S/o how to ensure I’m not a burden on my kids as I age

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Before her dementia got too bad, my mother used to tell me she did not want to be a burden. Unsurprisingly, she became a great burden as her dementia progressed. She now begs me to take her home every time I visit her in memory care.

Once my kids are old enough, I want them to understand that if/when I am debilitated with dementia, that I may say hurtful or guilt inducing things to them, but that it's the disease talking and not my true self talking. I'd want them to know that it's okay to feel bad, but to try not to feel guilt--because doing what works for them in regards to visiting or caring for me is the best thing they can do.

Also, if it hasn't already been mentioned, plan out and pay for your funeral in advance.

That’s got to be so hard! It’s such a good thing you recognize it’s the disease talking and not your mom. It’s hard when they get old!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Assisted suicide for debilitating, terminal illness.

It's only available in 10 states and the District of Columbia.
https://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/physician-assisted-suicide-fast-facts/index.html

Switzerland. Don’t need to go through the hoopla. Infinitely preferable to draining all assets and ruining children’s lives.

OP here. I keep hearing Switzerland but how does it work. My mother has and grandmother had dementia. I don’t want to live with it and don’t want my kids burdened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do people ever just donate/ throw out the contents of the whole house? I can’t imagine anyone will want my parents stuff, even as donations. It’s junk.

I’ll take the pictures and throw out the rest. Or does it end up being psychologically hard to do so?

Not hard, I just did that. Had someone come in to look at selling stuff and they said there wasn’t enough to make it worth their while. There are a few things we set aside to try to sell. Definitely had to do all this after my parent moved out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reality check for all of us: by the time we develop dementia or the like or figure out we’re a burden, it’ll be too late to do anything about it.

right, that's why OP is asking what they can do to "ensure" they aren't a burden to their kids.

OP, the only thing I can think of is memory care. When you hit dementia, you won't even realize that this is what you have, and that life sucks because of it. It becomes your new normal.

Having thought long and hard about this after managing my dad's care for years and watching my SILs manage the care of their parents, these are things we should probably ALL be doing.

*Downsize and get rid of your excess sh** as soon as you can. Your kids will thank you and you won't be so bogged down by your stuff that inertia takes over and you postpone moving to a better place for you.

*Move closer to your kids so that they won't have to scramble to manage your care from long distance.

*Write down detailed information about all your assets, including bank account info and amounts; life insurance policies and any other type of policies; stocks and bonds; annuity plans and amounts; outstanding debts, etc.--write it all down and put it in one master document. Attach the most recent copy of your will. Update yearly. That is what my dad did for me and it made handling his estate a lot easier. It also helped me when I had to fill out paperwork for his move to an assisted living community. If you can't handle your own finances one day, your kids will need to know what you have so they can complete the lengthy financial paperwork required by assisted living, memory care, and continuum of care communities. If you don't want them to know what you have/owe, then appoint someone like a lawyer to handle these things. And while you're at it, put someone on at least one of your accounts so that they have money to pay your bills if you cannot do it for yourself.

*Complete all the necessary medical directives years before you think you need them so there's no second-guessing what you want if you're incapacitated. Give all your kids a copy and one to your primary physician if you have one.

*SAVE at ton of money, at least a million, so that you have enough to cover expenses if you ever need costly care.

*Start taking care of yourself NOW. Prioritize your health so that you can maybe avoid some of the common ailments of aging. Lose the weight, stop smoking, cut back on drinking, do some cardio like walking on most days, start strength training and eating more protein to build muscle (especially if you are a woman), incorporate balance exercises to prevent falls by the time you're 70. (I'm in my early 60s and I've started doing these things now not just to live better in the present but to decrease the chances of health problems down the road). Whatever I do will be better than what my parents did to prepare for old age, which was nothing. We know better so we have to do better.

*Either move to a home that is appropriate for older adults or start renovating your home now so that there is a full bath on the first floor. Move the washer/dryer to the first floor. Get these things in place before you need them.

