Saturday - Thousands expected to attend pro-Palestine march in DC for ceasefire in Israel-Hamas war

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those complaining about American tax dollars going to Israel, you need to understand much of it goes to funding the Iron Dome.

Without the Iron Dome, those rockets by Hamas would have landed in great number. Then Israel would have been forced to destroy Hamas much earlier.

Our tax dollars essentially bought time for the Gaza Strip.

Do you really think Israel would have allowed rockets to rain down on their towns daily? The Iron Dome allowed them to ignore it. Be glad we had been funding their Iron Dome up to this point.

Also, our tax dollars don't go directly to Israel. They go to our defense contractors. Our foreign aid to Israel is mostly a jobs program with a side of diplomacy.

Why is Israeli missle defense the US’s responsibility?

Would you have preferred Israel crushed Hamas years ago? Cause that's what would have happened.

I’d prefer US tax payers not supply counties rich enough to do it themselves

[Anonymous]

Our foreign aid to Israel is a US jobs program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our foreign aid to Israel is a US jobs program.

It’s a Raytheon and Boeing shareholders subsidy.

[Anonymous]

So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-protesters-DC.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our foreign aid to Israel is a US jobs program.

With good reason....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-protesters-DC.html

Not to mention spray painting “death to Israel” all over DC building. Yeah, how the hell is this allowed….

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did any of the protesters condemn Hamas? Serious question?

You need to face the music. People have been angry for a long time about how much money our govt wastes propping up a belligerent theocratic "democracy," and this might be the straw the breaks the camel's back.

Right, US interests are totally served by letting Israel be destroyed

The state of Israel has resulted in nearly 7 decades of apartheid and oppression. Maybe it’s time for the US to stop giving it money and shielding it from the consequences of its actions on the world stage.

Look, many other states have failed and their people are fine. The third Reich was wiped off the face of the map and the German people have never been better. The USSR was wiped off the map and Russians are still invading other countries. The confederacy was wiped off the map and idiot Americans are thriving. If Israel is wiped off the map and Jews have to coexist in a democracy where everyone has a vote, they will be fine. And maybe they won’t have to build bomb shelters in their homes.

They'll be dead, but I guess by your thinking that's "fine".

Easiest, laziest pathway to status quo, which obviously is far preferable to you than true democracy.

Not at all. I, like the vast majority of Jews, would like a free and democratic Israel and a free and democratic Palestine.
I don't know why you continue to pretend that a majority of Palestinians don't want Jews dead. They keep telling you that, and for some reason, you refuse to believe it.

It doesn’t matter to me that any group wants the other dead. There are reasons for those feelings, which need to be addressed. And there are certain measures that can be implemented to restore civility, even with these two petulant groups (the various leadership groups purporting to represent Palestinians AND the leadership of the State of Israel).

Those leadership groups, militant individuals (including settlers) in both populations would need to be dealt with differently, but you’re not going to convince anyone not already warmly ensconced in you echo chamber that the garden variety Palestinian or the garden variety Israeli cannot be brought together.

Frankly, the Palestinians will be asked to extend far more forgiveness given the asymmetric extent of devastation their communities have experienced at the hands of the State of Israel over the past 75 years, but tough luck. They extend it, or they deal with multi-national consequences.

They’re not responsible for the holocaust / shoah, so refusing to capitulate on this transference of guilt isn’t helping anyone move forward.

This is the problem with rational, peaceful Americans. You simply cannot understand the hatred that exists in some people's hearts, and that's lovely. But it's not reality. Israel must deal with reality.

The real problem is that we share the same malignant view of the world. It manifests in our embarrassing Principle of American Exceptionalism, and in your laughable denial that you’ve never even seen the words “chosen people” in your holy texts.

This “better than thou” disease of the mind has brought us both to this pathetic point in history.

DP.

This “pathetic point in history” is, by most objective measures, superior to every point in recorded history.

But I don’t suppose you’re the type to let facts interfere with your ahistorical, dystopian fantasies.

Rant on.

How’s the climate doing in your echo chamber?

After you tell us all about these objective measures of superiority, next expand on 1. why it’s in our strategic interests to prop up the State of Israel in 2023; 2. why the majority of Americans and our elected reps. wish to prop. up the State of Israel; and 3. why an existential crisis is always at the ready to justify our “need” to prop. up the State of Israel.

Superiority? Global life expectancy, standard of living, respect for human rights, treatment of women and minority groups are all better in this era than at literally any other point in recorded history.

As for your other questions:

1. Strategic interest: if you need a primer on this, you have no business opining on this topic. But for starters, guess where the US gets much of its intelligence on the greatest regional threat?

2. Why? Is that even relevant? But check out immediate post-WWII history for insight. Consider also the behavior of Palestinians, their allies, and the behavior of both since 1947. Hardly calibrated to elicit sympathy among the US public. Add in religiousity here and a dose of Islamophobia, along with about 10 other factors and you’ll have an answer.

3. Ask Hamas, Hizbollah, the PLO, Iran, the surrounding Arab states, etc., etc.

Any further questions?

NP.

1. I am not sure the world hasn’t changed enough that this isn’t becoming less true. If Israel’s intelligence services cannot see this major attack (and Jordan’s could), why wouldn’t the better strategic approach be to build better relationships with others. While Israel was a democracy, it might have made some sense. But now it’s ruled by the same type of strongmen as elsewhere in the region.

2. The support for Israel in the US is waning. You may be right today but project forward 20 years and I think the landscape will be very different.

