An interesting article about MCPS student population

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is what white flight looks like in real time, the real question is what will happen to the area if it continues and if the historical effects such as depressed property values, school results and crime follow. Looking at the metrics the schools are starting to decline in those areas in the east.

Yes, it is so interesting. In decades past, white flight drove people out of DC and away from black/poor people. Now, the suburbs are no longer a sanctuary as the numbers of poor brown people are increasing, and so white flight into privates and areas further afield is happening.

In all seriousness, I don't know what the answer is. We moved out of one of the W school districts and bought in NW DC--but our oldest is young, the neighborhood schools are already good in a few areas and are improving in other areas as gentrification spreads, and we can afford private if need be (we're also AA and therefore are probably a lot more comfortable with diversity than some of the folks going on here about illegals). Of course, moving isn't a realistic or desirable option for most people.

If we stayed in MoCo and lived in one of the areas with significant increases in ESL students, I guess I'd just push the powers that be for more wrap-around services and other resources--smaller class sizes, more teachers, more social workers/psychologists to meet needs of those exposed to crime/violence in their home countries, etc. Yes, I guess this would likely come with higher taxes, but the demographic trends won't change anytime soon, so it seems a prudent investment of resources. DC spends a ton of money on education given the high-needs population in all but a handful of schools; perhaps MoCo should follow suit to ensure that standards remain high and all students needs are met, to the extent possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what white flight looks like in real time, the real question is what will happen to the area if it continues and if the historical effects such as depressed property values, school results and crime follow. Looking at the metrics the schools are starting to decline in those areas in the east.

Yes, it is so interesting. In decades past, white flight drove people out of DC and away from black/poor people. Now, the suburbs are no longer a sanctuary as the numbers of poor brown people are increasing, and so white flight into privates and areas further afield is happening.

In all seriousness, I don't know what the answer is. We moved out of one of the W school districts and bought in NW DC--but our oldest is young, the neighborhood schools are already good in a few areas and are improving in other areas as gentrification spreads, and we can afford private if need be (we're also AA and therefore are probably a lot more comfortable with diversity than some of the folks going on here about illegals). Of course, moving isn't a realistic or desirable option for most people.

If we stayed in MoCo and lived in one of the areas with significant increases in ESL students, I guess I'd just push the powers that be for more wrap-around services and other resources--smaller class sizes, more teachers, more social workers/psychologists to meet needs of those exposed to crime/violence in their home countries, etc. Yes, I guess this would likely come with higher taxes, but the demographic trends won't change anytime soon, so it seems a prudent investment of resources. DC spends a ton of money on education given the high-needs population in all but a handful of schools; perhaps MoCo should follow suit to ensure that standards remain high and all students needs are met, to the extent possible.

PP here. Meant to add, this trend of cities becoming richer and surrounding suburbs becoming poorer is happening all over the country, and internationally as well (just googled and apparently a similar trend is happening in London, and there's of course the banlieues around Paris). Here's just one article:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/02/26/cities-are-becoming-more-affluent-while-poverty-is-rising-in-inner-suburbs-and-that-has-implications-for-schools/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what white flight looks like in real time, the real question is what will happen to the area if it continues and if the historical effects such as depressed property values, school results and crime follow. Looking at the metrics the schools are starting to decline in those areas in the east.

Yes, it is so interesting. In decades past, white flight drove people out of DC and away from black/poor people. Now, the suburbs are no longer a sanctuary as the numbers of poor brown people are increasing, and so white flight into privates and areas further afield is happening.

In all seriousness, I don't know what the answer is. We moved out of one of the W school districts and bought in NW DC--but our oldest is young, the neighborhood schools are already good in a few areas and are improving in other areas as gentrification spreads, and we can afford private if need be (we're also AA and therefore are probably a lot more comfortable with diversity than some of the folks going on here about illegals). Of course, moving isn't a realistic or desirable option for most people.

If we stayed in MoCo and lived in one of the areas with significant increases in ESL students, I guess I'd just push the powers that be for more wrap-around services and other resources--smaller class sizes, more teachers, more social workers/psychologists to meet needs of those exposed to crime/violence in their home countries, etc. Yes, I guess this would likely come with higher taxes, but the demographic trends won't change anytime soon, so it seems a prudent investment of resources. DC spends a ton of money on education given the high-needs population in all but a handful of schools; perhaps MoCo should follow suit to ensure that standards remain high and all students needs are met, to the extent possible.

