Think she cheated on her SAT?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As far as ACT goes, looks like someone is finally taking them to court. It'll be interesting to see the rulings.
https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2019/01/14/lawsuit-against-act-adds-criticism-testing-organizations-allegedly
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/2019/01/sorry-act-kids-accused-of-cheating-can-now-sue-you-nj-judge-says.html

This is great news!

Okay, that article says the kid was offered a $20K scholarship somewhere with ACT scores in the low 20s.

How on earth is that possible?

Where are these kids going to college where they are getting scholarship for such low or middling ACT/SAT scores?

I thought kids need SATs in the upper 1300s to 1400s or ACTs in the upper 20s/low 30s to even get accepted to college, and much higher for scholarships.

Penn State. Didn't you read the article?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this is an entirely different world I wasn't privy to.

I'm AA, attended predominantly AA, working class schools in the south. I took the SATs once with no prep at all. Scored close to 1300, with an almost perfect verbal score.

I'd heard of prep classes, but I didn't know anyone taking them. Also, it would've been difficult for my family to afford. I also thought it only bumped your score up a bit, like 100 points.

You mean to tell me that people whose families can afford it are able to bump up their progeny's scores by hundreds of points??

If true (and not statistically rare), what is the point of the test if those with money can essentially manufacture their kids' results?? What is it measuring?? To my mind, this strengthens the case for affirmative action.

No, most research shows that prep classes bump scores on average 30-60 points. In addition, Asians are the most likely to use test prep, followed by blacks, then Hispanics and lastly whites.

From this link: https://people.socsci.tau.ac.il/mu/salon/files/2011/11/Racial_differences_SFJ_89_2_Alon-final.pdf

"…blacks and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high school courses, private courses and private tutors."

The study that you posted used data from the 1990s. Try again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this is an entirely different world I wasn't privy to.

I'm AA, attended predominantly AA, working class schools in the south. I took the SATs once with no prep at all. Scored close to 1300, with an almost perfect verbal score.

I'd heard of prep classes, but I didn't know anyone taking them. Also, it would've been difficult for my family to afford. I also thought it only bumped your score up a bit, like 100 points.

You mean to tell me that people whose families can afford it are able to bump up their progeny's scores by hundreds of points??

If true (and not statistically rare), what is the point of the test if those with money can essentially manufacture their kids' results?? What is it measuring?? To my mind, this strengthens the case for affirmative action.

No, most research shows that prep classes bump scores on average 30-60 points. In addition, Asians are the most likely to use test prep, followed by blacks, then Hispanics and lastly whites.

From this link: https://people.socsci.tau.ac.il/mu/salon/files/2011/11/Racial_differences_SFJ_89_2_Alon-final.pdf

"…blacks and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high school courses, private courses and private tutors."

The study that you posted used data from the 1990s. Try again.

DP . So what? Why do you assume the data have changed meaningfully since then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this is an entirely different world I wasn't privy to.

I'm AA, attended predominantly AA, working class schools in the south. I took the SATs once with no prep at all. Scored close to 1300, with an almost perfect verbal score.

I'd heard of prep classes, but I didn't know anyone taking them. Also, it would've been difficult for my family to afford. I also thought it only bumped your score up a bit, like 100 points.

You mean to tell me that people whose families can afford it are able to bump up their progeny's scores by hundreds of points??

If true (and not statistically rare), what is the point of the test if those with money can essentially manufacture their kids' results?? What is it measuring?? To my mind, this strengthens the case for affirmative action.

No, most research shows that prep classes bump scores on average 30-60 points. In addition, Asians are the most likely to use test prep, followed by blacks, then Hispanics and lastly whites.

From this link: https://people.socsci.tau.ac.il/mu/salon/files/2011/11/Racial_differences_SFJ_89_2_Alon-final.pdf

"…blacks and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high school courses, private courses and private tutors."

The study that you posted used data from the 1990s. Try again.

DP . So what? Why do you assume the data have changed meaningfully since then?

A couple of points: on the one hand, the test has changed several times since then. It does not resemble the early 1990s test.

On the other hand, College Board purposely made the test more preppable than ever and touts a study showing 100 point score increases from practice on Khan Academy (FREE), which the student in question wisely utilized.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this is an entirely different world I wasn't privy to.

I'm AA, attended predominantly AA, working class schools in the south. I took the SATs once with no prep at all. Scored close to 1300, with an almost perfect verbal score.

I'd heard of prep classes, but I didn't know anyone taking them. Also, it would've been difficult for my family to afford. I also thought it only bumped your score up a bit, like 100 points.

You mean to tell me that people whose families can afford it are able to bump up their progeny's scores by hundreds of points??

