Think Twice Before Sending Your Kid To An Elite School

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Moral of the story: If you're full pay at an Ivy but making huge financial sacrifices to pay for it like us (DH and I moved halfway across the country to a much lower COL area where we rent a crappy two-bedroom apartment while renting our house back in our old state for extra money), it's probably not worth it.

Sorry, OP, I don't think most people on here (or anywhere!) would have suggested this level of sacrifice to pay for a particular school. If nothing else, it's clearly not good for your relationship with him! I know you want to blame the elite school, but I'm not sure that's the problem here.

It would be fine for our relationship if he's working hard with any sense of direction. But he is not. Actually, we expect him to work hard with a sense of purpose regardless of which school he's at (even if he was at our flagship on a full ride). But unfortunately that isn't the case.

Honestly, it sounds like your kid will be fine. I graduated from a top school with a similar major and lower GPA than your kid and have excelled in the work world (with top compensation). Made six figures right out of college. I had no clear direction in college either.

Very curious -- what was your first job out of college? Finance? Consulting? Tech? He's not competitive for any of those.

Tech/VC. It sounds like your kid is competitive for this— you don’t need a specific major or background to get hired.

Aren't the vast majority of recent grads hired in that field CS/Econ majors? At least that's the case at DS's Ivy. Did you work in a "soft" role (i.e. marketing)? Very curious.

Started as an analyst. There are roles appropriate for liberal arts majors. Very common at HYP etc.

But liberal arts majors with mediocre grades? I don't think so. Maybe he can start out in the nonprofit world. Or he could work in admissions for several years, then set up shop as a private college counselor.- a HYPS grad

I think this kid has a 3.7 gpa, which would be sufficient.

Not if you're a humanities major. Massive grade inflation happening at Ivies these days. I think the average GPA at DS's school is around a 3.7.

Really? A 3.7? I doubt it's that high.

[Anonymous]

OP: Assuming your narrative is true, you should give your child a lot more space. He clearly understands that you are disappointed in him, wish he was a STEM major, and hoped he would make millions at a tech, finance, or consulting company. However, he’s not interested in that outcome. OP, what would you do if you knew that your ideas, hopes, and ambitions were deemed worthless by your parents? For many kids, they quit sharing. Who needs constant negativity? And, he likely doesn’t have all the answers for his ultimate direction, which makes it difficult for him to cogently argue his case. He may be failing at labs and RA roles not only because he hates it, but also because he wants to convince you that it’s not worth trying to push him into a STEM major. Just pay the bills, relate to him as a human being, quit asking him about his plans, and chill out. Your son is not a high-tech stock: quit trying to calculate the near-term ROI!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP: Assuming your narrative is true, you should give your child a lot more space. He clearly understands that you are disappointed in him, wish he was a STEM major, and hoped he would make millions at a tech, finance, or consulting company. However, he’s not interested in that outcome. OP, what would you do if you knew that your ideas, hopes, and ambitions were deemed worthless by your parents? For many kids, they quit sharing. Who needs constant negativity? And, he likely doesn’t have all the answers for his ultimate direction, which makes it difficult for him to cogently argue his case. He may be failing at labs and RA roles not only because he hates it, but also because he wants to convince you that it’s not worth trying to push him into a STEM major. Just pay the bills, relate to him as a human being, quit asking him about his plans, and chill out. Your son is not a high-tech stock: quit trying to calculate the near-term ROI!!!!

You know, if I were a Big 3 parent who had a trust fund for my DS, this would be okay. But he's on his own after graduation, and we want to make sure that his first job isn't making $30k a year at some nonprofit barely scrapping by without any room for moving up. Which, I might add, is how the majority of Ivy grads in his situation end up. He could've done that for free from our state school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ah, welcome back, Disappointed. Your son is probably depressed because his parent keeps asking for answers instead of helping him expand his horizons. I had such a parent. I was expected to be shut-in, work all the time, but also know exactly what I wanted to do in great detail, and get all kinds of opportunities without networking or talking to anyone.

If you are determined to hinder and not help this young man of yours, why don't you connect him with someone who can, a relative or friend. Someone who can ask what academic topics he prefers, what skills he's honed, and talk to him about all kinds of careers pertaining to those.

OP may be a troll but I am real and I had parents like this too, pp. I resent them tremendously for their attitude towards me once I was no longer a prize-winning racehorse and it has definitely impacted our relationship in a very negative way that only affects them in the end.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This poster is a troll. Her earlier post about how disappointed she was in her son was deleted by Jeff.

