DDOT's latest plan to destroy traffic, Georgia Avenue edition

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

I live a few blocks from Georgia and rarely cross it on foot with my kids (ironically when I do it is usually when I am getting off the bus). My oldest is in 4th grade and sometimes walks to or from school alone- I would never let him do this if he had to cross Georgia. In other words, the reason you might not see that many kids on Georgia is because drivers are insane and people don't feel safe walking on it. I am very much in support of this plan. If drivers want to try to hold DC residents hostage by saying that they will drive dangerously in residential streets as well then let's add in speed bumps on the side roads as well.

There are several schools (John Lewis, Truesdell come to mine) that have boundaries that cross Georgia Ave by the way. The four year old who was killed was a Truesdell student.

Speedbumps are dumb. Cars just go through stop signs to make up for lost time. I'd rather have drivers stop at intersections than randomly slow down in the middle of the block.

I've got news for you: if you are regularly running stop signs to make up for the time you lost at speed bumps, you are both in the minority and a dangerous driver.

I just live in the real world. People respond to traffic calming proposals in ways that aren't obvious or desirable that sometimes make traffic calming proposals a net negative for safety.

Traffic calming advocates assume they can make drivers' commutes substantially longer and drivers will just take it. The problem is: They won't! They are jealous of their time and they will do all kinds of things, many you would never think of, to make sure their commutes do not get longer, regardless of whatever crazy idea DDOT proposes.

Yes, dangerous scofflaw drivers will do dangerous illegal things, and that is what enforcement is for.

Rational drivers will do things like ask themselves, "Hey, maybe my commute would be better if I took the bus! I will try that."

Except this isn’t Oslo. 45 years of experience here has proven there are only a generous handful of reasonable drivers. Fewer than 10, all driving a pale green 2012 Prius.

Everyone else behind the wheel will peel off onto side streets. Because we rational drivers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

How many deaths are you willing to accept?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

I live a few blocks from Georgia and rarely cross it on foot with my kids (ironically when I do it is usually when I am getting off the bus). My oldest is in 4th grade and sometimes walks to or from school alone- I would never let him do this if he had to cross Georgia. In other words, the reason you might not see that many kids on Georgia is because drivers are insane and people don't feel safe walking on it. I am very much in support of this plan. If drivers want to try to hold DC residents hostage by saying that they will drive dangerously in residential streets as well then let's add in speed bumps on the side roads as well.

There are several schools (John Lewis, Truesdell come to mine) that have boundaries that cross Georgia Ave by the way. The four year old who was killed was a Truesdell student.

Speedbumps are dumb. Cars just go through stop signs to make up for lost time. I'd rather have drivers stop at intersections than randomly slow down in the middle of the block.

I've got news for you: if you are regularly running stop signs to make up for the time you lost at speed bumps, you are both in the minority and a dangerous driver.

I just live in the real world. People respond to traffic calming proposals in ways that aren't obvious or desirable that sometimes make traffic calming proposals a net negative for safety.

Traffic calming advocates assume they can make drivers' commutes substantially longer and drivers will just take it. The problem is: They won't! They are jealous of their time and they will do all kinds of things, many you would never think of, to make sure their commutes do not get longer, regardless of whatever crazy idea DDOT proposes.

Yes, dangerous scofflaw drivers will do dangerous illegal things, and that is what enforcement is for.

Rational drivers will do things like ask themselves, "Hey, maybe my commute would be better if I took the bus! I will try that."

Except this isn’t Oslo. 45 years of experience here has proven there are only a generous handful of reasonable drivers. Fewer than 10, all driving a pale green 2012 Prius.

Everyone else behind the wheel will peel off onto side streets. Because we rational drivers

Oslo also "wasn't Oslo", until people took action, and now it is.

Or we can shrug our shoulders, do nothing, and say nothing can be done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

How many deaths are you willing to accept?

In a metro area of 6 million? A few deaths are inevitable so I accept that.

