St. Stephens St. Agnes -- Hazing on Boys' Lacrosse

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This does NOT happen everywhere and does NOT happen in other sports. And while some kids may be OK with it, it is almost certainly humiliating for others. This is the naked exercise of power inflicted on those who want to both make the team and be accepted and therefore have no choice but to comply. And this is not a battle kids can fight on their own because it is something that has been institutionalized. One child, alone, objects and that child will not make the team, at best, and will most likely be ridiculed. Shame on the school for allowing this and on parents for defending it.

So, you're pissed because someone wants to cut your snowflake's locks? What does HE say about it?

The practice being discussed is bad enough but this poster (I'm hoping this is only one person) is giving SSSA a really bad name. I can't imagine wanting to send a child there after reading this thread.

I realize that all the information in the world won't change this poster's mind (seriously, read the link -- head shaving is specifically mentioned) but hopefully someone from the school will read this and maybe think about the rep they are getting.

By the way my DS associates baldness on young people with cancer because of a cousin who went through chemotherapy. It would absolutely be disturbing to him to have to shave his head.

And what happens when a boy refuses? Are boys allowed to refuse?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1
It's not your battle, it's his.
If he doesn't mind it or even likes theprestige of a frosh on the team, let it be.
If he doesn't want to do it, tell him it's ok to stand up for himself and say no. If he's good enough to make the team and is a team player, people will repsect his opinion.

I understand that the next few days are all about admissions on this board, and that's understandable! However, I wanted to respond to the several posts which suggested this issue is one that should be handled by the athletes themselves with no parent or school involvement.

I'm a high school teacher and coach at an area independent school who was a collegiate athlete. First, this is not something that occurs everywhere in this area, even at schools known for lacrosse traditions. I would say, however, that what I would classify as "mild hazing" DOES occur at many places -- that's part of the problem. The parents posting things along the lines of letting kids fight their own battles mean well and are probably raising great, grounded, independent kids. And as a teacher, generally I am NOT in the camp of those who say "go to the Head of School."

This one is an exception. Below I've included a link to the National Federation of High School Sports page on hazing -- you'll see that head-shaving is listed as one of the classic hazing techniques. Certainly much less disgusting/vile/degrading than some other things that are described -- but it squarely falls within the definition of hazing.

There are a few problems with ignoring or letting kids handle the issue of head-shaving on a high school sports team. First, even if it is not true currently, if a hazing culture exists, even starting with relatively mild things like largely voluntary head-shaving, there is a fairly good possibility that more serious and/or potentially harmful hazing rituals may develop. Second, I believe strongly that athletics should be complementary to the core mission of the school, which is to educate its students. Singling out one particular team by something that is not transitory (like wearing jerseys on game days) sends a message to other students (and teachers too) that these boys are lacrosse players first (or football, or ice hockey, or baseball players), not students. Healthy pride in being on a team is one thing (jerseys on game days), shaved heads to me takes it a step too far. Third, given peer pressure it is virtually inconceivable that any particular athlete is going to say no to the bonding ritual -- it removes the element of voluntariness from the situation.

I have a lot of respect for SSSAS as an institution -- it's a good school, the current Head is highly respected, they've got a talented faculty and their teams are well-coached and sportsmanlike. I think they are on the wrong side of educational theory and best practices here, though, and if you are a parent and object to this I would encourage you to contact the school admin or possibly even the Board (given that head-shaving is not something that can go on beneath the surface, thus it seems that the current practice must be being at least implicitly sanctioned by the school admin). If nothing else, a healthy debate over the situation could not hurt.

Link to the website with hazing info:

http://www.nfhs.org/content.aspx?id=3766

Well said PP. I completely agree.

[Anonymous]

Again this information is inaccurate. It was not a hazing incident.

[Anonymous]

It was voluntary!

[Anonymous]

For the posters saying it was not hazing and that the kids could opt out, did anyone do so? Opt out of the head shaving, I mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It was voluntary!

Was it? Could boys opt out? Did any? If no boys opted out, or boys who did opt out were subject to repercussions, then it wasn't voluntary.

When those in power, the older boys, subject the younger ones to a ritual like this, its very difficult to see it as voluntary. Opting out is embarrassing, it subjects them to ridicule or at the very least they worry that it will subject them to ridicule. There's a reason why this practice was specifically listed as a hazing ritual.

So, answer the question, did anyone opt out?

And try to control your nastiness. The consensus of non-SSAS posters here is clearly that you are painting the school in a bad light with every post.

[Anonymous]

The post was started (at least it seems like it was) by a SSAS parent intent on getting the school to see her point of view on the ritual. So please get off your high horse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The post was started (at least it seems like it was) by a SSAS parent intent on getting the school to see her point of view on the ritual. So please get off your high horse.

Her point of view is apparently shared by most posters here as well as the experts.

So why haven't you answered the question? Did anyone opt out?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The post was started (at least it seems like it was) by a SSAS parent intent on getting the school to see her point of view on the ritual. So please get off your high horse.

Her point of view is apparently shared by most posters here as well as the experts.

So why haven't you answered the question? Did anyone opt out?

I am not the poster you are referring to. I don't attend SSAS. The OP does so I would direct your question to her.

[Anonymous]

Yes, many boys opted out.

[Anonymous]

Can someone please clarify whether this practice is on the lacrosse team and kids who want to be on the lacrosse team, or is the tradition that the lacrosse team shaves the heads of all freshmen boys?? Thanks - I was just curious.

[Anonymous]

While we are on the topic of hazing... Does anyone have a good brownie cookie recipe?

[Anonymous]

As a male who has played lacrosse at St. Stephens, and this did not occur when I was there (I graduated in 2011), I think that this a very small form of hazing that is not a big deal at all and everyone on this site is blowing it way out of proportion. I made the varsity team my freshman year and the seniors did not buzz our heads, but I wanted them to and I bet if you asked freshmen that made the team the same question they would have wanted it to because its cool and you get attention for it from girls other students etc. However, when we made the playoffs my freshman year some of my friends and I actually voluntarily shaved our own heads in funny ways. I had someone make me a mohawk. Everyone that thinks that shaving freshmen boys heads on the team is probably against in because they are vain and do not want their sons looking ridiculous. You all should do something to stay busy and stop trying to control your sons' lives.

[Anonymous]

Brownies? Who has time to bake anymore?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a male who has played lacrosse at St. Stephens, and this did not occur when I was there (I graduated in 2011), I think that this a very small form of hazing that is not a big deal at all and everyone on this site is blowing it way out of proportion. I made the varsity team my freshman year and the seniors did not buzz our heads, but I wanted them to and I bet if you asked freshmen that made the team the same question they would have wanted it to because its cool and you get attention for it from girls other students etc. However, when we made the playoffs my freshman year some of my friends and I actually voluntarily shaved our own heads in funny ways. I had someone make me a mohawk. Everyone that thinks that shaving freshmen boys heads on the team is probably against in because they are vain and do not want their sons looking ridiculous. You all should do something to stay busy and stop trying to control your sons' lives.

You should have spent less time playing lacrosse and shaving your head, and more time learning to construct a convincing argument.