APS new “hall pass system”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the teachers will have a program and logs when they leave. Or there's something in a classroom. If a student is gone for too long, it automatically alerts admin or security (hopefully the time-keeping isn't up to the teacher, as if teacher don't have enough responsibilities).

That’s what I’m talking about! This could be great.

I fell down some reddits on Minga and it has been used to discipline teachers for allowing too many kids a hall pass, too many during specific periods, allowing kids to overstay the maximum time out (it looks like some schools set a timer)... There's also some amusing TikToks from students along the lines of, "My school doesn't care if we OD, but they do care if we sh-t for more than 8 minutes." This tracks for me how employers use swipe cards, devise tracking, keyboard and screen tracking... Be careful what you wish for when it comes to monitoring software. It's not just there to monitor those crazy kids.

I get all my best info from kids on TikTok. I’m a teacher, and not worried about being tracked. At all. I do think we need to do something about kids roaming the halls when they shouldn’t be, and this would help.

But how, specifically, does it help the hall roaming? Why is this different than the existing hall pass system? Are there hall monitors now? Are there hall monitors under the digital system?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the teachers will have a program and logs when they leave. Or there's something in a classroom. If a student is gone for too long, it automatically alerts admin or security (hopefully the time-keeping isn't up to the teacher, as if teacher don't have enough responsibilities).

That’s what I’m talking about! This could be great.

I fell down some reddits on Minga and it has been used to discipline teachers for allowing too many kids a hall pass, too many during specific periods, allowing kids to overstay the maximum time out (it looks like some schools set a timer)... There's also some amusing TikToks from students along the lines of, "My school doesn't care if we OD, but they do care if we sh-t for more than 8 minutes." This tracks for me how employers use swipe cards, devise tracking, keyboard and screen tracking... Be careful what you wish for when it comes to monitoring software. It's not just there to monitor those crazy kids.

I get all my best info from kids on TikTok. I’m a teacher, and not worried about being tracked. At all. I do think we need to do something about kids roaming the halls when they shouldn’t be, and this would help.

But how, specifically, does it help the hall roaming? Why is this different than the existing hall pass system? Are there hall monitors now? Are there hall monitors under the digital system?

I think the data would be helpful, and I know I don’t have the time to collect it nor coordinate it. I know many kids should be in class and they’re not. I know the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Let’s try this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Over in the AEM discussion someone mentioned that kids wouldn’t bring devices to restrooms – they would just use the device to request a hall pass.

This seems like a colossal waste of everyone’s time.

The kid needs to pee. Does he ask the teacher before requesting via device or is the teacher supposed to be monitoring yet another thing while simultaneously teaching?

Ignoring the idiocy of the above procedure, and acknowledging that any form of bathroom request likely interrupts something, then the kid heads to the restroom. We all know the issues with bringing a device. But say the AEM poster was correct and kids bring nothing, if a staff member sees them in the hall, do they check the app in real time to see if the kid actually has a pass?

I’m genuinely curious. I can see a million issues with this and none of them solve the safety issue of a non-student being in the building or the ridiculous amount of extra work needed to teach the system that Larlo and Larla shouldn’t be granted passes at the same time because they’re dating this week and might go have sex in a stairwell.

This just seems like $50k that could have been used as paper chains to create a barrier around schools with more effectiveness.

Fans of this system, what am I missing?

Imagine you have the same high school kid that is leaving for 10 to 15 minutes every class period. So… potentially missing about an hour of instruction every day.

This might help everyone figure that out more quickly. Please remember that high school teachers often have multiple preps, and typically about 165 students apiece, if you count advisories (and you should).

I think teachers already generally know which students are frequently absent or leave class for extended periods of time. Maybe they don't know if an individual kid is leaving every class period; but they surely know how often, and for how long, from their own class. If it's someone who regularly does this, they could simply stop approving passes for these students.

Ha! Sure. That’s how it works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I fell down some reddits on Minga and it has been used to discipline teachers for allowing too many kids a hall pass, too many during specific periods, allowing kids to overstay the maximum time out (it looks like some schools set a timer)... There's also some amusing TikToks from students along the lines of, "My school doesn't care if we OD, but they do care if we sh-t for more than 8 minutes." This tracks for me how employers use swipe cards, devise tracking, keyboard and screen tracking... Be careful what you wish for when it comes to monitoring software. It's not just there to monitor those crazy kids.

Um...isn't it the teacher's job to teach a class, not monitor bathroom breaks and how many people are gone for how long? Why don't some of the extra Syphax staff come over and monitor hallways and bathrooms?

This is the best idea I’ve heard re: APS this year. No sarcasm.

[Anonymous]

My high school uses this. They can access it on their school chromebook/iPad, so the phone isn’t an issue. It tracks where the student is going and how long they’re out. I kinda hate the surveillance aspect of it but it’s also useful when you’re explaining to a parent their kid is failing and you have screenshots showing they miss 45 minutes of each class each day on “bathroom” passes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Over in the AEM discussion someone mentioned that kids wouldn’t bring devices to restrooms – they would just use the device to request a hall pass.