+1

I think this is the same dude that's posting as an Asian tiger mom. Jeff deleted his post a few weeks back. In fact, last week's was similar to a copy and paste of a College Confidential post in DCUM that Jeff deleted about a year ago. I say this poster is a dude from the College Confidential post. He posted as a tiger mom - with the moniker "IOWABOY."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This poster is a troll. Her earlier post about how disappointed she was in her son was deleted by Jeff.

+1

I think this is the same dude that's posting as an Asian tiger mom. Jeff deleted his post a few weeks back. In fact, last week's was similar to a copy and paste of a College Confidential post in DCUM that Jeff deleted about a year ago. I say this poster is a dude from the College Confidential post. He posted as a tiger mom - with the moniker "IOWABOY."

I'm confused. If that's the case, what's the motivation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you’ve been posting several threads already. What can DCUM readers do to help you?

OP, PP means what can DCUM readers do to help with your mental issues. You need professional therapy. That's not what DCUM readers can do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This poster is a troll. Her earlier post about how disappointed she was in her son was deleted by Jeff.

+1

I think this is the same dude that's posting as an Asian tiger mom. Jeff deleted his post a few weeks back. In fact, last week's was similar to a copy and paste of a College Confidential post in DCUM that Jeff deleted about a year ago. I say this poster is a dude from the College Confidential post. He posted as a tiger mom - with the moniker "IOWABOY."

I'm confused. If that's the case, what's the motivation?

College Confidential closed one of IOWABOY3's threads with the admonishment he (not his kid) needs professional therapy. In fact, College Confidential closed one of his threads with the following: "@iowaboy3... Your two posts display all the hallmarks of a bored student who thinks it’s fun to get committed, helpful people commenting on your outrageous comments about “your child".... You’re actually a pretty good writer. Why not put your storytelling abilities to good use during these unpleasant times and write a bestseller? And in the sad event that you are, in fact, writing about yourself, I urge you to speak with a counselor or a trusted adult."

[Anonymous]

Trust the process of college and be proud of your kid. He will be fine. And he can probably learn more about life and life skills as a camp Counsellor than at a law firm internship. This is the time in life he can let go a little and explore.

[Anonymous]

"All of our family friends and relatives work in STEM, which unfortunately our son has no interest in. We don't have the connections to facilitate a job or an internship with his humanities degree, and he doesn't seem to understand that. Since he doesn't have connections, DH and I keep telling him he MUST be aggressive in finding opportunities for himself but for some reason he doesn't want to do that."

You sound pretty confused. My guess is your confusion is confusing your DS.

People without connections work manual labor or are self employed and even they aren't as shut out as you think you are. If everyone you know works in STEM, you have tons of connections to facilitate jobs and internships. Your connections should look around their companies and universities and look for human resources or administrative internships. Seriously, there is nothing better for the average rank and file engineer or scientists' career than having a friend/relative with an internship in the C-suite of their company or the vice president's office at their university. The fact seems to be that YOU are the one who is not being aggressive.

That brings us to an even bigger problem. You have no idea how to be aggressive but you pick away at him for a fault that he has never had any instruction in. He has no more idea how to be aggressive than you do. It's not that he doesn't WANT to be aggressive any more than you don't WANT to be aggressive to help him. It's just that you keep yelling at one another because neither of you have any idea what to do next. Even when you get past yelling at one another, it sounds like DS is still lacking the kind of straight-forward goal that drove him in HS.

This is where attending an Elite school can pay off. There are lots of people at the school that can help your DS come up with that kind of goal and the major steps necessary to reach it. Your DC has an advisor. He needs to go talk to them. He needs to go to office hours with the prof closest aligned to his major this semester and he needs to talk with them about what he needs to be doing and how to do it. The school also has a placement center. He needs to go there and go through their process to polish his resume and figure out his best moves and places to apply. Often, just going to all of these people once or twice isn't enough. They won't really know your son and the kind of goal he needs requires they get to know him, it can't just be thrown together in one quick solve everything hour. So he has to keep going back. Maybe help him set up a schedule so that every week he has a 30-60 minute meeting with someone or other to work on this.

ALSO you need to go on the parents facebook page (or other social media directly related to the college) at the college and learn as much as you can about how others are dealing with this problem and up your game tremendously. It might also help if you set up a call with DS's advisor so that you can set your expectations based on reality. Ranting on DCUM only rarely rates a useful reply because everyone thinks you are a troll.

Anyway, it's time you get to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe he's feeling burned out? These kids are under intense pressure to get into top schools from the time they are kindergarten. Every year it's push push push harder. No time to enjoy just being a kid. ALso no time to explore what you want to do in life because everything must be geared toward college applications. Maybe he just wants to be young and enjoy life for now, now that he's got the golden ring you wanted him to have?

