PSA: For all the confused men out there

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I take OP's point that attractive women choose attractive men. But the question remains whether the bad boy behavior adds, detracts, or is neutral. The thought experiment would be, given a set of identical twins, whether a woman would prefer sex with the bad boy twin or the nice guy twin.

If it's the bad-boy that gets the edge, then even ugly guys are going to want to be bad boys because they want to at least get the edge over the rest of the guys who are just as ugly as they are.

See, but now we have to define "bad boy". Do you mean a man with a criminal record or a man who acts with more authority than others in a given social context or a man who has greater resources or a man who is more confident? People employ different definitions all the time. You'll see introverted men at a bar complaining that women are flocking to the joke-cracking extravert with the loud laugh. In their mind, that guy is a "bad boy" type, but is he? Some women are attracted to men who look "dangerous" (tall, muscular, maybe unsmiling), nevermind those men's actual personalities. Guys who look more mainstream -- business casual-wearing nerds -- might conceptualize that guy as a "bad boy." If that guy works at a nursing home and leads a law-abiding life, is he really a "bad boy"?

What about the middle class father of two who is on Ashley Madison secretly, but looks like the nerdiest thing alive. Isn't that a "bad boy"? And yet, most people would not call him a "bad boy".

The term "bad boy" is useless because, at this point, it basically means the guy who is getting the girl a bitter man wants.

-OP

[Anonymous]

I think women prefer naughty over bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of baldness- there's a high correlation between baldness and waist size. If men kept the gut under control, they wouldn't have as bad of balding head.

I married the great looking good guy. He's literally a 10. Women will stop to talk to him in grocery stores and gas stations- really! He had no issues with the fact that he wasn't a bad boy. And now that we're in our 30s, women want him even more since he's more into family, house and wife. I think an equally looking bad guy and equally looking good guy would get the same amount of girl.

Nice guys, just tend to have a gigantic chip on their shoulder though. And likewise bad boys are cocky as hell.

Truly nice men don't (and nice doesn't equal pushover or beta, bitter males). But men pretending to be nice as a way of getting something (such as sex) because they feel entitled to it certainly have a chip on their shoulder.

Yes that might be true. I guess most nice guys are betas, so we correlate the two. My nice guy is an alpha (except at home- hah!).

Faux nice guys are betas pretending to be alphas

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I take OP's point that attractive women choose attractive men. But the question remains whether the bad boy behavior adds, detracts, or is neutral. The thought experiment would be, given a set of identical twins, whether a woman would prefer sex with the bad boy twin or the nice guy twin.

If it's the bad-boy that gets the edge, then even ugly guys are going to want to be bad boys because they want to at least get the edge over the rest of the guys who are just as ugly as they are.

The point remains: it doesnt contribute, at least in any meaningful way.

The major factors are 1) appearance (as in facial bone structure combined with bodyshape/muscles. Far and away the most important 2) having a good income 3) Other personality factors

[Anonymous]

^Yep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I take OP's point that attractive women choose attractive men. But the question remains whether the bad boy behavior adds, detracts, or is neutral. The thought experiment would be, given a set of identical twins, whether a woman would prefer sex with the bad boy twin or the nice guy twin.

If it's the bad-boy that gets the edge, then even ugly guys are going to want to be bad boys because they want to at least get the edge over the rest of the guys who are just as ugly as they are.

See, but now we have to define "bad boy". Do you mean a man with a criminal record or a man who acts with more authority than others in a given social context or a man who has greater resources or a man who is more confident? People employ different definitions all the time. You'll see introverted men at a bar complaining that women are flocking to the joke-cracking extravert with the loud laugh. In their mind, that guy is a "bad boy" type, but is he? Some women are attracted to men who look "dangerous" (tall, muscular, maybe unsmiling), nevermind those men's actual personalities. Guys who look more mainstream -- business casual-wearing nerds -- might conceptualize that guy as a "bad boy." If that guy works at a nursing home and leads a law-abiding life, is he really a "bad boy"?

What about the middle class father of two who is on Ashley Madison secretly, but looks like the nerdiest thing alive. Isn't that a "bad boy"? And yet, most people would not call him a "bad boy".

The term "bad boy" is useless because, at this point, it basically means the guy who is getting the girl a bitter man wants.

-OP

YES. Thank you, OP. This is exactly the issue.

When bitter men say "bad boy" I think that many times, what they mean is "man who was more assertive/aggressive than I was, who projected more confidence than I did" or some variation of "man who puts effort into his appearance so as to become conventionally attractive to women" where "conventionally attractive" is like, Tom Brady or some other muscular, tall, athletic male.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of baldness- there's a high correlation between baldness and waist size. If men kept the gut under control, they wouldn't have as bad of balding head.

