RANT: Teachers, why are you so whiny?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Skip to links below if you want to read research on this issue. Continue if you want my personal perspective as an attorney who is from a family of elementary and high school teachers.

YES. Thank you. Teachers are striking here in Denver now, carrying ridiculous signs and complaining about pay. The complaint that really gets me is the assertion that most teachers spend their evenings, weekends, vacations, and summers grueling over grades and lesson plans. That claim is simply disingenuous for anyone other than the newest, most obsessively dedicated, or poorly time-managed teachers. My brother is a teacher, lives frugally, and spends his vacations and summers traveling until in-service a few days before classes start. My sister is a teacher and is married to another teacher. Between the two of them, they do quite well and seem to enjoy their fall, winter, spring, and summer breaks just fine. YES, teachers have a tough job dealing with unruly kids and parents. YES, they have to take work home from time to time. But guess what, so do the rest of us, and we do it 50 weeks a year. I am an attorney who works in litigation, so the "stress" of having to spend an evening at a school sporting event (as opposed to hunched over a computer finalizing a brief at 10pm) just isn't all that convincing. And don't get me started about all the hours spent working outside the office. Moreover, when you look at my per hour pay it is not much different than a high school teacher with equal years experience (controlled for 9mo vs 12mo work-year), and I don't have nearly as good of a pension. Fact is, $50K for 9mos work in a profession that requires a bachelors or masters (in education - not organic chemistry, law, medicine, or computer science) is a pretty good gig.

http://www.aei.org/publication/no-teachers-are-not-underpaid/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffreydorfman/2014/08/07/low-teacher-pay-and-high-teacher-pay-are-both-myths/#1dca873631af

I think they're reasonably well compensated for one of the easiest majors out there. Most teaching staff attends less selective schools and score lower on average than most other majors out there. There are exceptions to the rule of course.

https://qz.com/334926/your-college-major-is-a-pretty-good-indication-of-how-smart-you-are/

To be fair, attending a highly selective school for an education major doesn't really make much sense. The salary and opportunity after graduation will be the same as any other accredited program and it will cost more to obtain the degree.

On the other hand, is the other PP (teacher) implying that her employers are paying for her to obtain multiple graduate degrees?

[Anonymous]

Teachers have to be recertified. In MD, teachers have to be recertified every 5 years so we have to take 6 grad credits every 5 years. In my district, we are reimbursed half of each course after our Master's degree. If you take 6 credits every 5 years, you end up with enough credits with a second Master's degree (teachers in my district need to have earned a Master's degree with 5 yrs of being hired). I have zero desire for a second Master's degree but with recertification, that's how many teachers end up with a second (and third) one. My Master's degree was exhausting and plenty of people quit. That's probably a good thing because they wouldn't have lasted long as a teacher either.

[Anonymous]

Elementary teacher here. I work a 194 day contract. That’s 39 weeks. So 13 weeks either off or not under contract.

I have been teaching 26 years. During the school year it’s not uncommon to work 50 hours a week, but I rarely go over that.

I can’t remember the last time I did anything work related in the summer. I leave after the last contract day in the middle of June and pick back up on the first day back in the middle of August. Spring and winter breaks are breaks. Sometimes I think I’ll accomplish some work but that doesn’t happen. I do take a minimum of 2 courses every 5 years for recertification, but I am lucky in that my district provides those at no cost.

I am ok with my pay, but have seen a steady reduction in benefits which I am not happy about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Elementary teacher here. I work a 194 day contract. That’s 39 weeks. So 13 weeks either off or not under contract.

I have been teaching 26 years. During the school year it’s not uncommon to work 50 hours a week, but I rarely go over that.

I can’t remember the last time I did anything work related in the summer. I leave after the last contract day in the middle of June and pick back up on the first day back in the middle of August. Spring and winter breaks are breaks. Sometimes I think I’ll accomplish some work but that doesn’t happen. I do take a minimum of 2 courses every 5 years for recertification, but I am lucky in that my district provides those at no cost.

I am ok with my pay, but have seen a steady reduction in benefits which I am not happy about.

I understand your frustration. The understanding for teachers was always lower pay in exchange for better benefits

Pension plans aren't sustainable and health care costs keep rising so the benefits need to be reduced but in exchange your salaries should go up

[Anonymous]

I disagree with your statements about the pay, OP. Teachers haven't had any really wage increases in decades.

[Anonymous]

I think they're reasonably well compensated for one of the easiest majors out there. Most teaching staff attends less selective schools and score lower on average than most other majors out there. There are exceptions to the rule of course.

You think they all study the same thing? Secondary teachers (grades 6-12) have to have a degree in their subject area: math, history/economics/etc., English, or a science (usually Chemistry or Biology). Some of these majors are very difficult, and the teachers teaching them could make much more money in other fields.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Skip to links below if you want to read research on this issue. Continue if you want my personal perspective as an attorney who is from a family of elementary and high school teachers.

