My DD wants to avoid applying to most competitive top 25 "usual suspects" colleges - which LACs considered part of T'25?

[Anonymous]

What a stupid stupid stupid asinine thread

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What a stupid stupid stupid asinine thread

Redundant, even.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Or way to view LACs is that they are advanced high school. LACs can be excellent and offer one a great education, but cannot compare with National Universities due to the dramatic difference in resources.

yes and many national universities provide an excellent grad school experience- but are lacking in undergrad experience, where the WASP schools absolutely shine

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

Why are you, from England? We are not talking about grad school rankings.

Both Brown and Dartmouth are far superior for undergrad. You may disagree; but applicants don’t. 80% choose Brown over Hopkins:
https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Brown+University&with=Johns+Hopkins+University
72% choose Dartmouth over Hopkins:
https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Brown+University&with=Johns+Hopkins+University
Stop digging your hole.

not to add fuel to this fire but Williams does trounce JHU in terms of x admits also..

https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Johns+Hopkins+University&with=Williams+College

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

Williams would 1000% - and probably higher than JHU, which some would say is a one trick pony

Now you're just be silly & childish. Compare the research budget of JHU to any other school in the world. JHU's 2023 fiscal year research budget was over $3.8 billion ($3,800,000,000+). Over $3.8 billion for just one year. Williams College's R&D budget for the same fiscal year (2023) was a paltry $3.448 million (less than one-tenth of one percent of JHU's 2023 R&D budget!)

JHU's $3,800,000,000+ budget versus Williams College's $3,448,000 R&D budget. They are in two different leagues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Or way to view LACs is that they are advanced high school. LACs can be excellent and offer one a great education, but cannot compare with National Universities due to the dramatic difference in resources.

yes and many national universities provide an excellent grad school experience- but are lacking in undergrad experience, where the WASP schools absolutely shine

Your statement regarding lack of an undergraduate experience at National Universities is incorrect and evidence that you have never been a student at a top ranked National University.

[Anonymous]

I don't understand the question. This is an A student with a 1500+ score. And she doesn't want to go to a college that is "competitive?"

What does that even mean?

Like, she doesn't want to apply to schools that are generally rejective? Community college solves that. Plus most of the public satellite campuses. Just enroll. Or does she not want to go to a school where students take classes seriously and try their best? There are a bunch of rich kid liberal arts colleges that are way down the list that will be very happy to take your money and not expect much academically.

Is she intimidated by students who are motivated and challenge themselves? Does she just want to glide for four years? Does she expect education to happen through osmosis? It seems odd to reject everything from a tiny little rural SLAC to giant a state school like UCLA out of hand because students... study? Have ambition? Want to do well?

Usually when a bright teenager loses all motivation there's something else going on. Is she using a lot of weed? Is she depressed? Those are the usual two suspects.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Or way to view LACs is that they are advanced high school. LACs can be excellent and offer one a great education, but cannot compare with National Universities due to the dramatic difference in resources.

I know you intended this without irony, but let’s just say you should understand what “milking the cow” means at Williams. There is indeed a dramatic difference in resources spent on undergrads — in favor of the wealthiest SLACs. I can say with complete confidence that you have never seen anything like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

Williams would 1000% - and probably higher than JHU, which some would say is a one trick pony

Now you're just be silly & childish. Compare the research budget of JHU to any other school in the world. JHU's 2023 fiscal year research budget was over $3.8 billion ($3,800,000,000+). Over $3.8 billion for just one year. Williams College's R&D budget for the same fiscal year (2023) was a paltry $3.448 million (less than one-tenth of one percent of JHU's 2023 R&D budget!)

JHU's $3,800,000,000+ budget versus Williams College's $3,448,000 R&D budget. They are in two different leagues.

Endowment per student:
Johns Hopkins, 366k
https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-rankings/details/EndowmentPerStudent/State/MD/
Williams, 1.4 million
https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-rankings/details/EndowmentPerStudent/State/MD/

Any questions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

Why are you, from England? We are not talking about grad school rankings.

Both Brown and Dartmouth are far superior for undergrad. You may disagree; but applicants don’t. 80% choose Brown over Hopkins:
https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Brown+University&with=Johns+Hopkins+University
72% choose Dartmouth over Hopkins:
https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Brown+University&with=Johns+Hopkins+University
Stop digging your hole.

not to add fuel to this fire but Williams does trounce JHU in terms of x admits also..

https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=Johns+Hopkins+University&with=Williams+College

Parchment is not a reliable source and is based on insufficient input to make any reasonably supportable statements.