If true (and not statistically rare), what is the point of the test if those with money can essentially manufacture their kids' results?? What is it measuring?? To my mind, this strengthens the case for affirmative action.

No, most research shows that prep classes bump scores on average 30-60 points. In addition, Asians are the most likely to use test prep, followed by blacks, then Hispanics and lastly whites.

From this link: https://people.socsci.tau.ac.il/mu/salon/files/2011/11/Racial_differences_SFJ_89_2_Alon-final.pdf

"…blacks and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high school courses, private courses and private tutors."

The study that you posted used data from the 1990s. Try again.

DP . So what? Why do you assume the data have changed meaningfully since then?

A couple of points: on the one hand, the test has changed several times since then. It does not resemble the early 1990s test.

On the other hand, College Board purposely made the test more preppable than ever and touts a study showing 100 point score increases from practice on Khan Academy (FREE), which the student in question wisely utilized.

Hmmm... but she had a 300 point increase.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this is an entirely different world I wasn't privy to.

I'm AA, attended predominantly AA, working class schools in the south. I took the SATs once with no prep at all. Scored close to 1300, with an almost perfect verbal score.

I'd heard of prep classes, but I didn't know anyone taking them. Also, it would've been difficult for my family to afford. I also thought it only bumped your score up a bit, like 100 points.

You mean to tell me that people whose families can afford it are able to bump up their progeny's scores by hundreds of points??

If true (and not statistically rare), what is the point of the test if those with money can essentially manufacture their kids' results?? What is it measuring?? To my mind, this strengthens the case for affirmative action.

No, most research shows that prep classes bump scores on average 30-60 points. In addition, Asians are the most likely to use test prep, followed by blacks, then Hispanics and lastly whites.

From this link: https://people.socsci.tau.ac.il/mu/salon/files/2011/11/Racial_differences_SFJ_89_2_Alon-final.pdf

"…blacks and Hispanics are more likely than whites from comparable backgrounds to utilize test preparation. The black-white gap is especially pronounced in the use of high school courses, private courses and private tutors."

The study that you posted used data from the 1990s. Try again.

DP . So what? Why do you assume the data have changed meaningfully since then?

A couple of points: on the one hand, the test has changed several times since then. It does not resemble the early 1990s test.

On the other hand, College Board purposely made the test more preppable than ever and touts a study showing 100 point score increases from practice on Khan Academy (FREE), which the student in question wisely utilized.

Hmmm... but she had a 300 point increase.

Averages and medians... how do they work?

[Anonymous]

I'd hope that if she cheated she'd have gotten a better score than a 1230. Also, I don't think that it is that difficult to improve upon the initial score of 900 with test prep, much of the gain could be familiarity and strategic test-taking rather than actual content knowledge. It is when you are trying to improve upon an already high score that it is difficult to improve through prep. I don't know if the student in question cheated or did not cheat, but it will be difficult to prove either way. The obvious solution would be a free of charge retake and expedited scoring so that the student has something to submit for her college application.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As far as ACT goes, looks like someone is finally taking them to court. It'll be interesting to see the rulings.
https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2019/01/14/lawsuit-against-act-adds-criticism-testing-organizations-allegedly
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/2019/01/sorry-act-kids-accused-of-cheating-can-now-sue-you-nj-judge-says.html

This is great news!

Okay, that article says the kid was offered a $20K scholarship somewhere with ACT scores in the low 20s.

How on earth is that possible?

Where are these kids going to college where they are getting scholarship for such low or middling ACT/SAT scores?

I thought kids need SATs in the upper 1300s to 1400s or ACTs in the upper 20s/low 30s to even get accepted to college, and much higher for scholarships.

Penn State. Didn't you read the article?

I read only one of them. I did not see Penn State listed as the school that offered the $20k merit aide. The article said he turned that school down but did not mention what school it was.

I did not realize that students only need a low 20s ACT to get accepted to Penn State with merit age. I am shocked, actually

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As far as ACT goes, looks like someone is finally taking them to court. It'll be interesting to see the rulings.
https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2019/01/14/lawsuit-against-act-adds-criticism-testing-organizations-allegedly
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/2019/01/sorry-act-kids-accused-of-cheating-can-now-sue-you-nj-judge-says.html

This is great news!

Okay, that article says the kid was offered a $20K scholarship somewhere with ACT scores in the low 20s.

How on earth is that possible?

Where are these kids going to college where they are getting scholarship for such low or middling ACT/SAT scores?

I thought kids need SATs in the upper 1300s to 1400s or ACTs in the upper 20s/low 30s to even get accepted to college, and much higher for scholarships.