This seems like a colossal waste of everyone’s time.

The kid needs to pee. Does he ask the teacher before requesting via device or is the teacher supposed to be monitoring yet another thing while simultaneously teaching?

Ignoring the idiocy of the above procedure, and acknowledging that any form of bathroom request likely interrupts something, then the kid heads to the restroom. We all know the issues with bringing a device. But say the AEM poster was correct and kids bring nothing, if a staff member sees them in the hall, do they check the app in real time to see if the kid actually has a pass?

I’m genuinely curious. I can see a million issues with this and none of them solve the safety issue of a non-student being in the building or the ridiculous amount of extra work needed to teach the system that Larlo and Larla shouldn’t be granted passes at the same time because they’re dating this week and might go have sex in a stairwell.

This just seems like $50k that could have been used as paper chains to create a barrier around schools with more effectiveness.

Fans of this system, what am I missing?

Imagine you have the same high school kid that is leaving for 10 to 15 minutes every class period. So… potentially missing about an hour of instruction every day.

This might help everyone figure that out more quickly. Please remember that high school teachers often have multiple preps, and typically about 165 students apiece, if you count advisories (and you should).

I think teachers already generally know which students are frequently absent or leave class for extended periods of time. Maybe they don't know if an individual kid is leaving every class period; but they surely know how often, and for how long, from their own class. If it's someone who regularly does this, they could simply stop approving passes for these students.

In theory yes, but in reality, then their parents scream that they have anxiety about using the bathroom and to give them their passes back. Parents absolutely are the block to giving meaningful consequences anymore.

-hs teacher

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Over in the AEM discussion someone mentioned that kids wouldn’t bring devices to restrooms – they would just use the device to request a hall pass.

This seems like a colossal waste of everyone’s time.

The kid needs to pee. Does he ask the teacher before requesting via device or is the teacher supposed to be monitoring yet another thing while simultaneously teaching?

Ignoring the idiocy of the above procedure, and acknowledging that any form of bathroom request likely interrupts something, then the kid heads to the restroom. We all know the issues with bringing a device. But say the AEM poster was correct and kids bring nothing, if a staff member sees them in the hall, do they check the app in real time to see if the kid actually has a pass?

I’m genuinely curious. I can see a million issues with this and none of them solve the safety issue of a non-student being in the building or the ridiculous amount of extra work needed to teach the system that Larlo and Larla shouldn’t be granted passes at the same time because they’re dating this week and might go have sex in a stairwell.

This just seems like $50k that could have been used as paper chains to create a barrier around schools with more effectiveness.

Fans of this system, what am I missing?

Imagine you have the same high school kid that is leaving for 10 to 15 minutes every class period. So… potentially missing about an hour of instruction every day.

This might help everyone figure that out more quickly. Please remember that high school teachers often have multiple preps, and typically about 165 students apiece, if you count advisories (and you should).

I think teachers already generally know which students are frequently absent or leave class for extended periods of time. Maybe they don't know if an individual kid is leaving every class period; but they surely know how often, and for how long, from their own class. If it's someone who regularly does this, they could simply stop approving passes for these students.

In theory yes, but in reality, then their parents scream that they have anxiety about using the bathroom and to give them their passes back. Parents absolutely are the block to giving meaningful consequences anymore.

-hs teacher

Yes. I think it might help some of them to see the data across classes. Also, it might help us identify a problem sooner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Over in the AEM discussion someone mentioned that kids wouldn’t bring devices to restrooms – they would just use the device to request a hall pass.

This seems like a colossal waste of everyone’s time.

The kid needs to pee. Does he ask the teacher before requesting via device or is the teacher supposed to be monitoring yet another thing while simultaneously teaching?

Ignoring the idiocy of the above procedure, and acknowledging that any form of bathroom request likely interrupts something, then the kid heads to the restroom. We all know the issues with bringing a device. But say the AEM poster was correct and kids bring nothing, if a staff member sees them in the hall, do they check the app in real time to see if the kid actually has a pass?

I’m genuinely curious. I can see a million issues with this and none of them solve the safety issue of a non-student being in the building or the ridiculous amount of extra work needed to teach the system that Larlo and Larla shouldn’t be granted passes at the same time because they’re dating this week and might go have sex in a stairwell.

This just seems like $50k that could have been used as paper chains to create a barrier around schools with more effectiveness.

Fans of this system, what am I missing?

Imagine you have the same high school kid that is leaving for 10 to 15 minutes every class period. So… potentially missing about an hour of instruction every day.

This might help everyone figure that out more quickly. Please remember that high school teachers often have multiple preps, and typically about 165 students apiece, if you count advisories (and you should).