PP here. Meant to add, this trend of cities becoming richer and surrounding suburbs becoming poorer is happening all over the country, and internationally as well (just googled and apparently a similar trend is happening in London, and there's of course the banlieues around Paris). Here's just one article:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/02/26/cities-are-becoming-more-affluent-while-poverty-is-rising-in-inner-suburbs-and-that-has-implications-for-schools/

Just so you know, we just had a massive tax increase just this year for schools. There is no more going to the well for quite a few years. Also, there is no money for wrap around services, teachers or smaller class sizes or new buildings. If you have been following MCPS problems at all, then you would realize that is crazy talk! Don't you think concerned parents are all already fighting tooth and nail for those things? I know my community is! Just read any of the posts concerning MCPS on these boards.

Parents are involved and vocal but the money for the resources just isn't there because there is a population explosion of needy kids. You really have no idea what is happening here. I am not meaning that to be mean but you really just don't. The county is absolutely tapped out. And the demographic hurt the most is the AA Farms kids and legal immigrants who should be getting these services not the exploding immigrant population. We need to take care of our own kids. There just aren't enough resources to go around. In a perfect world, there would be. But there isn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what white flight looks like in real time, the real question is what will happen to the area if it continues and if the historical effects such as depressed property values, school results and crime follow. Looking at the metrics the schools are starting to decline in those areas in the east.

Yes, it is so interesting. In decades past, white flight drove people out of DC and away from black/poor people. Now, the suburbs are no longer a sanctuary as the numbers of poor brown people are increasing, and so white flight into privates and areas further afield is happening.

In all seriousness, I don't know what the answer is. We moved out of one of the W school districts and bought in NW DC--but our oldest is young, the neighborhood schools are already good in a few areas and are improving in other areas as gentrification spreads, and we can afford private if need be (we're also AA and therefore are probably a lot more comfortable with diversity than some of the folks going on here about illegals). Of course, moving isn't a realistic or desirable option for most people.

If we stayed in MoCo and lived in one of the areas with significant increases in ESL students, I guess I'd just push the powers that be for more wrap-around services and other resources--smaller class sizes, more teachers, more social workers/psychologists to meet needs of those exposed to crime/violence in their home countries, etc. Yes, I guess this would likely come with higher taxes, but the demographic trends won't change anytime soon, so it seems a prudent investment of resources. DC spends a ton of money on education given the high-needs population in all but a handful of schools; perhaps MoCo should follow suit to ensure that standards remain high and all students needs are met, to the extent possible.

PP here. Meant to add, this trend of cities becoming richer and surrounding suburbs becoming poorer is happening all over the country, and internationally as well (just googled and apparently a similar trend is happening in London, and there's of course the banlieues around Paris). Here's just one article:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/02/26/cities-are-becoming-more-affluent-while-poverty-is-rising-in-inner-suburbs-and-that-has-implications-for-schools/

Just so you know, we just had a massive tax increase just this year for schools. There is no more going to the well for quite a few years. Also, there is no money for wrap around services, teachers or smaller class sizes or new buildings. If you have been following MCPS problems at all, then you would realize that is crazy talk! Don't you think concerned parents are all already fighting tooth and nail for those things? I know my community is! Just read any of the posts concerning MCPS on these boards.

Parents are involved and vocal but the money for the resources just isn't there because there is a population explosion of needy kids. You really have no idea what is happening here. I am not meaning that to be mean but you really just don't. The county is absolutely tapped out. And the demographic hurt the most is the AA Farms kids and legal immigrants who should be getting these services not the exploding immigrant population. We need to take care of our own kids. There just aren't enough resources to go around. In a perfect world, there would be. But there isn't.

+1

The ship is sinking fast

[Anonymous]

Just so you know, we just had a massive tax increase just this year for schools. There is no more going to the well for quite a few years. Also, there is no money for wrap around services, teachers or smaller class sizes or new buildings. If you have been following MCPS problems at all, then you would realize that is crazy talk! Don't you think concerned parents are all already fighting tooth and nail for those things? I know my community is! Just read any of the posts concerning MCPS on these boards.

