Just got yelled at for leaving my kid alone in in the car while I went to the pharmacy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, this thread.

I am curious what the security guard's behavior would have been if OP was a man.

I also used to read in the car at this age while my mom ran errands. She generally gave me a choice. She would not have left the car running so the choice would have been "stay in the uncomfortably hot car and read or come on the boring errand with AC." I usually chose car because I like being warm and love reading.

Some of you are overstating the risk of carjacking. Also isn't the security guard there to prevent carjacking?

I do this sometimes when I need to run in the house to grab something (we live in an apartment building). If I know it will only be a couple minutes, and I can look out the window to check on DC if I need to. DC knows how to get out of the car and come in the building on their own if they needed to.

It's actually good for kids to earn some independence and trust as they get older. It's good parenting to give them opportunities to be alone in public spaces in small doses. In a few years my kid will be in middle school and will be riding a public bus to school on their own. How will they reach the point where that is possible if they are never left alone in public for even a few minutes before the age of 10?

“She would not have left the car running…”

OP left the car running. OP created an unnecessary risk to her child and others.

OP is an idiot.

PP here. Agree I wouldn't leave the car running.

But if OP had turned the car off and cracked windows people would be yelling that she'd risked hot car death (by leaving a child old enough to get out if the car and come find her inside in a car with open windows for a few minutes).

If we had more sane attitudes about supervision of kids this age OP could have just cracked the windows and this would be socially confined. Heck, In a functional society OP should have been able to tell her son "if there's an emergency, talk to that security guard over there" and then let the guard know her son was in the car and the guard would be like "cool, thanks for letting me know."

But we live in a non functional society where leaving a 7 year old who can walk and talk and read and write alone for a few minutes is "child neglect." Meanwhile there are actual cases of child neglect that never get prosecuted because most neglect happens in private homes.

It's idiotic. Did you know in Denmark parents routinely leave babies in strollers outside store and restaurants so they can finish naps? Because they have a social agreement that children are a collective responsibility. They are happier and more well adjusted people than we are

We are not in Denmark. The couple from Denmark who did this in nyc got in big trouble.

Crimes against children are not wildly different between the US and Denmark and in both countries the offender is usually known to the victim

You comment has nothing to do with what I said. Please read carefully and slowly. Everything I said was factual. Here is the story:

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/danish-om-still-stung-by-97-arrest-for-leaving-baby-in-nyc/353952/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, this thread.

I am curious what the security guard's behavior would have been if OP was a man.

I also used to read in the car at this age while my mom ran errands. She generally gave me a choice. She would not have left the car running so the choice would have been "stay in the uncomfortably hot car and read or come on the boring errand with AC." I usually chose car because I like being warm and love reading.

Some of you are overstating the risk of carjacking. Also isn't the security guard there to prevent carjacking?

I do this sometimes when I need to run in the house to grab something (we live in an apartment building). If I know it will only be a couple minutes, and I can look out the window to check on DC if I need to. DC knows how to get out of the car and come in the building on their own if they needed to.

It's actually good for kids to earn some independence and trust as they get older. It's good parenting to give them opportunities to be alone in public spaces in small doses. In a few years my kid will be in middle school and will be riding a public bus to school on their own. How will they reach the point where that is possible if they are never left alone in public for even a few minutes before the age of 10?

So for all of you folks arguing that OP was fine, how many of you leave your 7 year old in a running car? Sadly I still have to run errands in person on occasion. I have never seen this but I see ton of kids in the store, I think most of you don’t actually live what you are saying.

The running car thing isn't all the time-- I have done that once or twice if it was really hot out but would otherwise not leave the car running. I'd lock it either way.

And yes-- as a parent if an elementary age kid I have left my kid in the car for a short errand many times. This is normal. There are situations where I wouldn't do it (bad or unfamiliar neighborhood, anyone sketchy-looking nearby, any chance I'd be detained longer than I think) but the situation OP describes is one where I definitely would do it. Safe neighborhood and picking up a prescription I know is ready? And also a situation where it would be easy to go check on my kid if I needed to (say it turned out the scrip wasn't quite ready-- I could just go back to the car until it was).

