Option H is permanent and the old Wootton HS campus will be closed for good?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

To people who are saying the anti H group dominates or hogs the board meetings... sign ups are open to the public. No one is preventing anyone from signing up.

That said, I for one am happy we finally see the Wootton cluster speaking out. This cluster has always been relatively silent prior to this whole fiasco. That's in part why we kept getting kicked off of CIP and find ourselves in this situation to begin with.

Yes, speak out. Fight for the funding. That isn't the criticism. If you are lucky enough to get selected please push for an actual option as an alternative to H. If you want Crown to be the holding school and not Wootton say that- advocate for something specific that is a viable option. Not "W".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Lol at this poster who either doesn’t get it or just doesn’t want to admit it.

KeEp tHe ClUsTeR together. Did you not read anything the other poster said?

Just admit Dufief rather Cold Spring and Fallsmead be the edge properties.

Ohhhh now I get it. You are also a Wootton Walker! That's why you are so mad at Dufief

I mean yes no shit lol. All these people clowning on Wootton walkers as if they didn’t have the exact reaction. Again why are Dufief parents supporting H when they hated A-D.

If you think the building is truly unsafe, you should have been thrilled with A-D. If you really thought the building was unsafe for your kid, you wouldn’t have given a shit if Stone Mill and Travilah weren’t moving with you. You would feel bad that that they weren’t and you would’ve thought to yourself, man I’m so glad my kid is going to a safe school not OMG I can’t believe we’re the only ones who have been singled out. You would have framed it as WOW we’re the only lucky ones who are guaranteed to not go to an “objectively unsafe” school.

You don’t actually think the building is unsafe. You just don’t want to admit the real reason, which is you rather another neighborhood be the edge property.

Then the building is fine and they just want an upgrade thinking that they are better and deserve the best and who cares about the impact on other schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Lol at this poster who either doesn’t get it or just doesn’t want to admit it.

KeEp tHe ClUsTeR together. Did you not read anything the other poster said?

Just admit Dufief rather Cold Spring and Fallsmead be the edge properties.

Ohhhh now I get it. You are also a Wootton Walker! That's why you are so mad at Dufief

I mean yes no shit lol. All these people clowning on Wootton walkers as if they didn’t have the exact reaction. Again why are Dufief parents supporting H when they hated A-D.

If you think the building is truly unsafe, you should have been thrilled with A-D. If you really thought the building was unsafe for your kid, you wouldn’t have given a shit if Stone Mill and Travilah weren’t moving with you. You would feel bad that that they weren’t and you would’ve thought to yourself, man I’m so glad my kid is going to a safe school not OMG I can’t believe we’re the only ones who have been singled out. You would have framed it as WOW we’re the only lucky ones who are guaranteed to not go to an “objectively unsafe” school.

You don’t actually think the building is unsafe. You just don’t want to admit the real reason, which is you rather another neighborhood be the edge property.

Good lord you are impossible. You don't understand and clearly never will. I'm done trying to help you get it.

No, they get it. You don’t get it. It’s your way or no way. You are claiming the building is unsafe. If it’s that unsafe you’d take the new building for everyone’s health. Many of us would jump at that also being in unsafe schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

To people who are saying the anti H group dominates or hogs the board meetings... sign ups are open to the public. No one is preventing anyone from signing up.

That said, I for one am happy we finally see the Wootton cluster speaking out. This cluster has always been relatively silent prior to this whole fiasco. That's in part why we kept getting kicked off of CIP and find ourselves in this situation to begin with.

You get bumped down as there are other schools in much worse condition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

This is a good point and might be why H will be rejected. The transportation logistics for Crown as a holding school are better, and I'm sure the preferences of students to spend 2 years in a new building vs another building in disrepair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Wow you still don’t get the point. Just answer one question: you are the one saying Wootton is unsafe. What’s more of a priority? Safety or cluster being intact?

But what are you saying? Having your kid get mold poisoning is A-OK so long as their diploma reads “Thomas S. Wootton”?

PS: that diploma might have a different name anyway bc, ya know, slave ownership.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

+1 It’s dozens of people making the same argument and not articulating a solution. It’s tiresome and it only affects a tiny sliver of the district and it’s not a life or death situation, rather a preference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Lol at this poster who either doesn’t get it or just doesn’t want to admit it.

KeEp tHe ClUsTeR together. Did you not read anything the other poster said?