*Explore elder care options in your current community or any future one you want to move to so that you scope out your options as you age that do not involve burdening your kids. For example, I know someone in DC who lived in a neighborhood (Palisades, I think) with a community organization that organized younger seniors (usually retired and in their 60s and 70s) to do simple chores, run errands, and drive older seniors to appointments so that they could also avail of these forms of assistance as they aged--a sort of organized paying-it-forward. I also know several people who live in cooperative-type neighborhoods where some of these forms of assistance are exchanged. I suspect new models of aging in place will develop in the future that will involve alternatives to depending entirely on our kids. These things are out there. You just have to do some research. Also explore continuum of care communities near you years before you think you need them so that you know what is available and you've done the legwork yourself instead of relying on your kids to do it. There's a whole range of them and they're not all bad. I visited one woman in a really posh one in Bethesda that had a very high buy-in but, if you could afford it, had beautiful apartments and attractive amenities in the independent living side. They are not nursing homes. Increasingly, these communities are appearing in walkable or urban areas, such as this new one being built right on Maple Avenue in downtown Vienna, VA (https://www.sunriseseniorliving.com/communities/va/sunrise-of-vienna). It clearly is catering to people like me who want to be in a walkable community with people of all ages rather than being on an isolated campus with just other older adults.


*Additional "action steps" in response to conversations on this forum:

*For those that say they want to off themselves if/when things get too bad in old age, you may want to research and move to states that allow physician-assisted suicide. Interestingly, DC is one of them, but the states that a lot of seniors move to (Florida, Arizona, the South) do not offer physician-assisted suicide. Maybe advocate for that issue in your own state if it isn't offered.

*For those that complain about having to care for parents they don't like or love, as you age maybe start working on your relationship with your kids if you suspect that your kids will want nothing to do with you later in life. Go to counseling with them now if there's an issue. Work on your relationships with all your kids. Whether you end up being a burden to them or not, there's clearly a lot of adults who harbor anger and resentment towards parents and siblings and that will be amplified exponentially in an elder care situation.
https://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/physician-assisted-suicide-fast-facts/index.html

This is just off the top of my head. I'm looking forward to other peoples' suggestions.

This 25 to 50 year old group ,for the most part, will not be caring for us. At all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Assisted suicide for debilitating, terminal illness.

It's only available in 10 states and the District of Columbia.
https://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/physician-assisted-suicide-fast-facts/index.html

Switzerland. Don’t need to go through the hoopla. Infinitely preferable to draining all assets and ruining children’s lives.

OP here. I keep hearing Switzerland but how does it work. My mother has and grandmother had dementia. I don’t want to live with it and don’t want my kids burdened.

Knowing Switzerland all too well, I am sure that people who have diagnosed dementia would be unable to avail themselves of that option. The Switzerland comments are usually made by people who have no idea what they are talking about. If anything, Canadian laws sounds much more liberal in that regard. Even there, I doubt it would be permissible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am first gen Indian immigrant so I have not had to deal with aging parents on day to day basis. My aging ILs are in India and I fly back frequently to visit them and do a lot of remote care -CCTV, attendants, domestic help - which is a financial possibility in India.

In my mind, the culture of multi-generational families removes the challenges of eldercare and childcare if the family is functional and collaborative. In Indian culture, at least we do have a blueprint for this type of living.

In US, I observe with interest how others in my community are navigating old age. Example 1 - One widowed friend sold her house and pooled the money with her 2 married ACs to help both children buy large homes in good school districts in different cities. She is the co-owner and has her own independent unit in these homes and shares the common area. Her kids would not have been able to afford these houses at such an young age without her help. She lives in both places and has her friends circle and medical care in both places. More importantly, she has freed herself of home maintainence tasks, personal security concerns or having someone to take care of her if she is unwell because the infrastructure is in place in both houses. At the same time, she had control of her property, and her independence.

