Lia Thomas - Will this change college sports for women or a nothingburger?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that there are plenty of sports that women and men can both engage in equal competition. Swimming is a sport where the competition is time. Creating an “open” category would allow trans men and women to achieve accomplishments and be recognized for the unique people that they are. Women also have the right to compete and award recognition to those born female. We should not remove that right.

I agree but I’m struggling to think of any sport where men and women can compete as equals.

Equestrian. Pickleball. Agility for dogs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Republican senate candidates in pa are going to make hay with this.

Thanks.

I am a Democrat and don't think that this guy has a place in women's sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that there are plenty of sports that women and men can both engage in equal competition. Swimming is a sport where the competition is time. Creating an “open” category would allow trans men and women to achieve accomplishments and be recognized for the unique people that they are. Women also have the right to compete and award recognition to those born female. We should not remove that right.

I agree but I’m struggling to think of any sport where men and women can compete as equals.

Equestrian. Pickleball. Agility for dogs.

All sports should be required to be co-Ed. Place a equal number of players male female and T on all teams. Problem solved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is fair?

Apparently as long as Lia feels good about herself it’s totally fair. Forget about how her competitors feel. Completely irrelevant.

She's obviously not unintelligent if she attends Penn but it boggles the mind that she could feel any sense of satisfaction in winning these races......I'd be humiliated.

That’s what makes me feel that there is a strong mental illness component to this.

Really? What about all of Will's enablers, starting with his parents and then coaches and others who've allowed this? It is pure selfishness and greed.

Well society has told them that unless they support Lia 100% no matter what, they are not only transphobes, but terrible parents/coaches/support people. This is the problem.

Or - take that clip - add 3 more seconds in spacing over Thomas and you would tie the 15 year old who came in second in last months Juniors. Add another second if you want to beat the 16 year old who won. Now - do the race again and compare with actual college record time - you could go out and buy popcorn and return to your seat after the winner touched and still have time to get comfortable, say hi to your neighbors and then notice that Thomas is finishing. It is why competition is leveled.

She swims fast for her level. Not great, but pretty fast. Go swim PAC 12 or SEC or even BIG10. Here’s an easy question - whose pool record time did she beat?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is fair?

Apparently as long as Lia feels good about herself it’s totally fair. Forget about how her competitors feel. Completely irrelevant.

She's obviously not unintelligent if she attends Penn but it boggles the mind that she could feel any sense of satisfaction in winning these races......I'd be humiliated.

That’s what makes me feel that there is a strong mental illness component to this.

Really? What about all of Will's enablers, starting with his parents and then coaches and others who've allowed this? It is pure selfishness and greed.

Well society has told them that unless they support Lia 100% no matter what, they are not only transphobes, but terrible parents/coaches/support people. This is the problem.

Or - take that clip - add 3 more seconds in spacing over Thomas and you would tie the 15 year old who came in second in last months Juniors. Add another second if you want to beat the 16 year old who won. Now - do the race again and compare with actual college record time - you could go out and buy popcorn and return to your seat after the winner touched and still have time to get comfortable, say hi to your neighbors and then notice that Thomas is finishing. It is why competition is leveled.

She swims fast for her level. Not great, but pretty fast. Go swim PAC 12 or SEC or even BIG10. Here’s an easy question - whose pool record time did she beat?

The 200 free that Thomas swam a Zippys, likely without a full taper given the NCAA schedule would have won juniors by an entire second, which in the 200 is huge. She is #1 in the NCAA in the 200 free, ahead of former Olympian Tori Huske. You can't handwave this away. She is a top tier swimmer post-transition.

[Anonymous]

She gave an interview for this website that I found interesting:

https://swimswam.com/penns-lia-thomas-opens-up-on-journey-transition-to-womens-swimming/

Honestly she seems like a nice person who just wants to swim. She's not breaking any rules. It's frustrating she is caught in this maelstrom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is fair?

Apparently as long as Lia feels good about herself it’s totally fair. Forget about how her competitors feel. Completely irrelevant.

She's obviously not unintelligent if she attends Penn but it boggles the mind that she could feel any sense of satisfaction in winning these races......I'd be humiliated.

That’s what makes me feel that there is a strong mental illness component to this.

Really? What about all of Will's enablers, starting with his parents and then coaches and others who've allowed this? It is pure selfishness and greed.

Well society has told them that unless they support Lia 100% no matter what, they are not only transphobes, but terrible parents/coaches/support people. This is the problem.

Or - take that clip - add 3 more seconds in spacing over Thomas and you would tie the 15 year old who came in second in last months Juniors. Add another second if you want to beat the 16 year old who won. Now - do the race again and compare with actual college record time - you could go out and buy popcorn and return to your seat after the winner touched and still have time to get comfortable, say hi to your neighbors and then notice that Thomas is finishing. It is why competition is leveled.

She swims fast for her level. Not great, but pretty fast. Go swim PAC 12 or SEC or even BIG10. Here’s an easy question - whose pool record time did she beat?

So now she’s in the wrong level? So she gets to move up a level because she transitioned? That seems like it wouldn’t be fair either. You seem to be making the opposite case by bringing up levels.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is fair?

Apparently as long as Lia feels good about herself it’s totally fair. Forget about how her competitors feel. Completely irrelevant.

She's obviously not unintelligent if she attends Penn but it boggles the mind that she could feel any sense of satisfaction in winning these races......I'd be humiliated.

That’s what makes me feel that there is a strong mental illness component to this.

Really? What about all of Will's enablers, starting with his parents and then coaches and others who've allowed this? It is pure selfishness and greed.