How many deaths will you accept? Be precise

How many bus-pedestrian deaths will you accept? Be precise.

[Anonymous]

I also live 2 blocks off Georgia Ave, and would love dedicated bus lanes - with more busses. I currently don't let my middle schooler take the GA Ave bus because it's so crowded. More busses would be great! Also, the double parkers are my utter nemesis every where in the city, and they seem to be more prevalent on GA ave than anywhere else. Maybe dedicated bus lanes could help with that as well. GA to 7th Ave could be safer for everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

1. He was on kennedy st, not the arterial. You don’t get to create your own facts

2. A bus lane wouldn’t have saved his life if he had been on Georgia Ave. I can make up a story in which a BUS ran over him. What would you say to that?

3 A car — or a bus — going just 7 mph and running over a kid is going to kill the kid. Slowing everything down to slow mo speed (your goal) can’t compensate for inattentive or indifferent parenting.

And quite soon after this baby was hit and killed, they made it illegal to turn left on Kennedy from Georgia. There was a very swift reaction. It's awful that this happened. The city did change something because of it. Things can change - and they don't necessarily need to wait for babies to be hit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

How many deaths are you willing to accept?

In a metro area of 6 million? A few deaths are inevitable so I accept that.

How many deaths will you accept? Be precise

How many bus-pedestrian deaths will you accept? Be precise.

Zero

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

+1

This plan is kinda bonkers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

How many deaths are you willing to accept?

Here's the number of speeding deaths each year in DC. As you can see, the numbers don't really change in a statistically significant way from year to year, despite all the things the city has down to try to "calm" traffic. These numbers are quite small, given the number of people on the road. If you were to list the 500 top ways people in Washington D.C. die, traffic deaths would not be on the list.

2022: 9
2021: 12
2020: 15
2019: 10
2018: 9
2017: 9
2016: 8
2015: 11
2014: 12
2013: 11
2012: 5
2011: 15
2010: 8

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

It's like arguing that, because a child was killed on the Beltway several years ago, we should make the Beltway a two lane road, and redirect all the commuter traffic into all the little towns surrounding the highway and, yeah, there's a lot of kids in those towns, but I'm sure it will be totally fine.

Yeah, you're another person who claims to be worried about the safety of kids, but actually your primary worry is the convenience of drivers.

Why shouldn't Georgia Avenue also be safe for kids?

It’s a major arterial and an evacuation route and a state highway at the border. It’s safe enough at this time.

Your statistics 101 class that you took in 2023 as a freshman surely taught that there is no such thing as zero risk.

Every death is a sad event to be sure but it was never going to be none. You can have all the fantastical “Visions” you want but it is not statistically possible. In any city. Never has happened— even in Sweden! — and it never will.

You should have stopped after "Every death is a sad event." Especially when the death in question was a four-year-old child.

But I didn’t because we are helping you to come to terms with the fact that there is no city in the developed world that has ever had zero pedestrian deaths.

It’s an irrational goal. Why then is it your talisman?

How many deaths are you willing to accept?

Here's the number of speeding deaths each year in DC. As you can see, the numbers don't really change in a statistically significant way from year to year, despite all the things the city has down to try to "calm" traffic. These numbers are quite small, given the number of people on the road. If you were to list the 500 top ways people in Washington D.C. die, traffic deaths would not be on the list.

2022: 9
2021: 12
2020: 15
2019: 10
2018: 9
2017: 9
2016: 8
2015: 11
2014: 12
2013: 11
2012: 5
2011: 15
2010: 8

You have already said literally this, literally on this very thread, as well as multiple times on multiple other threads, many times on this forum in the last few years, and it has been equally wrong every single time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. Georgia Avenue will become gridlocked, always

- Georgia Ave has been increasingly gridlocked since the removal of the streetcar system in DC. Eventually there is a limit to what the road can handle and we are very close to it already. This means that at some point there will need to be an alternative which brings me to…

2. Very few people ride the bus, and this isn't going to change that.

- many people ride the bus already and you don’t care about them at all so why should they care about you? If you want to sit in traffic then go ahead. Other people will choose to ride the bus.

