City councilwoman wants traffic cameras to dole out points, along with hefty fines

[Anonymous]

I’m pro car, anti bike lane. And I’m totally for this. But, her council colleagues will call this racist and regressive in 3, 2, 1….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

Perhaps here cameras will get the ATV drivers that make our city so livable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

But it wouldn't be enforceable in MD and VA. So it would just punish DC residents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

But it wouldn't be enforceable in MD and VA. So it would just punish DC residents.

Okay? If those DC residents are driving like a-holes they can get slammed too for all I care. I own a nice car that I drive regularly and I’m not at all concerned about this law, because I don’t speed or run red lights.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

Completely missing from that crappy analysis was the fact, confirmed by an industry database I have a license for, that the overwhelming majority of traffic through those lower income Black neighborhoods DOES NOT LIVE ANYWHERE NEAR THE NEIGHBORHOOD or even anywhere else in the District! We don’t know who those drivers are without additional data but we know they aren’t living in the neighborhoods they’re speeding through!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

But it wouldn't be enforceable in MD and VA. So it would just punish DC residents.

Okay? If those DC residents are driving like a-holes they can get slammed too for all I care. I own a nice car that I drive regularly and I’m not at all concerned about this law, because I don’t speed or run red lights.

The POINT was that you (or the PP) said that this would punish "crazy MD/VA drivers". It will not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

I assume you are talking about areas east of the river. I've been through the list of cameras (which is on the DDOT website) and the share of cameras in Wards 7 and 8 is less than those wards' share of the city's population. And the share is much less than Wards 7 and 8's share of fatal accidents in the city. If anything one could argue that it is racist to not have more cameras where black people are being killed by bad driving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

I assume you are talking about areas east of the river. I've been through the list of cameras (which is on the DDOT website) and the share of cameras in Wards 7 and 8 is less than those wards' share of the city's population. And the share is much less than Wards 7 and 8's share of fatal accidents in the city. If anything one could argue that it is racist to not have more cameras where black people are being killed by bad driving.

No, I was thinking of those articles about NYC, actually, like this: https://www.wnyc.org/story/speed-cameras-may-not-be-racist-road-design/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

Completely missing from that crappy analysis was the fact, confirmed by an industry database I have a license for, that the overwhelming majority of traffic through those lower income Black neighborhoods DOES NOT LIVE ANYWHERE NEAR THE NEIGHBORHOOD or even anywhere else in the District! We don’t know who those drivers are without additional data but we know they aren’t living in the neighborhoods they’re speeding through!!

And if they aren't from there, they won't be deterred by this legislation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s great. So sick of seeing running red lights, speeding and other reckless driving in neighborhoods with no consequences.

There are consequences. DC camera tickets are notoriously expensive. The problem is that too many people just pay them because they have the money and it's not a burden or they don't pay and DC looks the other way.

Did I say anywhere I support the speeding?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

But it wouldn't be enforceable in MD and VA. So it would just punish DC residents.

Okay? If those DC residents are driving like a-holes they can get slammed too for all I care. I own a nice car that I drive regularly and I’m not at all concerned about this law, because I don’t speed or run red lights.

You’ve clearly never been caught at a stop sign where you didn’t fully stop for three seconds. Because that is what some of these BS cameras give tickets for. It’s not just blowing through red lights.

And we should all be against enforcing points on your license for a camera fine. They don’t know who is driving the car.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot of studies showing traffic cameras disproportionately hit black drivers. This would be doubling down on that.

Putting aside the fact that the camera cannot determine the ethnicity of the driver before deciding whether to take a picture of a speeding car, traffic statistics tell us that speed and other forms of bad driving disproportionately affect black communities and kill black people. Would it not be more racist to just ignore the problem? Are the pocketbooks of black drivers more important than the lives of black victims of bad driving?

I think there might be the issue of where the speed cameras are placed.....there was some case somewhere else where the speed cameras were suggested to be placed in locations that had disproportionately more black drivers.

I assume you are talking about areas east of the river. I've been through the list of cameras (which is on the DDOT website) and the share of cameras in Wards 7 and 8 is less than those wards' share of the city's population. And the share is much less than Wards 7 and 8's share of fatal accidents in the city. If anything one could argue that it is racist to not have more cameras where black people are being killed by bad driving.

No, I was thinking of those articles about NYC, actually, like this: https://www.wnyc.org/story/speed-cameras-may-not-be-racist-road-design/

That article is very good and very applicable to DC. There was an attempt in the 60s to build a highway across the Potomac and into Ward 3. It was stopped. The construction of 295 in Anacostia obviously wasn't. Life east of the river would be very different today had that highway not been built or if it had since been put underground a la the Big Dig in Boston.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did she get elected with this type of thinking? One should wonder.

Because the voters who actually live here and deal with the crazy MD/VA drivers speeding recklessly through our neighborhoods day in/day out are strongly supportive. All the whining and moaning is coming from people who don’t live or vote in DC. Drive the speed limit or stay tf out of our city, I could not possibly feel less sympathy for you.

But it wouldn't be enforceable in MD and VA. So it would just punish DC residents.

Okay? If those DC residents are driving like a-holes they can get slammed too for all I care. I own a nice car that I drive regularly and I’m not at all concerned about this law, because I don’t speed or run red lights.

You’ve clearly never been caught at a stop sign where you didn’t fully stop for three seconds. Because that is what some of these BS cameras give tickets for. It’s not just blowing through red lights.

And we should all be against enforcing points on your license for a camera fine. They don’t know who is driving the car.

Do you know who is driving your car?