Example 2 - Another older couple, had their eldest son and DIL continue to live in to their home after marriage and continued supporting them. Once the younger couple were financially solvent, the older couple sold their home and all became co-owners of a large home in a good school district in DMV. At one point four generations were living in the same house. Later on, the older couple, sold their ownership to their son and DIL and started paying rent to them. They used the money to finance their youngest son's house. Through long illness and death of the older man, the family has shared the care and the life of the remaining partner has not been upended.

In the case of both examples, several things were common -
- the parents were fairly young. First example, the lady as in her early 50s. The second example - the family were always in a multi-gen living and the older couple were also in their 50s.
- the parents were not broke. They all had the money to live independently if needed. They had also paid for their kids college, weddings etc so there is a natural gratefulness and respect for parents making these sacrifices for their children.
- the parents retained control of their money and property.
- the parents helped the children buy homes that they could not have bought by themselves. They also pitched in money to outsource chores (cleaners, landscapers, part time cook) that made it comfortable for the entire family and did not cause resentment
- the grandparents helped in raising the grandkids and it fostered bonds in the family
- the grandparents though very attached with their families, also had a thriving social life.

I have two thoughts about this post. 1. Your Indian experience is so pleasant because of the cheap labor in India, and not because of the family relationships. None of your relatives actually has to do the heavy lifting of caregiving, if they do, you aren't aware of it apparently. 2. None of your local friends is actually in the care-receiving stage. They just live with their kids, are fairly young and healthy. How are they going to cope if/when they get dementia? Who's going to the work? Who's going to stay at home 24/7 to stop them form wandering on the streets? Who will patiently redirect them when they start guilting their grandchildren? You provided none of the answers that would help OP and others who are in this situation.

[Anonymous]

If people are serious about not becoming a burden you need to choose an age at which you still have your faculties and make a decision to unalive yourself at that point. For me, it 80. But in reality, most people aren’t willing to go that far.

[Anonymous]

Here you go OP. I did the google search for you. It isn't Switzerland, but Canada is much closer. https://alzheimer.ca/en/help-support/im-caring-person-living-dementia/end-life-care/medical-assistance-dying

There is information out there that is easily accessible via internet. I recall reading a book about making a decision in advance about ending your life and the complications when it is for future and not current disability. I can't for the life of me remember what book this was in (I think one about Alzheimer's), but main takeaway is that you have to plan this out well in advance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am first gen Indian immigrant so I have not had to deal with aging parents on day to day basis. My aging ILs are in India and I fly back frequently to visit them and do a lot of remote care -CCTV, attendants, domestic help - which is a financial possibility in India.

In my mind, the culture of multi-generational families removes the challenges of eldercare and childcare if the family is functional and collaborative. In Indian culture, at least we do have a blueprint for this type of living.

In US, I observe with interest how others in my community are navigating old age. Example 1 - One widowed friend sold her house and pooled the money with her 2 married ACs to help both children buy large homes in good school districts in different cities. She is the co-owner and has her own independent unit in these homes and shares the common area. Her kids would not have been able to afford these houses at such an young age without her help. She lives in both places and has her friends circle and medical care in both places. More importantly, she has freed herself of home maintainence tasks, personal security concerns or having someone to take care of her if she is unwell because the infrastructure is in place in both houses. At the same time, she had control of her property, and her independence.

Example 2 - Another older couple, had their eldest son and DIL continue to live in to their home after marriage and continued supporting them. Once the younger couple were financially solvent, the older couple sold their home and all became co-owners of a large home in a good school district in DMV. At one point four generations were living in the same house. Later on, the older couple, sold their ownership to their son and DIL and started paying rent to them. They used the money to finance their youngest son's house. Through long illness and death of the older man, the family has shared the care and the life of the remaining partner has not been upended.

