How often do you think applicants lie about their race?

[Anonymous]

I see AA as a way to give URMs a better chance to break the glass ceiling after graduation. Racism still exists in the corporate world (and beyond!): some employers assuming (stereotyping) White and Asians will be much better employees- higher chances for hiring and promotion. Black and Latinos: some employers might assume they are lazy, not as smart. URMs with degrees from more prestigious universities might have an even chance against a White/ Asian from a top 50 university.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First Gen And Low Income or simply Low Income is the only affirmative action that makes sense to me.

I hear you. One of my siblings has kids who will go to college when he and his spouse did not. This sibling makes a huge salary and has a ton of real estate. A cousin married a man who was born in Spain and they have an Hispanic sounding last name. They live in McLean, go to Langley, the man graduated from an ivy league and their two houses (inc. vacation) home are worth more than $3,000,000. Both families have given their kids every opportunity...and both get a leg up in college admissions.

[Anonymous]

If your child is 1/2 south asuan, and 1|2 white…..is it better to say white, Asian or mixed race for purposes of admissions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I see AA as a way to give URMs a better chance to break the glass ceiling after graduation. Racism still exists in the corporate world (and beyond!): some employers assuming (stereotyping) White and Asians will be much better employees- higher chances for hiring and promotion. Black and Latinos: some employers might assume they are lazy, not as smart. URMs with degrees from more prestigious universities might have an even chance against a White/ Asian from a top 50 university.

NP. I agree with the rest of your comment, but this is why I'm always wary of lumping white and Asian together. There's a lot of data out there on how Asians, especially East Asians, aren't promoted to leadership roles proportionate to their presence in the workforce. All sorts of stereotypes abound. There are other clear areas in my field (STEM academia) where discrimination towards Asians is still acceptable. The URM classification helps in targeting resources for the groups who need it the most, but the downside is that people now club the non-URM groups together even though the US doesn't see or treat whites and Asians as equal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A friend of my daughter's is claiming to be Hispanic on his application, which technically he can get away with because he is half Cuban, but he does not in any way at all look Hispanic, nor is he culturally Hispanic. It's a MASSIVE stretch.

My children are half-Latino. I a single Caucasian woman and used donor sperm to conceive and the donor is Latino. I've always felt that since my kids aren't culturally Hispanic/Latino, it would be disingenuous to identify them that way on school forms, so I haven't thus far. Am I doing them a disservice by not checking the box as Latino?

You would be wrong to check the box. Being Latino is not about genetics. It is 100% cultural. I am half latino and I have an adopted daughter who is from Russia. She will be checking the Latino box.

Let's say a girl is adopted by a pair of white parents. She is genetically Latino, but her parents don't do the best job of passing down her culture so she grows up with Caucasian culture. Would you say she shouldn't checjk Latino because "Being Latino is not about genetics. It is 100% cultural"!

I find it awfully convenient that your definition allows you to check the box for your daughter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thankfully, this will be the last admissions season where this silly game is still legal.

URMs welcome this! Can’t wait to see for the reactions when the admission outcomes don’t look any different!

If you want to see what a race-blind top school would look like, take a look at Caltech's demographics

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This forum is way too consumed about race.

I actually think this is an interesting discussion. And there are so many scenarios and interpretations.

--Like the single white mom whose sperm donor is Latino
--the Latina woman who adopted a child from Russia.
--Similarly I am friends with a white couple who adopted their daughter. One of the girl's biological parents is Hispanic. She has an open adoption so sees her biological family once per year or something. So technically, she IS Hispanic. Culturally, though, she is not being raised in that environment.
--My (adopted) daughter is Asian. We are white. We do minimal Chinese cultural things (We did when she was younger. My daughter is just not interested AT ALL). She is clearly Asian because she looks Asian. And she checked Asian because she is, but is it just because she looks that way? Is it because of her DNA?
--My daughter has a friend who is Jewish. Her ancestors were from Eastern Europe. When her grandparents escaped, they went to Cuba. Her mother moved to Florida where my daughter's friend was born and raised. She says she is Hispanic because her mother is from Cuba.
--Lastly, my daughter has another friend whose grandfather is 1/4 Native American, which makes my daughter's friend 1/16. They are on the rolls for their tribe. Is she enough Native American?