Just admit Dufief rather Cold Spring and Fallsmead be the edge properties.

Ohhhh now I get it. You are also a Wootton Walker! That's why you are so mad at Dufief

I mean yes no shit lol. All these people clowning on Wootton walkers as if they didn’t have the exact reaction. Again why are Dufief parents supporting H when they hated A-D.

If you think the building is truly unsafe, you should have been thrilled with A-D. If you really thought the building was unsafe for your kid, you wouldn’t have given a shit if Stone Mill and Travilah weren’t moving with you. You would feel bad that that they weren’t and you would’ve thought to yourself, man I’m so glad my kid is going to a safe school not OMG I can’t believe we’re the only ones who have been singled out. You would have framed it as WOW we’re the only lucky ones who are guaranteed to not go to an “objectively unsafe” school.

You don’t actually think the building is unsafe. You just don’t want to admit the real reason, which is you rather another neighborhood be the edge property.

Then the building is fine and they just want an upgrade thinking that they are better and deserve the best and who cares about the impact on other schools.

Are you dense or are you purposefully pretending to be stupid?
Do you think one day the building is safe and the next day all of a sudden it's unsafe?
Do I think Wootton is in pristine condition? No.
Do I think Wootton is in "objectively unsafe" conditions? Also no.
You do realize there is a HUGE spectrum of conditions between pristine/new condition and "objectively unsafe" right?

I think Wootton is somewhere in the middle.
I think renovations are indeed needed, but that doesn't mean the building is "objectively unsafe."
I think we should renovate based on urgent needs, in which case based on MCPS' VERY OWN FCI, Wootton should be one of the first schools in line to get fixed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

+1 It’s dozens of people making the same argument and not articulating a solution. It’s tiresome and it only affects a tiny sliver of the district and it’s not a life or death situation, rather a preference.

Is it my job to provide feedback or solutions? I thought they wanted the public's feedback. Are they now asking the public to crowdsource solutions?
If they want me to propose a solution, I would gladly do it for a fraction of what they paid their third party consultants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Wow you still don’t get the point. Just answer one question: you are the one saying Wootton is unsafe. What’s more of a priority? Safety or cluster being intact?

But what are you saying? Having your kid get mold poisoning is A-OK so long as their diploma reads “Thomas S. Wootton”?

PS: that diploma might have a different name anyway bc, ya know, slave ownership.

No I'm saying it's not objectively unsafe.
Because if you are team objectively unsafe, you should support H, A, B, C, and D.
If you support only H but not A, B, C, D, ask yourself why.
If you support H but not A, B, C, D, clearly the building is not THAT unsafe for you to avoid sending your child to Wootton.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

To people who are saying the anti H group dominates or hogs the board meetings... sign ups are open to the public. No one is preventing anyone from signing up.

That said, I for one am happy we finally see the Wootton cluster speaking out. This cluster has always been relatively silent prior to this whole fiasco. That's in part why we kept getting kicked off of CIP and find ourselves in this situation to begin with.

You get bumped down as there are other schools in much worse condition.

Ok. Name all the schools in worse conditions than Wootton and provide proof that it is actually in worse condition.
Then tell me why we don't shut that school down immediately.
I mean if Wootton is "objectively unsafe" and there are other schools in "much worse conditions" then let's close all these schools.

The reality is Margruder is the only school by MCPS's own metrics that is worse off than Wootton.
They rightfully should go BEFORE Wootton.
You know what option gets them faster renovations? NOT H! Why because it would take another few years before Wootton can even be renovated into a holding school. That's why Magruder is also against H. This isn't Wootton against everyone. NO SCHOOL that wants a holding school wants Wootton to be the holding school.

The reality is besides Magruder, Wootton has the worst condition in this county. BUT it is not unfixable, and it certainly is not "objectively unsafe."
If having mold is enough to be "objectively unsafe", I'm pretty sure half the schools and hell even half the houses in this county should be demolished today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Wow you still don’t get the point. Just answer one question: you are the one saying Wootton is unsafe. What’s more of a priority? Safety or cluster being intact?

But what are you saying? Having your kid get mold poisoning is A-OK so long as their diploma reads “Thomas S. Wootton”?

PS: that diploma might have a different name anyway bc, ya know, slave ownership.

