J.K. Rowling’s post on trans-identity and modern misogyny

[Anonymous]

^There are links throughout this thread if you want more information about the decades long attack by trans women on Canada’s oldest rape crisis center.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is acting like it’s so offensive that she said this during pride month. Let me tell you as a lesbian, so many of us are cheering her on. We’re not allowed to call our bars “for women” any more because apparently that offends non-binary people. I’ve literally seen posters saying such and such is a space for “non-men.” Are you kidding? We’re non-men now?

There’s also a lot of pressure to accept “girl d*ck” (their word, not ours). Most of us just quietly agree that we’re not interested and don’t say anything, but now in a lot of space we’re not even allowed to make lighthearted jokes about v*g because not all lesbians have that now. The activism of the 70s like the V*gna Monologues is censored on college campuses now, which is so regressive. There are also people who identify as he/him lesbians which... sigh

We also miss our butches, so many of whom have now begun to identify as men. For full grown adults to do that is fine but it hurts to see young girls who would have become masculine women transition to identify as men instead at very young ages, and I wonder if I were a teenager now if I’d be one of them.

Look, I KNOW that trans women have a really rough time. They’re the most violently targeted group within LGBT. I absolutely want to march with them for their safety, security, and freedom from discrimination. But the vast majority of violent attacks (all of them?) against trans women and trans men are committed by men. Straight men. But trans activists and allies have instead chosen to OBSESS about “TERFs” — ie women like JKR or like me who say “we support your right you live as you chose free of discrimination, but we also believe that in some cases XX women should be allowed their own spaces.”

Why is so much of the focus on women’s words and not men’s actions?

Well said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does J.K. Rowling write using her initials, and then also write the C.B. Strike novels as Robert Galbraith, a pseudonym? Did she realize that she would have better luck as a male author? Does anyone see the irony in that?

dp there is no irony. Where have you been? Did you read the post on here about "am I a snob because I don't think Harry Potter is good literature?" If she was a MAN and had written it he would have been declared a genius. Even today most people think women can not write male characters and that boys/men shouldn't have to read "chick" books! It is sexism pure and simple.

Once it became a runaway hit than it could be revealed but, still people question it and if it is "good"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does J.K. Rowling write using her initials, and then also write the C.B. Strike novels as Robert Galbraith, a pseudonym? Did she realize that she would have better luck as a male author? Does anyone see the irony in that?

dp there is no irony. Where have you been? Did you read the post on here about "am I a snob because I don't think Harry Potter is good literature?" If she was a MAN and had written it he would have been declared a genius. Even today most people think women can not write male characters and that boys/men shouldn't have to read "chick" books! It is sexism pure and simple.

Once it became a runaway hit than it could be revealed but, still people question it and if it is "good"

DP. It's also true that male authors do not use their own names when they write cozies, Regencies, etc. Readers expect what they expect. It's partly sexism and partly just preference (or what NY think is the readers' preference).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is acting like it’s so offensive that she said this during pride month. Let me tell you as a lesbian, so many of us are cheering her on. We’re not allowed to call our bars “for women” any more because apparently that offends non-binary people. I’ve literally seen posters saying such and such is a space for “non-men.” Are you kidding? We’re non-men now?

There’s also a lot of pressure to accept “girl d*ck” (their word, not ours). Most of us just quietly agree that we’re not interested and don’t say anything, but now in a lot of space we’re not even allowed to make lighthearted jokes about v*g because not all lesbians have that now. The activism of the 70s like the V*gna Monologues is censored on college campuses now, which is so regressive. There are also people who identify as he/him lesbians which... sigh

We also miss our butches, so many of whom have now begun to identify as men. For full grown adults to do that is fine but it hurts to see young girls who would have become masculine women transition to identify as men instead at very young ages, and I wonder if I were a teenager now if I’d be one of them.

Look, I KNOW that trans women have a really rough time. They’re the most violently targeted group within LGBT. I absolutely want to march with them for their safety, security, and freedom from discrimination. But the vast majority of violent attacks (all of them?) against trans women and trans men are committed by men. Straight men. But trans activists and allies have instead chosen to OBSESS about “TERFs” — ie women like JKR or like me who say “we support your right you live as you chose free of discrimination, but we also believe that in some cases XX women should be allowed their own spaces.”

Why is so much of the focus on women’s words and not men’s actions?

Well said.

Slow clap. Thank you for this perspective.

[Anonymous]

This is just so indicative of the liberal circular firing squad.

I am a very liberal very pro LGBTQ advocate.

Do I believe in trans rights to call themselves women/men? Yes.