This. Except maybe OP’s child was the driving force in going to an Ivy.

OP maybe you can have your child take on loans for the remainder of college tuition? I’m sorry you are going through this. There may be things in your child’s life that you don’t know about (mental health issues, he doesn’t know how to seek help such as tutoring, bad breakup, etc)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"All of our family friends and relatives work in STEM, which unfortunately our son has no interest in. We don't have the connections to facilitate a job or an internship with his humanities degree, and he doesn't seem to understand that. Since he doesn't have connections, DH and I keep telling him he MUST be aggressive in finding opportunities for himself but for some reason he doesn't want to do that."

You sound pretty confused. My guess is your confusion is confusing your DS.

People without connections work manual labor or are self employed and even they aren't as shut out as you think you are. If everyone you know works in STEM, you have tons of connections to facilitate jobs and internships. Your connections should look around their companies and universities and look for human resources or administrative internships. Seriously, there is nothing better for the average rank and file engineer or scientists' career than having a friend/relative with an internship in the C-suite of their company or the vice president's office at their university. The fact seems to be that YOU are the one who is not being aggressive.

That brings us to an even bigger problem. You have no idea how to be aggressive but you pick away at him for a fault that he has never had any instruction in. He has no more idea how to be aggressive than you do. It's not that he doesn't WANT to be aggressive any more than you don't WANT to be aggressive to help him. It's just that you keep yelling at one another because neither of you have any idea what to do next. Even when you get past yelling at one another, it sounds like DS is still lacking the kind of straight-forward goal that drove him in HS.

This is where attending an Elite school can pay off. There are lots of people at the school that can help your DS come up with that kind of goal and the major steps necessary to reach it. Your DC has an advisor. He needs to go talk to them. He needs to go to office hours with the prof closest aligned to his major this semester and he needs to talk with them about what he needs to be doing and how to do it. The school also has a placement center. He needs to go there and go through their process to polish his resume and figure out his best moves and places to apply. Often, just going to all of these people once or twice isn't enough. They won't really know your son and the kind of goal he needs requires they get to know him, it can't just be thrown together in one quick solve everything hour. So he has to keep going back. Maybe help him set up a schedule so that every week he has a 30-60 minute meeting with someone or other to work on this.

ALSO you need to go on the parents facebook page (or other social media directly related to the college) at the college and learn as much as you can about how others are dealing with this problem and up your game tremendously. It might also help if you set up a call with DS's advisor so that you can set your expectations based on reality. Ranting on DCUM only rarely rates a useful reply because everyone thinks you are a troll.

Anyway, it's time you get to work.

+1 to this except the part about the parent contacting the advisor. That’s called helicopter parenting. You can guide your son to do these things but you can’t do it for him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP: Assuming your narrative is true, you should give your child a lot more space. He clearly understands that you are disappointed in him, wish he was a STEM major, and hoped he would make millions at a tech, finance, or consulting company. However, he’s not interested in that outcome. OP, what would you do if you knew that your ideas, hopes, and ambitions were deemed worthless by your parents? For many kids, they quit sharing. Who needs constant negativity? And, he likely doesn’t have all the answers for his ultimate direction, which makes it difficult for him to cogently argue his case. He may be failing at labs and RA roles not only because he hates it, but also because he wants to convince you that it’s not worth trying to push him into a STEM major. Just pay the bills, relate to him as a human being, quit asking him about his plans, and chill out. Your son is not a high-tech stock: quit trying to calculate the near-term ROI!!!!

You know, if I were a Big 3 parent who had a trust fund for my DS, this would be okay. But he's on his own after graduation, and we want to make sure that his first job isn't making $30k a year at some nonprofit barely scrapping by without any room for moving up. Which, I might add, is how the majority of Ivy grads in his situation end up. He could've done that for free from our state school.

Why not? Those jobs have value, both in themselves and as a learning experience for him. $30k is very minimal. He will figure that out much faster if he experiences it. And he's graduated, so it's time for you to let him rise or fail on his own merit and his own decisionmaking.

My friend went to Wharton undergrad - very prestigious. Came out and went to one of those $30k nonprofit jobs. 15 years on she's marketing director at a large, well-known nonprofit that serves children. She'll probably never make more than $90k if she's lucky, but she is passionate about her job, and she is able to live in a low cost of living area where the money goes farther than it does here. She's happy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"All of our family friends and relatives work in STEM, which unfortunately our son has no interest in. We don't have the connections to facilitate a job or an internship with his humanities degree, and he doesn't seem to understand that. Since he doesn't have connections, DH and I keep telling him he MUST be aggressive in finding opportunities for himself but for some reason he doesn't want to do that."