Do you understand how many schools have mold issues? The only way to really fix it as it’s already there is to fully replace the school or tear it down to the shell. You cannot just throw in a new hvac and it’s fixed. Mold doesn’t just go away. If you were that worried you’d take a new school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

To people who are saying the anti H group dominates or hogs the board meetings... sign ups are open to the public. No one is preventing anyone from signing up.

That said, I for one am happy we finally see the Wootton cluster speaking out. This cluster has always been relatively silent prior to this whole fiasco. That's in part why we kept getting kicked off of CIP and find ourselves in this situation to begin with.

You get bumped down as there are other schools in much worse condition.

Ok. Name all the schools in worse conditions than Wootton and provide proof that it is actually in worse condition.
Then tell me why we don't shut that school down immediately.
I mean if Wootton is "objectively unsafe" and there are other schools in "much worse conditions" then let's close all these schools.

The reality is Margruder is the only school by MCPS's own metrics that is worse off than Wootton.
They rightfully should go BEFORE Wootton.
You know what option gets them faster renovations? NOT H! Why because it would take another few years before Wootton can even be renovated into a holding school. That's why Magruder is also against H. This isn't Wootton against everyone. NO SCHOOL that wants a holding school wants Wootton to be the holding school.

The reality is besides Magruder, Wootton has the worst condition in this county. BUT it is not unfixable, and it certainly is not "objectively unsafe."
If having mold is enough to be "objectively unsafe", I'm pretty sure half the schools and hell even half the houses in this county should be demolished today.

The schools have been heavily discussed. Googly it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dufief parents who now support H: Why were you all collectively pissed when the first options had send all of you to Crown. If Wootton is such bad conditions, you should’ve been happy with the original options?

I say those who want to go to Crown, should just go. Sounds like Dufief Travilah and Stone Mill want to go. Add in Rosemont and Fields Road and you got a high school of roughly ~2200, which matches perfectly with Crown’s size. This alleviates overcrowding at QO and Gaithersburg HS.

Leave Wootton to Fallsmead, Lakewood, Cold Spring families. Add in Wayside—half of Potomac Glen is currently split between Lakewood (which feeds into Wootton) and Wayside anyways. Then add in RM neighborhoods including the very walkable neighborhood of Horizon Hill and Fallsgrove, which is walkable as well (a lot of Wootton kids walk to Fallsgrove all the time). This justifies keeping Wootton as a cluster and alleviates overcrowding at RM and Churchill.

Welcome, you must be new. Dufief has been involved in this since June. Dufief was "pissed" because they split Dufief- and only Dufief- out of Wootton. Dufief overlapa constantly with Stone Mill and Travillah kids, that is their community. But the first options only sent Dufief to Crown. If they had sent Dufief, Stone Mill and Travillah all to Crown that at least would have made geographical sense. If you had any idea of the history here you would already know why Dufief was so mad.

Actually not new . Been following this issue from the beginning. Just find it ironic all these Dufief parents are talking about how happy they are getting a new school because Wootton is unsafe. Tell me does Dufief being the only school being sent make the Wootton building any more or less safe? If Dufief parents truly believed Wootton is unsafe, they should have been happy with the original options even if they were the only ones "lucky" enough to be districted to Crown. Or, is the argument about safety changing now?

I'm all for the most geographical sensible boundaries. Precisely why I did not buy in Dufief. By all means, send Dufief, Stone Mill, and Travilah kids to Crown. Don't send the rest of the kids who can walk to Wootton. Leave us in our "unsafe" building.

100%. The very few non-troll Wootton parents who support H are Dufief parents. They all say because option H is the only option where my child will get to go to a safe school. LOL no it's not. Options A-D also get your kid to a "safe school." At least stay consistent. If you support H because you really think Wootton is unsafe, you should logically also support A-D. Safety trumps all. It shouldn't matter if you are the only ES being moved to Crown because your kid's safety should be the most important factor.

Let's be real here. It's not about safety. If it were, Dufief parents would NEVER have pushed back on A-D like they almost UNIVERSALLY DID. It's pretty obvious. Dufief knew under A-D, their property values would have lowered and their kids would have gone from one of the highest ranked HS to an average ranking HS (and that's being generous). They see H as their ONLY saving grace. The logic is if we're doomed either way to go to Crown, might as well make the rest of the cluster move with us so that the rankings will be that drastic of a change.