YES. Thank you. Teachers are striking here in Denver now, carrying ridiculous signs and complaining about pay. The complaint that really gets me is the assertion that most teachers spend their evenings, weekends, vacations, and summers grueling over grades and lesson plans. That claim is simply disingenuous for anyone other than the newest, most obsessively dedicated, or poorly time-managed teachers. My brother is a teacher, lives frugally, and spends his vacations and summers traveling until in-service a few days before classes start. My sister is a teacher and is married to another teacher. Between the two of them, they do quite well and seem to enjoy their fall, winter, spring, and summer breaks just fine. YES, teachers have a tough job dealing with unruly kids and parents. YES, they have to take work home from time to time. But guess what, so do the rest of us, and we do it 50 weeks a year. I am an attorney who works in litigation, so the "stress" of having to spend an evening at a school sporting event (as opposed to hunched over a computer finalizing a brief at 10pm) just isn't all that convincing. And don't get me started about all the hours spent working outside the office. Moreover, when you look at my per hour pay it is not much different than a high school teacher with equal years experience (controlled for 9mo vs 12mo work-year), and I don't have nearly as good of a pension. Fact is, $50K for 9mos work in a profession that requires a bachelors or masters (in education - not organic chemistry, law, medicine, or computer science) is a pretty good gig.

http://www.aei.org/publication/no-teachers-are-not-underpaid/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffreydorfman/2014/08/07/low-teacher-pay-and-high-teacher-pay-are-both-myths/#1dca873631af

The funny thing is is once they put in subs and administrative staff in the Denver public schools and everything turned into chaos. Teaching is so easy ! Except so many people are pousy at doing it

[Anonymous]

Why does anybody teach? I can't see it being for the joy of it all anymore. Students and parents are a bunch of entitled jerks, and everyone thinks they know your job.

No thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does anybody teach? I can't see it being for the joy of it all anymore. Students and parents are a bunch of entitled jerks, and everyone thinks they know your job.

No thank you.

It’s too late to switch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does anybody teach? I can't see it being for the joy of it all anymore. Students and parents are a bunch of entitled jerks, and everyone thinks they know your job.

No thank you.

It’s too late to switch.

Same here. I don’t want to (and can’t afford) to go back to school. I have my kid’s tuition to pay and I’m a single parent. I’d love to find a middle of the road school. I’m a in Title 1 school and wonder if many of my students have parents. They are MIA. I can’t even get them on the phone. My friends teach in high SES areas and they are bombarded by parent emails.

[Anonymous]

At our school, teachers use instruction time as planning time to have the FCPS sheduled planning day off. They send a frowning sub to ruin the day of many 6-10 y o kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At our school, teachers use instruction time as planning time to have the FCPS sheduled planning day off. They send a frowning sub to ruin the day of many 6-10 y o kids.

I teach third grade for FCPS and can’t picture how this would even work. Could you elaborate?

If we don’t have meetings planned (which we often do), I am spending the time getting other work done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At our school, teachers use instruction time as planning time to have the FCPS sheduled planning day off. They send a frowning sub to ruin the day of many 6-10 y o kids.

What? You can't just not show up on a planning day. It's a work day. And the kids don't have school on teacher work days.

[Anonymous]

My sister teaches 5th grade and has for quite a while. Makes excellent money and works less than 40 hours a week. All holidays off as well as Summer break, xmas break, and spring break. Great benefits too. Not seeing her family want for much. Vacation all the time, nice cars.... but.... I hear her complain constantly. Let's break down her wage. For anyone else you'd need to make about $30 an hour and work 50 weeks a year at 40 hours a week to make around 60K. She does this in less than 9 months. How much is she getting an hour??????

[Anonymous]

I just can't feel sorry for teachers. I swear they must learn to complain in school to become a teacher. Our family has at least a half dozen teachers and it is the most annoying thing when we all get together. It's like a game of who can top the other for 'poor me' stories. Hey teachers, 99% of the rest of the workforce who actually work full time+ aren't loving their job and feel underpaid. Everyone would like more money for what they do. But when you don't have to go to work all 12 months of the year and have EVERY holiday and weekend off it's quite difficult to feel sorry for you. You also get Spring Break as well as a few days off at Thanksgiving. Any other job requires you to use vacation time to have time off. Plenty of jobs also make you work holidays or there is mandatory overtime or forced weekends. And oh yeah, there's your Summer where you don't have to work. Whoops, let's not forget about two weeks off at Christmas time. Then there is the fact that teaching is not a physically demanding job. You don't come home exhausted and sore. You're not lifting anything heavy over and over and there's no boss at the end of 8-10 hours telling you you're not going home and you've got 2-4 more hours to go. Or the infamous double shift. Even in skilled jobs there are very physical days and super long hours. Professional jobs are ALWAYS way more hours a day than a teacher puts in. Not to mention the stress. Plus they work year round and have no where near the time off. Salaried positions are usually based at 50 hours a week. A teacher can get to school 5 minutes before it starts and leave as soon as the students are gone. Grading papers is not hard and can be done at school during school hours. Students can do this too. And oh no, you may have conferences twice a year and have to be at school for 11-12 hours in one day for maybe 2-3 days. Ahhhh, most of us do this EVERY week. Then we have the teachers who teach at the same school and the same grade year after year. It's not like you're walking into a mystery every day you come in. And what about benefits, those are damn good if you ask me. Try getting good benefits elsewhere. You've been spoiled and don't realize it. Go out and actually WORK for a few years and then go back to your cush job teaching. You won't complain ever again.