I really do not get what the big deal is. Some of you seem insanely stressed about carjacking even though this is really not a something that happens outside of cities and a handful of close in suburbs.

Why not leave the engine running every time?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

It’s not about your spine or your kid’s spine. It’s about what other people can do to 7 year olds.

If you want to talk about what people "can" do to other people then almost no one should be left in a car alone. I'm 5' tall and weigh 100 lbs. People can do all kinds of things to me if they want and yet I am alone in public all the time.

In MD the law says you can't leave a 7 yr old alone in a car but you can leave an 8 yr old alone in a car. Are 8 yr olds more impervious to what other people can do? Of course not.

This is about the maturity level of the child. Most states have determined a 7 yr old is mature enough to sit in a car alone. Because they are. Just because you can imagine all kinds of crazy things that could happen to that 7 yr old doesn't mean they have even a remote chance of them happening.

I’m sure some 15 yr olds would be very safe drivers. And some 19 year olds can drink safely. But we live in a society here, whether or not you agree with every rule.

Yes and in VA where OP lines and in 42 of 50 US states it is legal to leave a 7 year old alone in a car. Yet we have many posters in this thread arguing OP is a bad person for doing it.

What's next? Yelling at parents who let their kids get drivers licenses when they can legally do so? Getting mad at colleges that permit 21 year old students to drink at campus events with alcohol?

Which is it? You have to follow the law (in which case OP is fine and the security guard was out if line) or you have to use your own judgment (in which case you need to accept people may have different judgment than you)?

+1

Everyone here knows that, in reality, OP’s kid was fine. There was an extremely small risk of anything happening in that short amount of time.

Posters just want to play hall monitor and complain about her “breaking the law” - even though it’s not illegal in VA.

Argumentative twats.

[Anonymous]

People get even more insane when they see a dog sitting alone in a car. Even if you live in the safest neighborhood most people don’t want to come back to their car with a crowd of people staring into the windows at your kids or dog and the cops waiting for the parent to return to talk to them. If you think dragging your kid along on an errand is bad, this is much worse.

[Anonymous]

I recall a long ago preschool director warning all parents against EVER leaving a child in the car for ANY reason. This seemed common sense to me then just as it should be to you now.

Over 45 years ago, my alcoholic father left me alone in the car in a liquor store parking lot. Another drunk passed by, saw me and banged on the window repeatedly. It was absolutely terrifying and just one of many incidents that drove me into therapy to cope with traumatic experiences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

I’m convinced the mom who keeps sharing the story of bringing her tantruming toddler into a preschool pickup doesn’t actually have any kids 7 or older because she seems very out of touch with parenting kids this age.

Well aren’t you a fool then. You think parents all leave their kids in cars everywhere? Do you live anywhere near kids? My kids are 8, 10, and 14. The vast majority of parents take their kids with them and don’t leave them in running cars.

Running cars no. I agree that was not a great decision. But I have left my 7 year old in the car (locked and shut off) for something small like dropping off a UPS return that just needs a quick barcode scan. Or to walk to the entrance of a building to sign a kid out or camp. It’s totally legal and my kid is like safer or just as safe the car for a few minutes than walking through a parking lot.

[Anonymous]

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/14/us/ohio-mother-killed-carjacking.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let’s remember there’s not some magical thing that happens upon midnight on a child’s 8th birthday. They are not sprinkled with fairy dust and determined to be safe at that time.

I mean, the magical thing that happens is they can legally be left alone. It’s sort of like the magic about drinking when you turn 21.

Right. So some of us actually get be our kid's alcohol before they turn 21, even though it's illegal, specifically because we want to teach them about alcohol and how to create name it responsibly before they are 21 yr old college kids.