Just be real and say the truth. Stop saying I support H because it's the only option where my kid gets to a safe school. SAY YOU SUPPORT A-D IF YOU REALLY THINK IT'S ABOUT SAFETY.

DUFIEF PUSHED BACK ON A-D BECAUSE THEY WANT TO STAY WTH THEIR CLUSTER. What don't you understand? It is BOTH. Stay with cluster AND safe school. Dufief was also told after the new utilization numbers came out that they could probably stay with the cluster in a modified A-D since there was now room at Frost. Nothing in writing though and can't trust MCPS so they won't end their advocacy against A-D.

Since then, all of these safety issues came out. Asbestos, mold, really??? Of course they want a safe school. It's insane that the other Wootton parents don't and are willing to settle for status quo as long as they can walk to school. Sorry, but magic money is not going to fall out of the sky to renovate Wootton and open Crown as a new high school.

And guess what? H isn't my first choice. I think Crown should be a holding school and E or F should be selected. Maybe Wootton should have collectively pushed those instead of an imaginary option.

Lol at this poster who either doesn’t get it or just doesn’t want to admit it.

KeEp tHe ClUsTeR together. Did you not read anything the other poster said?

Just admit Dufief rather Cold Spring and Fallsmead be the edge properties.

Ohhhh now I get it. You are also a Wootton Walker! That's why you are so mad at Dufief

I mean yes no shit lol. All these people clowning on Wootton walkers as if they didn’t have the exact reaction. Again why are Dufief parents supporting H when they hated A-D.

If you think the building is truly unsafe, you should have been thrilled with A-D. If you really thought the building was unsafe for your kid, you wouldn’t have given a shit if Stone Mill and Travilah weren’t moving with you. You would feel bad that that they weren’t and you would’ve thought to yourself, man I’m so glad my kid is going to a safe school not OMG I can’t believe we’re the only ones who have been singled out. You would have framed it as WOW we’re the only lucky ones who are guaranteed to not go to an “objectively unsafe” school.

You don’t actually think the building is unsafe. You just don’t want to admit the real reason, which is you rather another neighborhood be the edge property.

Then the building is fine and they just want an upgrade thinking that they are better and deserve the best and who cares about the impact on other schools.

Are you dense or are you purposefully pretending to be stupid?
Do you think one day the building is safe and the next day all of a sudden it's unsafe?
Do I think Wootton is in pristine condition? No.
Do I think Wootton is in "objectively unsafe" conditions? Also no.
You do realize there is a HUGE spectrum of conditions between pristine/new condition and "objectively unsafe" right?

I think Wootton is somewhere in the middle.
I think renovations are indeed needed, but that doesn't mean the building is "objectively unsafe."
I think we should renovate based on urgent needs, in which case based on MCPS' VERY OWN FCI, Wootton should be one of the first schools in line to get fixed.

Lol it’s almost like the last year of Wootton complaining about how unsafe their school is never happened. Such gaslighting. You all got on TV and did school walk throughs to show how terrible the conditions are. And now that the county listened and is talking about moving you to a safe school you suddenly say it’s not that bad. Just bc you don’t want to get on a bus to school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the reason the Wootton walkers haven't advocated for E or F (or G)? Do they not want to antagonize or be seen as going against Crown/Gaithersburg?

This exactly. They don't want to piss off Crown/Gaithersburg. They are both advocating for a stand alone high school and Wootton walkers think Crown helps them for now.

My sense is that the fiscal argument against option A-D is too strong for this to work. I think MCPS strongly wants a holding school, whether it's Crown or Wootton.

I agree. It will be either EFG or H.

If we’re talking about fiscally, Crown as a holding school is cheaper. MCPS has done the studies.

1. MCPS own studies show Crown is closer for all the schools that need a holding school than Wootton. It would thus cost more to bus everyone to Wootton than to Crown (more accessible due to 270). Then you have to bus Wootton kids out of Wootton, which yet another extra cost to H.
2. Using Wootton as a holding school requires it to be renovated regardless since it’s not up to code. Renovation for Wootton happens under EFGH.

I genuinely don’t get why H is more fiscally sensible compared to EFG.

I agree with this. I'm the PP that keeps trying to explain why people might like H (and the walkers can't get their head around it) but I actually think it's going to end up being E or F. No one, not even Crown, wants G. And Wootton still needs work to be a safe holding school. That money isn't there and Damascus needs their reno now. I think Crown as holding makes the most fiscal sense.

