DCPS & charter ESes in the same year. The current model is absurd and terrible for DCPS, which should frankly be the priority.

That said, this is exactly us. Our IB is SH and we’re actually not sure if we’d prefer it or BASIS, but will send our kid to BASIS if we lottery in, because if she hates it, she could still not only go to SH but start on time.

Yes, and? It is called school choice, not design your own school. You have an option to match at BASIS or Latin in 5th. You also have an option to return to SH if you are unhappy. What is laughable is the ignorance of your unbridled privilege in having SH as a fall back and objecting to BASIS and Latin having the audacity to cater to all kids in DC, and not just those privileged enough to be IB for SH.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DCPS didn’t let it happen. Remember, the public schools and the charter schools are different systems over seen by the mayor.

They are both public schools though so it had to be approved by someone affiliated with DCPS, right?

This should be stickied on all school threads as a warning of the blind ignorance of so many DCUM posters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have news for you. No one in Ward 3 knows or cares when the charter middle schools start, because no one is considering sending their kids there anyhow. Ward 3 kids have a viable DCPS path to Deal or Hardy, which most parents consider far preferable to any charter school. Very very few Ward 3 kids leave ES after 4th grade. Stop blaming the Hill 5th grade problem on charter schools and hold DCPS accountable for failing to provide families with viable DCPS options for MS.

The charters are correct that they need the 5th grade year to catch many students up, after a lackluster DCPS ES education. This might not apply to kids coming from Brent/Maury/LT, but certainly applies to kids coming from elsewhere. Plus the 5th grade year is a true gift to Hill parents who strike out in the lottery because it gives them a year to work on Plan B.

Ummmm, not to let "data" and "facts" get in the way, but you have no idea what you are talking about. Based on last released DC data, there are more kids IB for Wilson at BASIS than from Dunbar. There are more kids IB from Hardy and Deal catchments (combined) at BASIS than from SH. Deal and SH send almost the same number of kids to Latin (41 vs 42). Almost the same number of Wilson kids as Dunbar (49 vs 50).

You remind me of that amazing Stephen Colbert performance at the WH Correspondence Association where he explained "truthiness". You are uneducated. Go away.

NP. There are a number of families in ward 3 also sending their kid to DCI for middle/high school over Deal/JR

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One big problem for the Hill middle schools is that 5th is the only significant entry year for Latin and Basis. You can always “try” Latin or Basis for a year or two and then switch back to your in-bound middle school. But you cannot do the reverse. This results in a lot of people with some inclination to attend the nearby school gradually deciding to at least participate in the 5th grade charter school lottery and then further deciding to try Latin/Basis for 5th grade. Repeat.

100%. The biggest change I’d like to see to DC schools is ending DCPS & charter ESes in the same year. The current model is absurd and terrible for DCPS, which should frankly be the priority.

That said, this is exactly us. Our IB is SH and we’re actually not sure if we’d prefer it or BASIS, but will send our kid to BASIS if we lottery in, because if she hates it, she could still not only go to SH but start on time.

Yes, and? It is called school choice, not design your own school. You have an option to match at BASIS or Latin in 5th. You also have an option to return to SH if you are unhappy. What is laughable is the ignorance of your unbridled privilege in having SH as a fall back and objecting to BASIS and Latin having the audacity to cater to all kids in DC, and not just those privileged enough to be IB for SH.

The point is that it's a bad design for school choice for what's best for DC overall. It creates an added incentive for kids to leave their IB schools that is bad for DC overall. My whole point is that I will take advantage of it and it is, in fact, good for me personally (i.e., despite what you say, it *does* cater for SH families with good lottery luck). But it is not good for DC. In any case, I don't fault BASIS or Latin at all for starting in 5th when it's an available option. I fault the city for setting it up that way. (And FWIW I would also be fine with all DCPS / DCPCS middle schools starting in 5th instead, I just think the two different entry years is a bad model. DC *has* moved towards standardizing entry and exit years at DCPSes, they should just do it for DCPCSes as well.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know a bunch of Hill families of students who went through Stuart Hobson, now in HS (mostly at Walls) or college, who seem to be doing just fine. Some of these SH grads attend elite SLACs, Amherst, Middlebury, Swarthmore. We also know Brent students who went through Jefferson Academy and Maury students who went through Eliot-Hine, now top students at Walls or Banneker. These families coped and supplemented uncomplainingly, living their values by sending their children to neighborhood middle schools to stay in the community they love. More power to them. We've known these sweet kids since they were tiny tots. Come on, middle school is a tough age no matter where kids land. Our family isn't OK with DCPS after ES so we choose a parochial MS, but I'm not going to slam fellow Hill parents for having made a different choice, coming here to accuse them of poor parenting.

lol. they only “lived their values” because their kids got into Walls …

Also, they "lived their values"...by having the money to pay for private as a backup in case Walls didn't work out.

I think it is great if people want to send their kids to SH, of Jefferson or any other school. What is just dumb is people who make that about some larger social point, instead of what it is: parents making the best decision for their kid in light of their individual circumstances. This is the same old DCUM two step:

Poster #1: I choose public schools because charter schools are evil and people who send their kids there are evil and intentionally destabilizing schools. Also, I am also morally superior.

Poster #2: I send my kid to [BASIS/Latin] because I want to guarantee them a quality HS education and I can't afford private schools. SH is not an option for me because it does not offer truly advanced classes and has no guaranteed HS feed.

Poster #1: SH is an excellent school. A great school. A fine school. As long as you supplement out of pocket to keep your kid on grade level. Never mind that though, because people like you who don't have money to supplement or to afford private HS are entitled and. In fact your unwillingness to put your kid's future at risk to improve schools for the greater good is responsible for the fact that SH and other schools aren't great. The only possible explanation for you wanting a guaranteed HS path is hatred of public schools. Why don't people less entitled than me understand how much damage they are doing by putting their kids first?

Poster #2: So with all your moral superiority and commitment to public schools, are you going to send your kid to Eastern if they aren't admitted to Walls?

Poster #1: H*LL NO! If we don't get into walls we'll pay for private or move to a new state. Now let me lecture you some more about how you are destabilizing public education.

[Scene]

This is exactly the case. And it also creates situations in real life where white Karen’s and Susan’s and Christine’s feel the need to lecture everyone (including brown/black families) on enrolling their kids in Stuart Hobson/Jefferson/Eliot Hine. There is no moral high ground for those who choose their local school. There isn’t.

You can do what you want with your kids but I am not putting my kids in schools where their academic needs aren’t met. And for the record, even though it’s been stated many times in this and other threads, high achieving brown kids are treated way worse than white kids. Every single parent I know of brown kids knows that charter schools who cater to those seeking excellence are the safest bet for non-white children. Regardless of what your local Karen/Jennnifer/Christine/Susan will say to you.

[Anonymous]

A point that isn’t being raised here really is that the assumption that enrolling your high SES white kids in your local dcps will raise the quality of that dcps. That’s false. Dcps doesn’t give a rats a$$ what white families think. The only thing those white families do is slightly raise the test scores because they can afford to pay for Mathnesium/kumon/tutors. This doesn’t help those who can’t afford those things. Go to the school where your kids will thrive, not a sinking ship.