Like some of us want to be able to guide and prepare our kids for increasing levels of independence and responsibility. Leave them in a car alone for 3 minutes in a pharmacy parking lot with a security guard in a safe neighborhood while I run inside. Give a 17 yr old a half glass of wine with dinner on vacation so they can learn how alcohol impacts them in a safe environment. These laws don't help you actually raise kids. A drinking and of 21 is idiotic and we all know it-- kids legally can't drink until they've been adults for 3 years? What? A 7 year old can't wait in outside in a car fir a few minutes? These are nonsensical provisions for good patents because obviously part of parenting is slowly introducing your child to greater levels of independence and responsibility. You have to TEACH kids how to be in the world. They don't magically gain this knowledge on their birthday.

Mydh and my family is riddled with alcoholics so no I did not encourage them to 'belly up to the bar' there is need for alcohol. I've seen too many lives ruined. Same for pot and other drugs.

You can teach independence but not this way.

My parents were like this (zero tolerance on drugs and alcohol) because they had parents who were alcoholics and it didn't work-- both my brothers developed substance abuse issues and also just lied to my parents constantly because they knew they'd get in trouble if they revealed they'd been drinking or using drugs.

Meanwhile I know families who allowed older teems small points of alcohol at family functions starting around 15 or so, and had family discussions about alcohol use and talked through how to keep yourself from drinking too much and also how to decline drinking at all in situations like when you are driving or you just don't want to. The kids in these families became responsible adults with functional attitudes toward alcohol and other substances.

In general I think it's better to introduce kids to new responsibilities slowly over time instead of all at once.

Your examples are not my experience. My kids also have lifelong medical conditions and were told not to drink because it would interfere with their medication. There are many examples where parents 'introduce alcohol and drugs' to their kids and their kids become alcoholics and drug addicted people.

So to counteract your stories none of my siblings are alcoholics or drug addicted and yet we were NOT introduced to it early. I personally don't care what your family choses to do but please don't think that you're way is the only way. And you can think that my way is wrong too. I don't care. Alcohol is not needed and does so much damage. I pretty much never drink and I never miss it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

I’m convinced the mom who keeps sharing the story of bringing her tantruming toddler into a preschool pickup doesn’t actually have any kids 7 or older because she seems very out of touch with parenting kids this age.

Well aren’t you a fool then. You think parents all leave their kids in cars everywhere? Do you live anywhere near kids? My kids are 8, 10, and 14. The vast majority of parents take their kids with them and don’t leave them in running cars.

Running cars no. I agree that was not a great decision. But I have left my 7 year old in the car (locked and shut off) for something small like dropping off a UPS return that just needs a quick barcode scan. Or to walk to the entrance of a building to sign a kid out or camp. It’s totally legal and my kid is like safer or just as safe the car for a few minutes than walking through a parking lot.

And? I tried leaving my toddler in the car. Someone RATTED ME OUT. Then came the emails “as a reminder do NOT leave children unattended in the parking lot.” Which, hmm, I wondered who that was about? My toddler wanted to stay and play. Preschool is fun! But alas, not old enough, so she was sad when we had to leave. It was a good school, my son loved it, I wanted my daughter to go there the next year so in weighing all the risk/rewards it seemed much easier to just follow the rules than be the argumentative a-hole and be asked to leave the school because of leaving a toddler in the car which was probably not legal anyway. Convenient, yes, but not necessarily the right choice. Choices have consequences and leaving a kid in the car wasn’t worth it at the time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I recall a long ago preschool director warning all parents against EVER leaving a child in the car for ANY reason. This seemed common sense to me then just as it should be to you now.

Over 45 years ago, my alcoholic father left me alone in the car in a liquor store parking lot. Another drunk passed by, saw me and banged on the window repeatedly. It was absolutely terrifying and just one of many incidents that drove me into therapy to cope with traumatic experiences.

Completely agree with the preschool director that preschooler shouldn’t be left alone in the car. They can’t even unbuckle themselves in an emergency. A 7 year old, can leave the car.