There is no right answer. Probably best described by the Facebook relationship category. It's complicated.

Your daughter should check white because that's the culture she identifies with. Like with the lady who had a Latina daughter, the fact that this may give her an advantage is totally a happy coincidence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Would saying you are AA be lying if one parent is from Morocco, Tunisia or Egypt and is more Mediterranean? I know technically they are from the continent of Africa, but culturally they do not identify as black.

No, they are racially African-American

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I read how it’s all self reported information and how colleges claim to have a large diverse population. Is this happening rarely or frequently?

out and out lie? Not very often. I do think people who used to try to cover up or play down any ‘diversity’ in their lineage are now amplifying it -even if it is 3 or 4 generations ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First Gen And Low Income or simply Low Income is the only affirmative action that makes sense to me.

I hear you. One of my siblings has kids who will go to college when he and his spouse did not. This sibling makes a huge salary and has a ton of real estate. A cousin married a man who was born in Spain and they have an Hispanic sounding last name. They live in McLean, go to Langley, the man graduated from an ivy league and their two houses (inc. vacation) home are worth more than $3,000,000. Both families have given their kids every opportunity...and both get a leg up in college admissions.

Not really. The college admissions see that they are privileged by their application, HS and their activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the data:

https://thehill.com/changing-america/enrichment/education/577722-more-than-a-third-of-white-students-lie-about-their/

My guess is that they mostly put Hispanic.

I thought Hispanic % was said to be pretty high at some of the colleges.

Yeah, a friend of my son has an Hispanic mother ... whose family has been in the United States since the late 1800s. The father is a WASP who attended Columbia and HBS. Meanwhile the boy is checking the Hispanic box and applying to Harvard and Yale while my slightly-better-stats kid is focused on, like, Villanova.

It's so frustrating to see people abuse the system. I wish there was a way for colleges to distinguish (and who knows; maybe they do.)

Oh they know. They know he won't need financial aid, they know by admitting him they can get a two-for-one deal, boosting both their legacy and Hispanic admit rates, which are good for the school in two different ways. What's your white, privileged, unconsciously racist son bringing to the table?

[Anonymous]

The Hispanic question confounds me every time. I check it off on the census since it specifically calls out Spain by name (background is Spanish), but I don’t check it off on anything else, because we all know they mean Latino LOL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thankfully, this will be the last admissions season where this silly game is still legal.

URMs welcome this! Can’t wait to see for the reactions when the admission outcomes don’t look any different!

If you want to see what a race-blind top school would look like, take a look at Caltech's demographics

Truth

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I see AA as a way to give URMs a better chance to break the glass ceiling after graduation. Racism still exists in the corporate world (and beyond!): some employers assuming (stereotyping) White and Asians will be much better employees- higher chances for hiring and promotion. Black and Latinos: some employers might assume they are lazy, not as smart. URMs with degrees from more prestigious universities might have an even chance against a White/ Asian from a top 50 university.

It is a double edged sword because many people assume that a URM's degree, HYPS or otherwise, is a product of DEI/A-Action. I know African Americans who will not go to an African American doctor for this reason. Since you brought it up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First Gen And Low Income or simply Low Income is the only affirmative action that makes sense to me.

I hear you. One of my siblings has kids who will go to college when he and his spouse did not. This sibling makes a huge salary and has a ton of real estate. A cousin married a man who was born in Spain and they have an Hispanic sounding last name. They live in McLean, go to Langley, the man graduated from an ivy league and their two houses (inc. vacation) home are worth more than $3,000,000. Both families have given their kids every opportunity...and both get a leg up in college admissions.

Not really. The college admissions see that they are privileged by their application, HS and their activities.

Not always - the last name is an indicator, and some people use the "more favorable" last name of their parents, to get the admissions and financial aid benefits that go along with that. ie: not Asian or white names.

It is really easy for a school to find out if you are lying, and it is a Federal offense, since the school is getting Federal funds. So, the school has a substantial interest in following the letter of the law, and you will be found out. I would not recommend it. Since you asked.