College Admissions Doesn't Need to Be So Competitive: Super High Stat Kids are not "a dime a dozen."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, graduates with combo of high GPA, 5's on dozen plus AP exams, 1550+ SAT scores aren't that many. Its a shame they have to face same pressures as an average student.

Then all HYPSM has to do is set that as a minimum bar

That is something that you perceive to be in their interest but not something that they believe to be in their interest. It’s not about your needs, it is about theirs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, graduates with combo of high GPA, 5's on dozen plus AP exams, 1550+ SAT scores aren't that many. Its a shame they have to face same pressures as an average student.

TJ has about 50 students like this per year!

So take that profile, add captain and starter of a sports team that is good enough to make the state championships and you have the profile of what they are actually looking for.

How many of the 50 fit that profile?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

But the problem with your argument is not everyone wants to study hard but they still want to go to top colleges and universities.

Besides there are already too many Asians at to schools and if they didn't have holistic admissions, they couldn't keep moving the goal posts to avoid Asians.

Seriously if they were transparent about their admission criteria, asian kid world adapt so they have to keep it a moving target.

You think it is about keeping Asians out but it isn’t. It’s about building a class that fits their institutional priorities and many people on this thread just don’t want to accept that these schools have zero interest in optimizing for peak academics. They want excellent academics plus something else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Your racism is shining through again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, graduates with combo of high GPA, 5's on dozen plus AP exams, 1550+ SAT scores aren't that many. Its a shame they have to face same pressures as an average student.

TJ has about 50 students like this per year!

So take that profile, add captain and starter of a sports team that is good enough to make the state championships and you have the profile of what they are actually looking for.

How many of the 50 fit that profile?

Now wait a minute, we keep being told of many posters whose kids don't have that athletic hook, yet they get in...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

But the problem with your argument is not everyone wants to study hard but they still want to go to top colleges and universities.

Besides there are already too many Asians at to schools and if they didn't have holistic admissions, they couldn't keep moving the goal posts to avoid Asians.

Seriously if they were transparent about their admission criteria, asian kid world adapt so they have to keep it a moving target.

You think it is about keeping Asians out but it isn’t. It’s about building a class that fits their institutional priorities and many people on this thread just don’t want to accept that these schools have zero interest in optimizing for peak academics. They want excellent academics plus something else.

yes... "something else"....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

holistic admissions didn't exist 100 years ago. Before then ivies used test scores and grades exclusively. It was only when jews started push their way in that holistic admissions was introduced

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even going to college is something most this society doesn't get the opportunity to do.

they have the opportunity, we have student loans. They just choose not to, or choose a deadend major

Yeah, not everyone can just live (and go to school) off student loans for 4+ years. Most people have to work to earn money just for living expenses, let alone the cost of college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

holistic admissions didn't exist 100 years ago. Before then ivies used test scores and grades exclusively. It was only when jews started push their way in that holistic admissions was introduced

Actually that is a cute myth that people like to spin. Admissions were holistic before they were test based. Only, the holistic part was "what is your family name
', what is you families club, what prep school did you got to. Grades were of secondary importance as long as the rest of the application reflected the traits desired which was "good Protestant families". Testing came about as an attempt to bring in a wider student body. It is unfortunate that holistic admissions were brought back to put curbs on the number of Jewish students.

Holistic admissions existed long before there were significant numbers of Asian applicants. You are asking schools to change practices to your preferences, not out of any remorse about the impact on Jewish applicants long ago but rather in a way that you believe will advantage Asian applicants because the present system doesn't reflect what you believe is important not out of any sense of actually improving the system. The schools involved do not see themselves as you wish that they did and that is something that you just need to come to grips with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

NP. Your sweeping generalizations are appallingly racist. I’m a second generation Asian American whose siblings and spouse all went to various HYPSMs and whose kid is headed to one this fall. Exactly zero of us test prepped (albeit we do not judge those who do). All of us were highly engaged students on campus and continue to be as alums. We volunteer, donate, and support campus diversity, including FGLI and URM admissions priorities. Contrary to your insults, Asian Americans are not a monolith of “dutiful drones” who have no regard for others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

holistic admissions didn't exist 100 years ago. Before then ivies used test scores and grades exclusively. It was only when jews started push their way in that holistic admissions was introduced

Actually that is a cute myth that people like to spin. Admissions were holistic before they were test based. Only, the holistic part was "what is your family name
', what is you families club, what prep school did you got to. Grades were of secondary importance as long as the rest of the application reflected the traits desired which was "good Protestant families". Testing came about as an attempt to bring in a wider student body. It is unfortunate that holistic admissions were brought back to put curbs on the number of Jewish students.

Holistic admissions existed long before there were significant numbers of Asian applicants. You are asking schools to change practices to your preferences, not out of any remorse about the impact on Jewish applicants long ago but rather in a way that you believe will advantage Asian applicants because the present system doesn't reflect what you believe is important not out of any sense of actually improving the system. The schools involved do not see themselves as you wish that they did and that is something that you just need to come to grips with.

you can tell yourself whatever you want to rationalize an antisemitic practice

[Anonymous]

Holistic admissions is all such bullshit.

So many students being braver and protesting when protesting was popular and risk free.

Why aren't they protesting now? These kids were never "passionate" about BLM, they just wanted to "look" passionate. Now that there are perceived consequences, the students are staying home, the universities are rolling over, law firms are paying danegeld.