I’ve heard F is off the table. Churchill hates it and Julie Yang would never go for it. Between E and H, the irony here is the oppose H group won’t go for E because they are watching out for Dufief. In E, once Crown is done being used as a holding school, Dufief is going right back to Crown but without the rest of the cluster. E is just a delayed A-D. But at this point, based on this thread, I agree let’s get behind E.

Nice crystal ball you have there to see the future ten years down the road.

Also, would love to know when exactly the anti-H group has publicly supported Dufief.

There are literally people from Dufief in the group.

Genuine question: what do you think happens long term if E is selected?

I think long term the county does another boundary study. Probably 10 years down the road at least. I think this happens anyway regardless of what option is selected. Dufief may end up at Crown. It may end up at QO. If the metrics support that then so be it. Hopefully Dufief moves to Crown along with at least one other feeder or goes to QO versus Crown by itself. It does have some community overlap with Rachael Carson/Thurgood Marshall kids (sports, camps, etc.) more so than the feeders it would have gone to Crown with in A-D. It was pretty geographically isolated versus the other elems in A-D.

The metrics did not support the Dufief move to Crown in A-D. Dufief is so small there was no reason to pull it out of Wootton. It didn't change utilization. Saying it made sense geographically was nonsense if the Grove goes to Wootton. It went against all FAA factors. If it makes sense to move in ten years so be it. The whole county will look different and I don't think it will be only Dufief with a new boundary. I mean really, Dufief is so small it may actually be closed via an elementary study and would be absorbed by Travillah or Stone Mill by then.

Thank you for taking the question seriously. Does the majority of Dufief parents agree? Would they support E? If majority of Travilah, Stone Mill, and Dufief supports E, I see no reason as to why the Wootton cluster—including the anti H and Wootton PTSA—can’t fall behind E.

E is much more likely going to keep the cluster intact.

Obviously no choice will get 100% support but majority is sufficient.

Yes, I do think the majority would support E. E still offers a path to Wootton reno with a holding school available to use. A-D doesn't. But even so there are some parents within the community whose older kids will be at Wootton in the near future with serious safety concerns and they are the ones who prefer H due to timing.

Anti H refuses to push H because they do not want to upset Crown. They will not directly support E-G.

I think they have good intentions as Crown parents don’t want H either—at least it’s not their top choice. And we do need a coalition so it’s not just Wootton against everyone else. Although literally every Damascus and Magruder parent would prefer Crown as a holding school if a holding school had to be created.

That said, when push comes to shove, I’m sure any parent in the anti-H group would support E if it came down to it. Anything but H > upsetting Crown.

Then they should say that publicly in all of these board meetings they dominate. Person after person gets up to speak and all they do is push against H. They do not offer an alternative.

To people who are saying the anti H group dominates or hogs the board meetings... sign ups are open to the public. No one is preventing anyone from signing up.

That said, I for one am happy we finally see the Wootton cluster speaking out. This cluster has always been relatively silent prior to this whole fiasco. That's in part why we kept getting kicked off of CIP and find ourselves in this situation to begin with.

You get bumped down as there are other schools in much worse condition.

Ok. Name all the schools in worse conditions than Wootton and provide proof that it is actually in worse condition.
Then tell me why we don't shut that school down immediately.
I mean if Wootton is "objectively unsafe" and there are other schools in "much worse conditions" then let's close all these schools.

The reality is Margruder is the only school by MCPS's own metrics that is worse off than Wootton.
They rightfully should go BEFORE Wootton.
You know what option gets them faster renovations? NOT H! Why because it would take another few years before Wootton can even be renovated into a holding school. That's why Magruder is also against H. This isn't Wootton against everyone. NO SCHOOL that wants a holding school wants Wootton to be the holding school.

The reality is besides Magruder, Wootton has the worst condition in this county. BUT it is not unfixable, and it certainly is not "objectively unsafe."
If having mold is enough to be "objectively unsafe", I'm pretty sure half the schools and hell even half the houses in this county should be demolished today.

The schools have been heavily discussed. Googly it.

Anecdotally without evidence.
Show me with evidence that a school is worse off than Wootton, not including Magruder.
Also answer the second part.
If there are so many of these schools that are worse than “objectively unsafe Wootton,” under your logic, we should close those schools too right?