Parents are involved and vocal but the money for the resources just isn't there because there is a population explosion of needy kids. You really have no idea what is happening here. I am not meaning that to be mean but you really just don't. The county is absolutely tapped out. And the demographic hurt the most is the AA Farms kids and legal immigrants who should be getting these services not the exploding immigrant population. We need to take care of our own kids. There just aren't enough resources to go around. In a perfect world, there would be. But there isn't.

I'm the PP you're responding to. I still maintain that some of the furor seems to be fueled at least partially by racism based on the tone of some comments, but there also seems to be legitimate concern about overcrowding and limited resources. I admit that I have not followed this issue very closely, and just happened to see this in Recent topics.

What do the school board and others propose to try to get a handle on this problem re: the influx of new students, and meeting the needs of all students? And how are families with options responding (putting kids in private, fundraising for additional school staff like aides, etc.)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Just so you know, we just had a massive tax increase just this year for schools. There is no more going to the well for quite a few years. Also, there is no money for wrap around services, teachers or smaller class sizes or new buildings. If you have been following MCPS problems at all, then you would realize that is crazy talk! Don't you think concerned parents are all already fighting tooth and nail for those things? I know my community is! Just read any of the posts concerning MCPS on these boards.

Parents are involved and vocal but the money for the resources just isn't there because there is a population explosion of needy kids. You really have no idea what is happening here. I am not meaning that to be mean but you really just don't. The county is absolutely tapped out. And the demographic hurt the most is the AA Farms kids and legal immigrants who should be getting these services not the exploding immigrant population. We need to take care of our own kids. There just aren't enough resources to go around. In a perfect world, there would be. But there isn't.

I'm the PP you're responding to. I still maintain that some of the furor seems to be fueled at least partially by racism based on the tone of some comments, but there also seems to be legitimate concern about overcrowding and limited resources. I admit that I have not followed this issue very closely, and just happened to see this in Recent topics.

What do the school board and others propose to try to get a handle on this problem re: the influx of new students, and meeting the needs of all students? And how are families with options responding (putting kids in private, fundraising for additional school staff like aides, etc.)?

We're a family with options, and we're taking it year by year. So far, our (high needs, high ESOL, medium FARMS) school has done a great job of challenging and meeting the needs of our middle class, English speaking, high achieving, kids.

In MCPS you can't fundraise for additional school staff the way you can in DCPS, but I do work on grants, sponsorships, and other fundraising to help the school add the kind of interesting programming that might get dropped otherwise.

[Anonymous]

We are true middle class (not Potomac middle class) and we moved one to private at 6th and our youngest is in public with a hope of staying until 5th but this year has been a train wreck so we are looking at private for next year.

By train wreck:
1. Math is way too easy for 2nd. They haven't even learned money, time or fractions yet. Just very boring writing out numbers and extremely easy graphs. Who has more? Things kids in preschool could do.
2. HW is the same sheet different numbers every night. There has been 7 errors located on those sheets already
3. The teacher is flustered and mean. She doesn't look any kids in the face. She talks down to them. Even when parents volunteer or open house day.
4. My child's anxiety about school has increased. They have 27 kids in their class and many don't give a crap about being there or their school work. A lot of kids being sent to principal, teacher yelling, kids disrupting other kids. At least 5 that do not speak English.
5. My child is in the top reading group and they meet 2 times a week while other groups meet 3-4 times a week.
6. Most of the day is spent with kids at their desks self-guiding themselves to do worksheets or read. There is ver little actual teaching going on.
7. 2.0 has been awful. My oldest missed it so comparing both it is obvious which one was better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are true middle class (not Potomac middle class) and we moved one to private at 6th and our youngest is in public with a hope of staying until 5th but this year has been a train wreck so we are looking at private for next year.

By train wreck:
1. Math is way too easy for 2nd. They haven't even learned money, time or fractions yet. Just very boring writing out numbers and extremely easy graphs. Who has more? Things kids in preschool could do.
2. HW is the same sheet different numbers every night. There has been 7 errors located on those sheets already
3. The teacher is flustered and mean. She doesn't look any kids in the face. She talks down to them. Even when parents volunteer or open house day.
4. My child's anxiety about school has increased. They have 27 kids in their class and many don't give a crap about being there or their school work. A lot of kids being sent to principal, teacher yelling, kids disrupting other kids. At least 5 that do not speak English.
5. My child is in the top reading group and they meet 2 times a week while other groups meet 3-4 times a week.
6. Most of the day is spent with kids at their desks self-guiding themselves to do worksheets or read. There is ver little actual teaching going on.
7. 2.0 has been awful. My oldest missed it so comparing both it is obvious which one was better.

