Anyone else surprised by a lack of interest in William & Mary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

Not to nitpick, BUT that's not quite true. St Mary's (MD), College of NJ and UNC Asheville come to mind as others. Probably more.

Only US public National (vs regional or SLAC) U.

William and Mary may be the only national public university that is similar in undergraduate enrollment (and residential nature) to many of the selective, prestigious privates (5-10K). For undergraduate study, almost all prestigious public schools are significantly larger (and less residential) than their private counterparts. William and Mary couples this with having more focus on undergraduate study (and faculty mentored research) rather than graduate programs and sponsored research.

+1
These are really nice, unusual qualities--it's hard to find strong mid-sized schools focused on undergraduates. But it's what messes up WM rankings a bit because it's placed in the National Universities category where most of the schools are larger and have extensive grad programs and so its metrics are hard to compare. It's impressive that they do as well as they have given how the metrics have shifted in the rankings away from their core strengths.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

That’s nonsense. Virginia has other colleges that are like SLACs as do Maryland and other states. You may want to put W&M in the same company as some SLACs, but that’s a quite subjective assertion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

Not to nitpick, BUT that's not quite true. St Mary's (MD), College of NJ and UNC Asheville come to mind as others. Probably more.

Only US public National (vs regional or SLAC) U.

That literally makes it not a SLAC.

SLAC means small liberal arts college, meaning 1k-2k students. 6k+ students (10k total) is not small by any measure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

Not to nitpick, BUT that's not quite true. St Mary's (MD), College of NJ and UNC Asheville come to mind as others. Probably more.

Only US public National (vs regional or SLAC) U.

William and Mary may be the only national public university that is similar in undergraduate enrollment (and residential nature) to many of the selective, prestigious privates (5-10K). For undergraduate study, almost all prestigious public schools are significantly larger (and less residential) than their private counterparts. William and Mary couples this with having more focus on undergraduate study (and faculty mentored research) rather than graduate programs and sponsored research.

W&M is comparable to Dartmouth and Rice in that regard (although less recognized and with less research of course), but I don't think you can compare it to the rest of the T20 just because its undergraduate population sizes are similar. All the T20s sans Dartmouth are major research universities. Columbia for example has a undergrad population of 6k and a grad population of 26k.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

Agreed. DC thought they’d love it based on a long ago visit. Hesitated after the tone of some of their promotional videos.

The zoom interview was the nail in the coffin. Instead of being conversational as advertised, student interviewer asked questions rapid fire, told DS his answer to a question about being of service to others was wrong (described a long-term volunteering role at an area nonprofit including working with the public—interviewer said that’s not really service to others), and barely looked up from their screen. Ended up withdrawing his application.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

That’s nonsense. Virginia has other colleges that are like SLACs as do Maryland and other states. You may want to put W&M in the same company as some SLACs, but that’s a quite subjective assertion.

oh, citations to prove your points, please! lolol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

Not to nitpick, BUT that's not quite true. St Mary's (MD), College of NJ and UNC Asheville come to mind as others. Probably more.

Only US public National (vs regional or SLAC) U.

William and Mary may be the only national public university that is similar in undergraduate enrollment (and residential nature) to many of the selective, prestigious privates (5-10K). For undergraduate study, almost all prestigious public schools are significantly larger (and less residential) than their private counterparts. William and Mary couples this with having more focus on undergraduate study (and faculty mentored research) rather than graduate programs and sponsored research.

W&M is comparable to Dartmouth and Rice in that regard (although less recognized and with less research of course), but I don't think you can compare it to the rest of the T20 just because its undergraduate population sizes are similar. All the T20s sans Dartmouth are major research universities. Columbia for example has a undergrad population of 6k and a grad population of 26k.

Comparing W&M to Dartmouth and Rice is laughable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in-state at a public hs and our counselor told us that UVA, VA TECH, JMU and VCU were all "significantly" more popular than WM. We were really surprised given where WM is ranked.

This is very true.

By the numbers, that's just not the case. It is possible that that is true at your school and what the kids are telling your counselor, so I'm not disputing that your counselor thinks that. I think some of this is just regional. A friend who lives near Charlottesville told me that everyone they know wants VT. That's not the case here in NoVa and I have no idea what Tidewater kids want or what Bristol kids want, and so on. But the number of applicants per spot does not indicate that they are more popular, much less "significantly" so.

DP. Actually, that *does* seem to be the case in NoVA, at least among the students at my kid's high school and kids he knows on sports teams, etc. VT seems to be the #1 choice for so many of these students.

It's really not important what people on this board (including me) have to say. This is all anecdotal. The kids at my DS's school in NoVa mostly consider VT a backup, mostly for kids who won't get into UVa. That is also just anecdotal. Again, the numbers are what matter.