This whole goddam thing was always a lie. We might as well admit it and just admit based on actual merit and not virtue signaling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1500 has been the marker for many, many years. I believe it still is. I doubt many, if any, admissions officers care about a 1550 vs a 1540. Or a 1530 vs a 1570. All within the same standard deviation to account for those test takers having a good day vs those having a bad day.

Anyone in the 1500+ bucket gets extra attention paid to their ECs and other achievements.

We have data on this and a 1590 has more than twice the admission rate at top 11 schools as a 1500. It might not be worth the extra effort to get the 1590 but AOs are not indifferent to SAT scores above 1500

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-55119-0

The journal Nature published an article about how college admissions is unfair to Asians ... in 2024? This was obvious in 1994

Oh BS. Asians prep like crazy. It’s the hook that favors their cultural approach. Their parents and grandparents were used to the cram schools and spending 6 hours a day after school cramming. Prepping and cheating for scores only matter admission is common in countries like Korea, India and China. Of course the author wants to get rid of athletic recruits, particularly for sports that aren’t dominated by Asians, legacy and donors as Asian alumni do not give or give far less than other demographics, first generation college and any other aspect that doesn’t favor them.

Getting over 1500 on the SAT is not challenging to a reasonably intelligent kid that has been forced to practice for years until they consistently nail a perfect score on practice tests. It’s not a sign of brilliance, it a sign of obedience to parents that demand a perfect score.

you would have said the same about Jews a century ago when they were the ones getting the short stick

+1. And there’s nothing stopping a non-Asian kid from prepping. In fact many of them do, despite the PP’s ignorant stereotype. Let the prizes go to the kids who work the hardest. Sorry you don’t believe in meritocracy-not everything is going to be given to your kid in life if they’re not performing.

Let’s just point out that these kids are not that work the hardest, it’s their parents that push the hardest and bully kids into having no childhood since preschool. Kids don’t have a free will in this.

what's the difference between that and kids who have been doing football (either kind) since preschool?

The football kids aren't asian. The name of the game is asian evasion.

Colleges have had football teams forever. Asians dominating and expecting to fill every spot is a relatively new thing in the past two decades. If the new demographics of top colleges is for every ten admits, 4-5 are Asians with no legacy or sports just test scores 2-3 are white possibly with sports or legacy, 2 are Hispanic with maybe a sport, no legacy, and 1 is AA with maybe sports then you are basically shutting out all white, Hispanic or AA students who are not top athletes or legacy donors or first generation college.

a hundred years ago you would have said that about jews

Not at all. Jewish students and alumni engaged and still engage in college. As alumni, they donated and often led efforts to support their school. They also did not push out or seek to push out every other single demographic and pine for changing the criteria to solely benefit their cultural practice of test prep Asians are constantly fighting against affirmative action, first generation, veteran or other criteria that really helps marginalized groups move up and adds vibrancy to the campus because they want those spots. It isn’t about learning or thinking or changing the world it’s about being a dutiful drone and gaming whatever possible to get ahead.

holistic admissions didn't exist 100 years ago. Before then ivies used test scores and grades exclusively. It was only when jews started push their way in that holistic admissions was introduced

Actually that is a cute myth that people like to spin. Admissions were holistic before they were test based. Only, the holistic part was "what is your family name
', what is you families club, what prep school did you got to. Grades were of secondary importance as long as the rest of the application reflected the traits desired which was "good Protestant families". Testing came about as an attempt to bring in a wider student body. It is unfortunate that holistic admissions were brought back to put curbs on the number of Jewish students.

Holistic admissions existed long before there were significant numbers of Asian applicants. You are asking schools to change practices to your preferences, not out of any remorse about the impact on Jewish applicants long ago but rather in a way that you believe will advantage Asian applicants because the present system doesn't reflect what you believe is important not out of any sense of actually improving the system. The schools involved do not see themselves as you wish that they did and that is something that you just need to come to grips with.

you can tell yourself whatever you want to rationalize an antisemitic practice

Who is rationalizing antisemitism? I'm pointing out that Harvard wasn't always test based as the PP implied. I pointed out why testing was actually put in place as well which was to attract students from outside of New England/NY. Even then the idea behind testing wasn't to attract the most intellectually capable students, it was to provide a baseline measurement when the educational quality of distant schools was unknowable at the time.

The antisemitic reasoning for the restoration of holistic admissions was appalling and wrong, no doubt about it. But the cry for a return to test based admissions by portions of the Asian community has nothing to do with discrimination. They cry discrimination today because the system doesn't reflect their cultural preferences and they desire a system that favors these preferences. They also want a system that reflects their perception of what should be important for admissions to elite schools. Their problem is that the schools themselves have a different perception of themselves and how they view their part in the world. They are old, private and could have moved to a system similar to Oxford and Cambridge long long ago if they wanted to. The fact that they didn't tells one everything that one needs to know.

[Anonymous]

Defining merit as scores high on a standardized test isn’t deciding based on merit. Deciding based on who has the most APs when many schools offer few or no APs is not deciding based on merit. Working hard to prep for or game a test is not the same as working hard in college or life. GPA is even a good indicator as schools vary widely, cheating can be rampant, and some parents ensure their kid knows the material for the entire class before they sit down on the first day.