I married the great looking good guy. He's literally a 10. Women will stop to talk to him in grocery stores and gas stations- really! He had no issues with the fact that he wasn't a bad boy. And now that we're in our 30s, women want him even more since he's more into family, house and wife. I think an equally looking bad guy and equally looking good guy would get the same amount of girl.

Nice guys, just tend to have a gigantic chip on their shoulder though. And likewise bad boys are cocky as hell.

Um...no. baldness has nothing to do with waist size. After saying something that stupid, it's useless to read the rest of your statement.

- in great shape but bald guy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of baldness- there's a high correlation between baldness and waist size. If men kept the gut under control, they wouldn't have as bad of balding head.

Complete trash. Post a link providing evidence or, better yet, just shut up.

[Anonymous]

Attractive women, especially those who found great boyfriends or husbands, don't have the animosity and anger towards men that the bitter shrews writing here have. If men wrote about women here in such a mocking and dehumanizing fashion, they'd be lynched here. Calling people "gremlins" and "ugly"...what kind of person are you? Do you teach your children to be that shallow?

I suspect women here are mainly upset those great guys actually passed them over. Oh well. Get your flabby ass to the gym, stop drinking like a college kid, and watch that clock tick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Attractive women, especially those who found great boyfriends or husbands, don't have the animosity and anger towards men that the bitter shrews writing here have. If men wrote about women here in such a mocking and dehumanizing fashion, they'd be lynched here. Calling people "gremlins" and "ugly"...what kind of person are you? Do you teach your children to be that shallow?

I suspect women here are mainly upset those great guys actually passed them over. Oh well. Get your flabby ass to the gym, stop drinking like a college kid, and watch that clock tick.

Oh please, bitch.

Lots of men on here insult women all the time. In fact, you just did with your charming closing statement.

But it's funny to watch men get pissy and throw tantrums when the shoe is on the other foot

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Attractive women, especially those who found great boyfriends or husbands, don't have the animosity and anger towards men that the bitter shrews writing here have. If men wrote about women here in such a mocking and dehumanizing fashion, they'd be lynched here. Calling people "gremlins" and "ugly"...what kind of person are you? Do you teach your children to be that shallow?

I suspect women here are mainly upset those great guys actually passed them over. Oh well. Get your flabby ass to the gym, stop drinking like a college kid, and watch that clock tick.

Nope. I'm one of the people who agreed with the OP. I'm an attractive woman, happily married to a bald man who could stand to lose 20 pounds but who was quite attractive in his youth.

What is mocking and dehumanizing is the way that the MRAs talk about women. It is as though we do not have any agency and are mindless beings driven exclusively by our attraction to men who treat us badly. They talk as though the only reason for women to not be attracted to them is that they are "not alphas" and say things like "watch that clock tick."

I don't have animosity or anger towards men in general. I have nothing but contempt for men who patronize the men's rights Reddit and likeminded fora.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope, you just need money

Dumb dumb, this feeds right into the point in the OP. A fabulously wealthy man who can sweep a woman off her feet has something to offer, just as a good looking man does visually. Preferring men who actually come with more than bald spots spreading as wide as their guts does not mean that women want assholes. It means that women actually want some value in return for their time. You know, the way men do? Or are you beating down the doors of broke Roseanne Barr lookalikes?

I'm not going to address the arguments about money and young woman, but I'm pretty sure that the first picture is Giorgio Armani who is reportedly worth $7B and also happens to be gay. I think that young woman is a relative.

Well even women even want to marry gay rich men

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If only we could bottle whatever it is that makes most average to ugly men think they're far more attractive than they are. I'd call it "Delusion."

I love you.

and it would smell like stale sheets and old spice deodorant with an undertone of dirty socks

[Anonymous]

Guy here. It seems to me like women give all kinds of guys chances. They'll go on dates with everything from super attractive types to gym rats or brainey types - and you never know on which type of guy the wheel will stop. I think that's because there are tons of things women can find attractive in men: interpersonal skills, sense of humor, height, kindness, confidence, wealth, big hands, big dick, nice smile, good dresser, good kisser, ambition - the list goes on. A guy could have any one of or combination of these things. The more you have, the more conventionally attractive you are.

As a guy, if you haven't honestly assessed yourself and fixed or optimized the things you can change, then you can't get mad at a woman for finding a better deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Guy here. It seems to me like women give all kinds of guys chances. They'll go on dates with everything from super attractive types to gym rats or brainey types - and you never know on which type of guy the wheel will stop. I think that's because there are tons of things women can find attractive in men: interpersonal skills, sense of humor, height, kindness, confidence, wealth, big hands, big dick, nice smile, good dresser, good kisser, ambition - the list goes on. A guy could have any one of or combination of these things. The more you have, the more conventionally attractive you are.

As a guy, if you haven't honestly assessed yourself and fixed or optimized the things you can change, then you can't get mad at a woman for finding a better deal.

ITA with this!

Also, you sound like a catch.