I think teachers already generally know which students are frequently absent or leave class for extended periods of time. Maybe they don't know if an individual kid is leaving every class period; but they surely know how often, and for how long, from their own class. If it's someone who regularly does this, they could simply stop approving passes for these students.

In theory yes, but in reality, then their parents scream that they have anxiety about using the bathroom and to give them their passes back. Parents absolutely are the block to giving meaningful consequences anymore.

-hs teacher

How do the digital passes actually get kids to return to class sooner instead of wandering around or hanging out in the bathroom for 20 minutes? What oversight is happening in the halls and restrooms?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That other districts use it doesn't sway me. Our students need to be less tethered to tech. If teachers are burdened in the classroom with monitoring hall passes, that needs to be examined by Spyhax. Syphax could actually be useful and figure out what the hell is going on in our schools, with staffing, and with our students. Just slapping a tech bandaid on it and calling it a day isn't going to do anything but add a layer of big brother. No solutions. Just throwing $50,000 at an app and calling it a day, which is indeed par for the course with APS.

And APS just added new Deans of students at middle and high schools last year to focus more on student behavior issues. They need to be the frontline in their schools on this issue. Hearing from teachers what the issues are, and making sure to relay that to Syphax. Not more big brother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That other districts use it doesn't sway me. Our students need to be less tethered to tech. If teachers are burdened in the classroom with monitoring hall passes, that needs to be examined by Spyhax. Syphax could actually be useful and figure out what the hell is going on in our schools, with staffing, and with our students. Just slapping a tech bandaid on it and calling it a day isn't going to do anything but add a layer of big brother. No solutions. Just throwing $50,000 at an app and calling it a day, which is indeed par for the course with APS.

And APS just added new Deans of students at middle and high schools last year to focus more on student behavior issues. They need to be the frontline in their schools on this issue. Hearing from teachers what the issues are, and making sure to relay that to Syphax. Not more big brother.

what is syphax

[Anonymous]

The hand wringing over the tracking. By parents who install Life360. So they can track their kid every minute. and totally believe they are the only ones who will ever have access to the data.

Also, how dare schools try to do anything to make kids be in class and learn stuff?

and also, parents should be involved in these kind of decisions that are going on in our schools! Oh wait. No they shouldn't. Or I guess now they should because it's something that concerns me and effects my kid...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The hand wringing over the tracking. By parents who install Life360. So they can track their kid every minute. and totally believe they are the only ones who will ever have access to the data.

Also, how dare schools try to do anything to make kids be in class and learn stuff?

and also, parents should be involved in these kind of decisions that are going on in our schools! Oh wait. No they shouldn't. Or I guess now they should because it's something that concerns me and effects my kid...

I don't use any tracking program on my kids' phones. I probably should for when they go out for a walk on their own, or out with friends. But I don't.
I'm not firmly opposed to the digital hall pass idea in general. I want to know more about how it actually works, what the actual logistics are, exactly what is going to be tracked or not. More importantly, I want to know if there's any possibility of APS expanding its use of Minga beyond simple digital hall passes. Because I DON'T want my kids to have to download the app on their personal phones and I don't want my kids to have to show their ID on their school laptop to get into school events. And I don't want my kids tracked by school beyond the school day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a high school teacher. Lots of rumors here. I doubt the expectation is that kids will have to use their own phones. I highly doubt the expectation is that they take their laptops or iPads into the bathrooms.

Sorry, but I appreciate this effort on the part of APS. It may eliminate kids meeting up in the bathroom, or abusing bathroom privileges. That, I assure you, is rampant. Of course, there are many kids that don’t abuse the privilege, occasionally may need to take longer, or what have you. I doubt any of this will be a problem for them.

It is an extra measure of school safety and security. I’m down.

“Students will have to use their own phones”…. So APS is going to buy phones for all students middle school and up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The hand wringing over the tracking. By parents who install Life360. So they can track their kid every minute. and totally believe they are the only ones who will ever have access to the data.

Also, how dare schools try to do anything to make kids be in class and learn stuff?

and also, parents should be involved in these kind of decisions that are going on in our schools! Oh wait. No they shouldn't. Or I guess now they should because it's something that concerns me and effects my kid...

I don't track my kids. I am involved in APS and wish more parents were. A few decent points in favor, but overwhelmingly I'm opposed to this idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a high school teacher. Lots of rumors here. I doubt the expectation is that kids will have to use their own phones. I highly doubt the expectation is that they take their laptops or iPads into the bathrooms.

Sorry, but I appreciate this effort on the part of APS. It may eliminate kids meeting up in the bathroom, or abusing bathroom privileges. That, I assure you, is rampant. Of course, there are many kids that don’t abuse the privilege, occasionally may need to take longer, or what have you. I doubt any of this will be a problem for them.

It is an extra measure of school safety and security. I’m down.

“Students will have to use their own phones”…. So APS is going to buy phones for all students middle school and up?

OMG- WHO are you quoting? This is absolutely not a thing.