Do I believe in their right to transition and for advocating for health care coverage for those procedures? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for awareness and help for children and teens struggling with their gender? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for anti discrimination laws to protect all LGLBTQ people from harm? Yes.

Do I believe in people being able to use whatever bathroom they want? Yes (I know I differ from JKR here).

Will I happily use whatever pronouns a person wants me to use? Yes.

Do I believe that we should stop using specifically gendered language to discuss gendered political issues that have oppressed women for centuries? No.

Do I believe there should be some acknowledgement of the biological differences that result from the biological sex hormones you were born with when it comes to sports? Yes.

Do I think there should be some safe spaces that women who have been violently victimized by men and who are uncomfortable with women in transition should be able to occupy if they would like as victims? Yes.

But you go to war against people like me, an ally who you would rather call a bigot, because of disagreements in nuance.

[Anonymous]

Does anyone remember in Silence of the Lambs, how the serial killer was a crossdressing man? They made him look terrifying as he was putting on his makeup and women's clothes. And then there was the Brian DePalma movie years and years ago "Dressed to Kill." And of course, who can forget the movie "Psycho" with men dressing as women who kill women?

Is it possible some of us women are actually afraid of sharing our "safe spaces" like public restrooms with trans women?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone remember in Silence of the Lambs, how the serial killer was a crossdressing man? They made him look terrifying as he was putting on his makeup and women's clothes. And then there was the Brian DePalma movie years and years ago "Dressed to Kill." And of course, who can forget the movie "Psycho" with men dressing as women who kill women?

Is it possible some of us women are actually afraid of sharing our "safe spaces" like public restrooms with trans women?

Only if you’re very stupid and are also terrified of dolls because of “Chucky”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is just so indicative of the liberal circular firing squad.

I am a very liberal very pro LGBTQ advocate.

Do I believe in trans rights to call themselves women/men? Yes.

Do I believe in their right to transition and for advocating for health care coverage for those procedures? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for awareness and help for children and teens struggling with their gender? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for anti discrimination laws to protect all LGLBTQ people from harm? Yes.

Do I believe in people being able to use whatever bathroom they want? Yes (I know I differ from JKR here).

Will I happily use whatever pronouns a person wants me to use? Yes.

Do I believe that we should stop using specifically gendered language to discuss gendered political issues that have oppressed women for centuries? No.

Do I believe there should be some acknowledgement of the biological differences that result from the biological sex hormones you were born with when it comes to sports? Yes.

Do I think there should be some safe spaces that women who have been violently victimized by men and who are uncomfortable with women in transition should be able to occupy if they would like as victims? Yes.

But you go to war against people like me, an ally who you would rather call a bigot, because of disagreements in nuance.

This is also me. But I’ll never say it out loud.

- a lesbian

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is just so indicative of the liberal circular firing squad.

I am a very liberal very pro LGBTQ advocate.

Do I believe in trans rights to call themselves women/men? Yes.

Do I believe in their right to transition and for advocating for health care coverage for those procedures? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for awareness and help for children and teens struggling with their gender? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for anti discrimination laws to protect all LGLBTQ people from harm? Yes.

Do I believe in people being able to use whatever bathroom they want? Yes (I know I differ from JKR here).

Will I happily use whatever pronouns a person wants me to use? Yes.

Do I believe that we should stop using specifically gendered language to discuss gendered political issues that have oppressed women for centuries? No.

Do I believe there should be some acknowledgement of the biological differences that result from the biological sex hormones you were born with when it comes to sports? Yes.

Do I think there should be some safe spaces that women who have been violently victimized by men and who are uncomfortable with women in transition should be able to occupy if they would like as victims? Yes.

But you go to war against people like me, an ally who you would rather call a bigot, because of disagreements in nuance.

This is also me. But I’ll never say it out loud.

- a lesbian

And this is a goddamn shame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is just so indicative of the liberal circular firing squad.

I am a very liberal very pro LGBTQ advocate.

Do I believe in trans rights to call themselves women/men? Yes.

Do I believe in their right to transition and for advocating for health care coverage for those procedures? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for awareness and help for children and teens struggling with their gender? Yes.

Do I believe in advocating for anti discrimination laws to protect all LGLBTQ people from harm? Yes.

Do I believe in people being able to use whatever bathroom they want? Yes (I know I differ from JKR here).

Will I happily use whatever pronouns a person wants me to use? Yes.

Do I believe that we should stop using specifically gendered language to discuss gendered political issues that have oppressed women for centuries? No.

Do I believe there should be some acknowledgement of the biological differences that result from the biological sex hormones you were born with when it comes to sports? Yes.

Do I think there should be some safe spaces that women who have been violently victimized by men and who are uncomfortable with women in transition should be able to occupy if they would like as victims? Yes.