3. If you live within a half mile of Georgia Avenue in either direction, you can expect an enormous increase in traffic on your street as tens of thousands of drivers cut through side streets to avoid Georgia Avenue.

- Good point. We should increase red zones and limit access to those side streets during key hours.

4. The city says this is needed to reduce speeding. It's worth nothing that a grand total of 9 people in Washington DC were killed by speeding drivers in 2022, the latest year from the police statistics.

- 9 people that should not have died. You seem ok with the loss of life. I’m sure that you assume it’s someone else so not your problem? But why should we make policy based on such a cold and heartless thought process?

https://buspriority.ddot.dc.gov/pages/georgiaavenw

Here's the number of deaths each year in DC caused by speeding drivers (per the police). Please point out when the many, many, many traffic calming measures the city has implemented started reducing traffic deaths.

2022: 9
2021: 12
2020: 15
2019: 10
2018: 9
2017: 9
2016: 8
2015: 11
2014: 12
2013: 11
2012: 5
2011: 15
2010: 8

You must be one of the most obtuse people to inhabit this forum. Time after time, you bring up these statistics and every time people explain to you that they don't mean what you claim they mean, yet you can't stop embarrassing yourself by bringing them up at every opportunity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The argument that if we don't all agree Georgia Avenue should be a speedway to shuttle individual drivers in individual cars from their homes in MD to their offices downtown, then those drivers will go on murderous rampage of children on Petworth residential streets, is insane.

I'm sorry traffic is bad. All evidence ponts to the idea that the only way to address the issue on a long-term basis is to move people to more efficient modes of transportation. That includes buses. If you'd rather plow through crowds of school children in a residential neighborhood going 50 in 15 than take the bus, then I suggest it's time to rethink your values system.

I've taken the bus to work for years. It's fine. It's not as luxurious as driving my own car and parking in the building but it costs a tiny fraction of that option so whatever.

It's better to have car traffic where people expect it. That way, no one is surprised and there are fewer accidents. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road and responds accordingly. When you put lots of traffic in places where people don't expect it (like side streets), that's when bad things happen.

Look I actually feel for you. Commuting daily by car absolutely sucks and tends to break your brain over time. I get the headspace you are in and why you feel the way you do. That was me once.

Here's what opened my eyes: marrying a highway engineer (who focuses on building roads for cars -- not a city planner focused on pedestrians or cyclists or public transit) and learning how absolutely f***ed we are if we try to continue to support current car infrastructure with population growth and trends. There is literally not a way to build roads that will accommodate current driving levels without resulting in just 24-7 gridlock traffic. And WFH does not actually fix this because people still need to go places even if it's not the office. There's just no way to accommodate all the cars and it's made worse because of trends toward larger vehicles. You will never have enough roads to accommodate the onslaught of private vehicle traffic even if those roads are optimized for that traffic. You can't do it. Talk to someone who works in this field -- traffic is only going to keep getting worse forever and ever.

Some of you are obsessed with the idea that DC is not Oslo or whatever. I agree. But do we want it to be Houston or Dallas? Los Angeles? Toronto? DC has a chance right now to invest in public transportation infrastructure that can help support where the population is headed here. Even if you personally never intend to set foot on a public bus, you are going to want that infrastructure. Your current traffic woes will otherwise only get worse.

I know you won't listen to me but you should know that the vast majority of experts on infrastructure and transportation disagree with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. Georgia Avenue will become gridlocked, always

- Georgia Ave has been increasingly gridlocked since the removal of the streetcar system in DC. Eventually there is a limit to what the road can handle and we are very close to it already. This means that at some point there will need to be an alternative which brings me to…

2. Very few people ride the bus, and this isn't going to change that.

- many people ride the bus already and you don’t care about them at all so why should they care about you? If you want to sit in traffic then go ahead. Other people will choose to ride the bus.

