Why don’t schools make you just through some hoops for redshirting?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

I'll just add that I know two other families with end of August/September birthday girls who wish they'd redshirted. Their kids are seriously struggling and not ready for middle school. One is going to pay for private middle school just to hold her daughter back. The other is s continuing, but the girl is increasingly ostracized socially. So out of 4 families who chose to send our late August kids on time, as of end of 5th grade, 2.5 out of 4 wish they'd redshirted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

This is so sad- and familiar. I went to school at 4 and was fine intellectually but way behind socially. The pain of the social mismatch far outweighed any benefit of accessing the curriculum one year early. I wish I’d been redshirted. It’s not worth pushing academic acceleration at the expense of social and emotional health.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

You don't know when puberty will hit so being the smallest now means nothing and with genetics, she may always be small. Maybe it's a bad school fit and a school change would help? Or, maybe other things are going on that you are just ignoring and blaming age. And, if she is being compared to older kids, and scapegoated for the older kids bad behavior.

She was not exactly 4. She was turning 5 within a few weeks of starting school. And, 5 the entire year, which is the age she should be for K.

Even if you held her back, how do you know that would have helped? She may have the same issues. Get her support.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

I'll just add that I know two other families with end of August/September birthday girls who wish they'd redshirted. Their kids are seriously struggling and not ready for middle school. One is going to pay for private middle school just to hold her daughter back. The other is s continuing, but the girl is increasingly ostracized socially. So out of 4 families who chose to send our late August kids on time, as of end of 5th grade, 2.5 out of 4 wish they'd redshirted.

And, that is a small sampling as I know plenty of kids who went with those birthdays and are doing just fine. These kids would struggle regardless of grade and something more is going on and they need support, not held back. For the girl who is having social issues, maybe the school is the problem, not the grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

This is so sad- and familiar. I went to school at 4 and was fine intellectually but way behind socially. The pain of the social mismatch far outweighed any benefit of accessing the curriculum one year early. I wish I’d been redshirted. It’s not worth pushing academic acceleration at the expense of social and emotional health.

I was always the youngest, and I did feel a little socially immature compared to the fall birthday girls. And yet I also had lots of friends and a good high school experience. Anecdata is not very reliable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

This is so sad- and familiar. I went to school at 4 and was fine intellectually but way behind socially. The pain of the social mismatch far outweighed any benefit of accessing the curriculum one year early. I wish I’d been redshirted. It’s not worth pushing academic acceleration at the expense of social and emotional health.

I was always the youngest, and I did feel a little socially immature compared to the fall birthday girls. And yet I also had lots of friends and a good high school experience. Anecdata is not very reliable.

You weren't immature, you were younger. So, right on target.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Be glad the cutoff is 9/1.

In New York State, it’s 12/31. And people still redshirt summer boys at least, so the gap is huge.

That’s too much. Public schools really need to mandate it. Anything that is 6months from the cutoff should require a medical/learning condition of some sort that they are receiving services for.

Nonsense. You parent your kids, let other people parent theirs.

The point is that it affects others. It affects the class dynamic. It changes the age and size range etc in the class.

Yes, but it affects the dynamic positively. Like in Montessori school when there’s a 3 year age gap between children in the classroom. The older kids teach the younger ones and in the process they gain leadership skills! Sounds like a win-win to me.

This is way over-optimistic.

Perhaps some redshirted children are more mature in positive ways, wind up serving as leaders and example. Perhaps. Some percentage.

But anyone who has actually seen time in K and 1st grade classrooms knows that often the "maturity" kids display at these ages isn't positive. It's stuff like introducing aggressive and competitive dynamics at a time when teachers are often trying to teach social-emotional skills. It's kids talking about "dating" and sex with peers because of things they heard from older siblings or more mature TV/movies that most parents wouldn't allow a 5 yr old to watch. It's kids segregating into friend groups earlier than is typical, and younger kids being left behind. It's teasing younger kids for crying in class or still playing with dolls. Because, again, they are 5 years old and are developmentally normal, but they are in classrooms with more "mature" kids who are eager to demonstrate their maturity by asserting dominance and teasing.

And as kids get older, these dynamics can get worse, and classrooms with a large number of late redshirts (spring and even winter birthdays held back and starting K at 6 or 6.5) can see some very bad dynamics emerge around puberty.

Montessori is different because their classrooms are set up for larger age ranges, and also because the families who self-select for Montessori tend to be more willing to invest in helping their kids develop the social-emotional maturity that kids need in that environment. Montessori schools often also counsel out schools with behavioral issues or special needs, and are less willing to put up with aggressive behavior from older children because they think it will benefit their school's athletic programs later on (which is a deal some public schools make when they permit rampant redshirting of kids well outside the typical redshirting bubble).

What lord of the flies school district do you live in, and why haven’t you fled already?