In the case of both examples, several things were common -
- the parents were fairly young. First example, the lady as in her early 50s. The second example - the family were always in a multi-gen living and the older couple were also in their 50s.
- the parents were not broke. They all had the money to live independently if needed. They had also paid for their kids college, weddings etc so there is a natural gratefulness and respect for parents making these sacrifices for their children.
- the parents retained control of their money and property.
- the parents helped the children buy homes that they could not have bought by themselves. They also pitched in money to outsource chores (cleaners, landscapers, part time cook) that made it comfortable for the entire family and did not cause resentment
- the grandparents helped in raising the grandkids and it fostered bonds in the family
- the grandparents though very attached with their families, also had a thriving social life.

I have two thoughts about this post. 1. Your Indian experience is so pleasant because of the cheap labor in India, and not because of the family relationships. None of your relatives actually has to do the heavy lifting of caregiving, if they do, you aren't aware of it apparently. 2. None of your local friends is actually in the care-receiving stage. They just live with their kids, are fairly young and healthy. How are they going to cope if/when they get dementia? Who's going to the work? Who's going to stay at home 24/7 to stop them form wandering on the streets? Who will patiently redirect them when they start guilting their grandchildren? You provided none of the answers that would help OP and others who are in this situation.

1. Labor is cheap in India for only that fraction of the population that have money to pay for labor. Having said that - a key component of elder care in India and America is to have enough money to pay for care. Most people are not wealthy but by pooling resources early in life, they are able to amass wealth that can be used to pay for care.

2. By being in a multi-generational family while they are still fairly young and healthy -
- they are surrounded by family members in the same household. They do not have to combat loneliness and insecurity
- they are helping their children and grandkid and strengthening family bonds.
- they are not burdened with the chores of home maintainence and running a household by themselves.
- they are saving money.

I have observed that many elderly people in such situations have needed help (attendants or nursing homes) at pretty advanced age or stage of illness and they have not lived long once they need a lot of care and supervision. I think loneliness, isolation and being cut off from family plays a part in dementia, addiction and mental illness. Living in a familiar home and with family seems to make the memory loss slower.

[Anonymous]

Why are folks using “unalive” as a verb? Just say “kill.” It’s the same thing and a euphemism isn’t going to change that.

[Anonymous]

Have a life beyond your spouse, adult children and grandchildren. Cultivate friendships with people of all ages. Don’t depend upon family members to be your sole source of engagement with the world.

Volunteer.

Stay busy with many things that interest like a sport, hobbies and even solo quiet activities like knitting or Bible study or crossword puzzles. Maintain a schedule even if it involves meeting friends for coffee, exercise class, volunteering, playing Bingo, napping.

Eat well.

Saying all this and I’m exhausted from taking care of my equally exhausting and demanding 88 year old mom who can’t entertain herself, has no hobbies and spends her days score keeping and holds grudges. She’s never had any hobbies or interests.

Doesn’t read, doesn’t like tv.

[Anonymous]

OP you may not have considered this but a friend's mother committed suicide to avoid being a burden, but guess what...now her and siblings are dealing with the pain of her doing that when they begged her not to. So, there's that. It wasn't exactly a win for her kids.

I like pp's recommendations. Read the XX Brain.

[Anonymous]

A pp mentioned "home". The parent wanted to be taken home. If the parent does have advanced dementia, the word "home" does not mean what we think. "Home" is the past. Home is, "I want to be like I was before." It's not a place/location.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am first gen Indian immigrant so I have not had to deal with aging parents on day to day basis. My aging ILs are in India and I fly back frequently to visit them and do a lot of remote care -CCTV, attendants, domestic help - which is a financial possibility in India.

In my mind, the culture of multi-generational families removes the challenges of eldercare and childcare if the family is functional and collaborative. In Indian culture, at least we do have a blueprint for this type of living.