Nevertheless, if one was admitted to both Williams College and to JHU, I do understand the appeal of attending the #1 ranked LAC over a school that just recently made it into the top 10 National University ranking. Also, these are very different school environments. Williams is in a safe community with only a modestly competitive student environment whereas the environment for pre-med majors at JHU is quite intense & competitive. But, they are still playing in different leagues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

Williams would 1000% - and probably higher than JHU, which some would say is a one trick pony

Now you're just be silly & childish. Compare the research budget of JHU to any other school in the world. JHU's 2023 fiscal year research budget was over $3.8 billion ($3,800,000,000+). Over $3.8 billion for just one year. Williams College's R&D budget for the same fiscal year (2023) was a paltry $3.448 million (less than one-tenth of one percent of JHU's 2023 R&D budget!)

JHU's $3,800,000,000+ budget versus Williams College's $3,448,000 R&D budget. They are in two different leagues.

Endowment per student:
Johns Hopkins, 366k
https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-rankings/details/EndowmentPerStudent/State/MD/
Williams, 1.4 million
https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-rankings/details/EndowmentPerStudent/State/MD/

Any questions?

Yes, Williams College has a very impressive, substantial EPS (endowment per student), but that is meaningless beyond an indication of financial stability. Williams College's EPS is not spent on students--both sits in investments for Williams College's benefit.

JHU is spending over $3.8 billion dollars per year on R&D which benefits both students (undergraduate & graduate), professors, industry, government, and the real world. Think of it as working capital versus a savings account. Williams College's saving account does little to nothing to benefit it's students. Princeton University has such a massive endowment per student (EPS) that it does spend a meaningful amount to benefit each individual student each year.

I am not anti-LAC, but comparing an LAC to a top 25 or top 30 National University is ridiculous; it's like comparing an NFL football team to a great college football team. Different leagues. And, if you don't understand that, then you really should refrain from making declarative statements about this topic.

[Anonymous]

Oh look the National University poster is back!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

I’m a graduate of both Swarthmore and of JHU (for grad school). From my perspective, there’s no comparison: everything about the educational experience at Swarthmore was superior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For such a goal, it might make sense to avoid the most selective colleges. As a tool, this site provides Student Selectivity Ranks for colleges and universities together:

https://wallethub.com/edu/e/college-rankings/40750

Swarthmore, for example, placed 19th nationally by selectivity.

This list is crap. It does not factor in ED; it is just admit rates. The more the class is filled ED, the lower the admit rate. Chicago is 4 on this list; its ED admit rate is estimated at 40%. Just ask us what the admit rates mean; we’ll tell you. Once again, Swat is a way tougher admit than Chicago…

Your comments are crap.

The WalletHub methodology used 30 factors, not just overall admit rates.

U Chicago is a better school than Swarthmore because of the greater number of brilliant students and the presence of graduate students & programs. However, Swarthmore & U Chicago are similar in that they both encourage intellectualism among their students. Swarthmore is tiny, and that is a weakness due to fewer perspectives and less varied input.

I wouldn’t use WalletHub as a guide to help determine where to send my child to college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very odd that some LAC supporters criticize Johns Hopkins University. JHU has, by far, the largest research & development (R&D) budget of any US school and probably of any school in the world. There is no LAC that is even close to JHU or to any Top 15 university excluding Dartmouth College & Brown University--an other of which are over-rated.

If LACs were ranked with National Universities, none--according to the Wall Street Journal & The Times Higher Education published rankings, would fall among the top 20 schools.

I’m a graduate of both Swarthmore and of JHU (for grad school). From my perspective, there’s no comparison: everything about the educational experience at Swarthmore was superior.

Realize that you are comparing a grad school experience to an undergraduate school experience so I doubt that you can compare the two experiences on an equal basis.

Regardless, nobody is dissing Swarthmore College--its a demanding, small school. Would be a very different experience from attending a National University as an undergraduate student, although Swarthmore would share some similarities with U Chicago.

If you want to continue, then what did you major in at Swarthmore & what did you study in grad school at JHU.