You sound pretty confused. My guess is your confusion is confusing your DS.

People without connections work manual labor or are self employed and even they aren't as shut out as you think you are. If everyone you know works in STEM, you have tons of connections to facilitate jobs and internships. Your connections should look around their companies and universities and look for human resources or administrative internships. Seriously, there is nothing better for the average rank and file engineer or scientists' career than having a friend/relative with an internship in the C-suite of their company or the vice president's office at their university. The fact seems to be that YOU are the one who is not being aggressive.

That brings us to an even bigger problem. You have no idea how to be aggressive but you pick away at him for a fault that he has never had any instruction in. He has no more idea how to be aggressive than you do. It's not that he doesn't WANT to be aggressive any more than you don't WANT to be aggressive to help him. It's just that you keep yelling at one another because neither of you have any idea what to do next. Even when you get past yelling at one another, it sounds like DS is still lacking the kind of straight-forward goal that drove him in HS.

This is where attending an Elite school can pay off. There are lots of people at the school that can help your DS come up with that kind of goal and the major steps necessary to reach it. Your DC has an advisor. He needs to go talk to them. He needs to go to office hours with the prof closest aligned to his major this semester and he needs to talk with them about what he needs to be doing and how to do it. The school also has a placement center. He needs to go there and go through their process to polish his resume and figure out his best moves and places to apply. Often, just going to all of these people once or twice isn't enough. They won't really know your son and the kind of goal he needs requires they get to know him, it can't just be thrown together in one quick solve everything hour. So he has to keep going back. Maybe help him set up a schedule so that every week he has a 30-60 minute meeting with someone or other to work on this.

ALSO you need to go on the parents facebook page (or other social media directly related to the college) at the college and learn as much as you can about how others are dealing with this problem and up your game tremendously. It might also help if you set up a call with DS's advisor so that you can set your expectations based on reality. Ranting on DCUM only rarely rates a useful reply because everyone thinks you are a troll.

Anyway, it's time you get to work.

+1

T5 kids and parents have more resources than DCUM. He’s a troll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"All of our family friends and relatives work in STEM, which unfortunately our son has no interest in. We don't have the connections to facilitate a job or an internship with his humanities degree, and he doesn't seem to understand that. Since he doesn't have connections, DH and I keep telling him he MUST be aggressive in finding opportunities for himself but for some reason he doesn't want to do that."

You sound pretty confused. My guess is your confusion is confusing your DS.

People without connections work manual labor or are self employed and even they aren't as shut out as you think you are. If everyone you know works in STEM, you have tons of connections to facilitate jobs and internships. Your connections should look around their companies and universities and look for human resources or administrative internships. Seriously, there is nothing better for the average rank and file engineer or scientists' career than having a friend/relative with an internship in the C-suite of their company or the vice president's office at their university. The fact seems to be that YOU are the one who is not being aggressive.

That brings us to an even bigger problem. You have no idea how to be aggressive but you pick away at him for a fault that he has never had any instruction in. He has no more idea how to be aggressive than you do. It's not that he doesn't WANT to be aggressive any more than you don't WANT to be aggressive to help him. It's just that you keep yelling at one another because neither of you have any idea what to do next. Even when you get past yelling at one another, it sounds like DS is still lacking the kind of straight-forward goal that drove him in HS.

This is where attending an Elite school can pay off. There are lots of people at the school that can help your DS come up with that kind of goal and the major steps necessary to reach it. Your DC has an advisor. He needs to go talk to them. He needs to go to office hours with the prof closest aligned to his major this semester and he needs to talk with them about what he needs to be doing and how to do it. The school also has a placement center. He needs to go there and go through their process to polish his resume and figure out his best moves and places to apply. Often, just going to all of these people once or twice isn't enough. They won't really know your son and the kind of goal he needs requires they get to know him, it can't just be thrown together in one quick solve everything hour. So he has to keep going back. Maybe help him set up a schedule so that every week he has a 30-60 minute meeting with someone or other to work on this.

ALSO you need to go on the parents facebook page (or other social media directly related to the college) at the college and learn as much as you can about how others are dealing with this problem and up your game tremendously. It might also help if you set up a call with DS's advisor so that you can set your expectations based on reality. Ranting on DCUM only rarely rates a useful reply because everyone thinks you are a troll.

Anyway, it's time you get to work.

You people are crazy. Why the hell am I expected to get my son an internship? I am disappointed in him because I want him to be SELF motivated in college, and doing things like this will only hinder that. Sorry I'm not willing to coddle like the rest of you.