In US, I observe with interest how others in my community are navigating old age. Example 1 - One widowed friend sold her house and pooled the money with her 2 married ACs to help both children buy large homes in good school districts in different cities. She is the co-owner and has her own independent unit in these homes and shares the common area. Her kids would not have been able to afford these houses at such an young age without her help. She lives in both places and has her friends circle and medical care in both places. More importantly, she has freed herself of home maintainence tasks, personal security concerns or having someone to take care of her if she is unwell because the infrastructure is in place in both houses. At the same time, she had control of her property, and her independence.

Example 2 - Another older couple, had their eldest son and DIL continue to live in to their home after marriage and continued supporting them. Once the younger couple were financially solvent, the older couple sold their home and all became co-owners of a large home in a good school district in DMV. At one point four generations were living in the same house. Later on, the older couple, sold their ownership to their son and DIL and started paying rent to them. They used the money to finance their youngest son's house. Through long illness and death of the older man, the family has shared the care and the life of the remaining partner has not been upended.

In the case of both examples, several things were common -
- the parents were fairly young. First example, the lady as in her early 50s. The second example - the family were always in a multi-gen living and the older couple were also in their 50s.
- the parents were not broke. They all had the money to live independently if needed. They had also paid for their kids college, weddings etc so there is a natural gratefulness and respect for parents making these sacrifices for their children.
- the parents retained control of their money and property.
- the parents helped the children buy homes that they could not have bought by themselves. They also pitched in money to outsource chores (cleaners, landscapers, part time cook) that made it comfortable for the entire family and did not cause resentment
- the grandparents helped in raising the grandkids and it fostered bonds in the family
- the grandparents though very attached with their families, also had a thriving social life.

I have two thoughts about this post. 1. Your Indian experience is so pleasant because of the cheap labor in India, and not because of the family relationships. None of your relatives actually has to do the heavy lifting of caregiving, if they do, you aren't aware of it apparently. 2. None of your local friends is actually in the care-receiving stage. They just live with their kids, are fairly young and healthy. How are they going to cope if/when they get dementia? Who's going to the work? Who's going to stay at home 24/7 to stop them form wandering on the streets? Who will patiently redirect them when they start guilting their grandchildren? You provided none of the answers that would help OP and others who are in this situation.

1. Labor is cheap in India for only that fraction of the population that have money to pay for labor. Having said that - a key component of elder care in India and America is to have enough money to pay for care. Most people are not wealthy but by pooling resources early in life, they are able to amass wealth that can be used to pay for care.

2. By being in a multi-generational family while they are still fairly young and healthy -
- they are surrounded by family members in the same household. They do not have to combat loneliness and insecurity
- they are helping their children and grandkid and strengthening family bonds.
- they are not burdened with the chores of home maintainence and running a household by themselves.
- they are saving money.

I have observed that many elderly people in such situations have needed help (attendants or nursing homes) at pretty advanced age or stage of illness and they have not lived long once they need a lot of care and supervision. I think loneliness, isolation and being cut off from family plays a part in dementia, addiction and mental illness. Living in a familiar home and with family seems to make the memory loss slower.

It's a nice idea, but I don't see it working in all cultures. When my parents visit, they are more of a burden than anything. I have young children to shuttle around and a full time job, but when they're here, they want to me help them with a variety of things, and spend time with them that I don't have. They also feel like they've done their job raising children, so while they're happy to sit down for a family dinner or go watch a soccer game, they're not willing to provide childcare or cook a meal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reality check for all of us: by the time we develop dementia or the like or figure out we’re a burden, it’ll be too late to do anything about it.

right, that's why OP is asking what they can do to "ensure" they aren't a burden to their kids.

OP, the only thing I can think of is memory care. When you hit dementia, you won't even realize that this is what you have, and that life sucks because of it. It becomes your new normal.

Having thought long and hard about this after managing my dad's care for years and watching my SILs manage the care of their parents, these are things we should probably ALL be doing.

*Downsize and get rid of your excess sh** as soon as you can. Your kids will thank you and you won't be so bogged down by your stuff that inertia takes over and you postpone moving to a better place for you.

*Move closer to your kids so that they won't have to scramble to manage your care from long distance.