3. This time feels different. The terrorists are doing what they always do. Devaluing all human life and reveling in a sick form of tribalism. But some Palestinians have been able to articulate the harm done by the Israeli response in a way that appeals more to western sensibilities. Which is making Americans go back and understand why these terrorist groups have flourished for so long in that region. Of course the primary responsibility belongs to the terrorists. But they don’t exist in a vacuum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, it's OK now to scale the white house gate and vandalize? The new normal? Just asking.

Look, I’m not anti-Israel and pro-Jewish extermination so wouldn’t have been welcomed at the rally, but violating the boundaries of the White House seems much more restrained than rioting in the Capitol and attempting to overthrow an election. Not a fan of either but the latter seems infinitely more egregious. Think the “new normal” of lawlessness under Trump has opened the floodgates for all, sadly.

DP. As an aside I agree with you - this protest was more notable for its embrace of an antisemitic foreign policy goal as well as likely being funded by foreign governments. But the actual conduct of the protest was very well organized and with message discipline (ensuring that overt anti-semitism was minimized.) Ironically the chaos of Jan 6 bespeaks a lack of organizing coupled with intense propaganda manipulation - Trump literally incited an insane mob. I hope never to see something like that again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-protesters-DC.html

Nobody gets arrested unless it’s a Federal set-up like J6.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did any of the protesters condemn Hamas? Serious question?

You need to face the music. People have been angry for a long time about how much money our govt wastes propping up a belligerent theocratic "democracy," and this might be the straw the breaks the camel's back.

Right, US interests are totally served by letting Israel be destroyed

The state of Israel has resulted in nearly 7 decades of apartheid and oppression. Maybe it’s time for the US to stop giving it money and shielding it from the consequences of its actions on the world stage.

Look, many other states have failed and their people are fine. The third Reich was wiped off the face of the map and the German people have never been better. The USSR was wiped off the map and Russians are still invading other countries. The confederacy was wiped off the map and idiot Americans are thriving. If Israel is wiped off the map and Jews have to coexist in a democracy where everyone has a vote, they will be fine. And maybe they won’t have to build bomb shelters in their homes.

They'll be dead, but I guess by your thinking that's "fine".

Easiest, laziest pathway to status quo, which obviously is far preferable to you than true democracy.

Not at all. I, like the vast majority of Jews, would like a free and democratic Israel and a free and democratic Palestine.
I don't know why you continue to pretend that a majority of Palestinians don't want Jews dead. They keep telling you that, and for some reason, you refuse to believe it.

It doesn’t matter to me that any group wants the other dead. There are reasons for those feelings, which need to be addressed. And there are certain measures that can be implemented to restore civility, even with these two petulant groups (the various leadership groups purporting to represent Palestinians AND the leadership of the State of Israel).

Those leadership groups, militant individuals (including settlers) in both populations would need to be dealt with differently, but you’re not going to convince anyone not already warmly ensconced in you echo chamber that the garden variety Palestinian or the garden variety Israeli cannot be brought together.

Frankly, the Palestinians will be asked to extend far more forgiveness given the asymmetric extent of devastation their communities have experienced at the hands of the State of Israel over the past 75 years, but tough luck. They extend it, or they deal with multi-national consequences.

They’re not responsible for the holocaust / shoah, so refusing to capitulate on this transference of guilt isn’t helping anyone move forward.

This is the problem with rational, peaceful Americans. You simply cannot understand the hatred that exists in some people's hearts, and that's lovely. But it's not reality. Israel must deal with reality.

Fairytales, chosen people, hatred that exists just because, whatever.

If Israel must deal with it, why have I been paying for it since 1967?

Direct your outrage to your congressman then.

What exactly do you think protests are? They are a time honored way of “direct[ing] your outrage to your congressman”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-protesters-DC.html

Nobody gets arrested unless it’s a Federal set-up like J6.

lololol!!! they would have been arrested if they jumped over the fence. the fact is these are “rational” protestors and law enforcement correctly assessed that they would not cross that line. Jan 6 was a completely insane mob with anarchic organization incited by trump.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So let’s say Israel says ok ceasefire. What’s step 2?

Exactly - step two is Hamas kills more Israelis and takes more hostages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-protesters-DC.html

You'd shoot and kill someone over graffiti? Wow. I guess the 'dehumanize the other side' part of the campaign has done its part on you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Until the rallies acknowledge and condemn Hamas, Erhadt than calling attacks justified, it’s difficult not to take this as antisemitic and calling for Israel’s destruction

I have no control over Hamas.

What I can do is protest my own governments actions.

And, much of the money sent to Israel by the US is to replenish the iron dome. So, you are protesting the US protecting the lives of Jews.

A call for a ceasefire means everyone ceases fire.

“From the River to the Sea” isn’t calling for a ceasefire. It’s calling for a one state solution.

It leaves to the imagination how you get there.

From the river to the sea has been used in the past by supporters of a 2 state solution and by members of Likud

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So why was this allowed to get out of hand.

Protesters climbed the White House fence. They stray painted monuments and put red pain lt all over the White House Walls.

Why allow this as it will only get worse. I would think anyone climbing the White House fence should be immediate shot or arrested.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711815/amp/Antisemitic-vandalism-capital-thousands-
protesters-DC.html

All protests are going to have bad actors and I am disheartened to hear about this incident. I have heard, however, that for the most part, the protest managed to get their message out and didn’t turn violent or anti-Semitic. Which I was happy to see.