Penn State. Didn't you read the article?

I read only one of them. I did not see Penn State listed as the school that offered the $20k merit aide. The article said he turned that school down but did not mention what school it was.

I did not realize that students only need a low 20s ACT to get accepted to Penn State with merit age. I am shocked, actually

This is when you realize that only reading DCUM gives you a really warped view of the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As far as ACT goes, looks like someone is finally taking them to court. It'll be interesting to see the rulings.
https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2019/01/14/lawsuit-against-act-adds-criticism-testing-organizations-allegedly
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/2019/01/sorry-act-kids-accused-of-cheating-can-now-sue-you-nj-judge-says.html

This is great news!

Okay, that article says the kid was offered a $20K scholarship somewhere with ACT scores in the low 20s.

How on earth is that possible?

Where are these kids going to college where they are getting scholarship for such low or middling ACT/SAT scores?

I thought kids need SATs in the upper 1300s to 1400s or ACTs in the upper 20s/low 30s to even get accepted to college, and much higher for scholarships.

Penn State. Didn't you read the article?

I read only one of them. I did not see Penn State listed as the school that offered the $20k merit aide. The article said he turned that school down but did not mention what school it was.

I did not realize that students only need a low 20s ACT to get accepted to Penn State with merit age. I am shocked, actually

This is when you realize that only reading DCUM gives you a really warped view of the world.

But Penn State's average ACT is 25 to 29.

21 is WAY below average, and 26 is a skin of your teeth admittance. How do either of those scores result in merit awards?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As far as ACT goes, looks like someone is finally taking them to court. It'll be interesting to see the rulings.
https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2019/01/14/lawsuit-against-act-adds-criticism-testing-organizations-allegedly
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/news/2019/01/sorry-act-kids-accused-of-cheating-can-now-sue-you-nj-judge-says.html

This is great news!

Okay, that article says the kid was offered a $20K scholarship somewhere with ACT scores in the low 20s.

How on earth is that possible?

Where are these kids going to college where they are getting scholarship for such low or middling ACT/SAT scores?

I thought kids need SATs in the upper 1300s to 1400s or ACTs in the upper 20s/low 30s to even get accepted to college, and much higher for scholarships.

Penn State. Didn't you read the article?

I read only one of them. I did not see Penn State listed as the school that offered the $20k merit aide. The article said he turned that school down but did not mention what school it was.

I did not realize that students only need a low 20s ACT to get accepted to Penn State with merit age. I am shocked, actually

This is when you realize that only reading DCUM gives you a really warped view of the world.

But Penn State's average ACT is 25 to 29.

21 is WAY below average, and 26 is a skin of your teeth admittance. How do either of those scores result in merit awards?

They don’t. Penn State was never mentioned. She lives in Florida anyway. Idk where PP came up with it..

[Anonymous]

I think she cheated and not because of the score increase. That happens pretty frequently. I think that her test is EXACTLY like another test (probably from the internet) The one she copied and the computer caught it. There are many ways this can be done ( and doing it is not that hard) But most people don’t get caught. She did. She is also acting guilty by not retaking the test, or simply taking tha ACT instead. I suspect the evidence rather strong.

[Anonymous]

^^ the language from the test source is rather generic. It’s probably pretty obvious she cheated. The computer doesn’t know she’s black so let’s let that go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think she cheated and not because of the score increase. That happens pretty frequently. I think that her test is EXACTLY like another test (probably from the internet) The one she copied and the computer caught it. There are many ways this can be done ( and doing it is not that hard) But most people don’t get caught. She did. She is also acting guilty by not retaking the test, or simply taking tha ACT instead. I suspect the evidence rather strong.

+1 . Between the $100k Gofundme campaign (which is going great BTW), hiring the civil rights lawyer and the ensuing media blitz she certainly is doing everything she can to look guilty and somewhat idiotic. If she were truly concerned with getting into college she would retake the test and get on with her life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she cheated and not because of the score increase. That happens pretty frequently. I think that her test is EXACTLY like another test (probably from the internet) The one she copied and the computer caught it. There are many ways this can be done ( and doing it is not that hard) But most people don’t get caught. She did. She is also acting guilty by not retaking the test, or simply taking tha ACT instead. I suspect the evidence rather strong.

+1 . Between the $100k Gofundme campaign (which is going great BTW), hiring the civil rights lawyer and the ensuing media blitz she certainly is doing everything she can to look guilty and somewhat idiotic. If she were truly concerned with getting into college she would retake the test and get on with her life.

How is $346 towards a goal of $100,000 "doing great"? I think it proves that most people see this for what it is.