3. If you live within a half mile of Georgia Avenue in either direction, you can expect an enormous increase in traffic on your street as tens of thousands of drivers cut through side streets to avoid Georgia Avenue.

- Good point. We should increase red zones and limit access to those side streets during key hours.

4. The city says this is needed to reduce speeding. It's worth nothing that a grand total of 9 people in Washington DC were killed by speeding drivers in 2022, the latest year from the police statistics.

- 9 people that should not have died. You seem ok with the loss of life. I’m sure that you assume it’s someone else so not your problem? But why should we make policy based on such a cold and heartless thought process?

https://buspriority.ddot.dc.gov/pages/georgiaavenw

Here's the number of deaths each year in DC caused by speeding drivers (per the police). Please point out when the many, many, many traffic calming measures the city has implemented started reducing traffic deaths.

2022: 9
2021: 12
2020: 15
2019: 10
2018: 9
2017: 9
2016: 8
2015: 11
2014: 12
2013: 11
2012: 5
2011: 15
2010: 8

You must be one of the most obtuse people to inhabit this forum. Time after time, you bring up these statistics and every time people explain to you that they don't mean what you claim they mean, yet you can't stop embarrassing yourself by bringing them up at every opportunity.

Uh, huh, right. You know you're not fooling anyone, right? As the numbers plainly show, we've spent an enormous amount of time and energy on "traffic calming" and it has amounted to jack shit in terms of reducing traffic deaths.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The argument that if we don't all agree Georgia Avenue should be a speedway to shuttle individual drivers in individual cars from their homes in MD to their offices downtown, then those drivers will go on murderous rampage of children on Petworth residential streets, is insane.

I'm sorry traffic is bad. All evidence ponts to the idea that the only way to address the issue on a long-term basis is to move people to more efficient modes of transportation. That includes buses. If you'd rather plow through crowds of school children in a residential neighborhood going 50 in 15 than take the bus, then I suggest it's time to rethink your values system.

I've taken the bus to work for years. It's fine. It's not as luxurious as driving my own car and parking in the building but it costs a tiny fraction of that option so whatever.

It's better to have car traffic where people expect it. That way, no one is surprised and there are fewer accidents. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road and responds accordingly. When you put lots of traffic in places where people don't expect it (like side streets), that's when bad things happen.

Look I actually feel for you. Commuting daily by car absolutely sucks and tends to break your brain over time. I get the headspace you are in and why you feel the way you do. That was me once.

Here's what opened my eyes: marrying a highway engineer (who focuses on building roads for cars -- not a city planner focused on pedestrians or cyclists or public transit) and learning how absolutely f***ed we are if we try to continue to support current car infrastructure with population growth and trends. There is literally not a way to build roads that will accommodate current driving levels without resulting in just 24-7 gridlock traffic. And WFH does not actually fix this because people still need to go places even if it's not the office. There's just no way to accommodate all the cars and it's made worse because of trends toward larger vehicles. You will never have enough roads to accommodate the onslaught of private vehicle traffic even if those roads are optimized for that traffic. You can't do it. Talk to someone who works in this field -- traffic is only going to keep getting worse forever and ever.

Some of you are obsessed with the idea that DC is not Oslo or whatever. I agree. But do we want it to be Houston or Dallas? Los Angeles? Toronto? DC has a chance right now to invest in public transportation infrastructure that can help support where the population is headed here. Even if you personally never intend to set foot on a public bus, you are going to want that infrastructure. Your current traffic woes will otherwise only get worse.

I know you won't listen to me but you should know that the vast majority of experts on infrastructure and transportation disagree with you.

It's weird how there's no more room for cars, except DC is way smaller than it used to be, and people like you want to build as much housing as possible, which would encourage more people to live here. It's hard to keep track of all the contradictions.