[Anonymous]

OP, you can't really think that was ok to do. Definitely don't do it again.

[Anonymous]

You were in the wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I recall a long ago preschool director warning all parents against EVER leaving a child in the car for ANY reason. This seemed common sense to me then just as it should be to you now.

Over 45 years ago, my alcoholic father left me alone in the car in a liquor store parking lot. Another drunk passed by, saw me and banged on the window repeatedly. It was absolutely terrifying and just one of many incidents that drove me into therapy to cope with traumatic experiences.

Completely agree with the preschool director that preschooler shouldn’t be left alone in the car. They can’t even unbuckle themselves in an emergency. A 7 year old, can leave the car.

Np. Trying to imagine the emergency that could befall a preschooler strapped into a carseat 60 feet of asphalt away from me and in full view, the circumstance in which I frequently left my preschooler strapped in to pick up another kid. But I just as frequently didn’t because I was afraid of people like you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, this thread.

I am curious what the security guard's behavior would have been if OP was a man.

I also used to read in the car at this age while my mom ran errands. She generally gave me a choice. She would not have left the car running so the choice would have been "stay in the uncomfortably hot car and read or come on the boring errand with AC." I usually chose car because I like being warm and love reading.

Some of you are overstating the risk of carjacking. Also isn't the security guard there to prevent carjacking?

I do this sometimes when I need to run in the house to grab something (we live in an apartment building). If I know it will only be a couple minutes, and I can look out the window to check on DC if I need to. DC knows how to get out of the car and come in the building on their own if they needed to.

It's actually good for kids to earn some independence and trust as they get older. It's good parenting to give them opportunities to be alone in public spaces in small doses. In a few years my kid will be in middle school and will be riding a public bus to school on their own. How will they reach the point where that is possible if they are never left alone in public for even a few minutes before the age of 10?

So for all of you folks arguing that OP was fine, how many of you leave your 7 year old in a running car? Sadly I still have to run errands in person on occasion. I have never seen this but I see ton of kids in the store, I think most of you don’t actually live what you are saying.

The running car thing isn't all the time-- I have done that once or twice if it was really hot out but would otherwise not leave the car running. I'd lock it either way.

And yes-- as a parent if an elementary age kid I have left my kid in the car for a short errand many times. This is normal. There are situations where I wouldn't do it (bad or unfamiliar neighborhood, anyone sketchy-looking nearby, any chance I'd be detained longer than I think) but the situation OP describes is one where I definitely would do it. Safe neighborhood and picking up a prescription I know is ready? And also a situation where it would be easy to go check on my kid if I needed to (say it turned out the scrip wasn't quite ready-- I could just go back to the car until it was).

I really do not get what the big deal is. Some of you seem insanely stressed about carjacking even though this is really not a something that happens outside of cities and a handful of close in suburbs.

Why not leave the engine running every time?

DP, but presumably because it’s not adding value to the child’s comfort to leave the engine running every time. I would assume the default would be engine off, but if the situation seemed to warrant it maybe leave it on every once in awhile.

I truly hope you are not as dumb as you seem in this thread. Because… talk about someone who shouldn’t be a parent…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

I’m convinced the mom who keeps sharing the story of bringing her tantruming toddler into a preschool pickup doesn’t actually have any kids 7 or older because she seems very out of touch with parenting kids this age.

Well aren’t you a fool then. You think parents all leave their kids in cars everywhere? Do you live anywhere near kids? My kids are 8, 10, and 14. The vast majority of parents take their kids with them and don’t leave them in running cars.

Running cars no. I agree that was not a great decision. But I have left my 7 year old in the car (locked and shut off) for something small like dropping off a UPS return that just needs a quick barcode scan. Or to walk to the entrance of a building to sign a kid out or camp. It’s totally legal and my kid is like safer or just as safe the car for a few minutes than walking through a parking lot.

The OP is about a child left unattended in a vehicle with the engine running.

OP could not be bothered to just shut off the engine that is the problem.

No child is getting some sort of character building experience from that.