Well society has told them that unless they support Lia 100% no matter what, they are not only transphobes, but terrible parents/coaches/support people. This is the problem.

Or - take that clip - add 3 more seconds in spacing over Thomas and you would tie the 15 year old who came in second in last months Juniors. Add another second if you want to beat the 16 year old who won. Now - do the race again and compare with actual college record time - you could go out and buy popcorn and return to your seat after the winner touched and still have time to get comfortable, say hi to your neighbors and then notice that Thomas is finishing. It is why competition is leveled.

She swims fast for her level. Not great, but pretty fast. Go swim PAC 12 or SEC or even BIG10. Here’s an easy question - whose pool record time did she beat?

So now she’s in the wrong level? So she gets to move up a level because she transitioned? That seems like it wouldn’t be fair either. You seem to be making the opposite case by bringing up levels.

That’s silly. You don’t get that there are levels of competition? Why are you on a sports thread then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that there are plenty of sports that women and men can both engage in equal competition. Swimming is a sport where the competition is time. Creating an “open” category would allow trans men and women to achieve accomplishments and be recognized for the unique people that they are. Women also have the right to compete and award recognition to those born female. We should not remove that right.

I agree but I’m struggling to think of any sport where men and women can compete as equals.

Equestrian. Pickleball. Agility for dogs.

All sports should be required to be co-Ed. Place a equal number of players male female and T on all teams. Problem solved.

Problem solved for team sports, maybe.

[Anonymous]

How does that solve a problem?!?! Do the trans men (now female) count as a female? So now you have 5 guys and 5 girls playing against 5 guys, 4 girls and 1 trans (post pubescent male), so really 6 guys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She gave an interview for this website that I found interesting:

https://swimswam.com/penns-lia-thomas-opens-up-on-journey-transition-to-womens-swimming/

Honestly she seems like a nice person who just wants to swim. She's not breaking any rules. It's frustrating she is caught in this maelstrom.

In a long article from a little while back, a trans woman described her experience as a runner, first as a man then as a woman. As soon as she transitioned, she stopped competing, because it wasn't fair or right. She continued running, but only for herself. And as the years and decades went by, she noticed her times slowing.

In this interview, Lia sounds like a self-absorbed person who doesn't think about what she's doing, only about herself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She gave an interview for this website that I found interesting:

https://swimswam.com/penns-lia-thomas-opens-up-on-journey-transition-to-womens-swimming

Honestly she seems like a nice person who just wants to swim. She's not breaking any rules. It's frustrating she is caught in this maelstrom.

This person is gaming what he knows to be an unfair system. GTFOH. The fact that autogynephiles used their male privilege to push through unfair rules at the NCAA doesn’t mean the situation isn’t horrifically wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is fair?

Apparently as long as Lia feels good about herself it’s totally fair. Forget about how her competitors feel. Completely irrelevant.

She's obviously not unintelligent if she attends Penn but it boggles the mind that she could feel any sense of satisfaction in winning these races......I'd be humiliated.

That’s what makes me feel that there is a strong mental illness component to this.

Really? What about all of Will's enablers, starting with his parents and then coaches and others who've allowed this? It is pure selfishness and greed.

Well society has told them that unless they support Lia 100% no matter what, they are not only transphobes, but terrible parents/coaches/support people. This is the problem.

Or - take that clip - add 3 more seconds in spacing over Thomas and you would tie the 15 year old who came in second in last months Juniors. Add another second if you want to beat the 16 year old who won. Now - do the race again and compare with actual college record time - you could go out and buy popcorn and return to your seat after the winner touched and still have time to get comfortable, say hi to your neighbors and then notice that Thomas is finishing. It is why competition is leveled.

She swims fast for her level. Not great, but pretty fast. Go swim PAC 12 or SEC or even BIG10. Here’s an easy question - whose pool record time did she beat?

The 200 free that Thomas swam a Zippys, likely without a full taper given the NCAA schedule would have won juniors by an entire second, which in the 200 is huge. She is #1 in the NCAA in the 200 free, ahead of former Olympian Tori Huske. You can't handwave this away. She is a top tier swimmer post-transition.

The winning time last year (March) for the NCAAs was more than a second faster.

[Anonymous]

It will be interesting across the board in swim this year where times come in. Do to covid there are way more 5th year senior swimmers than ever. Way, way more. A common thing for football due to redshirting but uncommon in swimming. (A pretty substantial number of 6th year football players this past year and next year)

It is likely to result in some significant improvements in times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s me! That poster!

I have no problem listening to other voices. This could have been an interesting conversation even 3 or 5 years ago (yes, there were trans girls competing against cos girls then) or even a few years from now (yes, there will be trans girls competing against cos girls a few years from now)

No conspiracy theorist but this is the outrage du hour! Find all your Facebook “friends” who used to be so concerned abou #SaveTheChildren. See what they are posting about now. There will most likely be an uptick in Trans men competing against women!

This is at least the third trans thread I’ve seen you posting in. Your writing style is distinctive. Irrational, disruptive, using all caps place of making sense. Throwing out all sorts of bait in the hopes of derailing discussion of the trans agenda.

You’ll deny it, but you’re definitely a trans woman. You’re very invested and threatened by the fact that screaming TERF at people isn’t working anymore. Your time’s up. You belong in an asylum.

Go girl! And I agree with everything you said about the trans.

+2 Keeping speaking truth and railing against the lunatics. In five years we will collectively look back and applaud the bravery of JK Rowling for holding her ground when she simply was stating the obvious.

And yet today they are threatening to rename Quidditch...