True, but the numbers continue to show that VT is no one's "backup". Every year, parents are *shocked* that their kids did not get into VT when they assumed they would. Also, many kids prefer VT to UVA and never even apply (to UVA).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are no longer interested in W&M because of their students’ verbal attacks on Jewish W&M students and the brick-throwing incident at the (Katherine Rowe, Jewish) president’s home. It is not for us but good luck to everyone else.

Wow, I hadn't heard about these things - could you please tell us more?

https://www.13newsnow.com/amp/article/news/local/virginia/williamsburg/brick-thrown-william-mary-presidents-home-university-spokesperson-confirms/291-0542584c-c566-4999-9bd4-4e10f7931c2e

https://www.wavy.com/news/local-news/williamsburg/jewish-wm-students-say-other-students-verbally-assaulted-them-due-to-war-in-israel/amp/

Terrible!! Thanks for the links.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in-state at a public hs and our counselor told us that UVA, VA TECH, JMU and VCU were all "significantly" more popular than WM. We were really surprised given where WM is ranked.

This is very true.

By the numbers, that's just not the case. It is possible that that is true at your school and what the kids are telling your counselor, so I'm not disputing that your counselor thinks that. I think some of this is just regional. A friend who lives near Charlottesville told me that everyone they know wants VT. That's not the case here in NoVa and I have no idea what Tidewater kids want or what Bristol kids want, and so on. But the number of applicants per spot does not indicate that they are more popular, much less "significantly" so.

DP. Actually, that *does* seem to be the case in NoVA, at least among the students at my kid's high school and kids he knows on sports teams, etc. VT seems to be the #1 choice for so many of these students.

It's really not important what people on this board (including me) have to say. This is all anecdotal. The kids at my DS's school in NoVa mostly consider VT a backup, mostly for kids who won't get into UVa. That is also just anecdotal. Again, the numbers are what matter.

True, but the numbers continue to show that VT is no one's "backup". Every year, parents are *shocked* that their kids did not get into VT when they assumed they would. Also, many kids prefer VT to UVA and never even apply (to UVA).

What "numbers" prove that VT is no one's back-up? VT certainly was a backup for my DC and several of their friends, all of whom were admitted to VT but chose to go to schools higher up on their lists.

[Anonymous]

Haven't read all the posts. FWIW, I encouraged my senior to consider/apply to WM, but it just wasn't their place. We know more than a few families (we are inside beltway in Fairfax county) whose kids thrived at WM. As a parent, WM seems like a bargain compared to private schools. But not a bargain if kid not interested. So, WM is excellent school if kid interested.

[Anonymous]

This is immediate PP. Among my senior's friend group, VT is very much a target school - even #1 choice for a few of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

That’s nonsense. Virginia has other colleges that are like SLACs as do Maryland and other states. You may want to put W&M in the same company as some SLACs, but that’s a quite subjective assertion.

+1
UMW and CNU come to mind immediately, and that's just here in VA. The bolded statement is ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is immediate PP. Among my senior's friend group, VT is very much a target school - even #1 choice for a few of them.

Same here. Definitely #1 for many of the kids in my senior's class. It's a school that has it all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think William and Mary is a love it or hate it place - and both my kids hated it because of the vibe ((seemed) not fun, very academic, town is touristy and not much to do, a lot of talk about pressure and how to relieve stress by our tour guide) - this vibe even carried over in the video they played on the tour a few years ago). All of this said, the school knows who it is and I like that about it - they don't try to pretend to be something they are not to appease the US News BS. Other institutions with similar reputations (U of C) are trying to seem cooler and more relevant to keep their ratings up - and somehow that seems sad to me. Students of all types need a home and that's why when the program works for a W&M student they hit it out of the park.

All true. Virginia is fortunate to have the only public in the United States that, in essence, is a SLAC. That will appeal to those who are going to college to study and learn versus the rah-rah partiers. It's all a good thing. The Commonwealth has 30 public institutions (including community college) to choose from. There is something for everyone.

Not to nitpick, BUT that's not quite true. St Mary's (MD), College of NJ and UNC Asheville come to mind as others. Probably more.

Only US public National (vs regional or SLAC) U.

William and Mary may be the only national public university that is similar in undergraduate enrollment (and residential nature) to many of the selective, prestigious privates (5-10K). For undergraduate study, almost all prestigious public schools are significantly larger (and less residential) than their private counterparts. William and Mary couples this with having more focus on undergraduate study (and faculty mentored research) rather than graduate programs and sponsored research.

W&M is comparable to Dartmouth and Rice in that regard (although less recognized and with less research of course), but I don't think you can compare it to the rest of the T20 just because its undergraduate population sizes are similar. All the T20s sans Dartmouth are major research universities. Columbia for example has a undergrad population of 6k and a grad population of 26k.

Comparing W&M to Dartmouth and Rice is laughable.

The selective privates are mostly typically relatively small and residential for undergraduates. Not just Dartmouth and Rice.