But you go to war against people like me, an ally who you would rather call a bigot, because of disagreements in nuance.

This is also me. But I’ll never say it out loud.

- a lesbian

And this is a goddamn shame.

NP. But that’s the reality. Pp could lose employment and friendships if she were to state her opinions out loud. That’s how things work in the current “cancel” culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's interesting how this debate is only about trans women. Someone posted earlier upthread that no one cares about trans men. It all makes sense in terms of men "invading" a female space - even when they present as women, men still feel they have the right to define women in terms that best suit their agenda. We'd welcome you to the sisterhood with open arms if you weren't so intent on redefining an already occupied space.
Get your own space!

Basic TERFing right here.

Except that it’s not...

Women have had to fight so hard for resources and safe spaces, it is disconcerting to see them disintegrating under the banner of trans inclusion.

Even on this thread it’s now considered exclusionary to say women menstruate or that women bear children and go through menopause. Historically, much of the fight for women’s rights have included oppression directly related to female biological functions. Girls not being able to attend school because of their periods. Child marriage and forced or coerced pregnancy. Maternity care. Sexual violence and rape and the risk of pregnancy. All of these issues are not inclusive of trans women but they very relevant to biological women. Recognizing that reality is not anti-trans. It’s actually the height of misogyny to expect biological women to give up all the progress we’ve made and the safe spaces we’ve created because it might not be inclusive enough or relevant to a trans woman’s experience.

It’s TERF 101. No one is asking women to “give up” anything.

Actually they are.

Case in point, just this year trans advocacy resulted in defunding Canada’s oldest rape crisis center.

This was the end result of a decades long campaign and attacks from trans advocates. In the 1990’s a trans woman who presented as male wanted to volunteer with rape victims. The center offered her other ways to help but insisted that all volunteers be female so that victims of male violence feel safe. The trans woman immediately sued and tied up time and resources of the crisis rape center for decades until it was defunded this year.

So, don’t tell me that trans women’s advocacy isn’t asking women to give up anything. They absolutely are.

I love how all the people screaming TERF!!!! conveniently ignore things like this.

Remember, JK Rowling is a domestic violence survivor and she’s very involved in supporting shelters and crisis centers.

[Anonymous]

And today The Sun posts an interview with her abuser showing zero remorse at all. Because women are still, perpetually at the bottom of the totem pole.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is acting like it’s so offensive that she said this during pride month. Let me tell you as a lesbian, so many of us are cheering her on. We’re not allowed to call our bars “for women” any more because apparently that offends non-binary people. I’ve literally seen posters saying such and such is a space for “non-men.” Are you kidding? We’re non-men now?

There’s also a lot of pressure to accept “girl d*ck” (their word, not ours). Most of us just quietly agree that we’re not interested and don’t say anything, but now in a lot of space we’re not even allowed to make lighthearted jokes about v*g because not all lesbians have that now. The activism of the 70s like the V*gna Monologues is censored on college campuses now, which is so regressive. There are also people who identify as he/him lesbians which... sigh

We also miss our butches, so many of whom have now begun to identify as men. For full grown adults to do that is fine but it hurts to see young girls who would have become masculine women transition to identify as men instead at very young ages, and I wonder if I were a teenager now if I’d be one of them.

Look, I KNOW that trans women have a really rough time. They’re the most violently targeted group within LGBT. I absolutely want to march with them for their safety, security, and freedom from discrimination. But the vast majority of violent attacks (all of them?) against trans women and trans men are committed by men. Straight men. But trans activists and allies have instead chosen to OBSESS about “TERFs” — ie women like JKR or like me who say “we support your right you live as you chose free of discrimination, but we also believe that in some cases XX women should be allowed their own spaces.”

Why is so much of the focus on women’s words and not men’s actions?

+1 to all of this

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone remember in Silence of the Lambs, how the serial killer was a crossdressing man? They made him look terrifying as he was putting on his makeup and women's clothes. And then there was the Brian DePalma movie years and years ago "Dressed to Kill." And of course, who can forget the movie "Psycho" with men dressing as women who kill women?

Is it possible some of us women are actually afraid of sharing our "safe spaces" like public restrooms with trans women?

Only if you’re very stupid and are also terrified of dolls because of “Chucky”.

Some of us have to move beyond the images portrayed in the media about men who are crossdressing and men trans women.

The store Ulta has really become an advocate for crossdressing men and trans women. I am not a bigot because I see a hair stylist who is a man wearing make up, and I don't know if the hair stylist wants to be addressed as she or he. Some men are cross dressers but still prefer to themselves as men.