Can you share which school this is please?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are true middle class (not Potomac middle class) and we moved one to private at 6th and our youngest is in public with a hope of staying until 5th but this year has been a train wreck so we are looking at private for next year.

By train wreck:
1. Math is way too easy for 2nd. They haven't even learned money, time or fractions yet. Just very boring writing out numbers and extremely easy graphs. Who has more? Things kids in preschool could do.
2. HW is the same sheet different numbers every night. There has been 7 errors located on those sheets already
3. The teacher is flustered and mean. She doesn't look any kids in the face. She talks down to them. Even when parents volunteer or open house day.
4. My child's anxiety about school has increased. They have 27 kids in their class and many don't give a crap about being there or their school work. A lot of kids being sent to principal, teacher yelling, kids disrupting other kids. At least 5 that do not speak English.
5. My child is in the top reading group and they meet 2 times a week while other groups meet 3-4 times a week.
6. Most of the day is spent with kids at their desks self-guiding themselves to do worksheets or read. There is ver little actual teaching going on.
7. 2.0 has been awful. My oldest missed it so comparing both it is obvious which one was better.

How do you know this? Did you observe or hear it from the kids? just curious

[Anonymous]

You get what you vote for .

Nonsense PC leads to nonsense results.

[Anonymous]

PP, I have a second grader and a middle schooler. Our experience is very different from what you describe. I fully agree that MCPS has huge issues, and I don't think the county is grappling with them effectively. I don't know what the solutions are, personally. But my kids' education overall has been excellent, despite some bumps along the way, thanks in large part to mostly excellent teachers. We are in a BCC neighborhood, not sure if that matters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You get what you vote for .

Nonsense PC leads to nonsense results.

I always knew PC was for stupid people. That's why is so rewarding to watch the fallout and racist scramble to escape . When you're smarter than everybody it feels empowering .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You get what you vote for .

Nonsense PC leads to nonsense results.

I always knew PC was for stupid people. That's why is so rewarding to watch the fallout and racist scramble to escape . When you're smarter than everybody it feels empowering .

The global warmers are also driven by emotional instability. They are my favorites !

[Anonymous]

But didn't you hear about the Pew study that said illegal immigration is down? More are leaving than coming in, it's proven.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are true middle class (not Potomac middle class) and we moved one to private at 6th and our youngest is in public with a hope of staying until 5th but this year has been a train wreck so we are looking at private for next year.

By train wreck:
1. Math is way too easy for 2nd. They haven't even learned money, time or fractions yet. Just very boring writing out numbers and extremely easy graphs. Who has more? Things kids in preschool could do.
2. HW is the same sheet different numbers every night. There has been 7 errors located on those sheets already
3. The teacher is flustered and mean. She doesn't look any kids in the face. She talks down to them. Even when parents volunteer or open house day.
4. My child's anxiety about school has increased. They have 27 kids in their class and many don't give a crap about being there or their school work. A lot of kids being sent to principal, teacher yelling, kids disrupting other kids. At least 5 that do not speak English.
5. My child is in the top reading group and they meet 2 times a week while other groups meet 3-4 times a week.
6. Most of the day is spent with kids at their desks self-guiding themselves to do worksheets or read. There is ver little actual teaching going on.
7. 2.0 has been awful. My oldest missed it so comparing both it is obvious which one was better.

How do you know this? Did you observe or hear it from the kids? just curious

I'm not the PP but this has absolutely been the case in my DD's classrooms so far in ES. DD is an excellent reporter and for the past few years, I have volunteered in the classroom weekly. The teachers are excellent and do the best they can, but when the 1st grade classroom has 5 reading groups, there is a lot of downtime for the kids who don't actually need extra attention. The teachers are very honest that the kids who need to be brought up to grade level are the ones who get the most time. Which is somewhat fair, I guess, but does lead to the above level kids mostly left to read or do extra worksheets. Not very engaging.