This was our experience, and it gets worse in HS with mixed classes similar to Montessori. The older kids are burnt out and ready to be out of high school. Lots of bullying and resent with the younger kids, especially if they are outperforming them regardless of age. You can have a freshman or sophomore in precalculus along with a senior. So, think of that age spread of 14-19. The other issue is kids with learning disabilities, which schools and parents ignore for years, become harder to remediate as the child gets older. Everyone things of the kids in elementary school, but its also about high school.

As someone who did not redshirt, and whose kids are now young adults and older teens, this is only an issue in your head, or for people who do not bother to teach their children any resiliency. What you describe is not remotely normal, and leads me to believe that you taught your kids to be hypersensitive and unable to navigate normal teenage interactions. My kids were in classes with wide age ranges as the youngest ones and were not nearly this sensitive or unable to manage themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

You don't know when puberty will hit so being the smallest now means nothing and with genetics, she may always be small. Maybe it's a bad school fit and a school change would help? Or, maybe other things are going on that you are just ignoring and blaming age. And, if she is being compared to older kids, and scapegoated for the older kids bad behavior.

She was not exactly 4. She was turning 5 within a few weeks of starting school. And, 5 the entire year, which is the age she should be for K.

Even if you held her back, how do you know that would have helped? She may have the same issues. Get her support.

I'm not sure why you don't think I know my kid. It's really wrong that you're second guessing me having never met my daughter.

No, she doesn't have issues other than being young and somewhat immature compared to her peers. Why exactly do you think she wouldn't fit in better socially in the class below when she wouldn't be the oldest (probably a dozen kids are older) and when she's the absolute youngest in her current grade. My experience is that oldest kids in a family often skew a little young without older siblings to "teach" them. My daughter is in that vein, not in any way special needs.

Also, she's going to be late to puberty. It's 5th grade and not a mystery which girls are already turning that corner. Mine isn't even close. I'm not guessing based on 5 yos. You can tell.

What support exactly do you suggest for a kid who feels left out because all the other girls are talking about boys and crushes and she has no interest in that yet? What about for the kid who can't stay up as late at sleepovers and crashes emotionally? Is there an IEP for that?

It's such magical thinking that kids 2 weeks younger for her must be the perfect fit for the grade below, but because she's three weeks older she would be too old and a bully if she was in the same grade as them. Or that she's somehow an entire grade more mature because she was born two weeks earlier than kids on the other side of the cutoff. Kid development just isn't that black and white.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

I'll just add that I know two other families with end of August/September birthday girls who wish they'd redshirted. Their kids are seriously struggling and not ready for middle school. One is going to pay for private middle school just to hold her daughter back. The other is s continuing, but the girl is increasingly ostracized socially. So out of 4 families who chose to send our late August kids on time, as of end of 5th grade, 2.5 out of 4 wish they'd redshirted.

And, that is a small sampling as I know plenty of kids who went with those birthdays and are doing just fine. These kids would struggle regardless of grade and something more is going on and they need support, not held back. For the girl who is having social issues, maybe the school is the problem, not the grade.

You have no basis to say that the kids would struggle the same amount regardless of their grade. That pure conjecture with no basis in reality. Especially when you know the kids and know that one of their biggest issues is maturity and that they track younger in both interests and abilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Redshirting parents are doing what they think is best for their kid. That is in fact the job of parents.

And there are rules. You have to be enrolled in kindergarten by six. People who redshirt a winter birthday are still following those rules. Adding more rules isn’t going to make it less likely that parents try to choose better for their kids, just restrict the franchise.

We have a September birthday and we’ll likely redshirt her because we know there will be kids who turn seven in her kindergarten and we think it’s unfair for her to be four. That doesn’t make it wrong for the other parents to have made the choice to hold back their five y/o.

That’s not fair to hold her back because of others poor choices.

Why? She’ll be five when she starts kindergarten and won’t be the oldest or the youngest kid in her class, since we know the boys born March-May will likely redshirt and other September kids will be as well.

She’ll spend her “extra” year in a private outdoor-focused preK. She’s not being deprived or being treated unfairly, she’s getting an experience plenty of us what would for our kids— an extra year of childhood.

She isn't getting an extra year of childhood, she's losing an extra year of being an adult. She will turn 18 regardless. And, that sounds like a bad idea at an outdoor-focused preschool vs. an academic one. We started our September kid at 4/5 and it's been good. When I ask them, they are glad we didn't hold them back. They don't remember preschool at all so the benefit was far smaller than you think. How do you think she'll feel when her true peers go off to college and she's still stuck for a year in high school. It may sound good now but when your kids get high school age, it's very different.

I guess you just have to realize that not all kids are okay to start kindergarten at age 4/5. We sent our first "on time" as a 4-turning-5 yo and she was constantly in trouble and ended up in the principal's office almost daily the entire first month of school. All of K and first she'd sob at bedtime every night about how much she hated school and how she was a bad kid and they didn't want her there. Then she'd sob again the next morning and we'd fight her to get out the door. Then she'd get in trouble again and again. Really, it wasn't "good." We made it through and she's okay now, with only occasional issues, but we're about to start middle school with her as the youngest and smallest kid in the grade and I'm holding my breath all over again.

