Are the ivies overrated? Perhaps too much coddling?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I don't think a lot of people have that idea. Top students at less rich and less privileged schools have lots of opportunity.

And yet there are plenty of employees that will only interview at certain schools.
This isn’t sour grapes-I went to one of those schools. I just think it’s elitist and absurd.

[Anonymous]

This again.

How many threads can we post a day that attack the Ivies?

No.

I have a kid at an Ivy. The kid was always VERY independent. I never reminded him about homework or had to coddle him, tutor him or even check his Canvas--every. He managed time extremely well. He was a self-starter. He had a lot of variety--played sports, academic clubs, lots of friends.

He arrived on campus and w/in days had figured out where the zip cars were to get him to an activity (non-school related). He joined things in and out of school, won a departmental award, handled an emergency surgery---and was messaging profs from the hospital bed. He found opportunities. Figured out summer internship, etc.

There was zero coddling. He had great advisors--but they certainly weren't coddling--they are a research which you can use if you want.

I found his roommates all to be very mature for their ages--incredibly smart and accomplished as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nope:
One at an ivy. One at UVA. There are many more opportunities at the ivy and for the most part classes demand much more: more reading per week, more difficult problem sets, more complex midterms in calc. Peers do multiple time-intensive activities in addition to class at the ivy and more have campus jobs(though usually these are resume building jobs such as research or paid undergrad learning assistant). Classes are a lot smaller at the ivy but that is not coddling.

+100

the amount my kid is required to read any given week at the Ivy is sooooooooooooooooooooo much more than state school kid. Moves at a much faster and in-depth clip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I don't think a lot of people have that idea. Top students at less rich and less privileged schools have lots of opportunity.

And yet there are plenty of employees that will only interview at certain schools.
This isn’t sour grapes-I went to one of those schools. I just think it’s elitist and absurd.

And there are plenty of employees that will hire a top kid from a less rich school. The world is corrupt. Even the environment at these top schools is corrupt.
It is what it is. Get some coping skills and make something of yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to East Flyover State U and ended up in a top professional school with lots of ivy grads. They were okay-everyone in the class was pretty smart but they were not smarter than the non ivy students at all. They were more coddled (and much richer) on average but there were of course exceptions.

I’ve had the same experience.

Sour grapes

I do think people who didn’t go, or get into, ivies are a bit sour, but not in the way that you think. I think people are sour because, especially if they graduated from a top five or ten public, they feel like they were better trained but society still sees them as a notch below Ivy League grads who benefit from societal presuppositions about Ivy schools. And, as Forbes point out, employers are starting to catch on to that. The problem with private schools is that they rely too much on donors. As such, they can’t totally go too hard on their students. Public schools will flunk you, and that builds character and puts a little chip on students’ shoulders. Privates are afraid to flunk their students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I don't think a lot of people have that idea. Top students at less rich and less privileged schools have lots of opportunity.

And yet there are plenty of employees that will only interview at certain schools.
This isn’t sour grapes-I went to one of those schools. I just think it’s elitist and absurd.

And there are plenty of employees that will hire a top kid from a less rich school. The world is corrupt. Even the environment at these top schools is corrupt.
It is what it is. Get some coping skills and make something of yourself.

Big Dartmouth energy here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to East Flyover State U and ended up in a top professional school with lots of ivy grads. They were okay-everyone in the class was pretty smart but they were not smarter than the non ivy students at all. They were more coddled (and much richer) on average but there were of course exceptions.

I’ve had the same experience.

Sour grapes

I do think people who didn’t go, or get into, ivies are a bit sour, but not in the way that you think. I think people are sour because, especially if they graduated from a top five or ten public, they feel like they were better trained but society still sees them as a notch below Ivy League grads who benefit from societal presuppositions about Ivy schools. And, as Forbes point out, employers are starting to catch on to that. The problem with private schools is that they rely too much on donors. As such, they can’t totally go too hard on their students. Public schools will flunk you, and that builds character and puts a little chip on students’ shoulders. Privates are afraid to flunk their students.

Are you even paying attention? Public support for higher education is taking an absolute beating right now. A rich private university may be better able to weather this storm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I honestly don’t think Ivy families think this, I know I don’t. But, there truly are very few dimwits and none in my kids major. Wouldn’t be possible.