*Write down detailed information about all your assets, including bank account info and amounts; life insurance policies and any other type of policies; stocks and bonds; annuity plans and amounts; outstanding debts, etc.--write it all down and put it in one master document. Attach the most recent copy of your will. Update yearly. That is what my dad did for me and it made handling his estate a lot easier. It also helped me when I had to fill out paperwork for his move to an assisted living community. If you can't handle your own finances one day, your kids will need to know what you have so they can complete the lengthy financial paperwork required by assisted living, memory care, and continuum of care communities. If you don't want them to know what you have/owe, then appoint someone like a lawyer to handle these things. And while you're at it, put someone on at least one of your accounts so that they have money to pay your bills if you cannot do it for yourself.

*Complete all the necessary medical directives years before you think you need them so there's no second-guessing what you want if you're incapacitated. Give all your kids a copy and one to your primary physician if you have one.

*SAVE at ton of money, at least a million, so that you have enough to cover expenses if you ever need costly care.

*Start taking care of yourself NOW. Prioritize your health so that you can maybe avoid some of the common ailments of aging. Lose the weight, stop smoking, cut back on drinking, do some cardio like walking on most days, start strength training and eating more protein to build muscle (especially if you are a woman), incorporate balance exercises to prevent falls by the time you're 70. (I'm in my early 60s and I've started doing these things now not just to live better in the present but to decrease the chances of health problems down the road). Whatever I do will be better than what my parents did to prepare for old age, which was nothing. We know better so we have to do better.

*Either move to a home that is appropriate for older adults or start renovating your home now so that there is a full bath on the first floor. Move the washer/dryer to the first floor. Get these things in place before you need them.

*Explore elder care options in your current community or any future one you want to move to so that you scope out your options as you age that do not involve burdening your kids. For example, I know someone in DC who lived in a neighborhood (Palisades, I think) with a community organization that organized younger seniors (usually retired and in their 60s and 70s) to do simple chores, run errands, and drive older seniors to appointments so that they could also avail of these forms of assistance as they aged--a sort of organized paying-it-forward. I also know several people who live in cooperative-type neighborhoods where some of these forms of assistance are exchanged. I suspect new models of aging in place will develop in the future that will involve alternatives to depending entirely on our kids. These things are out there. You just have to do some research. Also explore continuum of care communities near you years before you think you need them so that you know what is available and you've done the legwork yourself instead of relying on your kids to do it. There's a whole range of them and they're not all bad. I visited one woman in a really posh one in Bethesda that had a very high buy-in but, if you could afford it, had beautiful apartments and attractive amenities in the independent living side. They are not nursing homes. Increasingly, these communities are appearing in walkable or urban areas, such as this new one being built right on Maple Avenue in downtown Vienna, VA (https://www.sunriseseniorliving.com/communities/va/sunrise-of-vienna). It clearly is catering to people like me who want to be in a walkable community with people of all ages rather than being on an isolated campus with just other older adults.


*Additional "action steps" in response to conversations on this forum:

*For those that say they want to off themselves if/when things get too bad in old age, you may want to research and move to states that allow physician-assisted suicide. Interestingly, DC is one of them, but the states that a lot of seniors move to (Florida, Arizona, the South) do not offer physician-assisted suicide. Maybe advocate for that issue in your own state if it isn't offered.

*For those that complain about having to care for parents they don't like or love, as you age maybe start working on your relationship with your kids if you suspect that your kids will want nothing to do with you later in life. Go to counseling with them now if there's an issue. Work on your relationships with all your kids. Whether you end up being a burden to them or not, there's clearly a lot of adults who harbor anger and resentment towards parents and siblings and that will be amplified exponentially in an elder care situation.
https://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/physician-assisted-suicide-fast-facts/index.html

This is just off the top of my head. I'm looking forward to other peoples' suggestions.

This is amazing! Thank you for sharing!

Agreed. Thank you PP for sharing so much valuable information!