(She attended a quality preschool program for two years before K, so she should have been prepared for K. She doesn't have special needs. She was just being a 4 yo and there is a reason that every 4 yos doesn't to kindergarten -- they just don't have the maturity to handle it yet.)

My DD is smart as can be and at the top of her class academically, so she's probably be bored a grade below (and is why we sent her on time), but she'd be a better fit in the lower grade socially, physically and emotionally. If we'd started her with the grade below, I think she would have fit right in with those peers. Having gone "on time" her experience is more akin to a kid who was skipped ahead a grade and spends much of their childhood feeling socially behind and emotionally stressed by expectations that she can't ever seem to meet.

You don't know when puberty will hit so being the smallest now means nothing and with genetics, she may always be small. Maybe it's a bad school fit and a school change would help? Or, maybe other things are going on that you are just ignoring and blaming age. And, if she is being compared to older kids, and scapegoated for the older kids bad behavior.

She was not exactly 4. She was turning 5 within a few weeks of starting school. And, 5 the entire year, which is the age she should be for K.

Even if you held her back, how do you know that would have helped? She may have the same issues. Get her support.

I'm not sure why you don't think I know my kid. It's really wrong that you're second guessing me having never met my daughter.

No, she doesn't have issues other than being young and somewhat immature compared to her peers. Why exactly do you think she wouldn't fit in better socially in the class below when she wouldn't be the oldest (probably a dozen kids are older) and when she's the absolute youngest in her current grade. My experience is that oldest kids in a family often skew a little young without older siblings to "teach" them. My daughter is in that vein, not in any way special needs.

Also, she's going to be late to puberty. It's 5th grade and not a mystery which girls are already turning that corner. Mine isn't even close. I'm not guessing based on 5 yos. You can tell.

What support exactly do you suggest for a kid who feels left out because all the other girls are talking about boys and crushes and she has no interest in that yet? What about for the kid who can't stay up as late at sleepovers and crashes emotionally? Is there an IEP for that?

It's such magical thinking that kids 2 weeks younger for her must be the perfect fit for the grade below, but because she's three weeks older she would be too old and a bully if she was in the same grade as them. Or that she's somehow an entire grade more mature because she was born two weeks earlier than kids on the other side of the cutoff. Kid development just isn't that black and white.

Give up - the antiredshirters not only can’t do math (You’LL HaVE a 19 YeAr OLd sEnIoR!!) but believe that there is some special magic to having an exactly 12 month age range in the classroom, as if celestial bodies dictate the proper class grouping.

Logic will not help.

[Anonymous]

People really forget what it looks like to send a kid to kindergarten who isn't ready. You end up with child who continually disrupts the entire classroom and who ends up 100% miserable because they can't seem to meet expectations and view themselves as bad.

It really isn't good for the other students or teacher. Redshirting for maturity isn't the same as for a sports advantage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People really forget what it looks like to send a kid to kindergarten who isn't ready. You end up with child who continually disrupts the entire classroom and who ends up 100% miserable because they can't seem to meet expectations and view themselves as bad.

It really isn't good for the other students or teacher. Redshirting for maturity isn't the same as for a sports advantage.

I don’t even care if people do it for sports. Truly I do not care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People really forget what it looks like to send a kid to kindergarten who isn't ready. You end up with child who continually disrupts the entire classroom and who ends up 100% miserable because they can't seem to meet expectations and view themselves as bad.

It really isn't good for the other students or teacher. Redshirting for maturity isn't the same as for a sports advantage.

I don’t even care if people do it for sports. Truly I do not care.

How old are your kids?
The only reason I care is because my kid is the youngest and it’s just annoying (not more, not less) but just annoying with grade based things for sports. Our dance studio is sorted by grade and the girl 15m older has gotten the lead every single year. I’m not anti redshirt, it’s just irritating because I see the advantage over my own kid who is as talented. I see that she is disappointed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People really forget what it looks like to send a kid to kindergarten who isn't ready. You end up with child who continually disrupts the entire classroom and who ends up 100% miserable because they can't seem to meet expectations and view themselves as bad.

It really isn't good for the other students or teacher. Redshirting for maturity isn't the same as for a sports advantage.

I have zero problem with redshirting for maturity. But I agree with OP that outside of a certain age window (say within 3 months of the cutoff, which would cover all summer birthday for a Sep 1 cutoff), a redshirting decision should require some kind of assessment or evidence of delays. Because some people will say they are redshirting for maturity, but they aren't. If you are redshirting a January birthday, and there is no clear evidence that it's necessary, I just assume it's because you are trying to work an advantage.

Bracing to be called a "crazed anti-redshirter" even though I literally just expressed support for redshirting in 3, 2, 1...