[Anonymous]

Some of the dumbest people I've worked with went to Harvard/Cornell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to East Flyover State U and ended up in a top professional school with lots of ivy grads. They were okay-everyone in the class was pretty smart but they were not smarter than the non ivy students at all. They were more coddled (and much richer) on average but there were of course exceptions.

I’ve had the same experience.

Sour grapes

I do think people who didn’t go, or get into, ivies are a bit sour, but not in the way that you think. I think people are sour because, especially if they graduated from a top five or ten public, they feel like they were better trained but society still sees them as a notch below Ivy League grads who benefit from societal presuppositions about Ivy schools. And, as Forbes point out, employers are starting to catch on to that. The problem with private schools is that they rely too much on donors. As such, they can’t totally go too hard on their students. Public schools will flunk you, and that builds character and puts a little chip on students’ shoulders. Privates are afraid to flunk their students.

Omg. NOT. They expel, suspend and flunk them all of the time if they are up to snuff. Where do you people come up with your theories?

Ted Turner billionaire founder of CNN and TBS was asked to leave Brown during his senior year. Apparently Turner, who was studying economics was suspended twice. One of those times was for getting caught with a girl in his room.

Robert Smigel of SNL originally went to Cornell for Dentistry but knew he never really wanted to be a Dentist. He said in one interview that he failed so badly at pre-Dentistry classes that his parents felt sorry for him and let him transfer to NYU to study communications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of the dumbest people I've worked with went to Harvard/Cornell.

For me it was CNU and SMU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I honestly don’t think Ivy families think this, I know I don’t. But, there truly are very few dimwits and none in my kids major. Wouldn’t be possible.

So kushner is a one off?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope:
One at an ivy. One at UVA. There are many more opportunities at the ivy and for the most part classes demand much more: more reading per week, more difficult problem sets, more complex midterms in calc. Peers do multiple time-intensive activities in addition to class at the ivy and more have campus jobs(though usually these are resume building jobs such as research or paid undergrad learning assistant). Classes are a lot smaller at the ivy but that is not coddling.

Same but different top flagship, both stem majors. There’s a reason the Ivies have such high MCAT scores on average and require far less time on prep, the classes and exams are intense and prepare them well.

I know it’s more fun to knock them down and they aren’t perfect, but the intense rigor and keeping up with the best of the best is very challenging and not being coddled in the slightest.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is disputing that there are super bright people at ivies, it’s more the idea that the dimwits there (and there are definitely plenty of dimwits there) are more capable than the top students at lot lots of other (less rich, less privileged) schools.

I honestly don’t think Ivy families think this, I know I don’t. But, there truly are very few dimwits and none in my kids major. Wouldn’t be possible.

So kushner is a one off?

In my opinion any dimwits getting in are of the donor variety, but my kid hasn’t encountered any as they wouldn’t be in their major.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to East Flyover State U and ended up in a top professional school with lots of ivy grads. They were okay-everyone in the class was pretty smart but they were not smarter than the non ivy students at all. They were more coddled (and much richer) on average but there were of course exceptions.

I’ve had the same experience.

Sour grapes

I do think people who didn’t go, or get into, ivies are a bit sour, but not in the way that you think. I think people are sour because, especially if they graduated from a top five or ten public, they feel like they were better trained but society still sees them as a notch below Ivy League grads who benefit from societal presuppositions about Ivy schools. And, as Forbes point out, employers are starting to catch on to that. The problem with private schools is that they rely too much on donors. As such, they can’t totally go too hard on their students. Public schools will flunk you, and that builds character and puts a little chip on students’ shoulders. Privates are afraid to flunk their students.

Omg. NOT. They expel, suspend and flunk them all of the time if they are up to snuff. Where do you people come up with your theories?

Ted Turner billionaire founder of CNN and TBS was asked to leave Brown during his senior year. Apparently Turner, who was studying economics was suspended twice. One of those times was for getting caught with a girl in his room.

Robert Smigel of SNL originally went to Cornell for Dentistry but knew he never really wanted to be a Dentist. He said in one interview that he failed so badly at pre-Dentistry classes that his parents felt sorry for him and let him transfer to NYU to study communications.

Turner's expulsion happened like 60 years ago and had nothing to do with academics.